My Project 1400 Array's..

[tom1040]

Have arrived.:applaud: I am in the early stages of tax season and have no idea when I will set them up (tomorrow)!:bouncy: I am pumped. Pictures (sometime) to follow..

[tom1040]

Finally. First off, unpacking and asssembling these alone is not recommended. The packages arrive with no damage. The driver actually helped me lug them up to the living room. At that point we had a discussion on things ranging from his "JBL record player" that he had in college-I think he meant some kind of "all-inclusive" design that perhaps had either cassete play or 8-track, to talk of equestrian activities with our daughters:blah:
Besides using the supplied spikes for the bottom of the speakers( they will go on when I have a bit of help), they are up and running as I type.
First impressions, with MY room, as is: They are waayy different than the S/2600's. The sweet spot with these is straight on, the S/2600 are everywhere....
The bass is a lot bigger, midrange is superior, top end...well, with my Tannoy Supertweeter on the S/2600's, is up for futher listening before I will say anything more. The visual impression is stunning. They look great with my tiger wood flooring, non intrusive and really do look better in person.

I have been listening to a number of new sacd & redbook cd's-all sounding different than the other JBL. The speakers are beautiful and sound as advertised. I think, as with the S/2600's, it will take a while to get use to the clarity of the midrange and deeper bass, albiet with a diifferent presentation of the music.

More later.

[timc]

Grats on your new speakers. I think they will bring you years of mucial joy.


-Tim

[tom1040]

Thanks, Tim.

[spkrman57]

Can't wait for the pics to be posted!

Regards, Ron

[Mr. Widget]

They are waayy different than the S/2600's. The sweet spot with these is straight on, the S/2600 are everywhere.....:yes:

I believe you were warned. :D

If you listen to music from a proper listening position, there should be no problem and the image will be noticeably more solid... if you use them more while you are walking around the house, you may find the imaging a bit disappointing.

Yes, they do look rather nice in person. Congratulations!

Pics please. :)


Widget

[scott fitlin]

Congrats on a serious speaker system!

To add to what Widget said, he is right about the walking around, but OTOH, you MAY find yourself listening very hypnotically, from the spot these speakers TELL YOU TO BE IN!

Pics please, and ENJOY THEM! :D

[lansingfan]

:yes:

I believe you were warned. :D

If you listen to music from a proper listening position, there should be no problem and the image will be noticeably more solid... if you use them more while you are walking around the house, you may find the imaging a bit disappointing.

Yes, they do look rather nice in person. Congratulations!

Pics please. :)


Widget

Is that what dictates it's imaging footprint? And if so, did JBL have a particular reason in mind when they turned it up?

[cooky1257]

FWIW stereo image is the last thing on my mind if I'm walking round the house-what with ears on either side of my head 'n all:)
I have a sofa roughly the same width as the speakers are spaced and either end of the sofa or the broad sweet spot in the middle they image fine.
More vague and diffuse imaging never sounds great(in imaging terms) wherever you're seated to these ears but I can see and appreciate the room filling sound has its attractions.
Cooky
Enjoy your Arrays!

[tom1040]

Well it did not take me long to get accustomed to these. They are awesome. The musical term I would use right now is clarity. As people say when listening to a new speaker, I can hear significantly more detail and decay of the instruments is beautifully produced. When I read those statements I was skeptical, however, after a few hours with these babies I have a sense of what they are hearing and understand.

I will post some pictures when I can get a camera-mine is with my wife in Florida. I am going to borrow one from my business partner.

My friend has a pair of B & W 803D and is mighty proud of them-I think he paid close to full retail which is around 9K. I think these Arrays sound better. ( We both have McIntosh )

I just finished listening to a track from Walter Becker(Steely Dan) called "Book of liars"---at about 1 watt it was just fantastic. WWOOWW.

Good job JBL & thanks again to all of you for your feedback & kind words.

[andywin]

I will post some pictures when I can get a camera-mine is with my wife in Florida. I am going to borrow one from my business partner.

