Why can't the USA order (really great) JBL speakers online like other countries? ....

[joeinid]

It seems like such a shame, but I'd love to buy a new pair of bookshelf/monitor speakers like others can. Why? Options?


ps. I'm still learning what models are great and the ones to buy. Thanks!

[hjames]

It seems like such a shame, but I'd love to buy a new pair of bookshelf/monitor speakers like others can. Why? Options?


ps. I'm still learning what models are great and the ones to buy. Thanks!

Because we've been sh*tty to JBL and tried building our OWN designs, and refurbing the old classics -
plus, it seems the overseas buyers are SO much more appreciative with the new JBL models!

:banana:

[joeinid]

I certainly hope the situation gets better.

I'll be good, I promise :)


Because we've been sh*tty to JBL and tried building our OWN designs, and refurbing the old classics -
plus, it seems the overseas buyers are SO much more appreciative with the new JBL models!

:banana:

[macaroonie]

It seems like such a shame, but I'd love to buy a new pair of bookshelf/monitor speakers like others can. Why? Options?


ps. I'm still learning what models are great and the ones to buy. Thanks!

Harman Audio has a rather strange marketing strategy it seems , make stuff in the US or Mexico and then not make it available in the US.

Pro is more international hence M2 is on the go worldwide. This is why Everest variants are on sale for silly cheap prices in certain markets.

Wait and buy M3 or M4 etc or go vintage ( Or best of all go vintage and DSP it to make it superb )

[Mr. Widget]

It seems like such a shame, but I'd love to buy a new pair of bookshelf/monitor speakers like others can. Why? Options?


ps. I'm still learning what models are great and the ones to buy. Thanks!I'm not sure that there are very many speakers from JBL that fall into that category. But that is just my opinion. :D

For those who get upset when moderators delete OT or other otherwise disagreeable posts... I did it this time. Let's try to keep it on topic and polite.

Thanks,


Widget

[Mr. Widget]

Harman Audio has a rather strange marketing strategy it seems , make stuff in the US or Mexico and then not make it available in the US.

Pro is more international hence M2 is on the go worldwide. This is why Everest variants are on sale for silly cheap prices in certain markets.
Not really... the price of the DD66000 dropped primarily due to Harman blowing the remaining stock out at 25% of their original price. They obviously don't have a clue about maintaining a brand... if they didn't produce so damn many outstanding products they'd be toast.

FWIW: I still positively love my DD66000s regardless if they are $60K speakers or $25K speakers! ...and like many of their excellent stablemates they are readily available here in the USA.


Widget

[JeffW]

I'm not sure that there are very many speakers from JBL that fall into that category. But that is just my opinion. :D


Widget

Can you get the 4429, 4338, 4465, 4312E, or any of the monitors here? Or the 4306, 4319, 4307, or 4305H?

That's 8, and there's still a couple of 4312 models I left out.

How many speakers are in the entire JBL catalog?

[BMWCCA]

I spent a good bit of this evening auditioning the new Nathan East album and switching back and forth between my low-ball JBL Pro-III + sub, the always surprising L5s, my base-line-setting 4412As, and my go-to L96 Deltas. There's so much music in those old "bookshelf" boxes I'm always stunned when I crank up the compact 3-ways. The L96 just does it all and the 4412A simply adds more depth in the bottom. Tonight the L5s didn't kick the L96's butt, but the Pro-III+ was still an amazing system for the forty-dollars I paid for it at the local Dairy Queen a few months back. Everyone got 100-watts per channel, two at a time from the switchable Soundcraftsmen Pro-Power-Four and the Pro-III+ was plugged into the Crown SL2, FM2, Power Line Three "receiver" system.

I enjoy these comparisons so much I'd love to try out the "latest and greatest" 3-ways from JBL to see how much they've improved . . . if at all! And, yes, I've been tempted by the close-out pricing on the DD6600s but I just have to think about what they'll cost in ten years. Maybe then I can A-B them with my 4345s and enjoy it as much as I do the impromptu comparos I run in my small bedroom.

Maybe tomorrow I'll run the L7 vs L5 vs L3. :D

[Mr. Widget]

Can you get the 4429, 4338, 4465, 4312E, or any of the monitors here? Or the 4306, 4319, 4307, or 4305H?

That's 8, and there's still a couple of 4312 models I left out.

