JBL L Series (1990s)

[jan_slagman]

While I believe this to be an error, here's a shop in England that lists a recone kit for the 708G.

http://www.europeanloudspeaker.com/E...Kits%20Eng.pdf

Hello,

Sorry to interupt you, but Pohle is a village in Germany not far from Minden, county Rheinland-Westfalen.

Kind regards,

Jan Slagman
The Netherlands

[Titanium Dome]

Hello,

Sorry to interupt you, but Pohle is a village in Germany not far from Minden, county Rheinland-Westfalen.

Kind regards,

Jan Slagman
The Netherlands

Thanks, Jan, I'm certain you're correct. However, when I tried to contact them from both the German and English site, here's where it sent me:

ELS Pro Audio
2196 Alberni Hwy, Box 191
Coombs B.C. V0R1M0
Canada

Merkwürdig, nicht ist es?

[Titanium Dome]

I've been lucky enough over the years to accumulate many pairs of L7s, some brand new, some L5s and some L3s. At one point I had a 7.1 set up of L Series (1990s).

I've trimmed down to two stereo pairs of L7s, a pair of L5s and a pair of L3s, plus a spare L7 for parts.

I have a pair of L7s in my Arts District office in Los Angles in what is a virtually perfect room, where the sound is nothing short of stunning--easily the best I've ever heard from the L7s. I have another pair in my music room at home, where they share the room with multiple JBL stereo pairs, and they sound very good there as well. I've got the L5s in one of the larger guest bedrooms, and the L3s serve me in the garage now.

As I've written before, the L7s require a lot of care in set up, and the room is a critical element. In the right room, set up in the best way, they are simply amazing. At the full retail of $1000 each, they were one of the greatest values JBL ever produced. In fact, I feel they were the best expression of audiophile quality sound at the lowest price point ever achieved by any manufacturer. IMO no one has beaten that equation before or since.

Of course, it's all about placement and set up, and if those things aren't right, then the L7 is a waste of money. If they have to be put where the wife/SO will allow, if the room shape demands a specific placement that is not ideal, if they cannot be at least 3' from the walls in both directions, then you'll never know the best that they can sound. When done right, the imaging is precise and solid, the soundstage is wide and coherent, the highs are brilliant and the lows are thunderous, yet articulate.

The L5 is much easier to set up. It's potentially just as strong as the L7 through the mids and highs, and can be very good in the lows as well. In fact, due to its ease of set up, it will sound better than a poorly set up L7. The L5 is the oddest of JBL's 4-ways due to its 8", 6.5", 4", and 035TiA drivers. It is perhaps the closest spacing of four different drivers all in a time-aligned row, except perhaps for the recent TiK. (Originally the two woofers were going to be the same.)

When placement is restricted, I'd say the L5 is the preferable choice. In small to medium rooms, it can sound better than the L7, which needs some room to breathe. The L5 is excellent at low volumes, medium volumes, and loud volumes. It absorbs a lot of power and runs "hot" with little stress.

The L7 is too cramped in small rooms and most medium rooms. It needs an end of the room where it can be 3' out from the side and 3' in from the back, so you're giving up 18' sq. of the room just to get optimal placement for a pair. Then you need clear space between the side-firing woofers and some open space between the listener(s) and the two speakers. IMO a 10' x 12' room is not acceptable, and 12' x 14' is really the minimum to achieve good (but not GREAT) sound.

At low volumes powered by amps under 100W/ch, the L7s can be anemic. Since the L7 is built to work with amps up to 450W/ch, the minimum 35W/ch is seriously under underpowered. I run the Arts District pair with two Soundcraftsmen 220W/ch amps (active bi-wire, so 220W into the woofers, and 220W into the mids and highs ) for stunning output.

Hopefully this will clarify some questions people asked about the L5 vs. the L7.

[JBLAddict]

I've been lucky enough over the years to accumulate many pairs of L7s, some brand new, some L5s and some L3s. At one point I had a 7.1 set up of L Series (1990s).

