Paragon cd

[MJC]

I saw this on ebay this morning while doing a search for other jbl speakers.
JBL Paragon Complete Plans on CD circa 1958

[Don McRitchie]

The auction is here:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...category=32861

I am willing to bid on this to add it to our site. However, I have to admit I am a bit conflicted. The seller appears to have gone to some expense to produce this CD. My making it available here would likely kill a large part of his market, assuming he continues to sell additional copies. What do you think?

[Alex Lancaster]

IMHO, the seller scanned the papers, so He did not invest any significant money; If You think it would make a worthy addition, go for it.

Alex

[Mr. Widget]

I would say go ahead and bid. If you are a winning bidder and get a disc, hold on to it for some period of time for him to run a few subsequent auctions then you can post it.

[thevott]

Is the compact disc and/or the scans within protected under copyright laws? Or is the C44 public domain in any form? Permission may be in order. Nonetheless, it would truley be a welcomed addition to this great site.

[Don McRitchie]

Here are the issues as I see them.

From a legal perspective, copyright applies to the intellectual property and not the media. For example, I can't scan the latest Stephen King novel and claim that I own copyright for any CD copies that I make. Therefore, the only copyright for Paragon plans should rest with JBL no matter how the information is distributed.

It would appear that the seller does not have permission to resell JBL intellectual property. We have standing permission from JBL to use copyrighted vintage materials on our site so we would not be in violation. In a legal sense, I could justify buying and publishing the work on our site.

Legalities aside, I do have some qualms about destroying the value of this CD to the seller, which would likely happen if it were published here. The costs of producing the CD by the seller (even if not monetary) are not trivial. The plans are blueprint sized and cannot be scanned on a home scanner. I once looked into the costs of commercial scanning of these plans when it looked like someone might donate a set to us. It would have cost me around $400.

My guess is that the seller did not go this route, but rather had access to a large scale scanner, maybe through work. Nonetheless, the time and effort to scan such a large number of huge plans is considerable. This is why I feel some degree of conflict.

[maxwedge]

It's a dog eat dog world and it's getting nastier every day! I dought that guy has any legal status with those so I would say get them and post them. Maybe delay posting them if it makes you feel better.

I think JBL and other's should offer more plans, either for sale or free if possible. Especialy for out of pruduction models.

[dancing-dave]

"This disc contains copies of all 92 pages that were made available to the public in the late 50's to the early 60's."

-Taken from the auction page

Technically the content of this disk was originally intended for the public. Thus it would be safe to post these plans online assuming the seller is correct in stating this.

As a community, it may be favorable to decide what these plans are worth and to snipe in a bid for this amount (www.esnipe.com). I would be more than willing to donate towards this action.

[John Nebel]

Don,

I'd be willing to photograph these for you with the appropriate equipment if someone can loan me a copy of the plans.

If 92 pages fit on one CD - they can't be very high resolution

John

[JBLnsince1959]

Don:

Being in the software business myself I understand where you are coming form. However, there are two main issues here:
1. content
2. Physical media

1. the content on the CD is public domain and therefore it would not violate any ethical or legal matters to repoduce it ( the content) on the site. ALSO, since you have permission to use such material form JBL, this would further make it "OK" to produce the content on the site.

2. The physical CD and it's layout( and possibly the way he formatted in the contect), is his. In other words if you were simply copy his CD and sell the CD's then you would be violating his work. This of course you would not do and is not the issue here.

Therfore, it's only the content that is in question and since it's public nomain ( and youn have premission) then there should be no problem either moral ot legal.

However, if somehow this vilolates or makes uneasy something in YOU, then best not to do it. Better to sleep at night than have that nagging feeling inside.

One possible solution is for one of us to buy the CD. Remove the content and email it you.

something to think about

take care
rick

[Oldmics]

Gentlemen,Gentlemen-Ask and you shall recieve ! My 92 pages of Paragon plans are availiable to donate to this wonderful website.
These are exact sized copys of big blueprint sized pages,so some sort of industrial scanning will be necessary.My preference is to send these to Don and let him delegate the copying chore as he sees fit.

This donation only seems fair since I originally acquired these plans from a former patron on one of the old versions of this forum.What goes around comes around.

Now if I could only find those Metregon plans.

Best regards,Oldmics

[JBLnsince1959]

sounds cool