Voltiaudio

[Wagner]

Hello,
I just recently wrote this fellow, Greg Roberts and asked him a few simple questions regarding his driver selections and specs of his systems as it would pertain to planning good amplification matching.

His response let us say was a bit less than forthcoming.
I first heard of this guy because of the restoration work, fancy cabinets, veneer jobs and box modifications which he was doing for and on Klipsch products. Seemed interesting and his work looked good as far as I could tell from photographs.

I initially was going to discuss some custom work on a pair of JBL boxes with the man.

Now it would appear he is no longer doing that as his loudspeakers have become quite trendy in certain circles and he appears and claims to be doing well enough to require devoting all of his time and efforts to that endeavor. More power to him and congratulations.

Still, it bothers me that any speaker manufacturer would be reluctant to at least provide the most basic of technical details regarding his systems. And as much as the quality of his wood work he really really really sells the fact that his systems are 100% Made in U.S.A. so that claim really piqued my curiosity as to who's drivers he was using or was this guy by wild ass chance actually building his own here in the U.S.A.!? At his asking prices I thought it might be possible, maybe.

I also pointed out that I consider this essential information also as to the what when and how to obtain service parts if he were NOT to survive forever (like diaphragms and the like)

Could anyone here shed any light on these designs?

His main emphasis on his website is the high quality of fit and finish, his heirloom quality boxes and the fact that he makes certain every piece of grille cloth is attched perfectly square.

I will be the first to admit that I too apprecaiate those things but I'd be even more interested in what's actually inside the boxes.

It's not as if one could not be opened and the big secret revealed.

My email to Greg Roberts:

Hello,
Please tell me if your would; what "brand" of transducers do you employ in your beautiful designs?
Please advise.
Thank you for your time and consideration

His reply:

Hi,
I'm sorry but I don't disclose what brand or model of drivers I use. I cantell you that the tweeter uses a 1" compression driver, the mid a 2" outletcompression driver with a 3.5" diaphragm, and the woofer is a high-power,pro-audio 15" driver. Why do you ask?
Regards,Greg Roberts
www.voltiaudio.com (http://www.voltiaudio.com/)

My response:

Hello Greg Roberts,
Well, I am sorry to hear that but not surprised.
As you are unwilling to reveal your "proprietary" off the shelf selections (I suspect) when it comes to driver selections then what does it matter "why" I ask.
But suffice it to say, in my opinion, anyone (purchaser) serious and knowledgeable in system matching and amplifier building and modifications (tubes) would certainly find this information useful.
I certainly hope you can understand that. Many of your boxes have been "opened up" and commented upon at various (many) "places" on the internet. I take much of this sort of palaver with a pound of salt.
I simply wanted to confirm, from the "horses mouth" as it were, the accuracy and the facts, rather than deal in second hand information and speculation. I could also find no technical data sheets on your web site, only glowing hyperbole and "glamour" shots. It may all very well be true, and well deserved (I have read nothing to cast doubt) BUT it is a brand of information of little use to an amp builder.
And again, when you ask me "why do I ask" I almost feel as if you are pulling my leg.
My age and current health prohibit me from a whole lot of system building at this point in Life; I found yours intriguing and their obvious beauty and attention to detail (fit and finish) make in them a viable candidate for me as I too find that element of system building important.
But there is more to it than perfectly attached grille cloth or exotic veneers (as you well know) and though nice, very nice indeed, I am still at a point in my audio endeavors to need a bit more information than that.
Sorry to hear you are unwilling or unable to help. I will learn what I seek from other sources.
I also find it difficult to be sitting here even justifying my most reasonable and practical inquiry!
Here's wishing you and your business well!
Thank you for your time and consideration.

Greg's response:

Hi,
I'm sorry you're having such difficulty with my decision to keep thisinformation private. I have my reasons. It does matter why anyone asks me about the drivers. Many people wish tobuild their own speakers, and would like to use the same drivers that I amusing and then claim they have made a Volti speaker. That's obviously notsomething I have any control over. But I do have control over whatinformation I choose to give out about my speakers. Regarding the technical specifications of my speakers, or the technicalspecs on the drivers for that matter, I am the first to admit that I am notmuch of a technician when it comes to designing and building speakers. Ionly put a small amount of importance on such things. I am more of anartist, and I use my ears to judge what I hear, and I take action based onwhat I hear. I fully understand that for some people that is not how theywish to buy audio products. There are those who focus on the technicalspecifications, and that's fine. They simply are not my customers, and Iaccept that. People buy audio equipment for many different reasons, and they usedifferent criteria for determining what they wish to own. Volti Audio hastheir customers and YG Acoustics, Raidho, JBL, etc... all have theircustomers. It's all good.
Regards, Greg Roberts
www.voltiaudio.com (http://www.voltiaudio.com/)

:confused: :eek: Is this guy just full of shit or is it me?
There were a few more exchanges but I'll spare you the rest.
Suffice it to say it got a little "testy".
Speakers he's asking over $15K for and he won't tell me what's in them?
Kind of blows my mind. But what do I know?
I reminded him of long gone trendy builders of audio like Audio Alchemy, California Audio etc.........didn't seem to phase him (my, and I would think anyone's, concern with future parts and or service needs.)
What the heck's up with this guy. But most importantly, can anyone please shed any light on what he's running in these boxes?
Just new and improved variations on Klipsch designs? I'd love to know.

Thank you!

[Bobecca]

Looks like the Klipsh:D I think I would go for the original ones. At least you know what you get;)But it says it is made in USA. Then the drivers are made there as well:)

[honkytonkwillie]

Interesting. In your exchange with him he claims not to be much of a technician when it comes to designing and building speakers, and puts a small amount of importance on such things.

From that I gather he doesn't understnad very much about how speakers work. Solely putting trust in ones ears is a pretty dubious way to design speakers - especially when self-bias somes into play. "Trust my ears" is one of those claims that's impossible to verify or counter. The sooner it comes out in conversation, the less I believe the claimant understands and more I believe they're concealing a lack thereof.

("Trust my ears" is not always suspicious. Many interviews with designers I've read and watched talk about their process and what they were aiming for, the trade-offs, alternatives, and what-not. "Trust my ears" for them tends to come at the end of the process, perhaps choosing one capacitor over another in a crossover.)

He provides an off-the-shelf Marchand (a long time DIY vendor) amplifier for his subwoofer, so it wouldn't surprise me if the drivers are commonly available, DIY drivers as well. If everyone knew that, it'd be tough to maintain a $15k price tag on his systems. I mean really - if they were manufactured to his spec, I think he'd proudly say so. And he'd probably have some say in the quantities manufactured and some control their distribution; and not fear so much people copying his product.

[honkytonkwillie]

Looks like the Klipsh:D I think I would go for the original ones. At least you know what you get;)But it says it is made in USA. Then the drivers are made there as well:)

He can define Made in USA any way he pleases until someone calls him on it.

[hjames]

He was a member of this forum for a while, had some JBL restoration on his site that looked very nice,
back in the days of Scott and Zilch and Ken (say '06 or so)
... He was very friendly and showed off some JBLs he refurbed, and beautiful Rosewood Klipsch he redid ...
At some point he did a restoration or a build for some customer that used some very personalized stylings.
It wasn't bubinga (? sorry, I am not a cabinetmaker) but it had a pretty dramatic pattern on the wood and
some members really vented their distaste on the look of those speakers.

He did what his customer wanted, I gather it was a very well funded project, but some of the members here were
merciless about what they felt it looked like, and he left the forum shortly afterwards.

I heard the Volti speakers and a matched sub at the Capital Audio show a few years back -
and yes, they were pretty pricey, but they looked very nice and the music he played sounded great,
and he was very friendly to everyone that came up and talked to him.

http://www.voltiaudio.com/

No snark meant, but maybe he just didn't take kindly to a series of emails grilling him?

[sheltiedave]

Wagner, you questioned him and he correctly assessed that you meant his business little good, so he did not provide the information you wanted. There are few difficulties sourcing 1" compression tweeters, 2" compression mids, and 15" 4 ohm woofers that will exceed the design performance specs of the Klipsch guts.

TAD, BMS, PAudio, JBL, Beyma, Eminence, Radian, Truextant, etc are the usual suspects. I'm sure if you spent the money to attend one of the expositions where he displayed, you went to one of his owner client's home for an in-house, or you read the various Klipsch threads where he kicked around some ideas, you could readily glean which direction he went. In doing this venture, he did not do Klipsch any favors, but Klipsch corporate showed no indication of bringing the Jubilee to market, and readily discontinued production of the Cornwall(since restarted) and Belle.

Volti has been formally reviewed a couple times. Maybe you can find the info there, but posting a snarky thread is beneath you. If you disagree with him, just come out and say you disagree with his pricing, or that he is sourcing components that don't match, or that his lack of attention to physics is castrating the quality of his speakers. His lack of being forthcoming is the exact approach 80% of speaker builders would provide to any generic query. Even Volti has competition.

I'm not trying to beat you up too much. I have 1963 KHorns, and besides the stock Jensen P15LL woofers and stock tophat, I can also run JBL 2470 mids through Martinelli trachorns, JBL 2404 tweets thru babycheeks, with JBL LE85s and wide dispersion trachorns, and TAD TD 2001/Edgar salad bowl horns. Klipsch has totally missed the boat over the last twenty years, as DIYers have taken the KHorn performance level where Paul wanted, but the factory has not followed suit. The active presence of a DIY cottage industry for crossovers, various horns, and in VoltiAudio's case, complete integrated speakers, shows that nature abhors a vacuum. :)

Dave

[sheltiedave]

And, shockingly, Art has answered your question in part. Some of the reviewers have not been of great service, but Art did at least a little homework.
http://www.stereophile.com/node/226666

[Wagner]

Wagner, you questioned him and he correctly assessed that you meant his business little good, so he did not provide the information you wanted. There are few difficulties sourcing 1" compression tweeters, 2" compression mids, and 15" 4 ohm woofers that will exceed the design performance specs of the Klipsch guts.

TAD, BMS, PAudio, JBL, Beyma, Eminence, Radian, Truextant, etc are the usual suspects. I'm sure if you spent the money to attend one of the expositions where he displayed, you went to one of his owner client's home for an in-house, or you read the various Klipsch threads where he kicked around some ideas, you could readily glean which direction he went. In doing this venture, he did not do Klipsch any favors, but Klipsch corporate showed no indication of bringing the Jubilee to market, and readily discontinued production of the Cornwall(since restarted) and Belle.

Volti has been formally reviewed a couple times. Maybe you can find the info there, but posting a snarky thread is beneath you. If you disagree with him, just come out and say you disagree with his pricing, or that he is sourcing components that don't match, or that his lack of attention to physics is castrating the quality of his speakers. His lack of being forthcoming is the exact approach 80% of speaker builders would provide to any generic query. Even Volti has competition.

I'm not trying to beat you up too much. I have 1963 KHorns, and besides the stock Jensen P15LL woofers and stock tophat, I can also run JBL 2470 mids through Martinelli trachorns, JBL 2404 tweets thru babycheeks, with JBL LE85s and wide dispersion trachorns, and TAD TD 2001/Edgar salad bowl horns. Klipsch has totally missed the boat over the last twenty years, as DIYers have taken the KHorn performance level where Paul wanted, but the factory has not followed suit. The active presence of a DIY cottage industry for crossovers, various horns, and in VoltiAudio's case, complete integrated speakers, shows that nature abhors a vacuum. :)

Dave


Thank you for the detailed post, but I think you missed the essence of my disbelief and the basis for my question here.