I've trimmed down to two stereo pairs of L7s, a pair of L5s and a pair of L3s, plus a spare L7 for parts.

I have a pair of L7s in my Arts District office in Los Angles in what is a virtually perfect room, where the sound is nothing short of stunning--easily the best I've ever heard from the L7s. I have another pair in my music room at home, where they share the room with multiple JBL stereo pairs, and they sound very good there as well. I've got the L5s in one of the larger guest bedrooms, and the L3s serve me in the garage now.

As I've written before, the L7s require a lot of care in set up, and the room is a critical element. In the right room, set up in the best way, they are simply amazing. At the full retail of $1000 each, they were one of the greatest values JBL ever produced. In fact, I feel they were the best expression of audiophile quality sound at the lowest price point ever achieved by any manufacturer. IMO no one has beaten that equation before or since.

Of course, it's all about placement and set up, and if those things aren't right, then the L7 is a waste of money. If they have to be put where the wife/SO will allow, if the room shape demands a specific placement that is not ideal, if they cannot be at least 3' from the walls in both directions, then you'll never know the best that they can sound. When done right, the imaging is precise and solid, the soundstage is wide and coherent, the highs are brilliant and the lows are thunderous, yet articulate.

The L5 is much easier to set up. It's potentially just as strong as the L7 through the mids and highs, and can be very good in the lows as well. In fact, due to its ease of set up, it will sound better than a poorly set up L7. The L5 is the oddest of JBL's 4-ways due to its 8", 6.5", 4", and 035TiA drivers. It is perhaps the closest spacing of four different drivers all in a time-aligned row, except perhaps for the recent TiK. (Originally the two woofers were going to be the same.)

When placement is restricted, I'd say the L5 is the preferable choice. In small to medium rooms, it can sound better than the L7, which needs some room to breathe. The L5 is excellent at low volumes, medium volumes, and loud volumes. It absorbs a lot of power and runs "hot" with little stress.

The L7 is too cramped in small rooms and most medium rooms. It needs an end of the room where it can be 3' out from the side and 3' in from the back, so you're giving up 18' sq. of the room just to get optimal placement for a pair. Then you need clear space between the side-firing woofers and some open space between the listener(s) and the two speakers. IMO a 10' x 12' room is not acceptable, and 12' x 14' is really the minimum to achieve good (but not GREAT) sound.

At low volumes powered by amps under 100W/ch, the L7s can be anemic. Since the L7 is built to work with amps up to 450W/ch, the minimum 35W/ch is seriously under underpowered. I run the Arts District pair with two Soundcraftsmen 220W/ch amps (active bi-wire, so 220W into the woofers, and 220W into the mids and highs ) for stunning output.

Hopefully this will clarify some questions people asked about the L5 vs. the L7.

sorry for any confusion caused by stating the Q in the tagline not the text body. I've read about this entire thread for the L7 L5 comparisons and have thoroughly enjoyed it.

[BMWCCA]

One-day L7 owner here. Moving up from the L5 and a truck-load of other superb JBLs. As seen elsewhere on this forum, I just picked up a pair of L7s from a neighbor. I previously settled for the L5 due to the infamous placement issues and I have to say I was overwhelmed by how nice the L5 is. But with only few hours of L7 experience, in a less-than-optimal location, robbing the the speaker leads from my venerable C37 030s and using their single DC300A-II, I have to say (after fifty years of living with JBLs) I'm a bit closer to heaven tonight without losing appreciation for all those that came before.

I find the L7 very easy to listen to. They've simply got to be pulled out from the wall and will want to dominate a smaller room, visually, for that reason but the resulting sound-stage fills the room and doesn't much care from what angle you choose to listen. Maybe it's the inward-firing twelves, or maybe it's the incredible height of the 035TiAs, but you can walk around the room and you think you're strolling around inside the orchestra. It's an uncanny feeling of the speakers filling the room with sound without making themselves the focal point. And that's no easy task for 45-inch-tall black monoliths.

