My upgrade project JBL L3

[CH46E]

Hello everyone.

After being outbid on some 4301b on the bay, I ended up with some clean L3s. I've been wanting some more JBLs every since I sold my recapped L80T. Regret it all the time! I have been wanting a 2 way JBL bookshelf but because of a rambunctious Belgian Malinois dog I can't keep speakers on stands. She will knock them over. So the L3 fit the bill perfectly. Floor standing 2 way with great looks.

I will be staring with the caps and resistors. I have decided on the Deulund silver graphite resistors. I still have yet to choose a cap. I'm am not very knowledgeable when it comes to inductors. I've read that it may not be as easy as just matching the mh value. Something about dcr???

Any help or suggestions for the inductors would be great.

I was also wondering if the 035tia is replaceable with another "better" JBL titanium dome like a 044 or 052? I had the 035ti in my L80T and L20t and I have always like the Ti JBL tweeters. I have hearing loss and the titanium seems to work well for me. I know they can be a bit bright but I like bright. If I keep the 035tia in there I will be looking at replacing the foam under the dome.

Once I get started on the work I'll throw up some pics.

Budget for the xover upgrade is about $300.00

I really appreciate any help you all can provide.

[HCSGuy]

Definitely replace the foam and see if it sounds to your liking. I do not know the specifics of your hearing loss, so I can’t say what tweeters you will like, but my absolute favorite direct radiating JBL tweeter is the 025Ti from the European Ti line, though it may be cheating as I think it’s actually made for JBL by Audax. Phenomenal detail. That and the Array horn tweeters are the best highs I’ve heard from JBL. Unfortunately, the 025Ti’s are not common, so your odds of finding them on the secondary market are slim, and I think they are about $190 each from JBL, which is steep for something you may not like, as they are probably not as bright as 035Ti’s, especially if your 035’s have ruined foam. However, if the foam in your 035’s has no damping, I don’t see any benefit to improving the crossover until that is fixed.

[CH46E]

I'm not sure o follow. You said "I dont see any benefit to upgrading the crossover". I figured they are 25 year old caps and made by the lowest bidder. I was thinking a fresh set would be good for them.

Could you elaborate a little please.

Thanks!
Chris

[Robh3606]

I figured they are 25 year old caps and made by the lowest bidder. I was thinking a fresh set would be good for them.

Hello Chris

If you are hell bent on messing with the crossovers leave the iron alone. Inductors are after all just a coil of wire not too much is going to go wrong and DCR values can be critical to a crossover design so best left alone. Also you don't need $20 resistors just get the mil versions at $3 a pop. I wouldn't bother with replacing them unless they show signs of being overheated.

Rob:)

[CH46E]

Thanks for the feedback. I will leave the coils alone. I have used Mills resistors before in my L80T. Maybe I'll go that route again. Now that it looks like the GOV might be down for awhile I may need to throttle back on costs. Got to love a furlough.




Hello Chris

If you are hell bent on messing with the crossovers leave the iron alone. Inductors are after all just a coil of wire not too much is going to go wrong and DCR values can be critical to a crossover design so best left alone. Also you don't need $20 resistors just get the mil versions at $3 a pop. I wouldn't bother with replacing them unless they show signs of being overheated.

Rob:)

[HCSGuy]

I'm not sure o follow. You said "I dont see any benefit to upgrading the crossover". I figured they are 25 year old caps and made by the lowest bidder. I was thinking a fresh set would be good for them.

Sorry - had a typo in my last sentence; now corrected.

[CH46E]

Sorry - had a typo in my last sentence; now corrected.

Oh ok, I got ya now. So yes, I'll work on making sure the tweeters are up to par first.
Thanks again

[CH46E]

Anyone have any suggestions for inside the cabinet? Is there anything you would do with them? Anything that could improve the overall quality of sound?


I do plan on a new vaneer for the sides. I really like the way these look.
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[Robh3606]

Anyone have any suggestions for inside the cabinet? Is there anything you would do with them? Anything that could improve the overall quality of sound?

Not if they are in good shape. No water damage, splits at the seems or other obvious issues. I have seen vernier bubble, split, crack and lift. A potential source for the cabinet to buzz. Other than that I would leave them as the are. The ones posted with the added or sanded and re-stained vernier look quite nice!

