Flat Panel speakers

[hjames]

Slag off these unamerican b@$tards!
Selling off an American icon like they did ...


I just bought a fine pair of American made speakers off CL -
The seller was about an hour away in Maryland ...
got clear the JBL trash outta the way to give them space to play, but they really aren't bad at all!

Gentlemen, Wisconsin's finest ... Magnepan!
STILL made in America!!


Magneplanar MG IIB

46953

[Titanium Dome]

My, my, those are big.

[grumpy]

a bit OT in carrying this further, but depending on how and to what you listen to,
they can be quite pleasing.

[hjames]

I saw them in the local CL and had heard they were intriguing - the entry price was pretty low, and when I did some research, it was impressive to hear THEY hadn't offshored their production!

They sound pretty good, for 22 year old speakers!
I'll take it to another thread now, ok?

[scott fitlin]

I saw them in the local CL and had heard they were intriguing - the entry price was pretty low, and when I did some research, it was impressive to hear THEY hadn't offshored their production!

They sound pretty good, for 22 year old speakers!
I'll take it to another thread now, ok?Are they as transparent and holographic sounding as they are said to be?

[hjames]

Are they as transparent and holographic sounding as they are said to be?

They seem to be - I just put them in the room where they fit for the moment, haven't spent any time with placement issues - but - at the moment - if you stand maybe a foot forward of dead between them, you are in the band, with every instrument placed precisely around you.

Emma says its like swimming in the music -
Its the craziest thing - the whole panel has music on it - there is no single point of radiation - there is no box, no ports, no focus, just a field of music ...
Gotta get to bed soon - but once I heard them, I had to bring it home and feed it from our system.

And I'm not even feeding it from the big system - right now its just got the carver receiver and the HK changer! Maybe 150w/ch into 4 ohms.

It does have a couple jumpers on the connector panel - so I could biAmp it in a heartbeat ...
but - lots of time to play with it later ...

Its an older 2 way model - they make a lot fancier ones now - but - its real oak uprights and struts.
Plus, the price was cheap enough - I paid more for the two walnut horns John made for me thanI did for this pair!

46958

[BMWCCA]

A close friend was recently given a pair. Service records show multiple tweeter replacements. When the owner's manual treat this like an annual service, even to showing what size PVC pipe you need to buy to ship the old part for re-furb, then you know there's weak link in the system somewhere. Sound just OK to me in his system. But free is good. He offered them to me but I declined.

[hjames]

A close friend was recently given a pair. Service records show multiple tweeter replacements. When the owner's manual treat this like an annual service, even to showing what size PVC pipe you need to buy to ship the old part for re-furb, then you know there's weak link in the system somewhere. Sound just OK to me in his system. But free is good. He offered them to me but I declined.

And so you should have - you have a house full of JBL inventory already!

Rollin said he bought his new in 88, and had one of them sent back for refurb - maybe 90/91, when he found his cat had used it for a scratch post. Didn't sound like his got annual servicings ... but - time will tell.

Apparently they are 5 ohm speakers but the load can drift down to around 2 ohm load at times - so - they may not play well with some amps ...

[SEAWOLF97]

if you stand maybe a foot forward of dead between them, you are in the band, with every instrument placed precisely around you.

Oh No !!! deviant speakers :( (wait till you hear Walsh's ....that kinda sound stage but with bass too)

Mine are listed as "4/3 ohm" ...its either 1 1/3 or 4 sometimes 3 ....Tim says they can drop to 2 ohm at some freqs....that what got me into BGW amps..they can handle the low impedance.

[BMWCCA]

And so you should have - you have a house full of JBL inventory already!

Rollin said he bought his new in 88, and had one of them sent back for refurb - maybe 90/91, when he found his cat had used it for a scratch post. Didn't sound like his got annual servicings ... but - time will tell.

Apparently they are 5 ohm speakers but the load can drift down to around 2 ohm load at times - so - they may not play well with some amps ...

