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jblnut
09-03-2004, 07:19 PM
Thanks to all that responded to my query about outdoor speakers. As soon as I nab a cheap H/K receiver on the bay, I'll be shopping for them.

In the mean time I'm curious what you guys use for headphones. I've been using Sony MDR-V6 (same as 7506) for what seems like forever. I've been patching them up when they break but they are on their last legs. Here's what I'm looking for:

Cheap-ish ($100 or under)
Efficient (gets loud driven with ipod or similar mini unit)
Small/folding if possible

I'm taking the train more and I've found it's a good hour to just chill and listen to tunes. The laptop makes a great music machine but I need some better headphones. The V6's are too big to wear outside the house and my older Sony MDR-CD5's are totally beat. I wish Sony made them again - they were a mini/enclosed design which was really the best of both worlds. Small and light enough to wear for a long time (or anywhere) and sealed for less outside noise and better bass.

How about the newer in-the-ear buds ? Any good ?

Thanks for any and all ideas...


jblnut

johnaec
09-03-2004, 07:30 PM
I posed this same question a couple weeks ago, but few responses. I mentioned my favorite years ago were the single element Koss Pro4 (AAA?), and was informed they've been re-released. I haven't looked into it yet, but that's where I'm starting...

John

dancing-dave
09-03-2004, 08:25 PM
Check out: www.etronics.com for any Sony headphones. They sell most of them way below market price.

Also www.audiocubes.com

I like the Sennheiser soundproof headphones they have at Brookstone. I use them for train and plane rides often.

andresohc
09-04-2004, 12:45 AM
I am looking into the Shure E3C and E5 series, noise cancelling ear buds. I read in a magazine about them but have no first hand experience.
Any one have experience with these Shure headphones? Seems like they would fit the bill.
They appear on ebay pretty frequently and I am bidding on a pair now
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=5718864502&ssPageName=STRK:MEBI:IT

SEAWOLF97
08-31-2006, 09:14 PM
I've got an iPod nano and love it. The 2 factors that affect sound quality are encoding bitrate and headphones. I currently use AKG K55s for over the ear - non mobile listening , and creative ear canal buds ( http://www.amazon.com/Creative-Labs/dp/B000EGJZ2O/ref=sr_11_1/002-8073208-5695233?ie=UTF8) for mobile. The CLs are great but I'm always looking for improvement.
Sooo....have been lusting after some Shure e2c's and was ready to pull the trigger, when I noticed these CLs ( http://www.amazon.com/Creative-Zen-Aurvana-In-Ear-Headphones/dp/B000G1Q9GW/ref=pd_rhf_p_1/002-8073208-5695233?ie=UTF8 ) the Aurvana set is new and looks nice.

Does anyone have any experience with either of these 2 ? or recommendations ?

QwertyAccess
08-31-2006, 09:47 PM
I cant comment on the creative earbuds, since i generally never trust their products to produce peripherals, but you will never go wrong buying from Shure, which they develop the best "earbuds" anyway from what i can see, (anless your the type that have to customize the mold for your ear costing you a thousand)

However for full-size or portable "headphones" I would personally go for sennheiser, or grado's headphones. AKG headphones from what i know of them are mainly good for DJing/mixing purposes, but not for actual music listening when compared to other brands, but people may correct me if i am wrong.

For sake of saving your ear though, i would prefer to never use earbuds. I use portable "headphones" mostly since i believe it will reduce the damage to your ear, since earbuds tend to go in places you shouldnt even stick your finger in.

Titanium Dome
08-31-2006, 10:17 PM
In the iPod thread, Bo speaks highly of Shure. Go to post #50.

http://www.audioheritage.org/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=9757

boputnam
09-01-2006, 08:15 AM
Bo speaks highly of Shure....Yea, I do. The E5c is amazing. I've trialed all the peers - that is, the top-shelf versions of each brand - and none have the even frequency response and bass reproduction of the E5c.

I saw a fellow traveller on an international flight using a pair with his iPod. Pretty surprising. That is an expensive bud, bud! I was using the Bose QC2 overear cup style, with it's fantastic noise cancelling - superb with the jet ambient noisefloor.

I use the E5c when performing; I use the Bose QC2 at FOH and when flying. Different pieces of hardware for different applications...

SEAWOLF97
09-01-2006, 11:25 AM
I have Sennheiser HD-580s for serious listening, but they are not efficient enough for the Nano to make decent volume. The AKG K55 is very musical and comfortable. Dont know the specs, but they sound nice with the Nano and produce sufficient volume.

I agree about most CL products , but this particular model gets super reviews and is rebadged as Sennheiser and then sold at a premium. These are "in the canal" and not really buds. Most people think this style sux until they learn how to insert them. ( for left ear, take RIGHT hand , reach over the top of head, pull up on top of ear and insert with LEFT hand....and of course reverse with other one)



I cant comment on the creative earbuds, since i generally never trust their products to produce peripherals, but you will never go wrong buying from Shure, which they develop the best "earbuds" anyway from what i can see, (anless your the type that have to customize the mold for your ear costing you a thousand)

However for full-size or portable "headphones" I would personally go for sennheiser, or grado's headphones. AKG headphones from what i know of them are mainly good for DJing/mixing purposes, but not for actual music listening when compared to other brands, but people may correct me if i am wrong.

.

jblnut
09-01-2006, 01:24 PM
I have a couple pairs of the Sony EX71SL buds which used to be $50 and are now about $30. They kick the s*it out of the ipod phones (comfort and sound quality) and they do a resonable job of blocking noise since they go into the ear canal. Not everyone can stand having something in their ear canal, but if you can these are great for the cash. They aren't Shures, but they aren't $300 either. We're listening to compressed digital music here after all so no need to get the panties all tangled up about extreme sound quality. Save your cash and go home to spin the vinyl through some JBLs for that :) .

jblnut

SEAWOLF97
09-05-2006, 07:31 PM
Sennheiser CX 300 series was formerly launch into the professional musician market as Sennheiser IE4 In-Ear Monitor.

Sennheiser IE4 sold at ~150 US Dollar (Suggested Retail Price). As a competitor of Etymotic Er6 and Shure E3c.

Following the product's success in the professional market now it is time to harvest from the vast consumer market.

So the marketing description of this product now change from "the high accuracy reproducing of the sound" into the new hype "the bass driven sound".
Very common marketing trick. :-)

Sennheiser IE4 was a rebranding of the highly acclaim "Sharp MD33".
Sharp MD33 is one of the most succesfull IEM in the world.
It also described as a "giant killer".

After it got wide reputation around the world Sharp MD 33 was rebranded into Creative ep630 (which can be found in Asia) and Sennheiser IE4 (which goes directly to the most demanding professional musicians market.

Sound of this Sennheiser/ Sharp/ Creative IEM is solid and very clear.
Bass is decent, mid and high are details.

It need less maintenance comparing with Etymotic or Shure since it cleverly use metal grills instead of direct filter.
Once a month scrap your earwax out of the metal grill is enough to keep this decent IEM working for years.

Silicone ear tips are interchangeable with Sony's ex series ear tips.
If you want to do some experiment you can try Shure's ear tip on them.
Even somebody have suggested Shure's Ultra Soft Flex Sleeve (PA749M) on this IEM but I would like to suggest Shure's PA757M Flex Sleeves instead. (Please change the size according to your ear size)

With Shure PA757M Flex Sleeve this Sharp/ Creative/ Sennheiser IEM sounds as if the sound stage become expanded without deterioration in sound quality.

If you live in US this Sennheiser IEM is worth your money. And sound quality is much better than many expensive IEM.

QwertyAccess
09-07-2006, 06:58 PM
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16826159420
I found the Sennheiser EH250 model to be a very nice bang for buck ratio, also i believe it is very efficient (if not even more efficient then alot of buds i've tryed) I use it for my ipod, it has alot of bass, but going a step up from there is the EH350
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16826159421
No idea about these but i didnt get them since they were open-eared (i like to not disturb people with my open-ear phones, the EH250 is closed so it cancels ambient noises effectively.)

