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Thread: jbl haters

  1. #1
    Senior Member greyhound's Avatar
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    jbl haters

    Im currently defending JBL against a bunch off audiophiles who are trying to convince me that JBL is rubbish and that i should trow them in the garbage.(www.hear.nl forum)
    I told them that every speaker (no matter how good it is ) will have a specific sound. In other words the speaker itself will have influence in the end result. I think some speakers are better in rock than otehers and some are better in classical or techno.
    I Said that of all the speakers ive heard in my life JBL is the one that makes sense of all kinds of music. They say if a speaker has preferences (soory for my english) its no good.
    Im a fighting windmills here or am i right.
    if you guys think im wrong i will immediatly accept it.
    So please let me know what your thinking
    robin
    finally i have a pair of 604 8g's....there not easy to find in the netherlands

  2. #2
    Senior Member LowPhreak's Avatar
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    Well, that's some of the same old "audiophile" crap I've heard for years. A lot of those guys are concerned mainly with imaging/soundstaging, who has the most exotic design, and bling. Anything that has real-world dynamics and honest, accurate bass output louder than a mouse fart is poo-pooed.




    "They say if a speaker has preferences...its no good."

    Let me tell ya, I've owned some of the best "audiophile approved" speakers (Apogee, B&W, Entec, KEF, Magnepan, Martin-Logan, Quad, REL), and there isn't a speaker in the world that doesn't "have preferences", ie: they ALL imprint their own "sound" on the end result. Some of these guys live in a fantasy world where they think if they try hard enough and throw enough money at it, that some day the perfect "neutral" speaker will come about.

    Ain't gonna happen.

    I've learned my lesson the hard way: you play what sounds most realistic to you and let the rest take a hike.

  3. #3
    Senior Member greyhound's Avatar
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    thats what i said. "youre living in a dream world when you think a speaker just reproduces sound"
    there will always be influence from the drivers , cabinets and so on.
    I told them the K2 s9500 was the best Speaker ive heard in my life time. They said its crap because it only goes until 35hz -6db.
    That must mean there are no good small cabinet speakers

    in my opinion when a speaker goes down to 20 hz you will need the perfect listening room. Some times you hear more room than music.

    A speaker is as good as the room you place it in right?
    for them its not about music but "how "something sounds.

    im talking to deaf people there. or am i?
    finally i have a pair of 604 8g's....there not easy to find in the netherlands

  4. #4
    Moderator hjames's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by greyhound View Post

    im talking to deaf people there. or am i?

    I think part of the problem is that once you have a certain amount of money invested in your system, you pretty much have to defend its merits above and beyond all comers or you seem a bit ... ridiculous. Its kind of like a placebo effect - you just HAVE to hear a difference.

    "I've spent $30,000 on this pair of Martin Lawrence speakers (made up name) and they are beyond your luddite Altec Model 19s (or JBL L300s or whatever). The sheer glisten of the violins heard in the post sonic range of 35ooo hz is just exquisite. I pooh pooh on your JBLs ... 20-20k is for dull-ears!"

    Or some such silly thing.
    It really doesn't sound like a place for productive discussions when all they do is insult you or your brand.
    2ch: WiiM Pro; Topping E30 II DAC; Oppo, Acurus RL-11, Acurus A200, JBL Dynamics Project - Offline: L212-TwinStack, VonSchweikert VR-4
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  5. #5
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    Ultimately it's pointless to argue with someone about brands or about specifications. Others will be emotionally attached to their favorite speakers just as I am attached to mine. We may try to use charts, graphs, and specifications to prove our point, but everyone (except Bose!) can produce those things. Then the argument shifts to "how" the sound was measured, or "why" one specification is more important than another, or "where" the measurement was made, or "what" was used in the audio chain to make the sound, etc.

    Very few people have ever listened to many speakers other than the ones they ended up purchasing, and the last time they heard a brand like JBL turns the argument into a "when" did you last hear a JBL, if ever?

    The fact remains that JBL is one of the oldest continuous loudspeaker brands in the world. Over its long history, it has accumulated more awards, developed more important technical and engineering innovations, and maintained the most diversified product line than virtually any other loudspeaker manufacturer.

    As a part of Harman International, it has access to the world's most sophisticated loudspeaker design and testing facility, has developed the world's most sophisticated listening panels and double-blind listening protocols, and has access to the greatest technical and artistic minds in loudspeaker design, all at the Northridge, California facility.

    JBL dominates theater, music hall, stadium, live venue, recording studio, and auditorium sound in many parts of the world. It is the most consistently widely-distributed brand around the world (check its Web site for countries and languages), and it has the largest support activities of any major brand.

    JBL recently won international recognition and awards for its Everest II DD66000, following up on its international award-winning K2 S9800. It developed unique and amazing technologies, including transducers, which are world-class and best-in-class in their execution.

    JBL is at the forefront of car audio, marine audio, professional audio, and home audio.

    It is also true that it is one of the most often criticized brands among boutique speaker owners, snobs, and people who hate big companies. Often these people will compare the under $1000/pair entry level JBL consumer speakers with speakers that cost much more and use that as an indictment of the entire product line. But on a price segment comparison basis, JBL can match or beat any brand out there.