The beauty of this is I still can have them, whenever I want them. For the time being they're stored at his house . . . in the third floor cathedral-ceiling "apartment" of his "garage" one-floor above the 42-motorcycle collection, with the cars (including lift) on the first floor. "Space; the endless frontier." But I, on the other hand, have none.

The Crown amp I brought over to use with them worked fine but the rest of the system isn't what I'd use and the whole thing lost my interest. Maybe I'll try them again in a different room with a better system . . . or just listen to yours! :thmbsup:

[lgvenable]

funny here I found a pair last year here in Newburgh 10.00.My wife said: No,No NO!!!. I came back on Monday, got the top of the trash pile out back; used carpet cleaner on them, and flipped them for 250.00. On Monday they were free.....

one mans trash is another's treasure

[hjames]

funny here I found a pair last year here in Newburgh 10.00.My wife said: No,No NO!!!. I came back on Monday, got the top of the trash pile out back; used carpet cleaner on them, and flipped them for 250.00. On Monday they were free.....

one mans trash is another's treasure

Kind of what I figured - that's about what I paid for them - so I can play with them for a while and sell them for what I paid with no problem ...

Sat downstairs reading last night and put on the CD of James Taylor & Carol King "Live at the Troubador". Its an authorized DVD-CD package from the tour I got for about $20 the other day. Anyway, it was a quite pleasant concert, and had a nice presence in the room.

Bout the only thing that DIDN'T sound right on them was B'Boom, KC Live in Argentina - Tony Levin's bass is obviously missing some bottom (at least until I try adding the Volkswoofer in that room) - but small jazz or folk stuff is nice

[JBL 4645]

They seem to be - I just put them in the room where they fit for the moment, haven't spent any time with placement issues - but - at the moment - if you stand maybe a foot forward of dead between them, you are in the band, with every instrument placed precisely around you.

Emma says its like swimming in the music -
Its the craziest thing - the whole panel has music on it - there is no single point of radiation - there is no box, no ports, no focus, just a field of music ...
Gotta get to bed soon - but once I heard them, I had to bring it home and feed it from our system.

And I'm not even feeding it from the big system - right now its just got the carver receiver and the HK changer! Maybe 150w/ch into 4 ohms.

It does have a couple jumpers on the connector panel - so I could biAmp it in a heartbeat ...
but - lots of time to play with it later ...

Its an older 2 way model - they make a lot fancier ones now - but - its real oak uprights and struts.
Plus, the price was cheap enough - I paid more for the two walnut horns John made for me thanI did for this pair!

http://www.audioheritage.org/vbulletin/attachment.php?attachmentid=46958&d=1281405165

46958

I noticed the fuse is that to protect the whole system from overload?

[hjames]

I noticed the fuse. Is that to protect the whole system from overload?

The fuse is just on the tweeter ...

It also has jumpers you can remove to bypass the crossover and connect to the drivers directly, if you want to biamp it.



http://www.audioheritage.org/vbulletin/attachment.php?attachmentid=46958&d=1281405165

[scott fitlin]

They seem to be - I just put them in the room where they fit for the moment, haven't spent any time with placement issues - but - at the moment - if you stand maybe a foot forward of dead between them, you are in the band, with every instrument placed precisely around you.

Emma says its like swimming in the music -
Its the craziest thing - the whole panel has music on it - there is no single point of radiation - there is no box, no ports, no focus, just a field of music ...


46958This is the thing about these kinds of speakers, they present the sound in hologprhic images. You describe as "IN THE BAND", Emma says "SWIMMING IN THE MUSIC", I just say "HOLOGRAPHIC SOUND", enjoy thjem, for what they are, and of course for what you did NOT have to pay to get sound like this, :applaud:

I think you will find these speakers suit some types of music really well. And are not very great with other kinds of music.

[JBL 4645]

The fuse is just on the tweeter ...

It also has jumpers you can remove to bypass the crossover and connect to the drivers directly, if you want to biamp it.

http://www.audioheritage.org/vbulletin/attachment.php?attachmentid=46958&d=1281405165

I see, for the tweeter that's interesting kinder like the fuse on my passive plastic JBL control1 since I no longer use the passive crossover on the control 5. You can use x1 DCX set to three-way two stereo inputs and select the outputs on the DCX2496 as, I see three jumper plugs on it.
1 left low
2 left mid
3 left high
4 right low
5 right mid
6 right high

Can you recover them I mean how transparent is the martial that covers the front and back?