Maybe I "over asked" my question of poor Greg.

I now wonder if I should have asked him what the country of origin was for his drivers rather than the manufacturer's name and model. Would he have gone into cardiac arrest? Problem is however, that would not have helped a bit with what I truly wanted to know which was system characteristics. I am not trying to "expose" Volti Audio, but he sure reacted like a guy that's got something to hide, or at least keep hush hush. That's certainly the vibe I got.
My point was and still is, I cannot believe his response. As you have pointed out (and I) the answer could can and will be readily obtained with enough effort. I just personally don't think that's the way it should be, my opinion.

To display such reluctance up and until the information is widely known will not help his cause I fear. Greg claims to admire and be inspired very much by Paul Klipsch......well we all know the famous reaction Paul Klipsch would have to all of this secrecy nonsense! (remember his famous yellow badges! :)) Used frequently for just such occasions as this.

I have written dozens of folks over the years with inquiries regarding county of origin and or manufacturer of goods. Everything from water faucets to audio equipment. ALL have always been willing to provide an answer. An example? Even Icon Audio will freely admit that their amplifiers are actually made in china although finished up in Britain.
I am certain they do not relish having that discussion as a large portion of their marketing is tilted toward the made in the U.K. element, still, with integrity, they do (when asked directly).
But I'm getting a little off track here..................

I fully understand and accept the concept too of building and selling audio jewelry. That is fine and is certainly Volti's or anyone else's right to do so. I don't have any issue with that. But most certainly some buyers are also interested in other aspects of any given design, not just the potential "heirloom" factor of the wooden box.

If I am going to buy an automobile for example, regardless of my motives or how impractical the overall eye candy design may be, I still also enjoy the right of knowing just exactly what is under the hood. Would you not agree?

I fail to see the "snark" in my inquiry (aside from despising that current catch phrase), either to Volti or in my thread here. Maybe the whole dialog wound me up a bit, but "snark"?

I also learned a long time ago that when one is engaged in the business of selling, selling anything, the greatest mistake you can make is to pre-judge or assume to know what is in the potential customer's pocket. Big mistake there!

My initial email to Volti was a very simple question and one which I do not find confrontational in the least; who's drivers do you use?

I did not press for specific model numbers or chastise him or press for a defense of his asking price initially. just a simple question.

Greg's claim that one of his concerns is that folks will copy his designs and claim them to be Volti is also absurd. How many do it yourselfers posses the degree of woodworking tools and skills to pull off the cabinets of the quality he's building? And if they did I don't think they'd be counterfeiting a relatively unknown cottage brand of loudspeaker which could be easily verified if fake. It's all rather silly to me and smacks of deception.

And just to remind, I did ask for the very reason I stated, matching! He doesn't even publish or provide the most rudimentary system specs, forget about the driver specifics! Then turns around and states he doesn't want to go the showroom route, is happy with internet sales only...........I mean how on Earth could one anticipate how this very expensive system might work in one's room?

Most manufacturers I have ever known, unless they build their own as is the case with a company such as pre-Mexican JBL are pleased to inform you of their choices, especially if those choices are of a premium, high quality variety.

So I stand in my bewilderment still.

If anyone owns a pair of these designs or actually knows what he's currently using please share (possibly already answered, if so thank you!).

And thank you for the link, I will read it now.

To quote a great man and friend, I hope accurately:
"More data, less wank"

[Wagner]

Interesting. In your exchange with him he claims not to be much of a technician when it comes to designing and building speakers, and puts a small amount of importance on such things.

From that I gather he doesn't understnad very much about how speakers work. Solely putting trust in ones ears is a pretty dubious way to design speakers - especially when self-bias somes into play. "Trust my ears" is one of those claims that's impossible to verify or counter. The sooner it comes out in conversation, the less I believe the claimant understands and more I believe they're concealing a lack thereof.

("Trust my ears" is not always suspicious. Many interviews with designers I've read and watched talk about their process and what they were aiming for, the trade-offs, alternatives, and what-not. "Trust my ears" for them tends to come at the end of the process, perhaps choosing one capacitor over another in a crossover.)

He provides an off-the-shelf Marchand (a long time DIY vendor) amplifier for his subwoofer, so it wouldn't surprise me if the drivers are commonly available, DIY drivers as well. If everyone knew that, it'd be tough to maintain a $15k price tag on his systems. I mean really - if they were manufactured to his spec, I think he'd proudly say so. And he'd probably have some say in the quantities manufactured and some control their distribution; and not fear so much people copying his product.


Thank you x2

But regardless of what he's doing and why, I only asked him as to better understand the system!

What he uses or doesn't use is his business, but anyone selling speakers at this price point should not be so reluctant to share the technical particulars of the most basic elements of the system.

Any proprietary design elements, patents, secret Tibetan mountain tops where magic wire is made, whatever................fine, keep,it yourself. But the most basic of basics should not be a big secret, especially justified by some artistic aesthetic nonsense and the claimed fear of being the victim of theft.

All systems were voiced by ear with the help of a slide rule for decades, there's nothing new or special there, or necessarily wrong for that matter if it makes you happy. And as I have mentioned, the number of folks willing to invest the time, expense in material and tools, buy the parts and are in the possession of the woodworking skills and the work space with which to commit this larceny, not to mention the time?..........well, you see my point. I have a strong feeling that those folks could probably afford to just buy Greg's creations and be done with it.

I find the whole thing absurd.

His reasons given for not answering my question are spurious and just do not ring true.

And again for the new agers, my OPINION

[Carl_Huff]

I have interacted with Greg a few times and found him to always be a gentlemen and a very good cabinetmaker. I am certain if he viewed you as a potential customer he would have afforded you more details.

Incidentally Eminence built most of the drivers used classic Klipsch products that inspire Greg. Part of Paul's magic was his ability to extract good sounds from inexpensive parts. In my observation Greg tends to use more expensive off the shelf drivers built for the pro market.
______________
Best Regards,
Carl Huff

[Wagner]

I have interacted with Greg a few times and found him to always be a gentlemen and a very good cabinetmaker. I am certain if he viewed you as a potential customer he would have afforded you more details.

Incidentally Eminence built most of the drivers used classic Klipsch products that inspire Greg. Part of Paul's magic was his ability to extract good sounds from inexpensive parts. In my observation Greg tends to use more expensive off the shelf drivers built for the pro market.
______________
Best Regards,
Carl Huff

As I said, never presume to know what's in a man's wallet, especially if you have something you'd like to sell that is a discretionary or luxury product.

I posted my initial contact email with Greg Roberts. If he was able to discern whether I was a potential customer or not from that then he's in the wrong business.

As for your statement regarding Eminence, Klipsch and the word "most", well it is just not true
Not even close. The "most" part that is. Was spread out over several vendors and often more than a few at the same time. "Most" woofers for a while, maybe.

Read this:
http://www.amazon.com/Paul-Wilbur-Klipsch-Life-Legend/dp/1582442266

I have acknowledged his fine cabinetry work several times already although his tastes in veneer are, let us just say a bit over the top and quite busy!

[Maron Horonzakz]

Let me set the record straight,,,I knew Paul klipsch very well.... He never made any of his drivers,,, only the speaker cabinets,,,,JBL also sourced other manufactured speaker drivers...so I don't understand the beef,,,

[AussieSteve]

Hello,
I just recently wrote this fellow, Greg Roberts and asked him a few simple questions regarding his driver selections and specs of his systems as it would pertain to planning good amplification matching.

His response let us say was a bit less than forthcoming.
I first heard of this guy because of the restoration work, fancy cabinets, veneer jobs and box modifications which he was doing for and on Klipsch products. Seemed interesting and his work looked good as far as I could tell from photographs.

I initially was going to discuss some custom work on a pair of JBL boxes with the man.

Now it would appear he is no longer doing that as his loudspeakers have become quite trendy in certain circles and he appears and claims to be doing well enough to require devoting all of his time and efforts to that endeavor. More power to him and congratulations.

Still, it bothers me that any speaker manufacturer would be reluctant to at least provide the most basic of technical details regarding his systems. And as much as the quality of his wood work he really really really sells the fact that his systems are 100% Made in U.S.A. so that claim really piqued my curiosity as to who's drivers he was using or was this guy by wild ass chance actually building his own here in the U.S.A.!? At his asking prices I thought it might be possible, maybe.

I also pointed out that I consider this essential information also as to the what when and how to obtain service parts if he were NOT to survive forever (like diaphragms and the like)

Could anyone here shed any light on these designs?

His main emphasis on his website is the high quality of fit and finish, his heirloom quality boxes and the fact that he makes certain every piece of grille cloth is attched perfectly square.

I will be the first to admit that I too apprecaiate those things but I'd be even more interested in what's actually inside the boxes.

It's not as if one could not be opened and the big secret revealed.

My email to Greg Roberts:

Hello,
Please tell me if your would; what "brand" of transducers do you employ in your beautiful designs?
Please advise.
Thank you for your time and consideration

His reply:

Hi,
I'm sorry but I don't disclose what brand or model of drivers I use. I cantell you that the tweeter uses a 1" compression driver, the mid a 2" outletcompression driver with a 3.5" diaphragm, and the woofer is a high-power,pro-audio 15" driver. Why do you ask?
Regards,Greg Roberts
www.voltiaudio.com (http://www.voltiaudio.com/)

My response:

Hello Greg Roberts,
Well, I am sorry to hear that but not surprised.
As you are unwilling to reveal your "proprietary" off the shelf selections (I suspect) when it comes to driver selections then what does it matter "why" I ask.
But suffice it to say, in my opinion, anyone (purchaser) serious and knowledgeable in system matching and amplifier building and modifications (tubes) would certainly find this information useful.
I certainly hope you can understand that. Many of your boxes have been "opened up" and commented upon at various (many) "places" on the internet. I take much of this sort of palaver with a pound of salt.
I simply wanted to confirm, from the "horses mouth" as it were, the accuracy and the facts, rather than deal in second hand information and speculation. I could also find no technical data sheets on your web site, only glowing hyperbole and "glamour" shots. It may all very well be true, and well deserved (I have read nothing to cast doubt) BUT it is a brand of information of little use to an amp builder.
And again, when you ask me "why do I ask" I almost feel as if you are pulling my leg.
My age and current health prohibit me from a whole lot of system building at this point in Life; I found yours intriguing and their obvious beauty and attention to detail (fit and finish) make in them a viable candidate for me as I too find that element of system building important.
But there is more to it than perfectly attached grille cloth or exotic veneers (as you well know) and though nice, very nice indeed, I am still at a point in my audio endeavors to need a bit more information than that.
Sorry to hear you are unwilling or unable to help. I will learn what I seek from other sources.
I also find it difficult to be sitting here even justifying my most reasonable and practical inquiry!
Here's wishing you and your business well!
Thank you for your time and consideration.