I did a bit of quick-and-dirty and switched the Soundcraftsmen DX4200 into A+B mono mode and A-B'd one L7 with one 030 just for fun. Gawd, I love that ancient 15" D130. Is there anything ever made that is just that purely musical? I felt like I was inside the cello. But the pair of L7s imaged better than the pair of 030s and the bass was obviously more extended and with more punch in the deep end compared with the light and subtle nature of the D130. (To establish a frame of reference, I also own L112s, L150As, 4412As, and L20ts.)

The L5s were real eye-openers, but the L7 is truly the grown-up in this family. I don't really even want to play them side-by side since I love them both and really enjoy the L5s even at tremendous volume. The L5s are benefiting from a Crown PS-400 and, even though I've been told over and over here that the circuitry of the PS-400 adds nothing to the sound quality over the DC300A-II, in my heart it plays stronger. But I'm "wasting" one on my L20ts so tomorrow they get a PS-200 and the L7s will get the "late-series" PS-400, and maybe a bi-wiring using the DC300 for the top terminals and the PS for the bottoms. The wiring diagram suggests identical stereo amps each feeding one L7, but I can't see how using two such similar amps with both left channels feeding both terminal pairs on the L7 would really alter the concept of bi-wiring which I don't profess to understand anyway. Tomorrow is the day to hear the L7 at volume, if I get around to trying the bi-wiring or not. I expect they won't let me down.

Thanks, T-Dome, for starting this thread, for opening my eyes, and for encouraging all of us new L1, L3, L5, and L7 owners to sample the finest speaker ever built for under $1000 a side (and an especially good value at 10¢ on the dollar used, too). Now I've got to figure out what to use on the black-stained wood veneer to maintain them. JBL says they're essentially maintenance-free and I'm not sure Howard's or any oil-based treatment will do anything but make them just look too shiny. I'm open to suggestions from other L-Series owners.

[rww1951]

Great score! Listen to Norah Jones’s ‘come away with me’ CD on those L7’s and I think you’ll really be impressed! Following is the care instructions from the L7 Owners Manual for what it’s worth (pretty lame).


Caring for your L Series
speakers

In general, a light dusting should
be all the care necessary since the
L Series cabinet finish does not
need waxing or oiling. However, if
the enclosure surfaces become
dirty, they may be cleaned with a
damp cloth or a cleaner suitable
for a sealed wood finish. Never
use a pump or spray cleaner di-
rectly on the speaker since the
over-spray could be harmful to the
L Series speaker cones. Instead,
apply cleaner to a soft rag and then
wipe it onto the cabinet.
To remove dust from the grille
cloth, use a vacuum with a brush
attachment. Spots may be
removed with a commercial
spot remover.

[BMWCCA]

rww,

Thanks, but that's what I read, too. Which is why I'm asking what others have done to care for the finish on the black L-series cabinets. Any tips on touch-up? Preserving the finish? Is it impregnable and therefor unnecessary to apply anything to the surface? It almost feels like plastic or latex paint rather than black stain, though the wood-grain is real.

Just wondering.

[hjames]

rww,

... I'm asking what others have done to care for the finish on the black L-series cabinets.
It almost feels like plastic or latex paint rather than black stain, though the wood-grain is real.

Just wondering.

Armour-All ?

excuse me - Armour-all for BMWs ...

[BMWCCA]

Armour-All ?

Don't laugh! I was considering Zymol Vinyl, since I've got a case of it in the basement!

Cleaner for a "sealed wood surface" seems to imply anything since the wood doesn't come into play. But I'd still like to know what the finish actually is!

[rww1951]

I think I remember reading somewhere that the L Series cabinets are painted Ash veneer with a sealer coat. If that’s the case just clean them with a mild household cleaner if they’re dirty and apply a high quality paste wax. Touch up could be done with any good semi gloss black paint (Krylon semi-flat is a good choice).