What is the fuse rated at any idea? Just in case you over loud it and need spare fuses what type of wire is it, yeah all you need is the fuse wire and solder in a new piece.

[hjames]

I see, for the tweeter that's interesting kinder like the fuse on my passive plastic JBL control1 since I no longer use the passive crossover on the control 5.

Can you recover them I mean how transparent is the material that covers the front and back?


Fuse is replaceable - its a slide in fuseholder, no soldering needed - tho I did pop them out and wipe the ends of the fuses with steelwool and a shot of DeOxit to improve connectivity.
Pulled all the jumpers and did the same - didn't see any signs of tarnish - but - they've all been in place for over 25 years, so it couldn't hurt.

There are screws that hold the oak rails in place around the actual panels - once you lay them down and remove all of that, I've read that the speaker cloth is held in place with lots of staples. I could recover them in most any transparent cloth I wanted - but - it takes a lot of cloth to cover 2 sides of the panel - 22" x 72"x 2"

Some of the newer 3-way models are covered with a dark cloth - makes them look like the TMA from 2001 ...
Not sure if I'd want to go that route ...

http://www.magnepan.com/content/binary/speakers/MG36_01.jpg

http://www.integracoustics.com/images/magnepan/mg25.jpg

[JBL 4645]

Fuse is replaceable - its a slide in fuseholder, no soldering needed - tho I did pop them out and wipe the ends of the fuses with steelwool and a shot of DeOxit to improve connectivity.
Pulled all the jumpers and did the same - didn't see any signs of tarnish - but - they've all been in place for over 25 years, so it couldn't hurt.

There are screws that hold the oak rails in place around the actual panels - once you lay them down and remove all of that, I've read that the speaker cloth is held in place with lots of staples. I could recover them in most any transparent cloth I wanted - but - it takes a lot of cloth to cover 2 sides of the panel - 22" x 72"x 2"

Some of the newer 3-way models are covered with a dark cloth - makes them look like the TMA from 2001 ...
Not sure if I'd want to go that route ...

http://www.magnepan.com/content/binary/speakers/MG36_01.jpg

http://www.integracoustics.com/images/magnepan/mg25.jpg

The good ole steel-wool I haven’t played with that in years! They used that as a visual effects illusion in STAR TREK II the Wrath of Khan when the U.S.S. Reliant was hit by phaser attack in the gases nebula towards the end of the battle, you see the Reliant banking over and sparkles of colours glittering around one of the blow off warp engines.

I tried this effect on the U.S.S. Enterprise 21” AMT model kit with a less than impressive effect. The steel-wool as traces of oil in it, as I read the later Cinefex magazine that I still have that explains the trade of visual effects. I think they also used the effect in STAR TREK III the search for Spock when the Enterprise is hit by klingon photon torpedo on her starboard warp engine it had this glowing blue sparkle that looked WOW!

You light the steel-wool and it should burn kinder like fuse on firework but I guess I didn’t have enough oil on the steel-wool for the effect, this was around 1985/86 when I did this.

Oh the days of steel-wool what you can do with it, besides cleaning with it.

So there’s a little thing you can try and who knows it might sparkle for you.;)

Oh, right stables that figures. Well it should be easy to recover them with fabric cloth that you and Emma like maybe (blue for left and red for right). LOL depending on what side you look at it? LOL

Oh, the mystics mysteries of the black monolith? Best it’s left alone it’s a power, we can’t understand. :D

Mind you do like the black ones maybe darker blue cloth.

[SEAWOLF97]

I think you will find these speakers suit some types of music really well. And are not very great with other kinds of music.