SEAWOLF97
09-08-2006, 06:57 PM
They sound great , nice quality , good case , good manual. are they worth 2X the price of my Creative/Senn/Sharps ?? Prolly not.

SEAWOLF97
09-11-2006, 08:02 AM
well , they are getting better , after some breaking in sessions. Bass seemed thin at first, but now think I was used to over boosted bass , tho did turn up the EQ to compensate a little. Very nice detailing. Was listening to CCR "Heard it through the Grapevine" and had never realized that there is piano in the tune. Lots of earpiece options. Well built, look foreward to them getting better still.

boputnam
09-11-2006, 08:09 AM
Bass seemed thin at first, but now think I was used to over boosted bass.That is a point many users need to remember - they may have unintentionally "trained" their hearing to be accustomed to a bass-boost EQ. That EQ curve can actually mask tonality in the LF.


Lots of earpiece options. Well built, look foreward to them getting better still.As weill all IEM, the key to good, representative bass response is a tight fit IN the ear canal. That is how they are 'sposed to fit. Try different earpieces, both sizes and styles. I prefer the triple flange that Shure now sells with the E5c - I trim the end-most flange off for a good tight, and non-fatiguing fit. A bandmate prefers the squishy yellow donuts, which seem to work best for him.

Just go easy on the SPL's - these IEM's are very close to the ear drum.

SEAWOLF97
09-23-2006, 08:08 AM
these little guys getting better everyday. just took some breaking in period.

Steve K
09-25-2006, 12:25 AM
Hi,

For noise cancelling headphones, so far the Bose Quiet Comfort 2 (now 3)is hard to beat. It has a switchable resistance setting for use with high gain or low gain sources. The sound is neutral with enough bass. If you're a frequent flyer, you can't go wrong with a pair. Oops, was I allowed to say this four letter word?

For earbuds, the Shure's excellent, but so is the Etymotics, i.e. ER6i.

If leaking sound is not an issue, the Grado SR6 or SR8 are great. These are also very efficient and have no problem playing music loud from iPods.

Hope this helped.
Steve K

BMWCCA
08-23-2007, 07:40 PM
While we all love listening to our JBLs in a proper listening environment, sometimes it's not just possible. And yet we all still love our music. With a family of five in a small house, I've sometimes had to resort to using headphones. My favorite type is the fully enclosed variety and over the years I've really had a hard time finding any I liked any better than the Superex ST-Pro-B-Vs I've had since I was a kid. I paid up for them back then (they blew the Koss Pro 4As away) and they've certainly served me well for something like thirty-five years if not more. Alas, Superex is no more and their old digs in Yonkers is a real-estate office these days.

So, when it came time for me to buy a pair of enclosed headphones for my middle daughter to take to college a couple of weeks ago, I got interested in researching the topic a bit. Luckily for me she was happy with the first pair she tried, a $19.95 Sony set from our local Crutchfield store. They have a liberal 30-day return policy even if they don't allow any headphone auditions in the store anymore (hygiene, they say) rather than the next up Sennheisers for $49. Seeing cans priced beyond $400 got me wondering what you could get in the under-$100 range. So I hit the Internet.

One model that kept popping up was the Sennheiser HD 280 Pro, listed as a retail of $199, but with a street price of $99. I read the review at Headphone.com (http://www.headphone.com/guide/by-manufacturer/sennheiser/sennheiser-hd-280-pro.php) and another at Dansdata.com (http://www.dansdata.com/hd280.htm) that seemed to be educated and complete. I was unable to find any review that didn't at least damn these with faint praise, yet all criticized them for a decided weak bass characteristic. So then I started shopping for price. Crutchfield had them listed on-line for $99 but they didn't have any in the store even to look at. I tried. On-line I found them for $79.99, plus shipping, and even a $79.99 w/free shipping at bav.com, but the free shipping was modeled after Amazon.com with a predicted 4-10 days. Then I came upon the old-semi-reliable J&R with a "click here for email low price". I did and they came back with $79.99 with a special link and included next day shipping via UPS at no additional cost. Tap, tap, and the order was done. Exactly two days and one-hour later they were delivered at my door.

First audition was plugged directly into a trusty Sony CDP-901 single-play CD loaded with Donald Fagen's Kamakiriad. Immediately I was grabbing for the volume control on the player to tame the assault on my ears. That was LOUD! Backed-off to half-way I was floored by how strong the bass was in these cans. So much that I put the old Superex back in for comparison on the same passage. All I can say is the Superex must be the D130s of all headphone, and the Senns the real LFs of the range. Then I tried the HD 280s in the Soundcraftsmen DX4200's headphone jacks, with about the same result. Just for fun I plugged them in next to the Crown PS400's monitor jack. For the short audition, the HD 280s sounded great (not much different than before, really) up to an extremely high level when they started to break up a bit, but the level was irritating enough already.

So what's up with the Internet experts, the graphs, and the ding for bass roll-off? Well, I next plugged them into my Powerbook G4 with iTunes and heard exactly what others had complained about. In fact it took some fiddling with the iTunes EQ to get the HD 280s to sound like much of anything, and I settled on the "Rock" setting as the most realistic (about a 6dB kick in both top and bottom extremes with a smooth curve). So, what's the deal? Do these reviewers sit there listening to their high-priced cans and pontificate using nothing other than an iPod for source material?

I know some of you may be due for some new cans, and I can recommend the Sennheiser HD 280s, so far, as an excellent choice for $80. I'd love to try some others in the $200-$400 range, or even those Euro-only aluminum Sony's, but in reality, when I took the Sennheisers off my ears and cranked up the Crown, even modern monitor headphones are no match at all for my 4412As, properly driven. And, for those of you who may recall, I thought those had overly accentuated bass at first. Of course that's what comes of listening to D130s in C37s in the 030 configuration for nearly fifty years!

If you want to get hold of the Sennheiser HD 280's quickly and efficiently for the best price I found, with free shipping, just follow this link (http://www.jr.com/JRProductPage.process?Product=3992210) to J&R's special unadvertised price. I have no affiliation with any of the reviewers, vendors, or manufacturers mentioned here other than to be completely happy with the service (and price) from J&R.

If anyone has any other headphone stories of success, recommendation, or warnings, feel free to jump all over this thread! ;)

SEAWOLF97
08-23-2007, 09:09 PM
I just read a discussion on Sennheiser HD 280 Pro's the other day.......

http://www.fatwallet.com/t/18/758873

I picked up a pair of AKG K-55 's and have been very impressed , comfortable
and very dynamic and was surprised to see on Parts Express that they were
on sale for about $30...really, no joke these are second in my collection only
to my expensive Senn Hd-580's.

Ducatista47
08-23-2007, 09:25 PM
Well, I have enjoyed headphones a lot through the years. I admit that these days I only listen through them when my big rig is down for repair or modification.

I did start with Pro 4-A's back in the Hippie days, when I built my first "serious" system - Dynaco separates, Dual turntable with Shure cart, etc. Then in the late 1970's I discovered Stax. No turning back after that...

Stax is pretty pricey, but I have read of great NIB deals from Canada. I got a great NIB deal here in Peoria to bag my current pair, manufactured in the early 1980's I think.

I have spent many, many evenings over the last four decades enjoying music through headphones and could not think of single bad thing to relate about the entire experience. I find that I adapt very quickly - within an hour - to the different soundspace when I switch. Too bad there is not a wealth of binaural recordings out there to be had.

As if I were not already gung ho enough, having probably the world's best headphone amp, the Grommes PHI-26, certainly helps move the experience along nicely. It was voiced on Grado product, but brings out the best in everything I have tried on it.

Clark in Peoria

Hoerninger
08-24-2007, 04:11 AM
If anyone has any other headphone stories of success, recommendation, or warnings, feel free to jump all over this thread! ;)
I do second the usage of an electrostatic headphone. Today there seems to be no alternativ to Stax.
Although the whole thing is pricey a special amp (high voltage output) is highly recommended.

I prefer listening with open headphones, the sound is much clearer. And with the electrostatics I crawled in many sounds and music. :)
___________
Peter

johnaec
08-24-2007, 05:07 AM
I recently picked up a pair of Sennheiser HD212Pro's that I really like. Less expensive than the 280's, but a great set for those that want to try them out.

