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Thread: JBL 2360 Compression Driver?

  1. #61
    Member oks81's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by oks81 View Post
    I use miniDSP 2x4 on my system.

    On the standard ti diaphragm I had the following setting:
    1650Hz -8dB 1Q
    2450Hz -1,5dB 2Q (High Shelf)

    With aquas I use this:
    1800Hz -7,5dB 0,5Q
    8000Hz 1,5dB 1Q (High Shelf)


    With this settings I have about the same treble, but the aquas not so resonant around 12kHz. Sounds cleaner.
    It`s playing to about 14-15kHz before it drops.
    20kHz..?? Ok, maybe, but think its most resonances..? maybe with Truextent be..?

    To get it all clean in the top thinking treble is the best. It`s made for the high frequencies, something the 2446 and 2360 is not so much.
    Sorry! I ment tweeter!
    Best oks, not in front row in english class.....
    Remember the history!

  2. #62
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    Quote Originally Posted by oks81 View Post
    I use miniDSP 2x4 on my system.
    Searching Aquaplas info brought me here, but I have a question about the MiniDSP. I've used them for years before switching to high efficiency speakers, and the noise floor was huge once I placed my JBLs in the system. The MiniDSPs are now bypassed and the system is silent(noise wise).

    Which MiniDSP are you using? I was using the 2x4 balanced, my pre and amps are all balanced in/out.

  3. #63
    Senior Member Lee in Montreal's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by emilime75 View Post
    I've used them for years before switching to high efficiency speakers, and the noise floor was huge once I placed my JBLs in the system.
    You need probably to reduce the input gain and raise the output. This is a common occurence on wrongly set-up DSPs ;-)

  4. #64
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    I had a pair with 2445 drivers in my living room. Sounded fantastic and the music was just sort of "there in the room." They were almost as tall as my L200 cabinets.

  5. #65
    Member oks81's Avatar
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    Hello!

    I use miniDSP 2x4, simplest and cheapest there is.
    Dead silent on 2360s but have some hum on the 2226s....don`t know what that is.

    I use 68uF protection cap on the 2446 as both my poweramps has huge power on thump.

    I also use 4channel preamp between miniDSP and the two poweramps.
    The preamp (Norwegian brand Musical Innovation) has 50ohm output impedance, instead of the miniDSP that is 560ohm.
    The preamp then function as buffer and volume control.
    To use preamp between miniDSP and poweramps made better sound
    When volume control is on zero, no hum in basses, thinking it is miniDSP in som way...
    But no big issue.


    By the way, the EQ settings i have mentioned is changed. Don`t use them. Try to find your own settings.
    I now used target curves in REW to setup the system. Sounds more correct

    Best
    oks
    Remember the history!

  6. #66
    Member sebackman's Avatar
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    My 25 cents.

    Hi all,

    A couple of things.

    There is absolutely no sonic difference between the 8ohm and the 16ohm diaphragms. The only thing is that the higher impedance reduces audible noise from the amp due to lower sensitivity at the same voltage (-3db). Potentially, if the amp is doing something weird due to the higher impedance, there can be a perceived difference but my 25 cents go to change of level as the ear is very sensitive and can detect as low differences as 0,1db.

    The 8ohms and 16ohms can of course not use the same passive network and of you have an attenuator and/or protection cap those will also behave different if the impedance changes.

    Regarding frequency response the SL’s is in fact better/flatter, rolls off less, that the Be dia’s above 10k. Hence you will do just fine with SL’s in a two way where you may need UHF with Be’s. Alternatively you can use an EQ/DSP to compensate, but remember that JBL themselves always used a UHF above the 476Be’s/476Mg’s (albeit I have never measured the 476Mg and only Truextent Be’s). I find the 2-way easier to set up than the 3-way.

    Contrary to what was mentioned above there is not “Less treble then standard” in the SL’s and there is no significant difference in sensitivity given the same impedance. For sensitivity JBL may have compensated potential loss with a few more turns on the voice coil, resulting in little, if any, real life difference.

    The maybe perceived lower treble output in the SL’s is only due to different sound, less ringing above 8k. When measured the SL’s are equally good or better dependant on horn/waveguide. I think I have most combinations up and running except Mg.

    The limiting factor here seem to be the 2” exit driver which have much less HF output than the 1,5” drivers. That can easily be verified by using a 2450 which is really a 1,5” driver core with a detachable bolted snout that makes it a 2” driver. If you measure them with and without the snout the difference become visible.

    I may be possible compensate some of it via EQ/DSP but there is a significant difference in design of the exit and the 2” horn mouth that has nothing to do with the diaphragms.