Greg's response:

Hi,
I'm sorry you're having such difficulty with my decision to keep thisinformation private. I have my reasons. It does matter why anyone asks me about the drivers. Many people wish tobuild their own speakers, and would like to use the same drivers that I amusing and then claim they have made a Volti speaker. That's obviously notsomething I have any control over. But I do have control over whatinformation I choose to give out about my speakers. Regarding the technical specifications of my speakers, or the technicalspecs on the drivers for that matter, I am the first to admit that I am notmuch of a technician when it comes to designing and building speakers. Ionly put a small amount of importance on such things. I am more of anartist, and I use my ears to judge what I hear, and I take action based onwhat I hear. I fully understand that for some people that is not how theywish to buy audio products. There are those who focus on the technicalspecifications, and that's fine. They simply are not my customers, and Iaccept that. People buy audio equipment for many different reasons, and they usedifferent criteria for determining what they wish to own. Volti Audio hastheir customers and YG Acoustics, Raidho, JBL, etc... all have theircustomers. It's all good.
Regards, Greg Roberts
www.voltiaudio.com (http://www.voltiaudio.com/)

:confused: :eek: Is this guy just full of shit or is it me?
There were a few more exchanges but I'll spare you the rest.
Suffice it to say it got a little "testy".
Speakers he's asking over $15K for and he won't tell me what's in them?
Kind of blows my mind. But what do I know?
I reminded him of long gone trendy builders of audio like Audio Alchemy, California Audio etc.........didn't seem to phase him (my, and I would think anyone's, concern with future parts and or service needs.)
What the heck's up with this guy. But most importantly, can anyone please shed any light on what he's running in these boxes?
Just new and improved variations on Klipsch designs? I'd love to know.

Thank you!

I Have just discovered Volti horns as well, and I fell in love with what I saw. I was watching them and him promote same on Youtube, and it seemed ridiculous using horns and his hands to show how sound works. Unprofessional for someone flogging $20K loudspeakers. As I looked at the website, I noticed nothing related to real specs or components. I was seriously considering putting away some cash to buy them, but after this I will not bother. This bloke could be out of business in a year and I have NOWHERE to go for parts or service! It's a shame he's not sold himself and his company as a serious player, the speakers are gorgeous. I happened to find another maker, DC10 Audio, they make great horn speakers and indeed one model- the Berlin Reference that comes with a JBL Alnico NOS driver from around 1979!!! They sound great.

[hjames]

I am not affiliated with volti in any way - I just read the guys posts here and heard/saw them at an audio show a few years back.

I have to ask - have you actually HEARD or seen a pair of them live and in person?

Not via youtube or some web video, but in the same room as you are in?

It just seems like that should be the real test of the speaker's quality ...

He was quite personable when I met him - he had an upper horn open and I could see the parts inside it -
it looked well made and it didn't seem like he was hiding anything to the folks at the show.






I Have just discovered Volti horns as well, and I fell in love with what I saw.
I was watching them and him promote same on Youtube, and it seemed ridiculous using horns and his hands
to show how sound works. Unprofessional for someone flogging $20K loudspeakers.
As I looked at the website, I noticed nothing related to real specs or components.
I was seriously considering putting away some cash to buy them, but after this I will not bother.
This bloke could be out of business in a year and I have NOWHERE to go for parts or service!
It's a shame he's not sold himself and his company as a serious player, the speakers are gorgeous.
I happened to find another maker, DC10 Audio, they make great horn speakers and indeed one model- the Berlin Reference that comes with a JBL Alnico NOS driver from around 1979!!! They sound great.

[shepjk01]

Sorry to hear Gregg was so standoffish. He started on the klipsch forums as a diyer and did veneer work on the side. From there he was helped by a few people to design a tractrix horn for a 2inch compression driver that could replace the stock k400 in the klipsch reference series. ALK engineering helped him with his crossover design. All his designs are based on upgraded klipsch heritage speakers. I owned a pair of his tractrix horns and his fit and finish are top quality. He never provided any measurements so I did it myself as I have all the equipment. He was always nice to deal. As far as drives last I new he was using a BMS 4592 for the mid and a eminence woofer similar to crites CW. He needs to invest in some measurement gear especially with building his own $15000 speakers.

[svollmer]

I'm not affiliated with Volti in any way either, but I'm just perplexed at what all the fuss is about. Mr. Roberts is certainly not the first to own a speaker company by focusing on the area of his expertise (cabinet making) and subcontracting some of the other work out (acoustical design). John Otvos of Waveform fame did exactly this too. Revel uses Kevin Voecks and many speaker manufacturers use a combination of in-house and contracted resources to design/test/finalize their products and then the produce them for market.

I too met Mr. Roberts at the 2013 and 2012 Capital Audiofests and he was a complete joy to talk to and took the time to explain how his speakers are built, what his design goals are, etc. And they sounded Fantastic! The first year I met him, he had the drivers he used on display. The following year, he told me that he had decided to no longer advertise what he uses because he wanted that kept confidential. So what? Will any BBQ sauce maker tell you his/her recepie? If not, does it taste worse?

And almost NO speaker manufacturer today makes their drivers in-house, nor will they tell you what they use. Some may tell you that their tweeters are from Focal or their woofers are from Accuton. But none of them will tell you exaclty which models they use and if they're modified for their design, they will never tell you what the modification is. Ask Wilson Audio what drivers they use; they'll most likely not share much. And they pot their crossovers so others can't see what components are in them without destroying them.

If I don't like what a manufacturer tells me, I don't try to get them to change their business practice. I just move on.

I see nothing illegal, immoral, or unethical here. Sorry, just my perspective.

[hjames]

OMG - JBL potted their older crossovers too - the SCANDAL!! :crying:

(Have a great weekend Steve!)


Ask Wilson Audio what drivers they use; they'll most likely not share much. And they pot their crossovers so others can't see what components are in them without destroying them.

If I don't like what a manufacturer tells me, I don't try to get them to change their business practice. I just move on.

I see nothing illegal, immoral, or unethical here. Sorry, just my perspective.

[Wagner]

I Have just discovered Volti horns as well, and I fell in love with what I saw. I was watching them and him promote same on Youtube, and it seemed ridiculous using horns and his hands to show how sound works. Unprofessional for someone flogging $20K loudspeakers. As I looked at the website, I noticed nothing related to real specs or components. I was seriously considering putting away some cash to buy them, but after this I will not bother. This bloke could be out of business in a year and I have NOWHERE to go for parts or service! It's a shame he's not sold himself and his company as a serious player, the speakers are gorgeous. I happened to find another maker, DC10 Audio, they make great horn speakers and indeed one model- the Berlin Reference that comes with a JBL Alnico NOS driver from around 1979!!! They sound great.


Thank you, the voice of reason and from someone that actually read my post.

I don't know what all this Greg Roberts defense league lecturing is all about; all I wanted to know was who's (more importantly models and or specs) drivers he used for two reasons:
1. Amp compatibility
and
2. Future service needs

And I'm catching shit for it? At this forum? After what a one time iconic giant did as far as specs and service parts? Unbelievable.

Everyone can pick sides and "think" what they wish but my opinion remains unchanged. You expect 15K and or up and refuse to speak to technical and or service needs and you are full of shit, period (and just MIGHT have something to hide, note I said MIGHT)

The discussion was never about the merits, or any criticism of, outsourcing, re-badging, subcontracting, buying from vendors versus manufacturing in house or Greg Robert's personality.........none of it. Don't know where all this BS is coming from?

He could take care of a lot of this by simply publishing some honest specs on his systems but he also refuses to do that, but oh yeah, Greg's an "artist" and doesn't like to get all bogged down with such pesky details..........he doesn't even provide a nominal impedance measurement! Guess his target demographic is expected to allow him, the "artist" to take care of those amplifier needs as well.

And there would be no issue for me me anyway except for the fact that these are for purchase ON-LINE ONLY.

And just to be adamantly clear, I never said one derogatory or negative word regarding the sound of this joker's speakers.

Not one

[Wagner]

Let me set the record straight,,,I knew Paul klipsch very well.... He never made any of his drivers,,, only the speaker cabinets,,,,JBL also sourced other manufactured speaker drivers...so I don't understand the beef,,,

Exactly.
And Paul Klipsch would be more than happy to tell you who's and the whys of his choices.
He also held PATENTS on all of his designs and stated on more than one occasion, and in the design goals of said patents, that one objective was to be able to execute his designs with readily available parts whenever possible. He considered this good practice, placing more of an emphasis on the design rather than the "bull shit" as his famous badges proclaimed.

http://www.itishifi.com/2011/02/origins-of-bullshit-button.html

http://www.fastcompany.com/3026282/how-to-be-a-success-at-everything/no-bull-branding-how-companies-use-trash-talk-to-charm-the

If what Greg Roberts has going on is so unique or proprietary then he too should have little problem applying for and receiving a patent himself for his own designs, wouldn't you think? He stated in the email I posted here that that was one of his concerns, so in effect he has already answered at least part of one of my questions. His stuff is built with off the shelf hardware I would venture and that is fine. He also states there is "nothing I can do about that". Yeah there is Greg, do what P.W.K. would have done and get a PATENT. That is unless what you're doing already belongs to someone else. http://www.audioheritage.org/vbulletin/images/smilies/scratchchin.gif

There is no "beef", just what feels like a pile on to defend some joker that builds very expensive boutique speaker systems, available only on-line, but cannot or will not reveal any technical information or actually show a great deal of product for that matter.

I can only come up with two reasons why that would be the case but what do I know

He doesn't even make any amplifier recommendations other than one which he just happens to sell also.

I mean from what some have written you'd think this guy was Santa Claus and I had just kicked him in the nuts

Just a call for "more data, less wank" (thank you Zilch)

[Wagner]

..........bet he removes all the part numbers and maker codes.

(Reminds me of the $5,995 dollar Lexicon MC-1 preamp with it's notorious power supply burn outs, back at the beginning of the 2000s decade. Lexicon would never provide any details but would happily charge you around $700 I think it was to install their custom built, proprietary ONLY available from them at the "factory" replacement. Turns out it was nothing more than a cheap $25 dollar chinese off the shelf PSU made by Artesyn. Only thing "proprietary" about it was the part number they gave it, I politely declined their offer and finally dug up the O.E.S. part #, on a 6K chip amp and they still gouged like that on and at service time? after someone had spent 6K with them?...........but I digress)

Wants "reliably sourced" just so long as the end user doesn't know from whom. Dodges directly answering the question really well:

" LB: Without giving away any trade secrets, what can you share with us regarding your choice of drivers?GR: One of things I learned about during my development of the Vittora, was the importance of choosing drivers that can be reliably sourced. This is especially important with a bass horn, where the horn is specifically designed around a particular driver. It would be disastrous to develop a new bass horn only to have your driver supplier go belly up after only a few months.I chose all the drivers based on reliability of my source, on durability and longevity, and finally on sound quality, determined by listening. I think it’s a good combination of parts that have been integrated nicely by John’s crossovers. John did all of the final acoustic testing of the Vittoras as well, and he provides individual test results for each pair of crossovers delivered to our customers."

http://dagogo.com/an-interview-with-greg-roberts-of-volti-audio

All this from the self described Apostle of "P.W.K."

What a bargain

Bet you a nickel he'll be out of business in a year at this rate. At least as Volti Audio anyway.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UdZv_AOEe9Y

Here, a wood worker and home builder by trade:
http://www.stereophile.com/content/listening-129

Musical background implied here:
http://dagogo.com/an-interview-with-greg-roberts-of-volti-audio

And here a life time's worth of years devoted to custom being a custom A/V installer:
http://parttimeaudiophile.com/2013/02/17/hello-goodbye-six-weeks-with-the-volti-audio-vittora/

The Legend Grows!

The internet is amazing

You would think this guy is Thomas Jefferson by the time they're through! :)

All I want to know is something about the speakers without having to scrounge for it all over the place

He'll be in the Audio Hall of Fame soon along with James Bullough Lansing and his hero "P.W.K.", just read post #7:
http://www.thegearpage.net/board/showthread.php?t=1208765

But I am managing to gather a little intel, would just be nice to have it all confirmed!