John

opimax
08-24-2007, 07:09 AM
I am looking for a head set to use riding a bicycle. I find the rushing noise of the wind quite loud and not enjoyable. If I turn my head almost sieways the noise goes away due to the different position of my ears.

What I was thinking of is some in ear buds which are noise canceling. In ears won't cause additional noise and noise canceling to get rid of the natural wind rush.

I haven't done any real research yet but does this seem right? can I get in ear noise cancelling ear buds, can i afford them? Sound quality is not as important as getting rid the the loud roar

thanks

Mark

BMWCCA
08-24-2007, 07:53 AM
Is it safe to ride a bike in traffic with such isolation as the noise-reduction ear-buds are capable of? Just asking. I wouldn't do it on my motorcycle, though I do use ear-plugs for wind noise.

00Robin
08-24-2007, 08:22 AM
Riding a bike with buds or headphones is NOT even a thought. For me anyway. Even really enjoying some good power walking with them has me craning my head around at times looking for what....triffids??? (for any one who watched the Day of the Triffids back in the early 60's)

I have a preference for complete over the ear jobs and they MUST be leather padded. They can still pull some sweat,but leather does help. And I don't dare if I look stupid,I want perfect sound.

Unfortunately sound vs headphones vs what they are plugged into whether it be your receiver,ipod,sonyMP3,or the now ancient disc player or portable radio,each has its own sound per headphone. Annoying.

For receiver and KurzweilPC88 privacy I like the Sennheiser and Sony studio variety,especially because they have a curled line I can hook on the music stand without fussing over the length. For my Sony MP3 and Ipod it HAS to tbe the Bose tri-ports. Leather around the ear and they are crispy and full of bass and not the fuzzy maddening kind. They all cost a hun or a little over,but as much as I would like to believe a $450 pair would be the "very best" when I listen to them I can't really tell. But maybe its because I have tried too many in too short of a time span to really be a good listener.

The ear buds I find to be maddeningly uncomfortable,but the younger people seem to love them.

opimax
08-24-2007, 08:22 AM
I wouldn't know, won't ride in traffic, 95% rails to trails, no one around if lucky.

I know some people have the opinion it shouldn't be done at all but that is for another thread. This is about actually saving my hearing from the loud roar w/o wearing ear plugs (which should have the same effect as noise cancelling) and as always it is a matter of how the individual uses the technology. I don't have to turn the music up loud, especially if doesn't have to overcome wind noise. i (most likely) don't want to run into traffic and I take full responsibilty of my actions w or w/o headphones ,at all times and all my actions.

So do they make noise cancelling ear buds?

Mark

Steve K
08-24-2007, 08:29 AM
I love headphones, too. I still own, I think 2 pairs right now. A Grado SR-80 and a AKG set. I say 'think' and can't remember the AKG's model name because they've been in storage for a few years already. The reason is simple. The eletronics I've got now don't have the jacks to plug them in, necessitating a separate headphone amp to be connected between the source (CD player) and the pre-amp. That's really too bad because there defnitely are times when headphones come in handy, like late at night when you still want to play your music loud, or when you want to be totally immersed in the music. So, while we're on the subject of headphones, how about recommendations on headphone amps, too?

00Robin
08-24-2007, 08:34 AM
I wouldn't know, won't ride in traffic, 95% rails to trails, no one around if lucky.

I know some people have the opinion it shouldn't be done at all but that is for another thread. This is about actually saving my hearing from the loud roar w/o wearing ear plugs (which should have the same effect as noise cancelling) and as always it is a matter of how the individual uses the technology. I don't have to turn the music up loud, especially if doesn't have to overcome wind noise. i (most likely) don't want to run into traffic and I take full responsibilty of my actions w or w/o headphones ,at all times and all my actions.

So do they make noise cancelling ear buds?

Mark


Yes Sony does on their website.

opimax
08-24-2007, 08:46 AM
thanks, don't suppose anybody has any experience with them...

I will check thir site


Mark

00Robin
08-24-2007, 08:54 AM
thanks, don't suppose anybody has any experience with them...

I will check thir site


Mark


No,Mark,sorry but I personally do not. I JUST saw them on the site under MP3 stuff yesterday so they really are there. Sometimes when you call them the person you talk too is really truthful if you push them and ask about others that compare to them. If there are others.

Ducatista47
08-24-2007, 09:21 AM
There is another in ear product, a professional in ear stage monitor. Not cheap, but Shure Brothers has been making a killing supplying the tour circuit with them. If you spot a wedge-free band playing, they just might be using them. http://www.shure.com/ProAudio/Products/PersonalMonitorSystems/index.htm

While I feel that one of the advantages of headphones is their single driver technology, the dual driver offering is interesting. http://www.shure.com/ProAudio/Products/PersonalMonitorSystems/us_pro_SCL5_content

Clark in Peoria

SEAWOLF97
08-24-2007, 09:43 AM
I ride bike very often and would NEVER wear sound isolating gear. Car drivers don't care about cyclists and you really have to protect yourself.
That means wearing bright shirt, helmet, gloves and have your hearing really attuned to stupid cars.
That said,,,,,I do take along my pod - makes the miles go faster- but the volume is always low. I use these buds by RIO. They have a soft ear hanger and do not block street noise.

Getting rid of the noise is not worth an accident !!!!!!

opimax
08-24-2007, 09:57 AM
Seawolf I don't fully understand your post. Don't do it but I do??? It also states I personally don't ride around cars and also states this isn't a thread on what I should or shouldn't do which is a pet peeve of mine.

shrt story...I bought a very early g35 coupe I wanted a bike rack for it. It was actually written that I must sell my car and don't deserve it because I was defaming such a beautiful car... I don't remember any of those posters making my payments, being married to any of them or i haven't broke any laws of any kind yet I should sell my car because some people on the net didn't think I was worthy...

I am the picture @byrd automotive products for his bike rack for the g35, thank you very much :)

Mark

opimax
08-24-2007, 03:13 PM
I hope the last post didn't come off too poorly and it wasn't really aimed st Seawolf, it just hit right on that last and sensitive nerve for the day. I am home now w/2 screwdrivers in my hand, one to drink and one to replace a woofer, much better now

I am now doing my sop for finding product and review for the sony 1122 something or other for about $70 to give them a try. certainly cheaper than other toys I want but can't afford at this time, anyone giving away a large screen full featured GPS ?

Mark

Chogull
05-13-2008, 01:54 PM
Can anyone point me to some stylish headphones that give good sound.
I am thinking of buying a pair of Beats by Dr. Dre (www.beatsbydre.com (http://www.beatsbydre.com)) when they come out. I have a friend who works over at monster and he says they are going to be sick.

What do yall think?

Chris Brown
05-13-2008, 02:16 PM
I’m skeptical… seems to have a lot of hype around it and the monster association just seems to go hand in hand as they love over-priced snake-oil type stuff.

If you want a good pair of headphones that aren’t all hype, that have years of reputation behind them and are known for their good bass for Hip-Hop and Rock, check out the Beyerdynamic DT770-Pro/80ohm

http://www.music123.com/272025-i1126937.Music123

demon
05-13-2008, 02:25 PM
hey.

well im using (for homerecording) AKG 24o and 271, and am very very happy with them.
dont know the prices of them in the US but here in europe they are quite a bargain.
they are comfy and look good.
look good indeed:
http://www.akg.com/mediendatenbank2/pspic/image/42/image11963474ec12f1b9a5.jpghttp://www.akg.com/mediendatenbank2/pspic/image/22/image11963474ec17099ae1.jpg
one is silver, and the other is gold!!
:applaud:



wait a sec.
dr.dre...?
if your a bass-freak better stay clear of the two. groove-a-liced theyre not!
:(


cheers anyway,
mikey

Mr. Widget
05-13-2008, 03:09 PM
What do yall think?Are you joking?

Beyerdynamic, AKG, and Sennheiser all make excellent headphones. If you buy the top or near top of the line from any of these companies you will have some excellent headphones. Monster is the very best of audio hype.