[Guido]

Thanks, Jan, I'm certain you're correct. However, when I tried to contact them from both the German and English site, here's where it sent me:

ELS Pro Audio
2196 Alberni Hwy, Box 191
Coombs B.C. V0R1M0
Canada

Merkwürdig, nicht ist es?

The shop owner is Randy.
He used to live in Pohle/Germany but moved to Canada early this year.

Mystery solved?

[Titanium Dome]

The shop owner is Randy.
He used to live in Pohle/Germany but moved to Canada early this year.

Mystery solved?

Yes, you are both a gentleman and a detective.

[BMWCCA]

OK, and mostly just to keep this thread in the "current" pile, I've recently added a pair of L1s to my collection of L5 and L7 speakers. Nice little speakers. Came in original packaging and look nearly new. Sound is as expected after becoming accustomed to the sound of the L5s.

The current thread about Harman Corporate mentioned edge-wound voice coils as a probably not-so tongue-in-cheek determiner of "heritage" versus "harman". But I've been unable to find that degree of detail about the driver construction in the 1990 L-series. I'm assuming the L7's LE120H-1 is likely to be a 3" edge-wound coil, but what constitutes the construction of the other drivers unique to the series? Is there something published with these details I've not been able to find? Got a good link?

Thanks again for the great thread. I had to stop myself from buying another pair of L5s yesterday, asking price $300. They were only 40-miles away but I'd set my limit at $200 and the (original) owner found another buyer somewhere around $250. I don't NEED any more! But I came so close . . . Would I sell mine for that? HELL no.

[Slare]

Partly due to this thread & board, I renewed my love for JBL's. I got back into audio a few months ago, which started with me selling off my old Northridge N38's and SC305 center. After trying out a few different setups, I ended up coming by a pair of very nice L5's and picking them up.

I've been fond of JBL's since my brother in law introduced me to his L100T's when I was a kid. At the time, I remember coming very close to purchasing some of the smaller LX (44's I think) but never quite coming up with the money. I remember seeing the L and SPL series and thinking "someday, I might be able to afford them". Since then 15 or so years have passed and I guess I just finally realized I had the money now to go out and piece some of these old gems together. That and being in a large metro area with a strong CL base has definitely helped!

I've since rounded out a 5.1 system with the L5's up front, L1's for surrounds, and a EC35 center. I have some E10's to use if 7.1 ever takes off because I doubt I'll ever have room for 4 L1's. The EC35 center may seem odd, but it was the best match to my ears after trying several JBL centers with the L5's. I actually think it is quite close, but I am using subs and high-pass in my system. Full range I think it is a little soft on bass.

I also tried a EC25 (not even close), LC1 (much softer on the high end, much boomier on the low end), and CL-505 (seemed a little dull). I really wanted to give the LC2 a shot but it is much too tall. I really have never been happy with wtw centers.

My main reason for posting here is that I'm currently trying to piece together an L5-hardware based center in a CL-505 cabinet. I found a pair of L5 mids and am just waiting on my 035 tweeter to arrive.

For now, I have the L5 mids swapped into the CL-505 box and the center sounds a little flat. The mids actually produce decent low end, midrange is spot on (of course) but the HRD tweeter is pretty dead sounding to my ears, so I'm hoping once I get the 035 in there it'll be good to go...

Wonder if anyone else has tried this?

I'm also considering refurbishing the grilles with black cloth, and wondering if anyone has done that? I'm not sure I'll do that unless I can find used grille frames. My opinion of the gray seems to vary from day to day.

Thanks for the great thread and forum. I hope I am not offending anyone with the frankesteining of a CL-505.

[BMWCCA]

I never could figure out why one L1 wouldn't make a more-than-adequate center channel for an L-series 5.1 system. Lay it on its side if you want. What am I not getting?