[sheltiedave]

Wagner, he gets his woofers from Eminence, his mids from BMS, and I don't know about his tweets. It would not be too hard to figure out, from a current owner. You need to calm the x down.
Neither is going away soon.

There are not too many patents issued to speaker manufacturers these days, as there is not too much groundbreaking innovation.

It would be curious to see what speakers you own. I know all my JBL speaker parts now are manufactured either in Mexico, or sourced from another foreign country.

[Wagner]

Wagner, he gets his woofers from Eminence, his mids from BMS, and I don't know about his tweets. It would not be too hard to figure out, from a current owner. You need to calm the x down.
Neither is going away soon.

There are not too many patents issued to speaker manufacturers these days, as there is not too much groundbreaking innovation.

It would be curious to see what speakers you own. I know all my JBL speaker parts now are manufactured either in Mexico, or sourced from another foreign country.


Sucks to be you then; maybe you should put a little sweat equity into a pair of heritage JBLs as I and many others have. That way you can rest assured of 100% American design AND manufacture. It is well worth the effort, I promise you! But you will need to verify the cabinet load before you buy them!

Do they suck as badly as my used to be made here, much beloved SHURE cartridges which are being made in Mexico now as well? 'Cause THEY sure suck now when compared to what it used to be like from those guys, let me tell ya!

If it's so easy then why does he feel the need to make it so hard? Perceived value clashing with real value perhaps? Even to a fool with more money than sense? Same goes for overall quality as well, which in my world includes customer support and response to any issues that may arise. I guess at 15 Grand I'm just supposed to take this guy at his word that he'll be here next year this time? Get real; I've lost count of all the darlings, the flavor of the month Stereophile sweethearts that were here and then gone inside of 5 years. And without exception, ALL expensive and in most cases customer support and parts simply collapsed or evaporated all together.

As for what speakers I own:
Pair C40 Harkness, 001 load, old style wooden legs, sold a year or so ago, big mistake, still hurts

Still own:
Pair Stephens Tru-Sonic 206-AXAs in Stephens factory modified reflex boxes
Pair Electro-Voice Sentry 500
Pair L112
Pair L96
2 Pair L20 with 4406 crossovers
Pair L100(A) - almost end of the run
Pair L55
Pair 1984 Heresy
2 Pairs 1985 Heresy II
Pair AR-2ax
Pair AR-5
Pair Telefunken 5403 "Sound Columns"
Pair Infinity 2000 II with hard and soft tops
Pair B&W CDM-1 - original version
Pair B&W DM-302
2 Pair Paradigm Titan - original version
Pair of some nondescript SONY product, SS-H1600L that I use for testing work on the bench, paid .02 cents for them literally at the end of the month clearance at the local thrift

Most all re-foamed, re-coned, refinished, re-capped or otherwise in some way rehabbed or reconstructed by moi

Many others have come and gone throughout my life

Would you care for an inventory of my electronics as well?

I don't know why I need to "calm the x down"
My responses may have been a bit over the top but were in response to a bunch of mouths lecturing me on what a great guy Greg Roberts is, and I never said anything (initially) about the guy!

I did ask if anyone knew anything about him, and his speakers, and if my initial reaction was "full of shit" I believe it was. To that I have heard nothing but noise and the same vague guesses and old information that I too could come up with thanks to Google

I think Greg Roberts is essentially a plagiarist and is selling as much of the Barzilay factor as he is sound (again, I am not knocking their sound, I've never heard a pair, that's why I asked all of these questions)
But I have heard plenty of Klipsch, got the hearing damage to prove it
Appealing on the exclusivity of a product that isn't really exclusive at all and nothing at least 50 other forum members here haven't already done and then some. But it is a soft sell on the "special club" angle

No different from the purveyors of $300 Sony/Philips CD players concealed in $10,000 boxes

I have gone to great lengths to acknowledge, that is MY opinion

But let's be serious here, he's asking $15K a pair and that's just for starters

Guys here want to know not only the load but the version and serial numbers of USED speakers for Christ's sake!

My question as posed to Greg Roberts of Volti Audio was not unreasonable, rude or insulting

As this ridiculous thread has lost sense of proportion and original topic, I made the effort to post those links to the several interviews were he is equally evasive when quizzed by the no name e-mags interviewing him

I admit, I did get pissed off with the attitude shown by some and was merely defending and supporting my new found position, arrived at while trying to find out what drivers the joker uses and some specific, reliable specs

Holy cow! What is so unreasonable about that?

No one has definitively answered my question(s), I don't know any Volti Audio owners, there is no dealer or show room and Greg ain't talkin' so

Further more, country of origin was never mentioned, or criticized, at least not by me, so you got me on where the hell that came from unless I missed something?
(Mexico came up I think in the context of crap product support and quality control as it pertains to Jane's JBL)

Please read Post # 1 before you join in on the pile on and lecturing

[SEAWOLF97]

NOT to inflame things ,( and I agree with a lot of what you've said Wagner) , BUT
there are so many companies, so much competition, that if a seller does not
do whatever is needed to sell to me ...I move on,

UNLESS the product is so spectacular and unique that further investigation is
warranted. It doesn't sound like this product is :dont-know:

[hjames]

That does seem like the best plan, buy it or not -
otherwise just move on ... :applaud:




NOT to inflame things ,( and I agree with a lot of what you've said Wagner) , BUT
there are so many companies, so much competition, that if a seller does not
do whatever is needed to sell to me ...I move on,

UNLESS the product is so spectacular and unique that further investigation is
warranted. It doesn't sound like this product is :dont-know:

[Maron Horonzakz]

Some buyers just cant be satisfied... I just politely show them the door...

[Wagner]

NOT to inflame things ,( and I agree with a lot of what you've said Wagner) , BUT
there are so many companies, so much competition, that if a seller does not
do whatever is needed to sell to me ...I move on,

UNLESS the product is so spectacular and unique that further investigation is
warranted. It doesn't sound like this product is :dont-know:

Thank you, and don't worry about inflammation :)

I'm done with this exercise in futility. I don't have the energy or the desire to engage in debate on the two sides of keepin' the customer satisfied in today's internet world. Especially in light of the fact it has absolutely nothing to do with what I originally asked, although a couple of posters understood my point and question. The trick is they actually read it, thank you!

These two statements (clipped from context but not edited) literally blew my mind! The paradigm shift!


If I don't like what a manufacturer tells me, I don't try to get them to change their business practice. I just move on.

I see nothing illegal, immoral, or unethical here. Sorry, just my perspective.

Next thing 'ya know we'll be debating brick and mortar versus e-tail and how it affects consumer's rights versus tax revenues! ;)

Anyone actually own a pair of Volt Audio speakers and or can actually put up some real measurements, that would be great! Thanks!

[Maron Horonzakz]

Giving you some real measurements would be like opening up a can of worms,,,,You,d ask if they are fesh

[Wagner]

Some buyers just cant be satisfied... I just politely show them the door...


Yeah! Take a stand and show 'em who's boss, that's what I say! :)

On a serious note, I've seen you around for years but have just now been inspired to Google your name and take a look at your oft mentioned business.

I cannot find any references to you other than AK, Missouri and here.

Please post a link if you would, I'd like to see what you do

Thanks

[Maron Horonzakz]

I dabbled in HYPERSONIC AIRCRAFT...Amongst other things,,,

[Wagner]

Giving you some real measurements would be like opening up a can of worms,,,,You,d ask if they are fesh

You are SUCH a funny guy! :bouncy:

This is sounding just like Republicans versus Democrats on talk radio here now! Lot's of smart ass remarks with no basis or relationship at all to the original subject.

Besides, I love my worms fesh, they gotta be fesh I tell ya! Yes siree Bob! :)

[Wagner]

I dabbled in HYPERSONIC AIRCRAFT...Amongst other things,,,

Link to your website please, I wanna see!

[Maron Horonzakz]

BOEING,,,,, Also Smithsonian ,,,Also Navy Museum

[Wagner]

BOING,,,,, Also Smithsonian ,,,Also Navy Museum


BOING? Not familiar.

Are you telling me you were the doorman at the Smithsonian Institution in Washington, D.C. and at the Navy Museum (which one)?

[Maron Horonzakz]

Your a real smartass arnt you..

[AussieSteve]

Thank you, the voice of reason and from someone that actually read my post.

I don't know what all this Greg Roberts defense league lecturing is all about; all I wanted to know was who's (more importantly models and or specs) drivers he used for two reasons:
1. Amp compatibility
and
2. Future service needs

And I'm catching shit for it? At this forum? After what a one time iconic giant did as far as specs and service parts? Unbelievable.

Everyone can pick sides and "think" what they wish but my opinion remains unchanged. You expect 15K and or up and refuse to speak to technical and or service needs and you are full of shit, period (and just MIGHT have something to hide, note I said MIGHT)

The discussion was never about the merits, or any criticism of, outsourcing, re-badging, subcontracting, buying from vendors versus manufacturing in house or Greg Robert's personality.........none of it. Don't know where all this BS is coming from?

He could take care of a lot of this by simply publishing some honest specs on his systems but he also refuses to do that, but oh yeah, Greg's an "artist" and doesn't like to get all bogged down with such pesky details..........he doesn't even provide a nominal impedance measurement! Guess his target demographic is expected to allow him, the "artist" to take care of those amplifier needs as well.

And there would be no issue for me me anyway except for the fact that these are for purchase ON-LINE ONLY.

And just to be adamantly clear, I never said one derogatory or negative word regarding the sound of this joker's speakers.

Not one

Hi Wagner, Check out the sales pitch from Greg on AVShowrooms in YouTube. It really is ridiculous! The responses here so far have clearly been by fan's of Greg and really surprise me considering that this site is supposed be about serious speaker lovers who understand the importance of specs. Why on earth wouldn't some specs and test results be available? Suspicious for sure. I read the websites of ultra high end makers like Kharma, Magico, Raidho ect and they all show test results and describe their drivers. My Harbeth monitors, whilst not tested in an anechoic chamber, do show Freq Response as tested in room. I really love the look of Volti, and was very keen, but not now. The blokes a woodworker DIY'er who has decided he can slap a driver in a box and sell it in the realm of the serious manufacturer.

[sheltiedave]

"Sucks to be you then; maybe you should put a little sweat equity into a pair of heritage JBLs as I and many others have. That way you can rest assured of 100% American design AND manufacture. It is well worth the effort, I promise you! But you will need to verify the cabinet load before you buy them!"

Yea, Wagner, I need help getting some old vintage JBL speakers....:eek:

I like collecting midcentury stuff that fits our 1957 brick MCM house, so why break up that vibe with the JBLs, eh?

one JBL C35
two JBL C36s with thin edge legs
three JBL C37s
two C38s
three C40s
And a new to the house pair of JBL 250Tis.
4313s

A pair of Altec 604Ds in Barzilay cabs
and a pair of Altec Model 19s
And the four pair of L100s, L150s, L112s, L166s and others that have moved on.

But we all realize this thread is a diatribe, which normally does not contain reasoned discourse.

[AussieSteve]

BOING? Not familiar.

Are you telling me you were the doorman at the Smithsonian Institution in Washington, D.C. and at the Navy Museum (which one)?