Widget

johnaec
05-13-2008, 03:41 PM
'Looks like a $399 troll to me... :bs:

John

BMWCCA
05-13-2008, 03:48 PM
IMHO, this first-post smacks of viral marketing. Is Monster paying hip dudes to hawk their wares on any Internet list that has anything to do with sound?

But I'll take the bait. I recently replaced my forty-year old Superex ST-Pro Vs with Sennheiser HD280 Pros, shown in this link from the same site as above (http://www.music123.com/Sennheiser-HD280-Pro-Closed-Back-Headphones-242411-i1126138.Music123), though I paid $79 for them elsewhere. A friend who does pro live sound swears by these MDR-V700DJs from Sony (http://www.crutchfield.com/App/Product/Item/Main.aspx?g=123800&i=158MDRV700&c=7&tp=887). Nothing from Monster in this house except their dual-banana plugs from Best Buy.

duaneage
05-13-2008, 03:54 PM
'Looks like a $399 troll to me... :bs:

John
We have a winner:dancin:

Moderator, show Dr Dre the door please!

just4kinks
05-13-2008, 05:14 PM
$400 for a pair of headphones!? They don't even list the specs. Does marketing and name recognition really go that far?

I really need to go into business. There are so many ignorant people that I could be taking advantage of.

toddalin
05-13-2008, 05:15 PM
I also have AKG 240s and like them very much. Still, I have a hard time getting 5.1 channels out of them.

SEAWOLF97
05-13-2008, 05:21 PM
I also have AKG 240s and like them very much. Still, I have a hard time getting 5.1 channels out of them.

I liked those AKG's also...for ultimate comfort, the Senn HD-580 is my champ...best cans I ever used were Fostex.

Mr. Widget
05-13-2008, 09:36 PM
IMHO, this first-post smacks of viral marketing. Is Monster paying hip dudes to hawk their wares on any Internet list that has anything to do with sound?I hope that is the case... and I hope that potential buyers find this thread.

Monster does one thing really well. Their cables stay flexible even after years of abuse. Unfortunately they are not worth what they cost and typically the ends fall off, break, or fail in some other manner. Their attempts at speaker lines have failed miserably and I expect these headphones will also. Look for them being dumped in a year or so on eBay.


Widget

invstbiker
05-13-2008, 10:00 PM
The hundred dollar Grado model works for me

johnaec
05-14-2008, 07:55 AM
IMHO, this first-post smacks of viral marketing.Just for grins, I did a search on his username and discovered he's posted essentially the same message on a number of audio forums... :(

John

Hoerninger
05-14-2008, 08:13 AM
... he's posted essentially the same message on a number of (other) forums... :(

same with witweew (http://www.google.de/search?q=witweew&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&aq=t&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:unofficial&client=firefox-a)
___________
Peter

louped garouv
05-14-2008, 09:28 AM
how lame... for the record...

i've been using Sony 7506s and Realistic LV-10s (which are essentially the same as Koss HV/1As)

SMKSoundPro
05-14-2008, 02:14 PM
Whatever happened to the KOSS pro4AAA or AA's?

I still have some of those.

Also I have AKG k140's that were a Christmas gift in 1978. Still use them when necessary.

I am recently becoming interested in some newer cans for the booth and wonder what others are using.

A DJ friend swears by the Sony MDR700(?). No other experience with recent headphones of the last 20 years.

Any Help?

Scotty.

grumpy
05-14-2008, 06:01 PM
Whatever happened to the KOSS pro4AAA or AA's?

heh... pro4aa's were my first set... bought 'em while saving up for speakers.
great bass, great isolation, then heavy and tiring... much later made the
move to some nice sennheisers... still have those.

Auditioned tube-amp/stax combo, ... wow... but $$$ at the time.

Mr. Widget
05-14-2008, 06:15 PM
heh... pro4aa's were my first set... bought 'em while saving up for speakers.
great bass, great isolation, then heavy and tiring... Then the ear pads dried out or leaked... they sounded OK for their time, but the newer offerings are far better.


Widget

duaneage
05-14-2008, 06:33 PM
I also have AKG 240s and like them very much. Still, I have a hard time getting 5.1 channels out of them.
Owned AKG 240 for 10 years. Listen to them every day at work. No boom, no sizzle, just right. like studio monitors on your head. And not too expensive either.

duaneage
05-14-2008, 06:35 PM
how lame... for the record...

i've been using Sony 7506s and Realistic LV-10s (which are essentially the same as Koss HV/1As)

I owned HV/1a's for years but they fell apart in many ways. Great sound, poor quality.

BMWCCA
05-14-2008, 06:54 PM
Only looosers bought the Koss. The rest of us discriminating folk went for the Superex from Yonkers, NY! Well, a few of iconoclasts did. And I still have mine, complete with a JBL badge on one side. ;)

(I think the badges came in the JBL cabinet construction kit?)

grumpy
05-14-2008, 07:16 PM
Only looosers bought the Koss.
"... and I'm not what I appear to be" :)

BMWCCA
05-14-2008, 07:43 PM
"... and I'm not what I appear to be" :)

That ST-Pro B-V; "She was a girl in a million, my friend!"


Well what do you know! A no-bid pair on Epay last month.

http://i18.ebayimg.com/05/i/000/ea/f2/6f67_1.JPG

demon
05-14-2008, 10:13 PM
oooohhh, looking good supertex.
but the kosses look good to, imho.

-----------------------------------------------

this thread turned out rather nicely dont you think?
hey dre! monster marketing your ...cans!


cheers,
mikey

SEAWOLF97
05-16-2008, 07:21 PM
the latest Stereophile mag gave a rave recommendation to these

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16826402014

and for listing at $249, thot the $104 at Newegg was outstanding. :bouncy:

Ducatista47
06-30-2009, 11:43 PM
...but Stax Omega II headphones in particular as well. It will definitely explain what the fuss over Stax is about. Note that one implication is that headphone listening is neither two channel nor surround in presentation, but something else all together. I find it closer to reality than either.

I am tempted to post this in General Audio Discussion instead of a headphone thread. It's implications are broad enough. I think it covers these topics better than any speaker article or paper I have ever read.

http://www.overclock.net/attachments...ega2review.pdf (http://www.overclock.net/attachments/sound-cards-computer-audio/106493d1240507900-essential-headphone-essay-darth-nuts-stax-darthnut_omega2review.pdf)

You can save it or open it. It was written by a poster at Head-Fi known as Darth Nut.

Clark

BMWCCA
07-01-2009, 07:53 AM
:hmm: $2,000 versus $104 . . . must be nice!

Funny, the customer reviews of the Audio Technicas say, for what it's worth:

Other Thoughts: Don't purchase unless your a serious gamer. High price headset is useless if never used properly, and these are not ment for music (little bass)I think I'd trust this opinion more: http://www.soundstage.com/allinyourhead/allinyourhead200804.htm
And Amazon has them listed now for $81. :thmbsup:

jcrobso
07-01-2009, 08:59 AM
First off, I don't like headphones but I use them when necessary.
Running live sound you need headphones, that's just the way it is.
Since getting the job at the radio station, well we use headphones. Mostly Sony and AKG.
But since I now ride Chicago's blue line to work and listen to my MP3 player, I use headphones a lot more.
I DON"T like ear buds, I have tried a couple of pairs of over the ear headphones. They were OK but the train is noisy and I would have to the volume up high just to hear at times.
I kept seeing the adds on eBay for the JBL headphones so I got a pair of 410s.
They are not great headphones, but still they do the job, so much better than the over the ear type. They provide much more outside sound isolation than other types. They do sound good, bass and mids and highs. Because of the better isolation I can keep the volume lower. They are light weight and fold up into a small bag for storage.

Ducatista47
07-16-2009, 11:05 PM
This is just one page from a thread about a meet of headphone fanatics. I was not present but I would love to have been there.