Rob:)

[BMWCCA]

Chris Hagen, the product designer for the L3, L5, L7 speakers, said the only compromise he had to make due to budget constraints was in the cabinets. I believe he was specific in saying they could be reinforced better but then he may have been directing those comments at the L7 exclusively. I own the L1, L3, L5, and L7 and don't have a problem with any of them. The structure of the L3 seems particularly robust given its squatty profile, but then to me it's always been the least satisfying of the four. That's not bad, it's just that the L1 performs beyond expectations and the voicing and soundstage of the L5 and L7 are clearly remarkable. The L3 is fine the way it is. Nothing more drivers and a larger box couldn't fix, but then you'd have an L7!
:D

[CH46E]

Chris Hagen, the product designer for the L3, L5, L7 speakers, said the only compromise he had to make due to budget constraints was in the cabinets. I believe he was specific in saying they could be reinforced better but then he may have been directing those comments at the L7 exclusively. I own the L1, L3, L5, and L7 and don't have a problem with any of them. The structure of the L3 seems particularly robust given its squatty profile, but then to me it's always been the least satisfying of the four. That's not bad, it's just that the L1 performs beyond expectations and the voicing and soundstage of the L5 and L7 are clearly remarkable. The L3 is fine the way it is. Nothing more drivers and a larger box couldn't fix, but then you'd have an L7!
:D


Well, I wanted L7s but the wife said I had to make room for them. I started selling some of my Polks. My RTA12B are my favorite and I'm keeping them. The SRS 2 and the SDA CRS are gone. I did not run that room like that. It was staged for a photo before I started selling them off.

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[old_4312]

I agree. Poly's don't break down like electrolytics do. If there are electrolytic caps in there, do replace those. The polys are in round cardboard boxes filled with sand and have wires coming out one end. The sand pack was for compression to prevent expansion under use which increases distortion. :bouncy: Check the polys with a cap meter to check values and matching. I solved a lot of my stereo imaging problems with my 4312's by hand selecting and matching the caps. A mono source can reveal differences between speakers.:)
QUOTE=Robh3606;419684]Hello Chris

If you are hell bent on messing with the crossovers leave the iron alone. Inductors are after all just a coil of wire not too much is going to go wrong and DCR values can be critical to a crossover design so best left alone. Also you don't need $20 resistors just get the mil versions at $3 a pop. I wouldn't bother with replacing them unless they show signs of being overheated.

Rob:)[/QUOTE]

[CH46E]

After driving a few hours I have them home now. First impression is "meh". They are ok, so so. I do like the tweeters. Bass is ridiculous high. Had to EQ some of it out. They sure can boom. Vocals seem to be lacking a little for my taste. I did just mow and edge the lawn before listening to them, so my hearing is likely off a bit. They use a LOT OF POWER! Where my Polk RTA12B would be at an extreame volume the L3s are asking for more. I have them on my Parasound 2250 v2. 225 watts at 8 ohms. I dont think I'll even bother with the NAD 90 watt amp.

To be honest I'm not sure I'm even going to mess with these. May just leave them alone. I will be using them as main while I finish the 12b refurb.

Thanks everyone for the info!

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[HCSGuy]

I used to sell these speakers at Circuit city, and I don't remember ever selling a pair of L3's - probably for the reasons you state. A/B'ing them with any other (louder) speaker made the other speaker seem better - L3's never really came alive. They were also, I think, $799/pr, and there were lots of other good speakers in that range. If you came into our store, you were far more likely to drive away with a pair of DCM TimeFrames - yeah, the drivers were shitty, but they sure sounded good.

[hjames]

Pretty sure these were the L7s during an infamous listening test at "Fred Sanford's" place circa 2008 ...
Think we also demoed some L20 speakers, L1s and a few others that weren't in the smaller range (some 4333s in evidence)

Keep the L3s intact - hunt for others (L5s, L7s) in the series!

831568315483155

[CH46E]

Thanks for the advice. Some cool pics. Are those 120Ti?
Some day I'll have some of them blue JBLs. Almost had a nice pair of 4301b baby blues.

I'm going to leave these L3s alone. I actually passed on a nice pair of L60T for the same price for the L3s. The L60T I know and have listened to a bit and liked them. Should have got them instead.

Live and learn right!

[BMWCCA]

I actually passed on a nice pair of L60T for the same price for the L3s. The L60T I know and have listened to a bit and liked them. Should have got them instead.
Heather will tell you (and I will agree with her), the L3 is a better speaker than the L60T. So, in that respect, you did okay! If I remember, heather modified the port on her L60T, then parted them out—or maybe sold them. :dont-know:

[SEAWOLF97]

Thanks for the advice. Some cool pics. Are those 120Ti?

sure looks like some. IMHO (:eek:) , the 120 is the best 3 way 12 inch "bookshelf" that JBL ever produced (under $5,000) .