Wagner, I am finding audio websites all over the place have nutjobs who are as fanatical about their argument they loose all credibility with their rants. For example, The Absolute Sound review $200K Magico loudspeakers and debate erupts about how much of a rip off they are, and how bad they sound, by people who obviously will NEVER actually afford to own them or only heard them at a trade show. These people are fanatical fools who like to seem intelligent online, yet are usually meek and slow in real life. Speaker debate is as bad as one with Democrats vs Republicans or Atheists vs Christians. Quite bizarre actually! Seemingly logical conversation is disregarded, and to not understand the basis of your initial contribution clearly shows that. I actually read what you said, agree completely with it, and whilst manufacturers are obviously entitled to maintain business confidentiality, any serious manufacturer go to great lengths to describe their speaker drivers and test results. My very first post here a couple of months ago, was about my new JBLS4700 speakers arriving home and I found one floor spike had a thread that was not cut properly. I had to use pliers to forcibly screw it on! It worked without damage, but my point here was that they should be perfectly made for a RRP of $20K! Well, the responses ranged from it being my fault in the way I screwed it on, (I'm an engineer), to just suck it up and enjoy the great speakers. It's the first pair of Mexican speakers I've bought, and whilst the sound is really good it will be the last pair of new JBL's I buy. Don't despair, logic is not lost on all, and my ego is not bruised easily.

[Wagner]

"Sucks to be you then; maybe you should put a little sweat equity into a pair of heritage JBLs as I and many others have. That way you can rest assured of 100% American design AND manufacture. It is well worth the effort, I promise you! But you will need to verify the cabinet load before you buy them!"

Yea, Wagner, I need help getting some old vintage JBL speakers....:eek:

I like collecting midcentury stuff that fits our 1957 brick MCM house, so why break up that vibe with the JBLs, eh?

one JBL C35
two JBL C36s with thin edge legs
three JBL C37s
two C38s
three C40s
And a new to the house pair of JBL 250Tis.
4313s

A pair of Altec 604Ds in Barzilay cabs
and a pair of Altec Model 19s
And the four pair of L100s, L150s, L112s, L166s and others that have moved on.

But we all realize this thread is a diatribe, which normally does not contain reasoned discourse.

You helped push it there

I was only answering to YOUR inquiry but now your line has changed

A guy who quotes Art Dudley as "Art", owns all those great speakers and lives in a "MCM"!

I'm impressed; can I sit at your table?

[Wagner]

Wagner, I am finding audio websites all over the place have nutjobs who are as fanatical about their argument they loose all credibility with their rants. For example, The Absolute Sound review $200K Magico loudspeakers and debate erupts about how much of a rip off they are, and how bad they sound, by people who obviously will NEVER actually afford to own them or only heard them at a trade show. These people are fanatical fools who like to seem intelligent online, yet are usually meek and slow in real life. Speaker debate is as bad as one with Democrats vs Republicans or Atheists vs Christians. Quite bizarre actually! Seemingly logical conversation is disregarded, and to not understand the basis of your initial contribution clearly shows that. I actually read what you said, agree completely with it, and whilst manufacturers are obviously entitled to maintain business confidentiality, any serious manufacturer go to great lengths to describe their speaker drivers and test results. My very first post here a couple of months ago, was about my new JBLS4700 speakers arriving home and I found one floor spike had a thread that was not cut properly. I had to use pliers to forcibly screw it on! It worked without damage, but my point here was that they should be perfectly made for a RRP of $20K! Well, the responses ranged from it being my fault in the way I screwed it on, (I'm an engineer), to just suck it up and enjoy the great speakers. It's the first pair of Mexican speakers I've bought, and whilst the sound is really good it will be the last pair of new JBL's I buy. Don't despair, logic is not lost on all, and my ego is not bruised easily.


Thank you for that and for your contributions to my thread

The one and only guy so far that actually came close to pulling the trigger on a pair of these things

As for your fit 'n' finish complaint? I concur 100%

My wife bought a cheap assemble it yourself chair from Target or the like made in china of course.
It's price was a little under $200
The overall quality and comfort is fairly decent, but in order to assemble it, it was a good thing that I just happened to have on hand a metric tap and die set as well as numerous other hand tools. The screws they provided in the "kit" were also too short in a couple of instances to properly secure the seat bottom slat as well as a few other bits
This chair was marketed and sold as an item which the purchaser could easily assemble with the hexagonal wrench provided in minutes.

Yeah, right

The major problem with it was, yep you guessed it, threaded inserts made on shit tooling, probably not calibrated since we shipped it over there 25 years ago and made of cheap steel.
Like most of the hardware one finds even in brand name hardware stores today
Sourcing really high grade high quality machine screws EASILY today? Forget it!
But you can get them if you need them

From the 3rd world I don't complain and have come to expect it and deal with it. After all it's only a cheap shit comfy chair for doing her nails and watching TV

But in the case of your speakers? Unacceptable. Use quality hardware, fitted before shipping, no problems, period.

So many people today (Americans especially) have been so brain washed into just simply accepting crap (all manner and brand of crap and mediocrity) based on bumper sticker philosophies and catch phrases like "shit happens" "life's too short" or my favorite, "that's a first world problem" that it makes me want to puke

I am a BIG fan of Western Civilization, The Industrial Revolution and most of all QUALITY, the way it used to and was expected to be, when dealing with luxury goods most especially

Hell, most things for that matter. It all starts small and pretty soon you wind up with nothing but crap

A great many people worked and fought VERY hard to get us where we are, I can't just fob it off so flippantly

Unfortunately, most of the herds today reject my position of "hold their feet to the fire" but maybe, just maybe if they embraced it the quality of manufactured goods in general would improve

RCA's Dynaflex debacle helps make my point; after enough returns they finally knocked it off with THAT crap
Guy who ran my boyhood town's little record shop didn't mind taking them back. His philosophy was the same as mine. Not just picking on Dynaflex. Anyone alive and buying records during the late '60s well into the '70s remembers well the generally piss poor condition of the record pressing business. The oil crisis etc etc etc.
My guy said bring 'em back!
If people just accepted this crap as just "the way it is", regardless of the justifications, rationalizations or even virtues cited, then pretty soon it'd be all you'd get is what he'd say. He was right then and he's right now.

I've got dozens more and I am quite certain everyone here has their own "made in china", or similar, cheap crap horror stories. But as John and those bumper stickers proclaim, "it is what it is"

Soon it will be all there is "all crap, all the time"

But not when you're paying real coin for a product, any product, which touts it's historical QUALITY as well as performance

And now I'm Mr. Off Topic!

[rusty jefferson]

Hello,
I just recently wrote this fellow, Greg Roberts and asked him a few simple questions regarding his driver selections and specs of his systems as it would pertain to planning good amplification matching.
Seems totally reasonable to me.


His response let us say was a bit less than forthcoming.
I first heard of this guy because of the restoration work, fancy cabinets, veneer jobs and box modifications which he was doing for and on Klipsch products. Seemed interesting and his work looked good as far as I could tell from photographs.

I initially was going to discuss some custom work on a pair of JBL boxes with the man.

Now it would appear he is no longer doing that as his loudspeakers have become quite trendy in certain circles and he appears and claims to be doing well enough to require devoting all of his time and efforts to that endeavor. More power to him and congratulations.
Indeed. Anyone that can make it in the audio industry these days....Goddess bless them.


Still, it bothers me that any speaker manufacturer would be reluctant to at least provide the most basic of technical details regarding his systems. And as much as the quality of his wood work he really really really sells the fact that his systems are 100% Made in U.S.A. so that claim really piqued my curiosity as to who's drivers he was using or was this guy by wild ass chance actually building his own here in the U.S.A.!? At his asking prices I thought it might be possible, maybe.

I also pointed out that I consider this essential information also as to the what when and how to obtain service parts if he were NOT to survive forever (like diaphragms and the like)
Still, totally reasonable....


Could anyone here shed any light on these designs?

His main emphasis on his website is the high quality of fit and finish, his heirloom quality boxes and the fact that he makes certain every piece of grille cloth is attched perfectly square.

I will be the first to admit that I too apprecaiate those things but I'd be even more interested in what's actually inside the boxes.

It's not as if one could not be opened and the big secret revealed.
I can't shed any light on the designs, however I have seen and heard a pair. They are quite beautiful to the eye. Designed with low power tube amps in mind, I'm sure.


My email to Greg Roberts:

Hello,
Please tell me if your would; what "brand" of transducers do you employ in your beautiful designs?
Please advise.
Thank you for your time and consideration
Now, you probably could have started off a little smoother here. You know, a little foreplay. For example, you could have explained your concerns about matching amplifier designs to his speakers, and maybe whether his speakers react better with low or high output impedance amplifiers. Or, would he have an opinion whether the speakers sound "better" with a 300b SET amp, or a Push Pull 845 amp. That sort of thing. "Work up" to the driver info. The actual brand of driver isn't critical to the case you laid out. You said you were looking for measurement information to better match an amplifier, and future availability of spare parts in the event of his or his company's (premature) demise. Oh, and curiosity.

His reply:


Hi,
I'm sorry but I don't disclose what brand or model of drivers I use. I cantell you that the tweeter uses a 1" compression driver, the mid a 2" outletcompression driver with a 3.5" diaphragm, and the woofer is a high-power,pro-audio 15" driver. Why do you ask?
Regards,Greg Roberts
www.voltiaudio.com (http://www.voltiaudio.com/)
Exactly what I would have expected from him.

My response:


Hello Greg Roberts,
Well, I am sorry to hear that but not surprised.
As you are unwilling to reveal your "proprietary" off the shelf selections (I suspect) when it comes to driver selections then what does it matter "why" I ask.
But suffice it to say, in my opinion, anyone (purchaser) serious and knowledgeable in system matching and amplifier building and modifications (tubes) would certainly find this information useful.
I certainly hope you can understand that. Many of your boxes have been "opened up" and commented upon at various (many) "places" on the internet. I take much of this sort of palaver with a pound of salt.
I simply wanted to confirm, from the "horses mouth" as it were, the accuracy and the facts, rather than deal in second hand information and speculation. I could also find no technical data sheets on your web site, only glowing hyperbole and "glamour" shots. It may all very well be true, and well deserved (I have read nothing to cast doubt) BUT it is a brand of information of little use to an amp builder.
And again, when you ask me "why do I ask" I almost feel as if you are pulling my leg.
My age and current health prohibit me from a whole lot of system building at this point in Life; I found yours intriguing and their obvious beauty and attention to detail (fit and finish) make in them a viable candidate for me as I too find that element of system building important.
But there is more to it than perfectly attached grille cloth or exotic veneers (as you well know) and though nice, very nice indeed, I am still at a point in my audio endeavors to need a bit more information than that.
Sorry to hear you are unwilling or unable to help. I will learn what I seek from other sources.
I also find it difficult to be sitting here even justifying my most reasonable and practical inquiry!
Here's wishing you and your business well!
Thank you for your time and consideration.
See, now you're pretty much telling him you think he's a wanker.

Greg's response:


Hi,
I'm sorry you're having such difficulty with my decision to keep thisinformation private. I have my reasons. It does matter why anyone asks me about the drivers. Many people wish tobuild their own speakers, and would like to use the same drivers that I amusing and then claim they have made a Volti speaker. That's obviously notsomething I have any control over. But I do have control over whatinformation I choose to give out about my speakers. Regarding the technical specifications of my speakers, or the technicalspecs on the drivers for that matter, I am the first to admit that I am notmuch of a technician when it comes to designing and building speakers. Ionly put a small amount of importance on such things. I am more of anartist, and I use my ears to judge what I hear, and I take action based onwhat I hear. I fully understand that for some people that is not how theywish to buy audio products. There are those who focus on the technicalspecifications, and that's fine. They simply are not my customers, and Iaccept that. People buy audio equipment for many different reasons, and they usedifferent criteria for determining what they wish to own. Volti Audio hastheir customers and YG Acoustics, Raidho, JBL, etc... all have theircustomers. It's all good.
Regards, Greg Roberts
www.voltiaudio.com (http://www.voltiaudio.com/)

Seems totally reasonable to me. It's his company, and he can run it any damn way he pleases.