How many speakers are in the entire JBL catalog?It maybe heresy here, but I've never been particularly interested in the '70s and '80s pro monitor inspired speakers that JBL produces... JBL and Revel do sell quite a few very high quality bookshelf speakers here in the USA.


Widget

[macaroonie]

Not really... the price of the dropped primarily due to Harman blowing the remaining stock out at 25% of their original price. They obviously don't have a clue about maintaining a brand... if they didn't produce so damn many outstanding products they'd be toast.

FWIW: I still positively love my DD66000s regardless if they are $60K speakers or $25K speakers! ...and like many of their excellent stablemates they are readily available here in the USA.


Widget

Imagine how devalued the owners of full priced DD66000 systems must feel having paid $60k and now see their world class investment now valued at $25k. Harman are really bad for this end of line flog off strategy. What about the dealers who are holding demo's or stock at the dealer price from 60K. Do they get a retro discount or a credit note from Harman to soften the blow ?
I doubt it somehow speaking from experience with Harman UK. So you basically have a dealer network that has been hung out to dry ( again ) by a company run by bean counters.
This folks is exactly why there is a dearth of JBL flagship dealers across the US. They are not trusted by the dealers.

Widgets comment in red , I second wholeheartedly.

M


Footnote : If this flog off was a factory direct deal / tent sale then of course Harman are setting themselves up in direct competition with their dealer network. I wonder whether the dealers were offered these at a dealer discount below the 25K . In my book that's a reason to be calling the rep. !!

[tomee]

Imagine how devalued the owners of full priced DD66000 systems must feel having paid $60k and now see their world class investment now valued at $25k. Harman are really bad for this end of line flog off strategy. What about the dealers who are holding demo's or stock at the dealer price from 60K. Do they get a retro discount or a credit note from Harman to soften the blow ?
I doubt it somehow speaking from experience with Harman UK. So you basically have a dealer network that has been hung out to dry ( again ) by a company run by bean counters.
This folks is exactly why there is a dearth of JBL flagship dealers across the US. They are not trusted by the dealers.

Widgets comment in red , I second wholeheartedly.

M

my thoughts exactly when I saw that they were available on such a huge discount - how many previous D66000 buyers are now going to step in and upgrade to a D67000 system? "thanks Harman, you just devalued my costly speakers on the used market down to the mid $20ks!" Can you imagine Rolex, or Omega, or Porsche or BMW (or any car company!) doing this when they change the model lines? This is a home-theater-in-a-box consumer electronics mentality applied to what is obviously a luxury product. (Yet even a consumer electronics company like Apple know better than to do this) The D66000 could've been sold next to the D67000, even for several months or years, as a lower cost option to get into the "Everest" line. (It worked for the iPad2 -haha!)

[Doc Mark]

I spent a good bit of this evening auditioning the new Nathan East album and switching back and forth between my low-ball JBL Pro-III + sub, the always surprising L5s, my base-line-setting 4412As, and my go-to L96 Deltas. There's so much music in those old "bookshelf" boxes I'm always stunned when I crank up the compact 3-ways. The L96 just does it all and the 4412A simply adds more depth in the bottom. Tonight the L5s didn't kick the L96's butt, but the Pro-III+ was still an amazing system for the forty-dollars I paid for it at the local Dairy Queen a few months back. Everyone got 100-watts per channel, two at a time from the switchable Soundcraftsmen Pro-Power-Four and the Pro-III+ was plugged into the Crown SL2, FM2, Power Line Three "receiver" system.

I enjoy these comparisons so much I'd love to try out the "latest and greatest" 3-ways from JBL to see how much they've improved . . . if at all! And, yes, I've been tempted by the close-out pricing on the DD6600s but I just have to think about what they'll cost in ten years. Maybe then I can A-B them with my 4345s and enjoy it as much as I do the impromptu comparos I run in my small bedroom.

Maybe tomorrow I'll run the L7 vs L5 vs L3. :D

Hi, Phil,

I have a question about your bookshelf speakers, in regards to comparing them to your benchmark 4345 system. My guess is that the 4345 adds far more depth and detail, when compared to the smaller JBL systems. Is that right? if not, I'd be very interested to hear what the larger systems, like your 4345's, offer when compared to the smaller JBL's. For myself, I do very much enjoy listening to smaller systems from JBL, and some that I made many years ago. But, as much as I appreciate the day in, day out, of having a smaller system right next to my work area, I always miss the wonderful sound from our L300's.