I had a pair of early (MG2 ?) back in the late 70's/early 80's....they were very smooth but had no low end at all ...a sub is a must with these....I agree that they prolly are best suited for jazz/classical...that was the beauty of the big 1 way Walsh's...they have the same enveloping 360 sound, but bass to 32hz ....(drawback is 4/3 ohms and non compat with many amps)

[JBL 4645]

I stumbled onto this video that was about a sub bass diy build and next thing I know its one of the same flat panel loudspeakers that Heather has.

The dude in the previous video needs a serious haircut! :D


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HMcmN-poNb4

One other thing I noticed was the camera being moved around the volume seemed remain the same level if its that loud I pity the poor creature because by the time he’s my age he would have serious hearing loss due to ignorance.

[richluvsound]

Hi Heather,

that is a wonderful find . I heard those about 25 years ago . No bass ( nothing a well tuned sub wont correct) Bi-amp with a nice little valve amp and you are there my Dear !

A good T.T. and Carol Kings' " Tapestry" Wow !

Rich

[clmrt]

Ahem...Minnesota...*cough*:p

[hjames]

Minnesota's finest ... Magnepan!
STILL made in America!!



Ahem...Minnesota...*cough*:p
, its not Wisc - sorry 'bout that! I caught that mistake on my part in the original thread --- American made is right, but its important to get the STATE right!

MAGNEPAN (http://www.magnepan.com/contact)
1645 Ninth Street
White Bear Lake, MN 55110
USA

[scott fitlin]

Minnesota's finest ... Magnepan!
STILL made in America!!



, its not Wisc - sorry 'bout that! I caught that mistake on my part in the original thread --- American made is right, but its important to get the STATE right!

MAGNEPAN (http://www.magnepan.com/contact)
1645 Ninth Street
White Bear Lake, MN 55110
USANO BIGGIE! At least they are STILL MADE IN AMERICA!

And, not to hijack your thread, and so Wisconsin doesn't feel offended, I'll add that MY tools ( SNAP ON ) ARE made in Wisconsin, and I ordered four Acoustic Elegance 18,s made in GREEN BAY, WISCONSIN!

It's all good, MADE IN THE U.S.A! :jester: :mona_lisa: :jester:

[macaroonie]

Placement is all important with dipole speakers. Get it right and you will have bass. About 4 ft out from the wall AIRC tweets to the inside . Start getting too close to the back wall and the bass dies away due to cancellation. They are very different to JBL in every respect but I suspect you will grow to like them.
Have fun ............. Mac

[JBL 4645]

NO BIGGIE! At least they are STILL MADE IN AMERICA!

And, not to hijack your thread, and so Wisconsin doesn't feel offended, I'll add that MY tools ( SNAP ON ) ARE made in Wisconsin, and I ordered four Acoustic Elegance 18,s made in GREEN BAY, WISCONSIN!

It's all good, MADE IN THE U.S.A! :jester: :mona_lisa: :jester:
,
I don’t mean to sound, snooty Scotty, :p but I don’t mind where any Hi-Fi gear is made as long as it does the job, that its designed to do.

I only have a few JBL items made in the US the rest Japan, China, Russia with love :D no just kidding haven't got anything from Russia as of yet.

So how comes then JBL hasn’t made Panel Loudspeakers?

[SEAWOLF97]

Placement is all important with dipole speakers. Get it right and you will have bass. About 4 ft out from the wall AIRC tweets to the inside . Start getting too close to the back wall and the bass dies away due to cancellation.

Why didnt you tell me THAT 25 years ago ? :confused:

My LR is not big enough to pull them 4 feet from a wall , they were more like 1 foot and had NO bass

[JBL 4645]

Heather
Just been reading the link wow 86db sensitivity that’s quite low so yeah I see it would require lots of power.
http://www.magnepan.com/manual_MMG

Am I reading this right down to 25Hz! MG20.1
http://www.magnepan.com/content/binary/pdf_manuals/manual_201.pdf

HOLY CRAP!:eek::eek::eek: I didn’t expect the prices to skyrocket as high as £15,750.00. Anyone got ski-mask I can borrow need to knock off a few banks first. :D
http://www.google.co.uk/products?hl=en&q=magnepan&um=1&ie=UTF-8&sa=N&tab=wf

[scott fitlin]

,
I don’t mean to sound, snooty Scotty, :p but I don’t mind where any Hi-Fi gear is made as long as it does the job, that its designed to do.

