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Thread: Charge Coupling on the Cheap

  1. #31
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    Yeah, but all this could have been avoided had I simply kept my mouth shut.

  2. #32
    Senior Member JBLnsince1959's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Giskard
    Yeah, but all this could have been avoided had I simply kept my mouth shut.
    I'm soooo glad you didn't. I've enjoyed this thread, becasue as you know I've been thinking about CC'ing my PS speakers. I have some questions ( and comments), but that'll have to wait until tomrrow...Nice thread Ian

  3. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by Giskard
    Yeah, but all this could have been avoided had I simply kept my mouth shut.
    What...your cake hole has significant importance.....please keep it open!

  4. #34
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    Okay,

    My own observation is that while I am only using the Claritycap on the Uhf (slot) when comparing the charge-coupling "On" to "off" position the top end sounded hot compared to "off" where the top end blends better with the upper mids in the "off" position.

    The detail is still there in "off" position but it will less pronounced, the tops stand out more in the ""on" position which is interesting. You can sort of look deeper into the sound but some may describe the effect as accentuating the top end, exaggerated perhaps

    In the current set-up I have metallised polypropylenes bypassed with polystyrene 0.01 caps and charge coupled everywhere else.(I discharge all the capacitors to perform the comparisons)

    If the horns had the claritycaps my observations might be different. I might say the horns and slot are both bright and I might be tempted to crank them back but that remains to be seen.

    That's as much as I can say until I decide to buy more Claritycaps.


    Ian

  5. #35
    Senior Member Rusnzha's Avatar
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    That sounds typical. When I made the charge coupled crossovers for my L100s, I had to back off the mids about a half. It balanced right out and sounded great!

  6. #36
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    Wonderful Thread! Just when I "Thought" I had Mystic Recipe #XXXX all worked out, here comes some new "Spices" for the perfect blend, as in cheap/road tested caps. Thanks for the links and "Ideas"!

  7. #37
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    While on holidays I propose to make a couple of passive crossovers with the Claritycaps.

    They will not be charge coupled so to some extent this may seem off topic but I have my reasons..........

    I tried it with this particular variety and while interesting it was a little too bright but that is only my observation.

    They seem to perform well enough functioning naturally.These are pure film and foil (not metailised like the Solen's) and are rated at 630 volts.

    From what I have read they made in consultation with speaker manufacturers like B+W and Tannoy so maybe they are voiced well enough to work right out of the box. The construction is first rate.

    I also wanted to build two crossovers, a new equivalent 3145 and a 3141. I could not see the point on spending $200 on one crossover when I could two for $100.00 .

    That does not mean I discourage charge coupling but sometimes some exploratory listening tests and circumstance pays dividends.

    The

    Watch this spot.

    Ian
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  8. #38
    Senior Member JuniorJBL's Avatar
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    Will the entire crossover be built with the claritycap?

    I am very interested in your findings.

  9. #39
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    I tried it with this particular variety and while interesting it was a little too bright but that is only my observation.

    How long did you run them though before making a decision? Run them good for a week or two and then pull the battery.

    I also wanted to build two crossovers, a new equivalent 3145 and a 3141. I could not see the point on spending $200 on one crossover when I could two for $100.00 .

    I hear you. I leave biasing as the final step to something I want to keep around for myself.

    That does not mean I discourage charge coupling

    Glad to hear it because that would put you directly at odds with THE MAN and he has too many home runs under his belt to ignore.

    sometimes some exploratory listening tests and circumstance pays dividends.

    Could be. I do want to try some of these capacitors too.

  10. #40
    Senior Member JuniorJBL's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Giskard
    that would put you directly at odds with THE MAN

  11. #41
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    Hi,

    JBL Junior..Yes .

    Giskard.... I run it for about two weeks. I don't think this should be regarded as conclusive as the whole crossover was not charge coupled!

    I would still like to build a crossover per Greg's own recipe!

    Ultimately I want to quad amp and this is another reason for using the above as a good but not by any means ultimate crossover.

    regards

    Ian

  12. #42
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    Understood. I'm not 100% convinced that the best grade capacitors do benefit from biasing. I think Jeff has told you and I both that doing so may merely cause them to be different as opposed to better. Jeff even suggested that the battery itself could introduce dirt into an otherwise clean filter circuit. I think we're talking considerable cash outlay to get to that point though.

  13. #43
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    Exactly.

    So far..

    1. Bypassing the parrelleled mylar / polyropolyne metalised capacitors with 0.01 polystyrene does make an improvement.(improves ambience)

    2. Further bypassing of the horn filter with small film foil capacitors makes further improvements.(improves transient details)

    3. Charge - coupling the above makes another improvement (removes background hash)

    4. Pure film capacitors (Claritycaps SA Series) non bypassed but charge coupled produced a different result and the user would need to try and taste test for there application.

    5. Pure film capacitors (Claritycaps SA Series) (non bypassed)
    (improvement in transparency over all previous 1 - 3)

    Research : I could not measure any change in amplitude of the a/c signal through the charge-coupled / non charge-coupled capacitors however the music signal certainly sounded difference and brighter in (4), almost a burnt glared quality.

    Giskard interesting that you talk about batteries. A long way back I bought a Crystal Logic DAC evaluation board and tried different power supplies...batteries produced a tarnished quality.

    Conclusions so far:

    I braved 40+ c temperatures today and installed the Claritycaps late this afternoon..running class A power amps on a hot day is not recommended.

    I think I am resonably sure in saying they Charge-coupling does make a noticeable improvement if you want to built a passive network on a low budget using inexpensive mylar or metalised polypropolyne capacitors and that bypassing does add further refinement in transient detail and ambience.

    You don't get anything for nothing however and as you progress to better capacitors (either metailise or film*) you will find improved transparency and information retreival that surpases even even what charge-coupling and bypassing does for low cost / quality capacitors. Of course if you have the budget a charge-coupled crossover using premium capacitors would be the ultimate.

    *There is a wide variation in performance of either film and foil or metalised types and there are excellent and average examples of both.

    I really like the Claritycaps and think they are very good value for money even using is non charge-coupled mode.

    When funds and time permits I consider a charge - coupled Claritycap crossover. On their own they certainly are hot on tails of the more exotic types. They do sound very good on the 2307/2308 horn and slot which in my experience is the acid test of how good and bad a capacitor can sound because the sound is mostly directed to the listener and not washed and softened by the reverberant field of the room as with CD horns.

    Happy listening.

    Ian

  14. #44
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    I remember during one conversation with Jeff that he didn't seem too fired up about using Sonicaps with JBL compression drivers. He felt the Relcaps were better in that application. I'll have to give the SA Claritycaps a try and see how they do.

    Quite a difference in price between the two U.S. Distributors:

    ICW Clarity Cap - SA Series 20.00 uF $34.16

    ClarityCap SA range SA Values (uf): 20uf $17.36

    According to one distributor the PX Series is priced to compete with the Solens.
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  15. #45
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    Hmm,

    Jeff is pretty sharp. This is the thing with all this stuff......

    Well I am watching Eric at the moment and I'm impressed.

    My Aust Distributor sells the 20 uf for A$15.90 ea.

    Allowing for exchange rate of say 1.35 that is A$11.77 to you plus postage

    Might be worth an email to http://www.ledeaudio.com/capacitors.html
    to see what David can do for you plus postage...I found him very obliging.

    Ian

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