I've found lacquered finish on the arrays reflects like a mirror and photgraphing them without taking a pic of yourself and the surroundings at the same time is not easy

My friend has a pair of B & W 803D and is mighty proud of them-I think he paid close to full retail which is around 9K. I think these Arrays sound better. ( We both have McIntosh )

Having now heard 4338's and a pair of Everest II's I would definitely say the Array 1400 images more precisely and with a far deeper soundstage than both of these. The Everests however were far more revealing in the lower frequencies, albeit with less deep slam than the Arrays.
A friend of mine has B&W 801D's, a similar concept to the Arrays but without horns and although we have not done a direct comparison (both are too heavy to want to try) there is nothing between them in performance, differences yes but both are exceptional.



http://i46.photobucket.com/albums/f120/emttsd15/HiFi/IMG_0498.jpg

[Titanium Dome]

Finally, we get another member into the Project Array Club! I'd include anyone who has any Array Series speakers, any DIY that uses the Array horn set, and SAM1HF owners. That makes maybe five or six of us? :D

Roll call!

[scott fitlin]

Well it did not take me long to get accustomed to these. They are awesome. The musical term I would use right now is clarity. As people say when listening to a new speaker, I can hear significantly more detail and decay of the instruments is beautifully produced. When I read those statements I was skeptical, however, after a few hours with these babies I have a sense of what they are hearing and understand.

I just finished listening to a track from Walter Becker(Steely Dan) called "Book of liars"---at about 1 watt it was just fantastic. WWOOWW.

Good job JBL & thanks again to all of you for your feedback & kind words.These words are essentially the same definitions as have been used to describe horn type systems for decades!

I, for one, happen to love the way they look as well.

:bouncy:

[Mr. Widget]

Finally, we get another member into the Project Array Club! I'd include anyone who has any Array Series speakers, any DIY that uses the Array horn set, and SAM1HF owners. That makes maybe five or six of us? :D

Roll call!I'm not there yet... but I am teetering on the fence and will possibly join that club. :)


Widget

[cooky1257]

Finally, we get another member into the Project Array Club! I'd include anyone who has any Array Series speakers, any DIY that uses the Array horn set, and SAM1HF owners. That makes maybe five or six of us? :D

Roll call!

That'll include me then :wave:

[scott fitlin]

I'm not there yet... but I am teetering on the fence and will possibly join that club. :)


WidgetI want to hear these, and after a good season I would probably want to be a member too! I hear really good things about this particular speaker system.

:bouncy:

[tom1040]

I thought some may find this an interesting read. James Tanner, The person I bought these from wrote about the Arrays.

[scott fitlin]

AHH, one thing I notice in James words is the crossover point. 750hz, and this point allows the compression driver a very nice dynamic sound that really shines on percussions and transients. I have been using THAT 750hz point for ages, and I don't like it lower, OR higher, 750 is the #.

As far as the NOT as in yer face as other traditional horn systems, that might not be bad, even tho some of the old horn systems were very lively and dynamic, some of them could become fatiguing to the ears after a while. And then, these are for home use, where I personally do NOT have enough space for a fully horn loaded rig to operate properly. So I like the idea of the ported bas enclosure mated to that horn/comp driver for my living room.

Interesting read, and thanks for posting.

[4313B]

It isn't arbitrary, that's where the horn/c.d. combo begins to roll off and Greg uses that mechanical roll-off along with the electrical roll-off in the high pass filter to create the 24 dB/octave acoustic roll-off. The low frequency transducer has to be able to meet the horn at that point.

[Titanium Dome]

If memory serves me, the SAM1HF transition to the SAM2LF target is 890 Hz. If true, this is no doubt possible with the nut-cracking range/power of the SAM2's dual 8s.

[Robh3606]

this is no doubt possible with the nut-cracking range/power of the SAM2's dual 8s.

Probably more to due with the match in directivity at the crossover point.

Rob:)

[scott fitlin]

It isn't arbitrary, that's where the horn/c.d. combo begins to roll off and Greg uses that mechanical roll-off along with the electrical roll-off in the high pass filter to create the 24 dB/octave acoustic roll-off. The low frequency transducer has to be able to meet the horn at that point.I understand that, but, at the same time, I have things that are able to be used with different xover points, and have alway found I like what I hear at 750hz, you can even hear it from coming down from 800hz.