I only have a few JBL items made in the US the rest Japan, China, Russia with love :D no just kidding haven't got anything from Russia as of yet.

So how comes then JBL hasn’t made Panel Loudspeakers?I'm just being a bit sarcastic.

[JBL 4645]

I'm just being a bit sarcastic.

I thought you’re serious .:D

I don’t know what prices they these go for in the US but £15grand for two pairs of loudspeakers is barmy. I trust Heather paid a few $hundred for these.

Can these be made on the diy side? Where can get parts for these?

Just don’t tell the missies you spent £15grand you might see an axe coming you’re way!:p You just say: oh, they cost £50 pounds for the pair.

I think after spending £15grand you won’t have any money left over to pay for the electricity key meter.

http://www.stoneaudio.co.uk/

Description 3-Way / Ribbon Tweeter - Planar-Magnetic
Freq. Resp. 25-40kHz ±3dB
Sensitivity 85dB/500Hz /2.83v
Impedance 4 Ohm
Dimensions 29 x 79x 2.062
Available in natural or black solid oak trim, off-white, black or grey fabric. (Dark Cherry trim available at an extra charge)

[Audiobeer]

I love the sound of Maggies! :applaud:

[hjames]

Ya know, not everything from JBL is an Everest ...
They make speakers to fit a number of price points - I gather magneplanar does too!
They've got a try it and buy it set for around $600 ... and, they have the fancy materials, fancy finish, extended range high end systems as well.

And yes, mine are older, used ones from the mid-80s ...
under $300 would be the operative phrase ...


I thought you’re serious .:D

I don’t know what prices they these go for in the US but £15grand for two pairs of loudspeakers is barmy. I trust Heather paid a few $hundred for these.


Description 3-Way / Ribbon Tweeter - Planar-Magnetic
Freq. Resp. 25-40kHz ±3dB
Sensitivity 85dB/500Hz /2.83v
Impedance 4 Ohm
Dimensions 29 x 79x 2.062
Available in natural or black solid oak trim, off-white, black or grey fabric. (Dark Cherry trim available at an extra charge)

[JBL 4645]

Ya know, not everything from JBL is an Everest ...
They make speakers to fit a number of price points - I gather magneplanar does too!
They've got a try it and buy it set for around $600 ... and, they have the fancy materials, fancy finish, extended range high end systems as well.

And yes, mine are older, used ones from the mid-80s ...
under $300 would be the operative phrase ...

I don’t think I have that sort money hanging around for JBL Everest nice lookers too. Well I’m off to get some kip now I’m buggered.:snore: I don’t really snore I just need the kip now. Later have fun listen! :)

[hjames]

Got the Volkswoofer tied in to the Magneplanars today ... got it cranked WAY DOWN, but - it adds a lot of bottom to them! Certainly all that I'll need!

Played King Crimson - B'Boom - Tony Levin is just pounding away downstairs -
yet I can still hear the subtleties of Larks Tongue in Aspic ... the sub clears the flaw I heard the other day!
Followed it with The Blue Nile: Walk Across the Rooftops - Paul Buchanan and the Linn Drums ... just stunning.

Now - what do I do with those big walnut boxes behind them - they are just gonna get in the way, for sure!

[hjames]

Time to downsize the herd - tried to sell the Dahlquist system last week, guy didn't show -
posted the maggies with Optional Volkswoofer in CL last night -
2 guys came this afternoon and listened to chinese music with and without sub -
They decided to buy maggies without the sub ...
Had them 16 months - spent nothing on them, sold them with a $60 profit ... not too bad.
Get to keep the Volkswoofer ...

Goodbye Maggies!

54097

[Lee in Montreal]

Hi Heather.

I love your perspective on audio equipment. Try this. Try that. Understanding that every brand has good stuff to offer. After all, isn't being an audiophile about collecting as many experiences as possible and making your own judgement? Way to go Heather. ;) And GLWS (Good luck with the sale).