    The Be’s does in fact roll off earlier than both Ti’s and SL’s but have less ringing and can be EQ’s harder without problem. However I don’t think any of the 2” drivers can go all the way regardless of diaphragm without serous EQ that in it selves can cause new issues. Around 15k seems to be the limit.

    I’m not familiar with the 2360 horn except for what I have read here and in other places but it seem rather beamy above 10k and may be perceived down on treble outside a very narrow sweet spot.

    You should be just fine with 2446 and SL’s plus some DSP or EQ magic. If not enough “sparkle” just add a 2405 above 10k.

    Kind regards
    //Rob
    The solution to the problem changes the problem.
    -And always remember that all of your equipment was made by the lowest bidder

  7. #67
    Senior Member Lee in Montreal's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sebackman View Post
    I’m not familiar with the 2360 horn except for what I have read here and in other places but it seem rather beamy above 10k and may be perceived down on treble outside a very narrow sweet spot.
    I never noticed my 2360s were any beamy. That's the advantage of CD horns.

  8. #68
    Senior Member 1audiohack's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lee in Montreal View Post
    I never noticed my 2360s were any beamy. That's the advantage of CD horns.
    Agreed. If you can see even one side of the diffraction slot you are in the coverage zone.

    Barry.
    If we knew what the hell we were doing, we wouldn't call it research would we.

  9. #69
    Member sebackman's Avatar
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    Still learning

    From the JBL spec it looks like there is at least some directivity above 10k. But maybe that is so little that it in reality it does not really affect perceived treble level.

    I have never used that horn so I stand corrected. :-)

    Kind regards
    //Rob
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    The solution to the problem changes the problem.
    -And always remember that all of your equipment was made by the lowest bidder

  10. #70
    Senior Member 1audiohack's Avatar
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    The plots posted are of the 60 degree 2365. The 90 degree 2360 is much better.

    It takes a lot of HF driver output to play reasonably flat on a 2360. If one is using it at domestic levels it's pretty easy to EQ an SL or 2441 but if you use it really loud, the old 2450 gets that done the best. Otherwise you EQ about 18dB of headroom out of the driver.

    Barry.
    If we knew what the hell we were doing, we wouldn't call it research would we.

  11. #71
    Member sebackman's Avatar
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    Sorry for the confusion. 2360 added.

    Kind regards
    //Rob
    The solution to the problem changes the problem.
    -And always remember that all of your equipment was made by the lowest bidder

  12. #72
    Member oks81's Avatar
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    All interesting!

    Keep on writing guys!!

    About aquas sensitivity, I tested when just changed one, so standard Ti in left and aquas in right.
    The aquas was quite a bit lower in sound level.

    Don`t know how beaming sounds like, so can`t say on my 2360`s.

    I use some EQ to get some level up to about 15kHz before drops down.
    Remember the history!

  13. #73
    Member sebackman's Avatar
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    Hi oks81

    "About aquas sensitivity, I tested when just changed one, so standard Ti in left and aquas in right.
    The aquas was quite a bit lower in sound level."

    Check color coding on the diaphragm, red is 16ohms and green is 8 ohms. Were these factory SL dia's? -Or "dusted", ie plain or ribbed?

    Do you have measuring capabilities with reasonable resolution?

    If they were factory SL's with the same DC resistance you probably have a faulty core or diaphragm. I had some difference on two SL dia's and turned out to be 7 ohms on the one and the other was 8 ohms DC, ie 16ohms impedance. I have no idea why they were different but the difference was clearly audible. I got a new SL from SE i Florida and tested again and they were spot on.

    Sorry to be a party pooper. They do sound different no doubt (less ringing in the SL) but they measure almost the same sensitivity.

    There are many members here with more experince than me so maybe they can share their experience.

    I'm located rather near you so we can have a chat over the phone if you like. Baldrik knows how to find me.

    Kind regards
    //Rob
    The solution to the problem changes the problem.
    -And always remember that all of your equipment was made by the lowest bidder

  14. #74
    Senior Member 1audiohack's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sebackman View Post
    Sorry for the confusion. 2360 added.

    Kind regards
    //Rob
    Ha no worries.

    Barry.
    If we knew what the hell we were doing, we wouldn't call it research would we.

  15. #75
    Member oks81's Avatar
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    You aren NOT a party pooper!

    Color is green (on wire connection for red wire) on both SL and TI.

    My SL diaphragms are working great! And they do sound great!
    But they beiing less sensitive is not so weird actually as the aquaplas coating do make the diaphragm heavier.
    Had to increase a little gain compared to the TI`s.
    But not much
    No issue for me as it plays loud enough for my living room!

    I bought my SL`s from reconingspeakers.
    http://reconingspeakers.com/product/...0sl-diaphragm/

    Are you from Norway?
    Remember the history!

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