On display are the best headphone amps on the planet. Note that tubes dominate to the point of near exclusivity. The 'phones scattered about are also the best. Sennheiser HE-90 Orpheus and HE-60s and HD-800s; top dog Grados, AKG and Ultrasone all over the place. And Stax, Stax, Stax. This is a complete droolfest for headphone people.

http://www.head-fi.org/forums/f45/canjam-2009-impressions-426794/index18.html

A lot of the amps reflect the quest to be the first to play the Stax Omega I/II series to their potential, which seems to be almost limitless. Reputed to be the most jaw-dropping transducers ever made, speakers included, their "faults" always end up being the upstream equipment being not up to the task.

The amplifier challenge is particularly daunting. It must be relatively small to be as lucid as only relatively small amps can be. It must combine huge voltage swings (electrostats, after all) with enough current to drive bass signals in a headphone that draws as much current as some speakers. I think the EL34 tube can do it, time will tell.

I will take this opportunity to announce that I will be posting an owner's impression at some point. I am putting my money where my mouth is. I have a pair on the way. :) Not everyone likes the sound of these, but it is probably the best transducer for the way I listen and what I listen to. It's all about the music.

Clark

Hoerninger
07-17-2009, 07:35 AM
their "faults" always end up being the upstream equipment being not up to the task.


:thmbsup:

http://img193.imageshack.us/img193/6024/img0516v.jp
http://img193.imageshack.us/img193/6024/img0516v.jpg


It must combine huge voltage swings (electrostats, after all) with enough current to drive bass signals in a headphone that draws as much current as some speakers. The demand for current is intesified by the need of big membran areas for powerful bass (just my experience).


:) Not everyone likes the sound of these, but it is probably the best transducer for the way I listen and what I listen to. It's all about the music.
But electrostatic headphones give a clearity in sound reproduction which is a challenge for speakers. So it's worth to talk about here for comparison.

Thank you for sharing! (I still have to go through the whole thread.)
____________
Peter

Chas
07-17-2009, 07:58 AM
I really enjoy an older pair of Stax SR Lambda Signature's with the matching tube energizer. Funny thing is that despite the wide difference in transducer design and type, I always think about how some aspects are so similar to the sound of my tricked out 4345's.

boputnam
07-17-2009, 07:59 AM
A friend who does pro live sound swears by... Pretty much the standard at FOH is the Sony MDRV6 (http://www.sonystyle.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay?catalogId=10551&storeId=10151&langId=-1&productId=8198552921665089914). These have a pretty flat (un-colored) response and good over-ear fit. This model is a must have. Do not be unimpressed due to their affordability (Full Compass has them for around $80).

For studio / home use, the Sony MDR-SA5000 (http://www.sonystyle.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay?catalogId=10551&storeId=10151&langId=-1&productId=11038053) are peerless. I have never before heard a headphone like these - incredible technology. Stereo separation and definition is startling - the best I've ever heard, as is the frequency response and overall sound quality. Priced accordingly...

Oh, and I drive the MDR-SA5000's with the Little Dot MK V (http://www.little-tube.com/forum/forums/thread-view.asp?tid=142&posts=1&start=1) (read about Little Dot line here (http://www.little-tube.com/forum/forums/thread-view.asp?tid=315&posts=10&start=1)).

Ducatista47
07-17-2009, 09:19 AM
Sony has always supplied great value in headphones. Years ago, when I was between Stax phones - one electret set had died and the SR-5 was in my future, and I was not satisfied by my latest speaker acquisition - I plunked down $50 US for the MDR-V200. They are still doing computer sound duty.

I will try to get a listen to other Sony phones to keep up with these bargain hi fi speaker killers.

Bo, I never would have guessed you used headphones at home. Cool!

Clark

boputnam
07-17-2009, 11:19 AM
Bo, I never would have guessed you used headphones at home. Cool!Hi, Clark...

Not as often as I'd like to! Too often, in my between hours, I'm re-racking stuff or making cables, and those many hours are in the shop blessed by the 4301B's. The sound there is amazing...

I wear the cans at-home when I'm editing down some shows I've captured - not often, and not for long, but it is a help. Whenever I put those SA5000's on, I am floored by them. Truly a remarkable experience (maybe like Doug's new HT set-up!!).

I wear cans at FOH most of the time. Reasons-a-plenty:
- refine the EQ of each instrument / vocal. That's why the V6 are so important - they are colorless and true.
- check for line issues and noise(s).
- refine the mix, pan and overall balance
- reduces the time I'm exposed to high SPL (and most of my shows are at 95 dBA, max).
- reduces the intrusions of adoring fans and wannabe or usedtobe engineers. Running at 95 dBA, the talking noise around me is really loud and disruptive. And, without something on my ears people don't think I'm busy. I try and be cordial, but too often once I am, they want to keep sharing war stories or whatever - me, I have work to do...

grumpy
07-17-2009, 04:03 PM
Last time I did this, I had someone ask me to make change (currency) :banghead:

A pair of the sony MDR's should go on my list with an x8 pre->adat-lightpipe
expander/box so I can grab all 16 ch :D. Thanks Bo.

(scratch that, just ordered a pair :) )

Ducatista47
07-17-2009, 11:07 PM
So far, in the speaker world in general and in this forum as well, any mention of how good headphones are is quickly followed by a “yeah but” rejoinder. I would like to write a few words about what is better about headphones.

The negative points I hear often are about how you have to stay in one place, how unsociable they are, how the bass lacks extension, authority and visceral impact, and how the best headphones cost so much. All of these points are countered by similar inconveniences in the speaker world, or are simply not true, or both.

Like speakers, headphones have been advancing in clarity and capability over the years. Let’s take a look at the current state of headphone affairs.

Their price/performance ratio, even in the most expensive designs, is still able to trump speakers by an order of magnitude or better. And their absolute, as opposed to relative, quality has definitely surpassed speakers, period. I know, “What about bass?” The top electrostatic models will make a believer out of you. The bass is not a smaller, lighter version of great speaker bass. It is, in the Stax Omega for instance, better than speakers. It is deeper, higher fidelity, less colored, less distorted and better balanced with the rest of the audio band. It can’t thump you in the chest but it thumps your brain to the point of utter disbelief. Demanding listeners are finally achieving unmatched experiences with all styles of music, including heavy metal, electronica, dance and trance. You are out of date if you think electrostatic phones are only good for listening to old people playing recorders. Remember, these are single driver “speakers” possessing complete coherence and the most transparent, least colored re creation of music yet achieved. And effortless, realistic, world class dynamics

Not only is the high end of the headphone world higher than the high end of the speaker world, it is actually affordable by less than wealthy listeners.

The price/performance ratio of headphones tempts many to compare how expensive the top models are with how little bargain headphones cost. It is actually correct, given their performance, to compare them with the best speakers. $3500 US ($4200 full retail) gets you Stax’s best headphones and amplifier. How does that compare to a pair of Everest II speakers and the best amp(s) you can think of to drive them. To a pair of Wilson Alexandria X-2s? Obviously, the price/performance ratio holds for even the most expensive headphones.

A set of limitations that speakers have is related to the space in which they are played. We all know that those custom designed $60,000 room treatments will bring out more from a speaker than lesser endowed rooms can. This is a problem and a cost that is absent in the headphone world. The “room” is designed by the headphone engineers and they have complete control and freedom to make it as perfect as they can, and at almost no cost. That small cost is amortized over the entire production of the headphone model, not paid for in full by each owner/user. The same situation holds for the problem of speaker placement within the room. No need to mess with subwoofer placement either. The “speaker” is single driver, its coherence is perfect and its relation to your listening position never deviates from what the design engineers intended. You are always in the sweet spot, and that spot is as sweet as expert audio engineers can make it. The sweet spot matters very much with speakers because if you are making the effort to listen intently to music, it does not make any sense to sit anywhere else.

With headphones, sit wherever you want. The sweet spot is, rather than confining, both perfect and portable. Simply place your rig, which after all is smaller than a speaker based rig, wherever you want it to be. Its placement has no acoustic considerations to attend to. Think about that for a minute, it is an alien and previously unimagined concept. A decent extension cable will allow you to sit, sprawl, do yoga, go outside, or all of the above. I can listen to my Stax sitting inside or out, contemplating the forest beyond the patio. That would be a pain it the ass or impossible with my big speakers, sweet spot or no.