:confused: :eek: Is this guy just full of shit or is it me?
It's You.


There were a few more exchanges but I'll spare you the rest.
Suffice it to say it got a little "testy".
I don't know why it would have gone past the email exchanges you've posted. You made your argument for information, he made his argument for secrecy.

Speakers he's asking over $15K for and he won't tell me what's in them?
I'm certain there are many speaker builders selling expensive speakers you could send that same email to, and get essentially the same response.


Kind of blows my mind. But what do I know?
I reminded him of long gone trendy builders of audio like Audio Alchemy, California Audio etc.........didn't seem to phase him (my, and I would think anyone's, concern with future parts and or service needs.)
Look, pretty much everyone on this forum understands your interest in serviceability. Who among us hasn't been burned by out of production parts? And I'd venture to guess, most everyone here is in the 99% this guy is not trying to sell his speakers to. The folks who will purchase these can afford to not worry about spare parts. How long will JBL support parts for the Everest? 2020, 2030? Will they contact all the owners and let them know that "after a certain date recone kits will no longer be available for your $60,000 speakers." Don't think so.

What the heck's up with this guy. But most importantly, can anyone please shed any light on what he's running in these boxes?
Just new and improved variations on Klipsch designs? I'd love to know.
Sorry, but I can't help with what drivers he's using. If I knew, I'd tell you.


Thank you!
You're welcome

[Maron Horonzakz]

$15K 20K,,,,By some standards ,that's not a lot of money,,,Maybe daddy can buy you a new audio toy... like a BOSE. Now that's a company that will give you a specsheet..

[Wagner]

Now, you probably could have started off a little smoother here. You know, a little foreplay. For example, you could have explained your concerns about matching amplifier designs to his speakers, and maybe whether his speakers react better with low or high output impedance amplifiers. Or, would he have an opinion whether the speakers sound "better" with a 300b SET amp, or a Push Pull 845 amp. That sort of thing. "Work up" to the driver info. The actual brand of driver isn't critical to the case you laid out. You said you were looking for measurement information to better match an amplifier, and future availability of spare parts in the event of his or his company's (premature) demise. Oh, and curiosity.


I enjoyed your post very much! Gave me a good chuckle after spending 2 hours+ in a damn MRI machine this afternoon

Actually, I am still chuckling!

And hoping from it all and notably the above, you are just one funny guy (that likes to make people laugh!)

Thanks again!

[rusty jefferson]

;)

Sorry to hear about the time in the MRI. Hope all's well.

[Wagner]

$15K 20K,,,,By some standards ,that's not a lot of money,,,Maybe daddy can buy you a new audio toy... like a BOSE. Now that's a company that will give you a specsheet..


Sorry pal, strike three. Well known fact to anyone with any experience fooling around with loud speakers, It would appear that to some, the "no data, all wank" practice only yields SOME companies as laughingstocks in the opinions of those claiming to be serious about sound quality:

https://www.google.com/?gws_rd=ssl#q=why+bose+does+not+publish+their+spec s&spell=1

https://www.google.com/?gws_rd=ssl#q=why+bose+doesn't+publish+specs

But thank you very very much for your help in further supporting my position on what is, and isn't, simply internet noise, baseless hyperbole and just plain old bull shit! (this excerpt can be found in one of the many articles I have provided you the links for just in case you don't feel compelled to actually use them and read up on a few of the facts of the matter)

http://techcrunch.com/2007/09/19/dr-bose-tells-all-company-sercrets-why-they-dont-publish-specs-and-more/

"The mysterious, elusive, and admittedly obsessive Dr. Amar Bose, founder and namesake of the Bose Corporation, made a rare appearance Tuesday to a select group of journalists. The occasion was the launch of their new Bose Computer MusicMonitor speakers, but the real treat was hearing the good doctor dish out secrets about the history of Bose, why they almost went bankrupt, and why they never, ever publish specifications for any of their products. As he put it, he spoke to us about “things never discussed outside the company, things that only people involved in the beginning know.”

[Wagner]

;)

Sorry to hear about the time in the MRI. Hope all's well.


Thanks
But after all, "it is what it is"! ;)
After all, que sera sera! :D

[Maron Horonzakz]

Did it resonate the metal plate in your head....?? Most of Bose Labrinth design came frome Stromberg Carlson design of 1939 As well as AMPEX direct/reflective design speakers

[AussieSteve]

Thank you for that and for your contributions to my thread

The one and only guy so far that actually came close to pulling the trigger on a pair of these things

As for your fit 'n' finish complaint? I concur 100%

My wife bought a cheap assemble it yourself chair from Target or the like made in china of course.
It's price was a little under $200
The overall quality and comfort is fairly decent, but in order to assemble it, it was a good thing that I just happened to have on hand a metric tap and die set as well as numerous other hand tools. The screws they provided in the "kit" were also too short in a couple of instances to properly secure the seat bottom slat as well as a few other bits
This chair was marketed and sold as an item which the purchaser could easily assemble with the hexagonal wrench provided in minutes.

Yeah, right

The major problem with it was, yep you guessed it, threaded inserts made on shit tooling, probably not calibrated since we shipped it over there 25 years ago and made of cheap steel.
Like most of the hardware one finds even in brand name hardware stores today
Sourcing really high grade high quality machine screws EASILY today? Forget it!
But you can get them if you need them

From the 3rd world I don't complain and have come to expect it and deal with it. After all it's only a cheap shit comfy chair for doing her nails and watching TV

But in the case of your speakers? Unacceptable. Use quality hardware, fitted before shipping, no problems, period.

So many people today (Americans especially) have been so brain washed into just simply accepting crap (all manner and brand of crap and mediocrity) based on bumper sticker philosophies and catch phrases like "shit happens" "life's too short" or my favorite, "that's a first world problem" that it makes me want to puke

I am a BIG fan of Western Civilization, The Industrial Revolution and most of all QUALITY, the way it used to and was expected to be, when dealing with luxury goods most especially

Hell, most things for that matter. It all starts small and pretty soon you wind up with nothing but crap

A great many people worked and fought VERY hard to get us where we are, I can't just fob it off so flippantly

Unfortunately, most of the herds today reject my position of "hold their feet to the fire" but maybe, just maybe if they embraced it the quality of manufactured goods in general would improve

RCA's Dynaflex debacle helps make my point; after enough returns they finally knocked it off with THAT crap
Guy who ran my boyhood town's little record shop didn't mind taking them back. His philosophy was the same as mine. Not just picking on Dynaflex. Anyone alive and buying records during the late '60s well into the '70s remembers well the generally piss poor condition of the record pressing business. The oil crisis etc etc etc.
My guy said bring 'em back!
If people just accepted this crap as just "the way it is", regardless of the justifications, rationalizations or even virtues cited, then pretty soon it'd be all you'd get is what he'd say. He was right then and he's right now.

I've got dozens more and I am quite certain everyone here has their own "made in china", or similar, cheap crap horror stories. But as John and those bumper stickers proclaim, "it is what it is"

Soon it will be all there is "all crap, all the time"

But not when you're paying real coin for a product, any product, which touts it's historical QUALITY as well as performance

And now I'm Mr. Off Topic!

Agreed, Time and again I read about or experience smaller speaker companies that go to great lengths explain and show how they make, test and match individual pairs of speakers. They are the manufacturers who take enormous pride in their creations as well, but they go all the way in ensuring that each pair that leave the premises are perfect. Those are the companies that succeed in the long term, regardless if they use compound x or whatever, the transparency and accountability makes them a viable option for those of us who can afford their products. Hell, even look at Kenrick Sound in Japan. They rebuild classic JBL stuff and take great pains to show the process involved, and the results they finish with. Oh boy, they do a great job! and their speakers aren't cheap. However they sell them quicker than candy at a kids party. The Volti issue is sad, I adore the look of them, however looks alone are only a small part of the equation. Now judging by the responses to you, may I suggest you now let it go, it's not worth the hassle. Time will tell if they are a success, and in my opinion it takes a foolhardy person to spend that amount of cash without any serious understanding of what they are buying. Proprietary issues aside, any maker worth his salt WILL AND DOES test thoroughly. Take Care.

[Maron Horonzakz]

So what is it your trying to say ???????

[hjames]

So what is it your trying to say ???????

Its about the Glory of American Industry and doing the right thing for the buyers -
How some have lost their way, and sod off to all who are doubters or have lesser visions ...

... with liberty and justice for all ... Amen.

I got yardwork to do -
have a great Sunday, Y'all...


:bouncy:

[Maron Horonzakz]

That's the way to go SuperGirl.....Over three million voicecoils were made in China last year,,, What speaker manufactures picked them up to build their speakers ?????

[Wagner]

That's the way to go SuperGirl.....Over three million voicecoils were made in China last year,,, What speaker manufactures picked them up to build their speakers ?????


I'd be willing to bet the number is probably more like a 100x that, or even greater, but
you can start the search to find your answer here:

https://www.google.com/?gws_rd=ssl#q=+chinese+speaker+voice+coil+parts+al iba

http://www.alibaba.com/trade/search?fsb=y&IndexArea=product_en&CatId=&SearchText=speaker+voice+coil+formers (http://www.alibaba.com/trade/search?fsb=y&IndexArea=product_en&CatId=&SearchText=speaker+voice+coil+formers)

http://www.alibaba.com/showroom/speakers-made-in-china.html (http://www.alibaba.com/showroom/speakers-made-in-china.html)

http://www.alibaba.com/showroom/bluetooth-speaker.html

http://www.alibaba.com/trade/search?fsb=y&IndexArea=product_en&CatId=&SearchText=cheap++speakers

http://www.alibaba.com/showroom/voice-coil.html

http://www.alibaba.com/showroom/speaker-voice-coil.html

You can even buy your own machine and maybe go into business with Greg!:
http://www.alibaba.com/speaker-voice-coil-winding-machine-manufacturers.html

http://www.alibaba.com/showroom/voice-coil-wire.html


Have fun, search function works just like ePay

[Wagner]

Sorry to hear Gregg was so standoffish. He started on the klipsch forums as a diyer and did veneer work on the side. From there he was helped by a few people to design a tractrix horn for a 2inch compression driver that could replace the stock k400 in the klipsch reference series. ALK engineering helped him with his crossover design. All his designs are based on upgraded klipsch heritage speakers. I owned a pair of his tractrix horns and his fit and finish are top quality. He never provided any measurements so I did it myself as I have all the equipment. He was always nice to deal. As far as drives last I new he was using a BMS 4592 for the mid and a eminence woofer similar to crites CW. He needs to invest in some measurement gear especially with building his own $15000 speakers.

My apologies for taking so long to acknowledge and say "thank you" for this very pertinent and informative response to my inquiry.

Was caught up in the jibber-jabber.