Also, what is the title of the Nathan East album you mentioned? Back when I played music for a living, Nathan, and some other friends, would come in and hear our band, which played quite a bit of "Funk" music at that time, and they sat-in now and then, which was always a treat!! I'm proud of Nathans accomplishments, and success, and always thought he was a very talented, and very good guy. Fun that you like his work, too. Thanks, and God Bless!

Every Good Wish,
Mark

[jblnut]

The Pro III plus sub is my desktop system driven by a small Carver amp fed directly from my computer's Audigy sound card. I've had it over 10 years and it's a decent setup but it pales with the larger speakers in the house. The reason? Coloration. It's just not as transparent as the other speakers and it really needs to be used near field.

On the larger topic I sympathize with those that have bought the Everest, but only a little. This is a speaker system and not an investment vehicle. You paid top dollar to be the first on the block but time goes by. It's clear they were priced for luxury consumption from the get go (60k for 2 speakers) and the market always corrects eventually. Many of us here get our JBLs farther down the depreciation curve so I can't help but celebrate the slide which might see many of us as Everest owners some day.

It's still clear JBL has a way to go in terms of a long term US marketing and sales strategy on the high end. There are too few dealers spread too far apart with too little stock for most of us to be able to ever even hear these fine loudspeakers. And I'm sorry but it's clear the pricing is still way too high for what are large wooden boxes with 2 or 3 transducers in them. Only in Japan is JBL carrying enough brand prestige to be able to sell these at these prices I would guess.

i have recently been introduced to someone very high in the Harman food chain. I look forward to having this exact conversation with him about where JBl is headed in the US market. And I may also have some very exciting news on my own system if things work out . Stay tuned....

jblnut

[macaroonie]

It's very simple really , It's all based on loyalty and if that fails on one of the sides of the equation then the game is up.

Harman generally asks for a pretty heavy commitment before you get a dealership. That can amount to a bucket of money tied up in demo stock and selling stock ( Boxed ).
When the product gets dumped into a discounter to clear the Harman warehouse it just messes up that balance of loyalty and commitment.

This can be caused by just a few pairs going into a discounter , who then advertises them as if that is the ongoing price and the market is shot.
It happened in the UK last year with Studio 590's being sold through Richer Sounds. They were scratch and dent or service returns but this was not obvious and the price advertised will have caused serious problems for the real dealers ( if indeed there are any left ) selling perfect new stock.

[SEAWOLF97]

Seems rather obvious that the web has killed many types of brick & mortar businesses.

Other big name audio companies have the same problems as JBL
They would rather you order from a website than have to do a demo for you.

Many of the points that Mac made are valid too. Inventory investment, then being undercut by the producer ,,, who wants to risk it ? Only sell high volume models .. no pun.

The days of the dedicated AR exhibit demos at RCMH are toast.

Glad I got in on the days you could go into a dealer and do comparisons for as much time as you needed.

as to original question ? I think Harman shoots them own foots often , although the traveling demo truck is a good idea. need more of them ? *


* they even screwed that up in my area .. only finalized the date/time/location at the last minute.

[pos]

Imagine how devalued the owners of full priced DD66000 systems must feel having paid $60k and now see their world class investment now valued at $25k. Harman are really bad for this end of line flog off strategy. What about the dealers who are holding demo's or stock at the dealer price from 60K. Do they get a retro discount or a credit note from Harman to soften the blow ?
JBL could also just rewamp those old stock DD6000 and make them D67000 in a snap: just change the woofers, or recone them into 1501AL-1 to be used in the D65000, or even machine the frame and install 1501AL-2 kits... (oh, and a new foilcal!)

[BMWCCA]

I have a question about your bookshelf speakers, in regards to comparing them to your benchmark 4345 system. My guess is that the 4345 adds far more depth and detail, when compared to the smaller JBL systems. Is that right? if not, I'd be very interested to hear what the larger systems, like your 4345's, offer when compared to the smaller JBL's. For myself, I do very much enjoy listening to smaller systems from JBL, and some that I made many years ago. But, as much as I appreciate the day in, day out, of having a smaller system right next to my work area, I always miss the wonderful sound from our L300's.

Also, what is the title of the Nathan East album you mentioned? Back when I played music for a living, Nathan, and some other friends, would come in and hear our band, which played quite a bit of "Funk" music at that time, and they sat-in now and then, which was always a treat!! I'm proud of Nathans accomplishments, and success, and always thought he was a very talented, and very good guy. Fun that you like his work, too. Thanks, and God Bless!