So what about the element of unsociability? I don’t know about your friends, but when I get together to listen to music with even the most dedicated serious listeners I know, a lot of talking goes on over the music. The commentary and verbal camaraderie are a social pleasure all right, but add nothing to the musical (as opposed to social) experience and detract much from it. Music is never going to be the centerpiece of a party, but rather a social lubricant like alcohol is. Since music is not the center of the experience, high fidelity is neither required or important. Nor is attention. The late Ferrari racing team driver Phil Hill was considered odd because when he had friends over to listen to music on his hifi rig, he insisted they actually listen, in silence. Most of us are not so inclined and limit our real listening to private sessions, but I do admire Hill’s recognition of what listening to music seriously is really about. My friends who are real music lovers enjoy also the times when we all fall silent and collectively listen. It happens spontaneously and it forges a bond easily as strong as conversation does amongst us. We are sharing something we all love and recognize without being reminded that anything we say about it at the time would be parenthetical.

Ah, you say, but what about the special moments when you and your lover, or your best friend, bond over the intimacy of listening to music in verbal silence, together? The very best headphone amplifiers, Stax included, have always had two sets of jacks, and for just such times. When I was not yet married I considered double headphone jacks akin to silk sheets on the bed and a fire in the fireplace.

Other than (literally) chest thumping bass, headphones win on all counts.


Clark

boputnam
07-22-2009, 11:22 AM
(scratch that, just ordered a pair :) )Oh, yea? Full report, when you can!! I'm kinda excited for you... :bouncy:

grumpy
07-22-2009, 02:11 PM
Phones are great. Amazon had a reasonable price (If anyone else is curious,
there's no need to buy the 1/8"->1/4" adapter that they seem to indicate
would be useful... one comes with the MDR-V6 package)... save's you $10.

They'll work a lot better (for this purpose) than the semi-open Sennheisers
I use at home and was trying to push into SR service :p

MOTU 8pre (or something similar to go with my Traveler)
will have to wait a bit (sorry if that's what was of most interest).

I'm using the "AudioDesk" s/w that came with the Traveler in
learn by the seat of my pants mode. Nice effects are included, but
I'm looking to see if there's a non r/t mode to bounce tracks/mixes :snore:.

The single recording I did from a Mackie 1604 to the Traveler (just
used 4 ch in) came out good enough for folks to enjoy and "bad"
enough for me to want to do a better job next time... I was really
winging it... and having a good time :)

Akira
07-22-2009, 06:32 PM
These appear to be the top of the food chain for noise cancelling headphones. While reviews are always good, the main criticism seems to center around price vs performance. List price $450. (maybe that's where the name comes from?)
Anyone have any opinions about this product?

My use is for recording live classical music while in the same room as the performers. While there maybe better traditional phones than these, there is no other option but noise cancelling headphones for my application.

Any other suggestions are welcome.
p.s. not a fan of the Bose quiet comfort series.

grumpy
07-23-2009, 08:09 AM
If extreme isolation and accuracy are key, I don't think I would look at the NC products,
but perhaps in-ear (if you can stand to wear them). UltimateEars, Etymotic, Shure,
Sennheiser, Future Sonics, Sensaphonics, ...

The NC headphones I've tried (which did not include the Sennheiser PXC 450), did
not sound bad, but seemed to be more useful for noise cancellation than critical
listening. I hope you find a workable solution.

boputnam
07-23-2009, 09:03 AM
p.s. not a fan of the Bose quiet comfort series.Hi, Akira...

I respect your knowledge of studio stuff, and am curious on this opinion. I am not overwhelmed by Bose QC2, but they work pretty well for me when flying. What have you found?


The NC headphones I've tried (which did not include the Sennheiser PXC 450), did not sound bad, but seemed to be more useful for noise cancellation than critical listening. A truism.

I recall a discussion over on ProSound web where a poster included a Link to a website/page with a fairly comprehensive review of the field. I regret that I cannot find it... :(

midlife
07-23-2009, 11:55 AM
I had some semi iso Sennheisers back in the day (Koss b4 those) , they worked pretty good. Wouldn't mind having a buck for everytime I listened to Robin Trowers' Bridge of Sighs or Edgar Winters' Frankenstein on those phones. They mixed and reproduced the music in your head (quite well actually). I like the speaker experience, but headphones can be a little more personal at times when you might want a little isolation and peace.

Akira
07-24-2009, 04:30 PM
Hi, Akira...

I respect your knowledge of studio stuff, and am curious on this opinion. I am not overwhelmed by Bose QC2, but they work pretty well for me when flying. What have you found?

Bo, as a professional I'm sure you'll agree that it all boils down to application.

I've been doing live classical recordings lately and it really is a challenging difference-- Instead of 30 mics followed by a massive downmix, I'm using 6-8 strategically placed mics capturing 'air' and 'space.' It really is the opposite of what I have been doing all my life.
Since classical is 100% dependent on the room I am forced into recording in the same room as the orchestra. The only mix decision I make is balance. No EQ, no effects, no processing. So I need something that, (A) blocks out the initial sound (only about 70db back of the hall) and (B) is relatively neutral in bass, mid and high response.

The BOSE just don't do that as you can see from the graph. The Bose have an intentionally colored sound that is consumer friendly. To be fair the graph is the QC3's which Bose has intentionally boosted the bass even more so than the QC2's.

I think I am going with the Senn's (PXC 450) Review after review says the sound is very good but, not as good as open back units delivering a clean balance of bass, mid and high. They also block out sound equal to the Bose units in the lower frequencies and better on the higher frequencies.

graph: QC3 green = left side red = right side

boputnam
07-24-2009, 04:50 PM
Akira...

Great reply and post - thanks. And, for reaffirming that website. I went there, but the color of the site threw me off, so I ignored it. You made me dig deeper...

I've not used the QC3, but as I said, have found the QC2 useful for when I'm flying. They are pretty compact, hella comfortable (I wear them for 10-hrs San Fran to Heathrow, time and time again...), and as you say, at-least OK for sound. FWIW, I posted the QC2 response curve and you are right - Bose boosted the bass frequencies considerably on the QC3. I suspect it might have to do with the overear fit reducing the bass performance? Dunno...

boputnam
07-24-2009, 04:59 PM
:o:

I never thought to measure the response of my cans. Duh...

I have measured SPL - frequently, to ensure my ears are quasi "calibrated" to the gain I use in the cans so that I don't over do it. But I think when time next permits, I'll run some Pink Noise through them and capture their response. Easy to do. Maybe after this run through southern OR...

Akira
07-24-2009, 06:00 PM
Picked up a pair from Dell...yeah the computer guys.
$450. USD paid $343. CND
I'll post a review when I try them out--hopefully they will get here before my next gig on August 6th.

as you say, at-least OK for sound. FWIW, I posted the QC2 response curve and you are right - Bose boosted the bass frequencies considerably on the QC3.
Yeah, the pro reviewers rate the QC2's better sonically than the QC3's, and also better noise rejection due to the closed ear design.
But, with all things Bose, guess which one will sell better.

robertbartsch
07-28-2009, 01:56 PM
Well, the Bose headphones I'm currently using are terrible.

What units are good?

MikeBrewster77
07-28-2009, 02:23 PM
Well, the Bose headphones I'm currently using are terrible.

You were expecting... ???


What units are good?
The merits of multiple models have been/are being discussed in this active thread:

http://www.audioheritage.org/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=3094&

I don't use them so I have no credible opinion to offer.

jcrobso
07-28-2009, 02:25 PM
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=160351416258&ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT

They sound good and are portable is that is what your looking for.

SEAWOLF97
07-28-2009, 02:44 PM
Altoids Tin Headphone Amp -



1 custom Altoids Tin Headphone Amp (CMOY) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cmoy
works great
I will include 3 new 9 volt batteries http://images.craigslist.org/3nf3o03lfZZZZZZZZZ97rda64ff756dd316be.jpg http://images.craigslist.org/3m33p23o0ZZZZZZZZZ97rb773b4f7f6f31d86.jpg http://images.craigslist.org/3n03m43o9ZZZZZZZZZ97r51612e6685e01e04.jpg http://images.craigslist.org/3n53kd3p8ZZZZZZZZZ97rf1b9ac361c7f1fa2.jpg

robertbartsch
07-29-2009, 06:39 AM
I got the Bose headphones free from AA for flying a million miles. Anyway, they need batteries to power the equalization circuit and they always sound like they are in equalization overload mode.