I know it is the proper point for this horn, but there is a certain trait in the sound. That TINY TINY little bit of excursion is audible, or what sounds like that, in a good way.

Particularly with JBL comp drivers.

[Titanium Dome]

Probably more to due with the match in directivity at the crossover point.

Rob:)

True enough, but without the SAM2's 92dB sensitivity (the SAM1 is not "dialed back" like in the 1400 Array) and ability to extend beyond 900 Hz, directivity alone would be insufficient.

However, you're a builder and I'm a listener, so... ;)

[Valentin]

I thought some may find this an interesting read. James Tanner, The person I bought these from wrote about the Arrays.
James Tanner is the one of the owners of Bryston

[speakerdave]

James Tanner is the one of the owners of Bryston

Is he moving up to Everest II's?

[Titanium Dome]

I thought some may find this an interesting read. James Tanner, The person I bought these from wrote about the Arrays.

Thanks for the link. It's interesting to see how similar his feelings about horns are to mine and how this somewhat colored his preconceptions about the 1400s. He's absolutely correct that the Array Series is so un-hornlike that you wouldn't identify it as such unless you already knew. Same for the SAMs only perhaps more so since they are running with greater sensitivity.

I will say, the Everest II is even better, but for those of us who still live in the middle class, the Array Series is as good as it gets for ANY horn-based consumer system I've ever heard. I haven't heard the K2 S9900, but I prefer the over all sound of the Array to the K2 S9800, though it's hard not to be impressed with the overall sheer strength of the K2.

It will be interesting to see how your appreciation changes as your ears and listening habits get accustomed to your wonderful 1400 Arrays. James Tanner seemed to go through an evolution of his own as he gained experience with them.

[4313B]

I haven't heard the K2 S9900, but I prefer the over all sound of the Array to the K2 S9800, though it's hard not to be impressed with the overall sheer strength of the K2.Yeah, the S9800 didn't add up to the sum of its parts. The S9900 does though. :yes:

The Arrays are super tough to beat. I really need to get four Synthesis 8's before they "go foreign". After June of this year JBL ceases to be a viable brand for me personally. It's been a great 35 year run though! :yes:

[timc]

Yeah, the S9800 didn't add up to the sum of its parts.


Awww...Come on. You're almost making me cry.............



-Tim

[Earl K]

Congratulations Tom on getting your Arrays .


First impressions, with MY room, as is: They are waayy different than the S/2600's. The sweet spot with these is straight on, the S/2600 are everywhere....

- Have you played with various angles of toe-in ?
- Dr. Geddes recommends as much as 45 degrees for his Summas .


The bass is a lot bigger, midrange is superior, top end...well, with my Tannoy Supertweeter on the S/2600's, is up for futher listening before I will say anything more. The visual impression is stunning. They look great with my tiger wood flooring, non intrusive and really do look better in person.

I have been listening to a number of new sacd & redbook cd's-all sounding different than the other JBL. The speakers are beautiful and sound as advertised. I think, as with the S/2600's, it will take a while to get use to the clarity of the midrange and deeper bass, albiet with a diifferent presentation of the music.


Well it did not take me long to get accustomed to these. They are awesome. The musical term I would use right now is clarity. As people say when listening to a new speaker, I can hear significantly more detail and decay of the instruments is beautifully produced. When I read those statements I was skeptical, however, after a few hours with these babies I have a sense of what they are hearing and understand.

I will post some pictures when I can get a camera-mine is with my wife in Florida. I am going to borrow one from my business partner.

- I agree ,the usage of bigger diaphragms ( compression types ) can lead to greater resolution ( clarity ) once some of the (typical) horn issues have been addressed .


I'm looking forwards to some photos . ;)

<> cheers

[jblnut]

I'm not there yet... but I am teetering on the fence and will possibly join that club. :)


Widget

Put me on that list too....