Now we're really taking this off-topic, but . . .

I don't compare them in the same room for a couple of reasons:
1. The 4345s are bi-amped with active crossovers so I'd have to split the output to a separate amp to play the others next to them.
2. The 4345s are in the living room and it's crowded enough without more speakers. The other room is full of speakers and amps.
3. The 4345s are so far beyond compare there'd be no point other than to embarrass the little guys!

The L7, L5, 4412A, and L96 are fantastic speakers that can project an image of a live performance if you close your eyes, click your heels together, and make a wish. The 4345s will make you believe you're in a live performance, only one with no sound-system issues and you're in the best seat in the house. The 4345s are incredible at loud SPL but absolutely amazing at low volume where an acoustic bass still has authority and presence at a level where you'd hardly hear it at all with lesser speakers. The 18-inch woofer is simply effortless in producing the full range missing in the smaller boxes. And then there's the great mid-bass, and that horn . . .

I've listened to Nathan East for quite some time but when my daughter ordered the Daft Punk album on which he appears I was amazed that they chose such a fine artist to be nearly the only person playing non-synthesized instruments! His new album is an interesting collection of mostly covers with some interesting guest appearances. Not that I'd choose Michael McDonald to sing Van's classic Moondance, but the recording quality is very good and I find it an interesting listen. The album is simply titled Nathan East

61845 (http://www.amazon.com/Nathan-East/dp/B00I1XYDUQ)

[jpw]

Regarding the heavy discounts and effected resale value on Everest's, I will make two points as a JBL dealer. First, few if any people, paid anywhere near $60,000 pair for the DD-66000. Secondly, although many may have not noticed, when the DD-67000 and DD-65000 were announced, JBL lowered the MAP price to $41,999 pair for about a year in an effort to make a soft transition. Evidently this still did not sell off the remaining DD-66000's fast enough for Harman so they were officially discontinued and closed out at around $25,000 pair. You've also got to remember that the ongoing poor economy does not help in a situation like this. Many manufacturers have been hit with the same reality.

Regarding comments that JBL should have taken 66 cabinets and made 67's out of them or offered to upgrade 66's to 67's, they are too many differences to be practical to do this.
The woofers, crossover networks, and the tweeter are all different and although these could be swapped out, the cabinet baffle boards are different with dual layer plywood and MDF instead of MDF only. Even if it was just a parts swap, the shipping to JBL, and the labor and parts cost alone would make this very impractical.

[JeffW]

It maybe heresy here, but I've never been particularly interested in the '70s and '80s pro monitor inspired speakers that JBL produces... JBL and Revel do sell quite a few very high quality bookshelf speakers here in the USA.


Widget

I bet, over the years, JBL has sold more of those types of speakers in the US than any other. I think you said you even kept a pair of L100s. So your preferences aside, it seems like JBL could possibly be missing out on quite a few sales by not offering their entire product line to the very market where they have sold a buttload of units in the past. Offer the things here. If they don't sell, then they don't sell. But there's always that outside chance that people might rediscover the brand, given a chance.

[Aaron]

I haven't bothered to this yet as I don't have money to get serious and buy a set of 4429s but Yodobashi sells JBL stuff and they have this promising looking page:

http://www.yodobashi.com/html/globaltop.html

[SEAWOLF97]

IMHO , most here enjoy large , full range speakers. We (again IMHO) , are an
anomaly in 2014.

The US population is more & more mobile today, having to follow jobs. They just don't want to pack and move large speakers. The percentage of apartment dwellers is increasing. Trends are towards smaller, more portable sound solutions. Physical media is even too much to lug around.
Those who own their homes and don't plan on moving most likely already have the large speakers that they want. The US is not a dynamic market (mostly) for those products anymore, and besides ..there is now a lot more competition for the audio dollar.

JBL consumer would likely have ceased if not for the L-100/4310 varients in the 70's. Those are now considered "large" speakers. heck, even Gallo micro speakers will do the job now *. Expectations have been lowered, along with music quality requirements. (mp3)

It appears that the nouveau riche of Asia are building their McMansions , plan to live there forever and furnish them with large impressive sound systems . It only makes sense to concentrate sales to where the current market/money is. But then again it is senseless to alienate your traditional home country by not giving those few who want product the access to it. :crying:



* if I were moving often, a pair of Minimus 7's and a little powered sub could keep the music going at an enjoyable level.