    At the high end, it has a number of offerings that will humiliate similar priced lines, but since most people have never heard these JBLs, these people will use poor arguments and specs on paper to make their judgments. I make it a point to go to audio shops when I can to listen to the best they have. I am open to finding speakers that I can afford that will sound better than my JBLs.

    But in any case, when someone attacks JBLs, I can say that I have heard their speakers and what my opinion is based on actually hearing them, or I keep my mouth shut if I haven't heard them. If they cannot say they have heard comparable JBLs, then they are ignorant in every sense of the word, and I have no reason to want to argue with an ignorant person. It wastes both of our times.

  6. #6
    RIP 2021 SEAWOLF97's Avatar
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    The FORD , CHEVY and MOPAR guys all do that same thing.....
    It really has nothing to do with JBL or even speakers....it's just current human nature.
    Some kind of happiness is measured out in miles

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    Quote Originally Posted by LowPhreak View Post
    Well, that's some of the same old "audiophile" crap I've heard for years. A lot of those guys are concerned mainly with imaging/soundstaging, who has the most exotic design, and bling. Anything that has real-world dynamics and honest, accurate bass output louder than a mouse fart is poo-pooed.
    It took me a long time to learn that lesson. In the UK at least, when you hear a reviewer ravving about a speaker, they are nomally basing it on the performance with jazz/classical. Imaging/soundstage is everything to these guys but they generally don't worry about bass impact/dynamics.

    Anyway, don't let it get to you. Be safe in the knowledge that a lot of these audiophiles are actually getting ripped-off. I once overheard a conversion at a hi-fi show where a new loudspeaker designer was talking to a well respected retailer about what price point to target his new 2 way speaker design (6.25" woofer + tweeter - usual boring design). They were basically picking numbers (high numbers!) out of the air with no consideration of the actual production costs, etc. They knew that some audiophile would buy this new "groundbreaking" design no matter what the price is.

    That's the day I stopped reading reviews, etc.

  8. #8
    Senior Member dino's Avatar
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    From the 1940s altec lansing set the speaker audiophile world on fire. other speaker companies had 20 years to come up with there answer! (its so lonely at the top) Just when you thought it couldnt get any better here comes JBL, The Lansing speaker company set the standerd so damm high ethier you came correct or dont come at all.( Like james brown said-this is a man world)It was 1982 or 84 when jbl set the standerd agin with the L-250 the most accurate speaker in the world. If you are a true audiophile and it doesant matter what country your from -say the name JBL, I dont care what responce you get good or bad they KNOW the name JBL.

  9. #9
    RIP 2021 SEAWOLF97's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Andyoz View Post
    That's the day I stopped reading reviews, etc.
    I always like Julian Hirsh and Ken Pohlman ... they seemed to be "well grounded"
    Some kind of happiness is measured out in miles

  10. #10
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    There was trend in the UK in the 80/90's where "Audiophiles" were buying extremely expensive turntable/amps and running them into speakers costing about 1/10 the price of the rest of their system.

    Some opinion leader in audiophile circles had convinced people that this was a good basis to design a system, i.e. if it aint' perfect at the source, you can't improve on it. Imagine listening to Led Zep on those type of systems.

  11. #11
    Senior Member Tom Brennan's Avatar
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    Arguing preference is futile.

    Besides, today's typical "high-end" type audiophile is an overly refined, decadent and delusional ninny who'd be hard pressed to tell the working end of a hammer. Why care what such fools think?

  12. #12
    Senior Member JBLRaiser's Avatar
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    Don't need to go there and

    Quote Originally Posted by greyhound View Post
    Im currently defending JBL against a bunch off audiophiles who are trying to convince me that JBL is rubbish and that i should trow them in the garbage.(www.hear.nl forum)
    I told them that every speaker (no matter how good it is ) will have a specific sound. In other words the speaker itself will have influence in the end result. I think some speakers are better in rock than otehers and some are better in classical or techno.
    I Said that of all the speakers ive heard in my life JBL is the one that makes sense of all kinds of music. They say if a speaker has preferences (soory for my english) its no good.
    Im a fighting windmills here or am i right.
    if you guys think im wrong i will immediatly accept it.
    So please let me know what your thinking
    robin
    bash JBL speakers. The L100 gets bashed here all the time.:dont-know

  13. #13
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    Greyhound,

    Remember, at least you're not part of a group for which this product is targeted:

    http://6moons.com/audioreviews/furutech5/demag.html ......It's an $1,800 vinyl LP demagnetizer of course

    p.s. it does CD's and cables as well.....cooks a mean Flapjack too apparently!

  14. #14
    Senior Member Tom Brennan's Avatar
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    I call it 6 morons.

  15. #15
    RIP 2013 Rolf's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Andyoz View Post
    There was trend in the UK in the 80/90's where "Audiophiles" were buying extremely expensive turntable/amps and running them into speakers costing about 1/10 the price of the rest of their system.

    Some opinion leader in audiophile circles had convinced people that this was a good basis to design a system, i.e. if it aint' perfect at the source, you can't improve on it. Imagine listening to Led Zep on those type of systems.
    Don't really know how it is today, but in my most active hi-fi time it was said that a pair of speakers should cost the same or more as your amp and record player.

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