Thank you for taking the time to respond,
Thomas

[Maron Horonzakz]

Yes China is the largest supplier of voice coils, world wide,,,

[AussieSteve]

Yes China is the largest supplier of voice coils, world wide,,,

Maron, Stop being such a dickhead! You have a different opinion, SO WHAT! Stop trying to be inflammatory, you come across as a child who must get his own way. Find something productive to do with yourself, maybe use your skills and start a speaker manufacturing business. Too many people like you exist on Audio Forums who seem to like to have lengthy passionate debate's about very informal topics. This place is a friendly site for people with a shared love of JBL, any comments on issues are the views of the writers, not invitations to be proven right or wrong. It seems obvious though that JBL have disregarded their heritage and the loyalty of it's customers by becoming a manufacturer who now has production offshore. Very few, if any, quality speaker makers DO NOT make their own products in house. It makes JBL one of the lower tier manufacturers who have the dubious honor of being not much better than some Chinese product. Who knows, before too long they will save money by having all their R&D done in China as well. Poor old Mr JBL would be rolling over in his grave if he knew where the company has gone!

[SEAWOLF97]

Maron, Stop being such a dickhead! You have a different opinion, SO WHAT! Stop trying to be inflammatory, you come across as a child who must get his own way. Find something productive to do with yourself, maybe use your skills and start a speaker manufacturing business. Too many people like you exist on Audio Forums who seem to like to have lengthy passionate debate's about very informal topics. This place is a friendly site for people with a shared love of JBL, any comments on issues are the views of the writers, not invitations to be proven right or wrong. It seems obvious though that JBL have disregarded their heritage and the loyalty of it's customers by becoming a manufacturer who now has production offshore. Very few, if any, quality speaker makers DO NOT make their own products in house. It makes JBL one of the lower tier manufacturers who have the dubious honor of being not much better than some Chinese product. Who knows, before too long they will save money by having all their R&D done in China as well. Poor old Mr JBL would be rolling over in his grave if he knew where the company has gone!

well, I can agree with some of that :blink: , BUT

how 'bout hitting "CR/ENTER" every now and then to break up the text blob so
I can be sure of what you are saying ?

[Ian Mackenzie]

Hello,
I just recently wrote this fellow, Greg Roberts and asked him a few simple questions regarding his driver selections and specs of his systems as it would pertain to planning good amplification matching.

His response let us say was a bit less than forthcoming.
I first heard of this guy because of the restoration work, fancy cabinets, veneer jobs and box modifications which he was doing for and on Klipsch products. Seemed interesting and his work looked good as far as I could tell from photographs.

I initially was going to discuss some custom work on a pair of JBL boxes with the man.

Now it would appear he is no longer doing that as his loudspeakers have become quite trendy in certain circles and he appears and claims to be doing well enough to require devoting all of his time and efforts to that endeavor. More power to him and congratulations.

Still, it bothers me that any speaker manufacturer would be reluctant to at least provide the most basic of technical details regarding his systems. And as much as the quality of his wood work he really really really sells the fact that his systems are 100% Made in U.S.A. so that claim really piqued my curiosity as to who's drivers he was using or was this guy by wild ass chance actually building his own here in the U.S.A.!? At his asking prices I thought it might be possible, maybe.

I also pointed out that I consider this essential information also as to the what when and how to obtain service parts if he were NOT to survive forever (like diaphragms and the like)

Could anyone here shed any light on these designs?

His main emphasis on his website is the high quality of fit and finish, his heirloom quality boxes and the fact that he makes certain every piece of grille cloth is attched perfectly square.

I will be the first to admit that I too apprecaiate those things but I'd be even more interested in what's actually inside the boxes.

It's not as if one could not be opened and the big secret revealed.

My email to Greg Roberts:

Hello,
Please tell me if your would; what "brand" of transducers do you employ in your beautiful designs?
Please advise.
Thank you for your time and consideration

His reply:

Hi,
I'm sorry but I don't disclose what brand or model of drivers I use. I cantell you that the tweeter uses a 1" compression driver, the mid a 2" outletcompression driver with a 3.5" diaphragm, and the woofer is a high-power,pro-audio 15" driver. Why do you ask?
Regards,Greg Roberts
www.voltiaudio.com (http://www.voltiaudio.com/)

My response:

Hello Greg Roberts,
Well, I am sorry to hear that but not surprised.
As you are unwilling to reveal your "proprietary" off the shelf selections (I suspect) when it comes to driver selections then what does it matter "why" I ask.
But suffice it to say, in my opinion, anyone (purchaser) serious and knowledgeable in system matching and amplifier building and modifications (tubes) would certainly find this information useful.
I certainly hope you can understand that. Many of your boxes have been "opened up" and commented upon at various (many) "places" on the internet. I take much of this sort of palaver with a pound of salt.
I simply wanted to confirm, from the "horses mouth" as it were, the accuracy and the facts, rather than deal in second hand information and speculation. I could also find no technical data sheets on your web site, only glowing hyperbole and "glamour" shots. It may all very well be true, and well deserved (I have read nothing to cast doubt) BUT it is a brand of information of little use to an amp builder.
And again, when you ask me "why do I ask" I almost feel as if you are pulling my leg.
My age and current health prohibit me from a whole lot of system building at this point in Life; I found yours intriguing and their obvious beauty and attention to detail (fit and finish) make in them a viable candidate for me as I too find that element of system building important.
But there is more to it than perfectly attached grille cloth or exotic veneers (as you well know) and though nice, very nice indeed, I am still at a point in my audio endeavors to need a bit more information than that.
Sorry to hear you are unwilling or unable to help. I will learn what I seek from other sources.
I also find it difficult to be sitting here even justifying my most reasonable and practical inquiry!
Here's wishing you and your business well!
Thank you for your time and consideration.

Greg's response:

Hi,
I'm sorry you're having such difficulty with my decision to keep thisinformation private. I have my reasons. It does matter why anyone asks me about the drivers. Many people wish tobuild their own speakers, and would like to use the same drivers that I amusing and then claim they have made a Volti speaker. That's obviously notsomething I have any control over. But I do have control over whatinformation I choose to give out about my speakers. Regarding the technical specifications of my speakers, or the technicalspecs on the drivers for that matter, I am the first to admit that I am notmuch of a technician when it comes to designing and building speakers. Ionly put a small amount of importance on such things. I am more of anartist, and I use my ears to judge what I hear, and I take action based onwhat I hear. I fully understand that for some people that is not how theywish to buy audio products. There are those who focus on the technicalspecifications, and that's fine. They simply are not my customers, and Iaccept that. People buy audio equipment for many different reasons, and they usedifferent criteria for determining what they wish to own. Volti Audio hastheir customers and YG Acoustics, Raidho, JBL, etc... all have theircustomers. It's all good.
Regards, Greg Roberts
www.voltiaudio.com (http://www.voltiaudio.com/)

:confused: :eek: Is this guy just full of shit or is it me?
There were a few more exchanges but I'll spare you the rest.
Suffice it to say it got a little "testy".
Speakers he's asking over $15K for and he won't tell me what's in them?
Kind of blows my mind. But what do I know?
I reminded him of long gone trendy builders of audio like Audio Alchemy, California Audio etc.........didn't seem to phase him (my, and I would think anyone's, concern with future parts and or service needs.)
What the heck's up with this guy. But most importantly, can anyone please shed any light on what he's running in these boxes?
Just new and improved variations on Klipsch designs? I'd love to know.

Thank you!

I don't see the relationship between asking questions and the price point or if its mutli national or one man show.

The fact to decline your request has annoyed you.

But your questions may have been better asked.

What is the relevance of the drivers in determining of you like the system or if it will suit your amps?

Your question is a leading question in that context. Perhaps you are fishing for details of the design?

As he does not use his own in house drivers sending a message to the market I use B brand may be miss interpreted and would therefore be reluctant to advise.
Technically only system engineering can determine that and what designer would publicise his IP when all you have to do it plug in your amp and see if you like it?

ie Is the loudspeaker suited to 8 or 4 ohm taps for a valve amp?

This is a difficult question to answer without knowing the design of your amps, ie the output impediance and the phase angle of the loudspeaker impedance (resistive or reactive).

If I was the loudspeaker guy I would be reluctant to make comment
Some designer get around this by stating their drivers are made to their specifications which is not that difficult these days.

OMA in NY have lavish designs $100K Plus and they state nothing of their designs other than the basic physics.

The their marketing does the talking with industry experts behind the designs.

So its not useful to make a blanket statement that no specs means the brand is doubtful.

More often than not a little bit of knowledge is a dangerous thing.

[Maron Horonzakz]

I believe Wagner was doing the flameing,,A little bit of knowledge is what he was askng for before he whent on a diatribe..

[BMWCCA]

I believe Wagner was doing the flameing,,A little bit of knowledge is what he was askng for before he whent on a diatribe..
I'm not taking sides—because I love all you guys . . . but there's an acrimonious personality clash going on here and all the rest of us are getting caught in the cross fire.

Truce?

Vielen Dank!

A sheynem dank!

[Wagner]

I don't see the relationship between asking questions and the price point or if its mutli national or one man show.

The fact to decline your request has annoyed you.

But your questions may have been better asked.

What is the relevance of the drivers in determining of you like the system or if it will suit your amps?

Your question is a leading question in that context. Perhaps you are fishing for details of the design?

As he does not use his own in house drivers sending a message to the market I use B brand may be miss interpreted and would therefore be reluctant to advise.
Technically only system engineering can determine that and what designer would publicise his IP when all you have to do it plug in your amp and see if you like it?

ie Is the loudspeaker suited to 8 or 4 ohm taps for a valve amp?

This is a difficult question to answer without knowing the design of your amps, ie the output impediance and the phase angle of the loudspeaker impedance (resistive or reactive).

If I was the loudspeaker guy I would be reluctant to make comment
Some designer get around this by stating their drivers are made to their specifications which is not that difficult these days.

OMA in NY have lavish designs $100K Plus and they state nothing of their designs other than the basic physics.

The their marketing does the talking with industry experts behind the designs.

So its not useful to make a blanket statement that no specs means the brand is doubtful.

More often than not a little bit of knowledge is a dangerous thing.


So its not useful to make a blanket statement that no specs means the brand is doubtful.

First, let us set the record straight; I never did make or imply such a statement. Some of you just infer and go off on all sorts of shit that's not being said or even the topic, I don't understand it, but's let's wrap this up, shall we?

I hear you and I concur on all your points of fact; that there is more than one way to build a mouse trap and not everyone does everything the same way every time. But speaking to some of your points:

I never made mention nor was my original intent to determine the country of origin of anything used by Greg Roberts. My emails to him were NOT an attempt to gain evidence in order to refute his "All American" claims; the "made in the prc" tangent was the result of this thread being derailed.

OK, now that I have said that for what feels like the one hundredth time, I had to go "fishing" as you put it, not to engage in industrial espionage or reverse engineering (as Greg seems to fear, or so he says), not to find reasons to belie and belittle his products or designs but to at least garner some of the most essential of information as there is regarding his loudspeakers and my main point of interest for what really matters, their SOUND.
Yes, my initial draw was the fact that they were horns and a build quality of what appears to be of exquisite craftsmanship (or so they seem), but no need to do the dance of price negotiations or the "foreplay" as someone put it, if once I learned of the essentials I would know immediately I would proceed no farther, so why waste both of our time?

