Think outside the box.........

[RacerXtreme]

You guys ever get into electrostats or magnetic ribbon speakers ? Their high end can be breath-taking at times. They're definitely not for the "loud and proud" crowd, but in the right room can be impressive. I had a set of Magnepan Tympani's about 20 years ago and wish I would have kept them. I bought them used for about a grand, but think they cost 3 or 4 times that when new. There were 3 hinged panels per side and by adjusting the contour of the panels, and depending on placement in the room, you could change their sound. There was no "box" per se. Each panel was something like 6' tall, 22" wide and about 2" thick. This is one of the few photos I could find on the internet:
http://www.mypages.iparenting.com/webs/racerxtreme/maggietympani1.jpg
They took a TON of power to get going and were better suited to use for listening to movie soundtracks, or jazz or classical music. Here's another
shot I found but did not have the 3 panels per side:

http://www.mypages.iparenting.com/webs/racerxtreme/maggietympani2.jpg

Just picked up this oriental room divider made out of carved sea-shells and it reminded me of the Maggies.
http://www.mypages.iparenting.com/webs/racerxtreme/orientaldivider.jpg

Maybe I'll look for another pair............



Guy

[Regis]

Whatwas the bass response like? Just curious, as I've never personally heard a pair...

[Titanium Dome]

Bass? What bass? There's no friggin' bass. :no:

Well, okay, there's usually a traditional bass module: a woofer in a box. Even today's high end electro or ribbon units are bounded by the box on the bottom.

[Titanium Dome]

BTW, I'm not crapping on electrostatic or ribbon units. They can sound brilliant. (pun intended :p ) It's just that at this point, they still have wonderful strengths and predictable weaknesses.

[gerard]

My very first speakers where quad electrostatic , then ess Amt1 and then Jbl .

I can only tell the quad sounds right but they have no bass and dynamic for Jazz and pop .

As I said before , quad can be something like a bmw 5 diesel with automatic drive , ess like an alfa romeo and Jbl 43xx like porsche turbo :bouncy:

Where is the Ferrari , I do not know ?

Gerard

[Mr. Widget]

Bass? What bass? There's no friggin' bass. :no:

Well, okay, there's usually a traditional bass module: a woofer in a box. Even today's high end electro or ribbon units are bounded by the box on the bottom.

Not always the case. This is a terrible photo, but the Sound Labs Ultimate 1s have very good response down to 30Hz. They are also quite large, but they are a true full range electrostatic panel.

Widget

[RacerXtreme]

Hey Mr. Widget:


How much are those Sound Lab speakers ? I've seen them somewhere before......:blink:


Ever had a chance to listen to them?

c-ya



Guy

[Mr. Widget]

I've heard them several times and a few different versions of them. I have a friend that had a pair of the Ultimate 1s and I have listened to them extensively. They are excellent. I prefer them to the Acoustats and Martin Logans I've heard. I'd say that they have all of the features of other great electrostats, great detail, a very large sound stage, etc. and are a bit more dynamic than most other panels, though they are still not quite as dynamic as a good horn system.

How much? I have no idea. They do tend to depreciate significantly... used Sound Labs are quite a bargain.

Widget

[Titanium Dome]

Depending on the source, you'll pay about $30k+ or - for a pair of these 24 Hz to ultrasonic peakers. Unfortunately, there's no response curve to illuminate what that claim looks like. Is it ruler flat? One would assume so based on the simple claim, but I think there might be a +3dB -6db (or more) in that equation.

Still, with enough power, say 300 or 400 Watts, these babies will do some amazing things. Yes, the bass is there; it's just not what we'd expect of a $30k rig.

Hope you don't mind some do-it-yourself assembly for $30k.

http://www.audiofederation.com/dealership/soundLAB/uncrating-and-setup/index.htm

At least when you're done, you've got coffins for the entire family. ;)

[yggdrasil]

At least when you're done, you've got coffins for the entire family. ;)
If I came home with a $30K bill, the coffins would come in handy at once.

[johnaec]

I wonder how those compare to the JBL K2 S9800 in roughly the same price range?

John

[Mr. Widget]

I have only heard the K2-S9800 at trade shows and have worked with the K2 components on the Project May, so I can't really say what my opinion would be, but I would expect that most folks would like one or the other... sort of the Hummer/Ferrari comparison. They are just so different. I haven't heard the Ultimates in years, but the last time I did the goose bump factor was off the charts. ...and as for bass, they have more extension than the K2-S9800.

Dome that was quite a thorough photo essay! Those are exactly like the ones my friend had. He may have paid extra, but Dr. West came out to his house and directed the assembly.

Widget

BTW: Guido's avatar is the A-1. It is essentially the same speaker with a wood frame and different transformers.

[louped garouv]

but I would expect that most folks would like one or the other... sort of the Hummer/Ferrari comparison. They are just so different. Widget




I wish for all of us that we have this issue to worry about in the not too distant future :D

[Titanium Dome]

... sort of the Hummer/Ferrari comparison. They are just so different. I haven't heard the Ultimates in years, but the last time I did the goose bump factor was off the charts. ...and as for bass, they have more extension than the K2-S9800.

Widget

As Bill Miller says, "Why can't it be both?" :p

I've heard the K2-S9800 at a couple of shows, the dealer, and in two homes. The home set ups were the most pleasing, but the guys were running relatively conservative amps. Both were bi-amping and running tubes on the top, SS on the bottom. No more than a few hundred Watts total. Nice, I thought, but perhaps underperforming a bit. I think I'd go SS all the way.

The one time I got close to the Ultimates over in Palos Verdes Estates, they were being pushed by some Krell FPB600 monoblocks. The whole set up was intimidating in a good way.

I wanted to put those Krells behind some K2-S9800s to see what they'd do, but of course the chance of that happening was zero.

You can quote me on this: I love great speakers, no matter how they sound.

But I'd have to say I like dynamic direct radiators better than electrostatics better than dynamic horns better than refelctive radiators better than plasmas better than...

http://www.plasmatweeter.de/

That is, unless it's Wednesday, in which case I like... :D

[Steve Schell]

In the early 1980s I went from owning Klipschorns to building fully adjustable stands and running stacked Quad ELS. The overall timbre and smoothness of the Quads was much better than the Klipsch, but I soon longed for the dynamic range and effortlessness of the horns. The old saying with Quads was "It takes 50 watts to drive them properly and 51 to blow them up."

The Quads, though sounding ravishing at times, were an emotional burden to live with. Whenever I would crank them up to lifelike volume I was running the risk of arcing the tweeter panels. I still remember that feeling of being on edge, ready to sprint to the volume knob at every instant.

Although other 'stats are free of the arcing problem, they all seem to suffer from a hard ceiling in dynamic range; above a certain point they just won't go any louder. Although they excell at sounding like an open window on the recorded event at low to moderate levels, that dynamic constriction is a gross coloration that I can no longer live with. The way I see it, my job from here on out is to refine horn systems to attain as much of the open window effect as possible while enjoying their dynamic freedom all the while.

[Robh3606]

With me only on the small side. I still own a pair of Koss ESP-9's headphones that I drag out every now and then. I never heard a pair that had the power and body in the lower midrange and bass that either dymanic speakers or horns have. They just don't seem to have the impact. Not sure it it's the lack of dynamics as Steve pointed out or something else. All the magesty, openess and sparkle with no power behind it. Same thing with a friends Magnepan just not enough umph behind it.


Rob:)