MikeBrewster77
07-29-2009, 07:03 AM
I got the Bose headphones free from AA for flying a million miles.

This is why I fly Delta :p

robertbartsch
07-29-2009, 10:59 AM
Delta has too many Eurobus tail-snappers for my taste in aircraft fleets.

Anyway, the Bose headphones are fairly efficeint but [they are] also fairly battery intensive requiring a new aaa every few hours of play.

They also seem to color the sound extensively and this is annoying when you are familiar with a particular sound track and it does not sound right.

I can't beleive people would be willing to pay > $250 clams for these.

jcrobso
07-29-2009, 11:50 AM
They have a high sensitivity and do a good job of noise suppression. I ride the Chicago CTA trains every day and they are far noisier than an airplane.
JBL also has an active pair that has noise suppression.
http://cgi.ebay.com/JBL-510-HEADPHONE-SYSTEM-ACTIVE-NOISE-CANCELING-NR_W0QQitemZ360174796356QQcmdZViewItemQQptZOther_M P3_Player_Accessories?hash=item53dc173e44&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14

Ruediger
07-29-2009, 01:41 PM
Excellent. Great value for relatively little money. They reproduce insane levels without distortion.

ruediger

boputnam
09-16-2009, 09:03 PM
I got the Bose headphones free from AA for flying a million miles. Anyway, they need batteries to power the equalization circuit and they always sound like they are in equalization overload mode.Which Model? I've had the QC1, QC 2 and today, the QC15 and I "think" I'm pretty picky about frequency response and have not had the experience you describe.


Anyway, the Bose headphones are fairly efficeint but [they are] also fairly battery intensive requiring a new aaa every few hours of play. Which Model? I've flown SanFran -> Heathrow - Johannesburg -> Heathrow -> SFO over the course of a ten-day period all on the same single AAA battery.


They also seem to color the sound extensively and this is annoying when you are familiar with a particular sound track and it does not sound right.

I can't beleive people would be willing to pay > $250 clams for these.Well, I have - a number of times. The QC 1, 2 and 15 all take one "AAA" battery, and I've had these last for months - and I fly a lot.

I read the promotes for the QC15, and today trialed them at DEN. Impressive enough that I bought a pair - my QC2's over-ear surrounds were finally decrepitating (5+ yrs?), so it was time for a change. The QC15 is a remarkable improvement over the QC2 (NB: I have never tried the QC3 - I don't like on-ear fit). I will try and measure the improvement (gain reduction), but I truly could not hear "nuthin' " in the cabin, and was able to turn down my 20 GB Archos 204 (http://www.archos.com/support/support_tech/manuals.html?country=gb&lang=en) (which was only offered in the UK - never in the US) -12% and with improved clarity. I sensed no "coloration" whatsoever.

I have used the QC-series for well over 8-yrs and typically listen to the 2-tr soundboards I capture of our shows, and use the air travel time audit my mixes - it gives me ideas. I cannot say I have experienced an unfaithful "coloration" or anything that I felt was additive. But, I use these only when travelling - planes, trains and automobiles - and in those conditions, this is a remarkable product.

Akira
09-17-2009, 02:49 PM
I read the promotes for the QC15, and today trialed them at DEN. Impressive enough that I bought a pair
So Bo can you provide a review of the QC15's after you've had some time with them. I have been reading reviews about them as I was thinking about picking up a pair. I have also heard that you can EQ their response (?) If true that would certainly change things. I found the QC2's pleasing to listen to but, not good for accurate monitoring. I ordered Sennheiser's top model (PXC450) over two months ago and only got notice yesterday that Dell has finally shipped them. I will write a review on them once I have properly tried them out.

p.s. the reason I stuck with the Senns is because in a head to head test with their cheaper model PXC350 they blew away the QC3's.
Test Gear: Newmann Binaural stereo microphone and Korg MR1000 high resolution recorder you can hear the results here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cQdbcDTiIas

Akira
09-18-2009, 01:06 PM
Okay, after the longest wait I finally received delivery.

Initial reaction...HIGHLY DISAPPOINTING.

The noise reduction is good for continuous hum but, poor to non existent for random noises. The unit does have natural sound blocking abilities being a closed (circumaural) design as it seals the ears well. When used outdoors the unit is susceptible to wind noise. I don't know if all NC units have the same problem as they employ external microphones. Yes you can hear very low level hiss--reported in every NC unit on the market.
Build quality is very good and the unit is very comfortable and looks great -- 9/10 on all three counts.
I also like the short cable (for working) but for pro use, any unit with a mini stereo jack HAS TO HAVE A LOCKING FEATURE. This unit does not.
I found these headphones very efficient, a surprise as that was one of the knocks against them. Perhaps I am use to inefficient pro units which require proper amplification.

AUDIO QUALITY: Here is where I give this product a poor grade --C minus.

First off being a circumaural design there is a natural lack of "air and spaciousness" to the sound. That much I expected. However, most disappointing is the lack of detail revealed in recordings. Sound is muffled as if a blanket were over top. All of the subtleties are missing. Part of the problem is a hump in the response around 180Hz which has a masking effect on higher frequencies. Play back on a John Mayer track, 'Your Body Is a Wonderland' the snare looses all of it's snap and sounds contained and boxy. The kick drum has a big low end thump and not the true body and texture that was originally recorded, especially on the attack--the beater hitting the skin. The vocal is closed and contained as opposed to open and breathy. Acoustic guitars have really high harmonics which are missing--again the quality of 'air' and 'space'.

I let a lay person try them out and they thought they sounded great. But to an educated ear the short comings are obvious. I find the faults glaring, especially when I listen back to my own work which of course I know intimately.
Perhaps I am being overly critical as I used my studio monitor series phones (AKG K240df) as a comparison. The AKG's I'm sure are not the best when compared to the highest end of the market, but they are EXTREMELY revealing in detail--one of the best for critical if not analytical monitoring.

WHAT TO DO??? I suppose I should audition them side by side with some Bose QC15's. I can return the Senn's and I am tempted to immediately, but I want to see if the Bose are any better. BO...I could really use a report!

Akira
09-19-2009, 03:58 PM
The first thing that you notice about Bose's latest entry (Quiet Comfort 15) is that the second you put them on your head, you are in another world. Unlike the the Sennheisers the sense of isolation is immediate. Bose has added internal mics in their quest for improved noise cancellation. At almost half the size the fit is snug and yet comfortable; the natural circumaural seal is tight, again better than the Senns.
While the QC15's are also susceptible to wind noise they are a lot less so. The added negative white noise is however, more noticeable in the Bose.
The second thing you notice is the detachable cable. This is the cheapest flimsiest piece of manufactured garbage I have ever seen on ANY headset in my entire life...and WTF, no standard 1/4" adapter --Bose 3 Sennheiser 2

Looks, comfort and build Quality: While many people, especially travelers prefer the much smaller Bose, I favor the substantial, rich and quality look and feel of the Sennheisers which also have superior build quality.-- slight edge Sennheiser.

AUDIO QUALITY--the big one.
As much as I hate the exaggerated low end response of the Bose, (kiss of death for mixing) I have to say the overall sound is better. These headphones have dynamic punch and are much better in the critical midrange. There is detail in the recordings and even a bit of air and space. If the bass were not so ridiculously out of whack I would say the sound is very good--excellent for this type of design. While not quite voiced 'forward' the vocals remain in the forefront and the snare has that pop in it. They do not sound like they have a blanket over the mix. I also listened to the Sennheisers with the NC switched out and I found the balance the most neutral of the two in this configuration. With a sunken middle the frequency interference induced in these headphones resulted in a lack of distinction; this was not the case with the circuit out. While not as aurally stimulating as the Bose, I would have kept them if they sounded like this all the time because I am after the most neutral response I can get--not necessarily the best sounding product.
(For test comparisons I used a track bye Jo Dee Mesina called; Bye, Bye'
This is my test track I always play when setting up my monitors)

I am still not totally happy with the Bose QC15's but, after an exhaustive search I will be keeping them and returning the Senns. I really wanted to like the Sennheisers better...My wife says she will be posting a notice on the internet--Akira uses BOSE.:o:

p.s. a word of caution. If I did not need these right away, I would have put off the purchase till a much future date. Noise canceling headphones are currently in that 'cycle' where a product is relatively new to the market and every manufacturer is jumping on the bandwagon. I expect these products to see a lot of improvement in the future as evidenced by the QC15's. Perhaps the biggest improvement we will see is the ability to cancel out random sounds which they all do rather poorly.