[BMWCCA]

IMHO (:eek:) , the 120 is the best 3 way 12 inch "bookshelf" that JBL ever produced (under $5,000) .As I recall, the 120ti wasn't that impressive . . . until we lifted it off the floor and placed in on a chair then we all liked it quite a lot. I think it was that session listening to our host's 4333s that sent me on my quest for my own pair which ended in the purchase of my 4345s. Still love the L7 though. Those in the pictures are one of my two pair.

[hjames]

Yep, I had L60T speakers - I didn't like the rear port - it meant I had to leave clearance between them and the wall,
so I removed the tube from the rear port, got a hole saw the same size, drilled a port hole in the front, glued the resulting sawed plug into the rear port hole,
and had a speaker that better suited my needs. But - tried for ages and never could get more money for the speaker than the 035tia tweeters would sell for.
So, I gutted the speakers, sold the drivers, tried to give away the boxes and finally put the cabinets on the curb.

Phil's right - the L1, L3. L5, L7 series sound better than the older L20T, L60T, L80T series ...

[Ruediger]

I have been wanting a 2 way JBL bookshelf but because of a rambunctious Belgian Malinois dog I can't keep speakers on stands. She will knock them over..


If your Malinois messes up your flat then this may be an indication of underemployment. The Malinois is much more agile and demanding than a normal German Shepherd. If you don't give it employment it will start looking for some. May be eating your shoes or your sofa. Or may be taking over leadership in the family.

Regards
Ruediger

[CH46E]

If your Malinois messes up your flat then this may be an indication of underemployment. The Malinois is much more agile and demanding than a normal German Shepherd. If you don't give it employment it will start looking for some. May be eating your shoes or your sofa. Or may be taking over leadership in the family.

Regards
Ruediger


All very true. We keep her busy and she loves chasing the fast RC Boat on the lake. We hide stuff for her to find all the time and she even recycles things for us. Water bottles paper plates etc.

But..... when she and our Anatolian Shepherd get to playing they get rough and tend to knock things over.

We have been very lucky that the Belgian (Zoe) is not destructive. 83157

[CH46E]

As I stated before, I'm not really thrilled with the L3s.

Is there any way to help bring the vocals out/up a bit and maybe tame the tweeter just a hair.

I almost traded them for a pair of JBL S38s. I know it may sound corny but I find the L3 aesthetically pleasing. I want to keep them in the living room. Plus the wife seems to like them.

Originally I had planned to just recap them altogether. But with the less than stellar performance I was just going to leave them alone.

Are there some value changes I could make to the caps and or resistors that may help accomplish my goal of opening up the vocals?

Thanks guys.

[BMWCCA]

Swap them out for L5s. They don't cost that much more, usually.
I have a pair in my new home filling in until I can get the 4345s set up here.
They're doing very well with a Crown PS400 and PSL2 in a large room.

[CH46E]

Swap them out for L5s. They don't cost that much more, usually.
I have a pair in my new home filling in until I can get the 4345s set up here.
They're doing very well with a Crown PS400 and PSL2 in a large room.


I'd really like some L5 but right now I'm trying to get my hands on a Carver TFM45 to send out for upgrade and restoration.

Just need to get my Parasound 2250 v2 sold.

Thanks for the suggestions.

[SEAWOLF97]

I was also wondering if the 035tia is replaceable with another "better" JBL titanium dome like a 044 or 052? I had the 035ti in my L80T and L20t and I have always like the Ti JBL tweeters. I have hearing loss and the titanium seems to work well for me. I know they can be a bit bright but I like bright. If I keep the 035tia in there I will be looking at replacing the foam under the dome.

don't mistake this post for snark

I would bet that time in or around CH46's could have a detrimental affect on hearing. UH1's sure did for me, also all that time being 20 feet away from F4's in burner/launch mode. :eek:

A hearing exam MAY be prudent before making mods to hardware. If you make a claim with the VA, they will test for free and you may even earn a percent rating. ;)



After being outbid on some 4301b on the bay

I just finished up refoaming a pair of L19's (supposed to be a pretty close equivalent of the 4301b) and was quite impressed.

[clwinbe]

As I stated before, I'm not really thrilled with the L3s.

Is there any way to help bring the vocals out/up a bit and maybe tame the tweeter just a hair.

I almost traded them for a pair of JBL S38s. I know it may sound corny but I find the L3 aesthetically pleasing. I want to keep them in the living room. Plus the wife seems to like them.

Originally I had planned to just recap them altogether. But with the less than stellar performance I was just going to leave them alone.

Are there some value changes I could make to the caps and or resistors that may help accomplish my goal of opening up the vocals?

Thanks guys.

i work for a local speaker manufacturer. They had a stack of bases that went it’s one of their towers. If fits perfectly and provides a spiked heavy stable base that adds 4”. I found they sound much better up at this altitude. 871598715987159