As everyone knows by now, Volti Audio designs use off the shelf drivers, fine. I want to know exactly which ones. With this information, and assuming the drivers employed are/were well known and accessible, I could at least have some possible idea of what his systems might sound like, kind of, sort of, maybe. At least some small shred of an idea of what their sonic character MIGHT be. A thought, an idea.........SOMETHING

Because, these $15,000 dollar a pair and up loudspeakers are NOT AVAILABLE IN STORES,
HE HAS NO DEALERS,
THERE IS NO SHOWROOM,
YOU CANNOT HEAR BEFORE YOU BUY unless you just happen to live next door to Greg in Tennessee or attend a trade show. Trying to break into the market at this price point with the "internet only" option currently available, I would think this guy would be HAPPY to answer questions. What's he think, "social media"'s going to make him a star?
I doubt very much that Mr. Roberts would be willing to ship a pair out to me, here in California, for an in home audition (at $15K I would ALMOST expect that option) and I am not planning any trips to Boulder Colorado or New York or Las Vegas or wherever else the hell it is he may be hawking them at the trade shows next, simply to have a listen. The woodwork is not THAT nice!

So, I asked of Mr. Roberts some very basic and essential information regarding his product. If HE is "annoyed" by that as you put it, or finds it suspicious or wishes to "assert his "rights" as many have put it or whatever it is, then fine, that's his prerogative. BUT, tough shit, 'cause guess what?

Ding! Ding! "No Sale" Ya jes let one git away thar Greg ole boy.

Greg Roberts is just a guy selling some, what appears to be, very well made, expensive loudspeakers. He's just a guy. He's not a guru, he's not a god, he's not James B. Lansing or Paul Klipsch. He's not Greg Timbers or Edmond May. He has no history or back story other than that of being a long time member of the Klipsch forums. What little information out there is scattered and not always in agreement. And lastly, his own "website" , which is more like a few web "pages", is little more than audio cheese cake shots with little to no useful information.

So, with all of that and then some in mind, I do not feel nor am I going to jump through hoops in dealing with this guy. I'm the one with the money that he wants. I don't have to figure out a way shmooze this guy or have "foreplay" with him or any of the other ridiculous shit that people have suggested.

He is attempting to break into a HIGHLY competitive business, what I call the prestige market. I understand EXACTLY what he wants and is trying to do. I know of the target demographic of which he dreams.

And you know what? All of you are correct, 100%. Greg Roberts can do or tell whatever the hell it is he wants to. But you know what else? Until he learns how to SELL his product he's going to be gone in about 5 minutes and that's a fact. Companies like B&W for example that know how to market to today's "prestige market" will squash him like a bug. The business model that Roberts wants pretty much evaporated after the dot com bubble burst. So unless Fabio and all of his entourage and others like him all decide that Volti Audio is the way to go his ass better wake up. And it will make NO difference how good his speakers sound, none.

Whether Greg the "artist" likes it or not, selling is part of it, IF he wants to survive and be successful. He made a comment that not enough folks were still listening to and upgrading their K-Horns so he moved into making the new ones full time. How long does he think it will be before his "target" market that asks no questions is saturated? It's not rocket science.

When there is a zero proprietary component to his drivers and nothing that cannot be determined with a screw driver (and access to a sample, that's the big hurdle) beside the fact that as others have already pointed out, some of the information is already being circulated, not answering such a simple inquiry from who, for all he knows, is a prospective QUALIFIED buyer (Greg probably likes to call them "clients") is SUSPECT. Plain and simple. Period. The End.

He has deferred the "technical" things to others, maybe he needs to do the same with the sales and marketing of his fledgling enterprise.

Enough time wasted on this bull shit. Now that I know there is no way I am dealing with this guy I really don't care anymore what drivers he uses.

[hjames]

Me and SVollmer and a number of other folks have heard the speakers at Audio Festivals, speaker shows,
whatever you want to call them. They sounded nice in that enviroment.
I suspect there are sales generated through that medium. Don't know or care how many,
but for a small business, he may not need to sell a lot of them to keep busy.

If you don't like them, don't buy them - its an easy mantra to remember ...

At least during the original stuff I saw from him, his main business is/was custom homes
and the speaker refurbs and custom designs was a hobby.

Why anyone thinks he needs to get approval from anyone in this forum I'll never know.
This whole thread started weird and went off the rails quickly ...

[macaroonie]

Indeed

[AussieSteve]

First, let us set the record straight; I never did make or imply such a statement. Some of you just infer and go off on all sorts of shit that's not being said or even the topic, I don't understand it, but's let's wrap this up, shall we?

I hear you and I concur on all your points of fact; that there is more than one way to build a mouse trap and not everyone does everything the same way every time. But speaking to some of your points:

I never made mention nor was my original intent to determine the country of origin of anything used by Greg Roberts. My emails to him were NOT an attempt to gain evidence in order to refute his "All American" claims; the "made in the prc" tangent was the result of this thread being derailed.

OK, now that I have said that for what feels like the one hundredth time, I had to go "fishing" as you put it, not to engage in industrial espionage or reverse engineering (as Greg seems to fear, or so he says), not to find reasons to belie and belittle his products or designs but to at least garner some of the most essential of information as there is regarding his loudspeakers and my main point of interest for what really matters, their SOUND.
Yes, my initial draw was the fact that they were horns and a build quality of what appears to be of exquisite craftsmanship (or so they seem), but no need to do the dance of price negotiations or the "foreplay" as someone put it, if once I learned of the essentials I would know immediately I would proceed no farther, so why waste both of our time?

As everyone knows by now, Volti Audio designs use off the shelf drivers, fine. I want to know exactly which ones. With this information, and assuming the drivers employed are/were well known and accessible, I could at least have some possible idea of what his systems might sound like, kind of, sort of, maybe. At least some small shred of an idea of what their sonic character MIGHT be. A thought, an idea.........SOMETHING

Because, these $15,000 dollar a pair and up loudspeakers are NOT AVAILABLE IN STORES,
HE HAS NO DEALERS,
THERE IS NO SHOWROOM,
YOU CANNOT HEAR BEFORE YOU BUY unless you just happen to live next door to Greg in Tennessee or attend a trade show. Trying to break into the market at this price point with the "internet only" option currently available, I would think this guy would be HAPPY to answer questions. What's he think, "social media"'s going to make him a star?
I doubt very much that Mr. Roberts would be willing to ship a pair out to me, here in California, for an in home audition (at $15K I would ALMOST expect that option) and I am not planning any trips to Boulder Colorado or New York or Las Vegas or wherever else the hell it is he may be hawking them at the trade shows next, simply to have a listen. The woodwork is not THAT nice!

So, I asked of Mr. Roberts some very basic and essential information regarding his product. If HE is "annoyed" by that as you put it, or finds it suspicious or wishes to "assert his "rights" as many have put it or whatever it is, then fine, that's his prerogative. BUT, tough shit, 'cause guess what?

Ding! Ding! "No Sale" Ya jes let one git away thar Greg ole boy.

Greg Roberts is just a guy selling some, what appears to be, very well made, expensive loudspeakers. He's just a guy. He's not a guru, he's not a god, he's not James B. Lansing or Paul Klipsch. He's not Greg Timbers or Edmond May. He has no history or back story other than that of being a long time member of the Klipsch forums. What little information out there is scattered and not always in agreement. And lastly, his own "website" , which is more like a few web "pages", is little more than audio cheese cake shots with little to no useful information.

So, with all of that and then some in mind, I do not feel nor am I going to jump through hoops in dealing with this guy. I'm the one with the money that he wants. I don't have to figure out a way shmooze this guy or have "foreplay" with him or any of the other ridiculous shit that people have suggested.

He is attempting to break into a HIGHLY competitive business, what I call the prestige market. I understand EXACTLY what he wants and is trying to do. I know of the target demographic of which he dreams.

And you know what? All of you are correct, 100%. Greg Roberts can do or tell whatever the hell it is he wants to. But you know what else? Until he learns how to SELL his product he's going to be gone in about 5 minutes and that's a fact. Companies like B&W for example that know how to market to today's "prestige market" will squash him like a bug. The business model that Roberts wants pretty much evaporated after the dot com bubble burst. So unless Fabio and all of his entourage and others like him all decide that Volti Audio is the way to go his ass better wake up. And it will make NO difference how good his speakers sound, none.

Whether Greg the "artist" likes it or not, selling is part of it, IF he wants to survive and be successful. He made a comment that not enough folks were still listening to and upgrading their K-Horns so he moved into making the new ones full time. How long does he think it will be before his "target" market that asks no questions is saturated? It's not rocket science.

When there is a zero proprietary component to his drivers and nothing that cannot be determined with a screw driver (and access to a sample, that's the big hurdle) beside the fact that as others have already pointed out, some of the information is already being circulated, not answering such a simple inquiry from who, for all he knows, is a prospective QUALIFIED buyer (Greg probably likes to call them "clients") is SUSPECT. Plain and simple. Period. The End.

He has deferred the "technical" things to others, maybe he needs to do the same with the sales and marketing of his fledgling enterprise.

Enough time wasted on this bull shit. Now that I know there is no way I am dealing with this guy I really don't care anymore what drivers he uses.


I am intelligent to completely understand the whole purpose of your initial point - period. Even after you try to close this issue, you get responses of disagreement! I said it before, these Audio forums are a place for the ill equipped to make themselves seem relevant and knowledgeable, without being either. I call it, "small man syndrome" This post of yours is articulate and accurate, we are the one's who get it. Volti speakers will travel a path they choose, and time will tell if they are still represented at audio shows several years from now. Who knows, maybe they will take something positive from this forum and perhaps take a different path of marketing. I know I would still love to see some spec's, I really love the look of them. Take Care mate, now let's finish this post for good.

[Greg Roberts]

I would just like to take a moment to say that Volti Audio is thriving. It has been a rewarding experience for me, to be able to provide my products to so many great customers over the years.

During my time in this business, I've seen many passionate speaker builders come and go. For whatever reason/s, they just couldn't make a go of it. It's a tough business, and if you don't have enough customers who love your product as much as you do, it's very difficult to sustain. Being good is simply not good enough. Your product must stand out and above. These folks who tried and didn't make it were just as passionate about building a great sounding speaker as I am. I am very fortunate that it's worked out for me.

I will continue to learn and I'll work hard to design and build the very best horn speakers I can. I'll do it my way, because that's the only way I can do it. In the process, I'm going to set policies that upset some people, and I'm sorry for that, I'm simply running my business the way I think I need to. To be fair, I always make sure my customers know about those policies before they send any money to me. I'll continue to design and build speakers that I like the sound of, and I really don't care that some people consider them to be poorly engineered because they don't meet an arbitrary standard of measured performance. It simply doesn't matter to me or to my customers. Another way of putting that is to say if if matters to you, you probably aren't going to be my customer. I can live with that.

If I don't provide enough details about my products for some customers, I'm sorry about that. I'm just running my business the way I think best. If I lose some customers because of that, I can live with that. I assume that if a potential customer is not able to find enough information on my website, or from reading about Volti Audio online to make them comfortable doing business with me, that they will simply go elsewhere. If a potential customer really pushes for information that I'm not willing to give and they get angry with me and choose to vent their frustrations on an online forum instead of just moving on, I think that speaks volumes about their personality, intent, and general demeaner, and confirms that I was right in my initial assessment of them.

Greg Roberts
Volti Audio
207-314-1937
www.voltiaudio.com

[Robh3606]

Hello Greg

This is a 6 year old thread surprised you are responding to it now as you just brought this back into the frey. Glad you are doing well through this nightmare.

Here are a couple of reviews with measurements and manufacturer comments. Helps fill in some of the blanks and adds information missing from the beginning of the thread.

Rob :)

https://www.stereophile.com/content/volti-audio-razz-loudspeaker

https://www.stereophile.com/content/volti-audio-rival-loudspeaker