4313B
10-06-2009, 07:41 AM
Unless you derive some sick pleasure from jogging with a pair of giant cans bolted to your head, earbuds are the way to go.

Giz Explains: Why You Can't Get Decent Earphones for Less Than $100 (http://gizmodo.com/5371253/giz-explains-why-you-cant-get-decent-earphones-for-less-than-100)

boputnam
10-06-2009, 10:21 AM
Unless you derive some sick pleasure from jogging with a pair of giant cans bolted to your head, earbuds are the way to go.That's a great Link - thanks. I've found the triple flange to be the best all around fit - it gives a really good seal.

And, to Akira - I've been too dang busy to get the testing done. I plan to, but things like this 3-day Hardly Strictly (http://www.strictlybluegrass.com/) festival in Golden Gate Park keep getting priority...

Top = Banjo Stage, from the air
Middle = Banjo Stage, audience from FOH position
Bottom = Rooster Stage, audience from Monitorworld

SEAWOLF97
10-06-2009, 03:55 PM
http://gizmodo.com/5033455/ultimate-cut+the+crap-in+ear-headphone-battlemodo

Akira
10-07-2009, 12:35 PM
And, to Akira - I've been too dang busy to get the testing done. I plan to, but things like this 3-day Hardly Strictly (http://www.strictlybluegrass.com/) festival in Golden Gate Park keep getting priority...


Looks like a great gig.
Don't worry about the testing, just wanted to know your opinions on the QC15's before I bought them....I bought them anyway. But, if you care to comment--by all means.

boputnam
10-09-2009, 06:23 PM
OK, here goes.

Methodology: After a number of failed attempts, I settled upon the likely flawed "consumer" level, and friendly method. Since not all headphones would seal around the Earthworks M30 tightly alone, I wore the suckers, and stuck the Earthworks into the small groove of my RH ear's antitragus.

Each measurement used Pink Noise and comprises two screen-shots: a gain-balanced RTA and a Magnitude (Transfer Function) trace.

The RTA gains are matched - Pink Noise (reference) in Blue; Measurement in Green. Areas where the Blue can be seen represent areas the headphone response is deficient. Areas where the Green obscures the Blue are areas the headphone response matches or exceeds the reference signal gain.

The Magnitude trace is collected after time-aligning the reference and measurement signals. The Yellow trace is the difference between the two signals. Humps above 0dB are areas of the frequency response where the headphones are producing more of that frequency then they were given; valleys represent areas where the headphones produce less than they were given. Note the Red trace - this is coherence. Areas with low coherence that are coincident with "valleys" indicates this portion of the Yellow trace is spurious - an anomaly introduced by the environment and which cannot be remedied with EQ. Other humps and valleys of high coherence can be remedied with EQ.

First up:

Sony MDR-V6, my field cans...

boputnam
10-09-2009, 06:27 PM
Here is the Sony MDR-SA5000, my studio cans...

Two obvious and extreme points of low coherence at 8kHz and approx. 12kHz. This must relate to mic positioning / reflections.

boputnam
10-09-2009, 06:29 PM
Here is the Bose QC2

boputnam
10-09-2009, 06:30 PM
And lastly (for me...), the QC15

boputnam
10-09-2009, 06:35 PM
Observations:

There is not a meaningful difference in the QC2 vs QC15 by this method - that being in a noise-free environment where the NC was not benefitting the user. There is a slightly smoother response in the 1kHz to 6kHz by the QC15, but the lower range of their responses is nearly identical.

I have above reported that use of the the QC15 allowed using much lower output gain on my mp3 device. I tried to quantify this but failed - it did not show in the ear-tight results. However, it did show in my early trials where I tried to keep the ear shells closed together (no head involved), and in those instances Smaart showed a ±9dB difference between the two, with the QC15 the louder. Therefore, this difference must relate to instances where the increased effectiveness of the "new" NC algorithm does matter.

I again travelled with the QC15 this week, and it provides a remarkably isolated environment.

To Akira's frustration that a mini-plug to 1/4-in plug adapter is no longer provided, the rep at DEN gave me one on asking, and told me their research indicated something far less that 5% of buyers used it, so they dropped it from the product offering. Everyone is using these with mobile devices, all of which have (only?) a mini-jack. I admit I've only used mine a few times, but my world is odder than the norm...

Mr. Widget
10-10-2009, 10:46 AM
Here is the Sony MDR-SA5000, my studio cans...

Two obvious and extreme points of low coherence at 8kHz and approx. 12kHz. This must relate to mic positioning / reflections.I think the problem was with the "dummy" head you were using. :rotfl:

If you ever feel up to doing this bit again, I'd be curious as to how my Sennheiser HD-600s compare.


Widget

Akira
10-10-2009, 12:48 PM
My impressions were subjective as I never used any test gear.
I must say the graphs look a lot better than anything my ears hear...but, them I'm probably deaf. Regardless of any data, IMO the QC15's are much too bass heavy for actual mix applications....but, I don't mind it for casual music playback. You never want to hear an over exaggeration of low end when recording. Something I'll just have to learn to compensate for.

I did get a chance to try them out on a high SPL situation last night--my first FOH gig in 8 years... An old Martin horn system--now I remember why I always hated those things. When I showed up I had to think what to do next--oh yeah--establish power. The QC15's were able to isolate the solo function at mix position which was a good 110-115db-- life in a club.
p.s. nice scenery, but you know your old when your staring at ALL 200 girls who could be your daughter. :p Of course back in the day, THEY USED TO STARE BACK!:o:

boputnam
10-10-2009, 02:26 PM
I think the problem was with the "dummy" head you were using. :rotfl:No kidding! My thoughts exactly...


If you ever feel up to doing this bit again, I'd be curious as to how my Sennheiser HD-600s compare. Sure - it's pretty easy to set-up. I seem to always have my head nearby somewhere and Smaart is never too far away...


IMO the QC15's are much too bass heavy for actual mix applications....Agree. I suspect that emphasis is needed to compensate for the high energy levels in that frequency range that typify "transportation noise".


I did get a chance to try them out on a high SPL situation last night--my first FOH gig in 8 years... I have tried the QC2 a few times - they work pretty well, but when it gets loud, they are less useful. I have not tried the QC15's but guess they would be better.


p.s. nice scenery, but you know your old when your staring at ALL 200 girls who could be your daughter. :p Of course back in the day, THEY USED TO STARE BACK!:o:Ah, the benefits of being an old soundguy. My daughter and her mates come around to quite a few of my local shows - they enjoy the great "seats" at FOH, but prefer being on the rail.

LowPhreak
10-20-2009, 04:10 AM
I've never been crazy about using cans, but do so when I have to.

AKG K701's here. Fairly easy to drive (62 ohms), comfortable (except the headband is pretty stiff/hard at first but gets better), and if you can get through the long break-in period (3-4 weeks) you'll have great SQ.

I'm not keen on the white "iPod" look, but otherwise worth the $309. I paid a couple of years ago. A vast improvement IMO on the 240 Studio Monitors of old, and I like their sound and fit better than the Senn HD600's, Koss Pro 4/AAA's, Sony V6's, and Grado Torture Devices™ I used to have.

Accurate/'neutral', great dynamics and soundstage (as headphones go), and excellent midrange. No real flaws sonically.



http://www.akg.com/akg_personal/mediadb/live/psfile/image/49/image_K_70486e2792379ae.jpg