:D

jblnut

[tom1040]

It is a good list to be on. I think that all that have this design are pleased, correct? The others that have heard them know what they are capable of. If you can secure a good deal on these and your budget allows...then I recommend them. They will be my last speaker for this decade at least ( I think I said that about the S/2600's, however;)).

[tom1040]

I DO have a question to those who know better than I. As designed for the speakers, I assume that the floor spikes are necessary to de-couple from the floor. Is that correct? I have them sitting on the coasters provided. I know it is not necessary, but will putting them on help?

I am assuming that it will. Perhaps a stupid question but would like to know. Thanks to all!

[Titanium Dome]

I often wonder about the efficacy of such devices, other than as a marketing tool. Excluding bookshelf models, which of my floor standing speakers have spikes?

L250 - no
XPL200, XPL160 - no
L7, L5 - no
4430- no
240Ti - no
SVA2100, SVA1800 - no (pseudo spikes in front only, more as leveling devices)
S/2600 - no

So, :hmm: I guess those could all be bad designs. ;)

Now, the Performance Series LF unit, the PS1400, has cones for feet (not spikes), so there's a "sort-of" representation of spikes.

OTOH, the most expensive gear I have, the Synthesis® stuff, does not have a cone or spike in sight. Even the massive S1S-EX sub is cone- and spike-less. The SAM1/SAM2 tower has no feet whatsoever, though there are small felt pads that must be installed between the units to separate the cabinets.

So, my uneducated summary is that it's not too important. The easy solution is for me to tell you to put them on and see if there's any difference. Even if there's not, you might imagine there is, and that's an easy "upgrade" right there. I think some women look better in high heels. Plus any audiophile friends you have will approve, as no doubt will some of the folks here. :D

[timc]

To use spikes, or some sort of softer damping under your speakers, will depend on the resonances of your system. Both speaker and surface you put them on will determine the effect your get (or lack of any).


-Tim

[tom1040]

Well, since I would rather not fuss with them right now, I will leave as is. I still can't stop gushing about these speakers. Man...:bouncy::bouncy:

[Titanium Dome]

All right, so it will soon be Valentine's Day. You've lived with the 1400 Arrays for several days. Will you be getting them a card and chocolates?

[tom1040]

I should. Haha. Sorry for the tardiness of the pics...they will arrive as soon as I can get a freakin' camera. They look kinda' nice sitting next to the S/2600's. I have the afternoon off and enjoying the music today.

Happy Valentines, everyone!:)

[Valentin]

some pics
some pics

:bouncy:

[tom1040]

a few shots with the S/2600. Advice on room treatments (windows) are welcome. They sound great, however.....I will get some more up soon. Sorry for the wait.:)

[Earl K]

Very Nice Tom!

The color of the couch & the pillows' striping, complement the Arrays' finish, really quite nicely .

http://www.audioheritage.org/vbulletin/attachment.php?attachmentid=44465&stc=1&d=1267052908

>< cheers :)

[tom1040]

the McIntosh/Marantz & view for the chair-windows look disgusting-man-i think it must be cat snot!!!! got to take care of that but is actually outside and it is a tad cold in this area. HaHa.:applaud:

[tom1040]

The only reason I post today is to address my impressions of this system. These speakers are the best I have ever heard. Perhaps not saying much from my somewhat limited exposure but, man, if anyone gets a chance to listen or buy...do it!:bouncy:

[lansingfan]

The only reason I post today is to address my impressions of this system. These speakers are the best I have ever heard. Perhaps not saying much from my somewhat limited exposure but, man, if anyone gets a chance to listen or buy...do it!:bouncy:

The cat would have to go. I guess it's the snot thing.:beamup:

[4313B]

The only reason I post today is to address my impressions of this system. These speakers are the best I have ever heard. Perhaps not saying much from my somewhat limited exposure but, man, if anyone gets a chance to listen or buy...do it!:bouncy::applaud:

[Mr. Widget]

Ditto!

Especially now after you've been able to give them a good listen.

And you were worried about how many watts you had. ;)


Widget

[tom1040]

Nope. Cats stay. I have windex which I will use when the weather gets better and I am not preparing tax returns. The speakers will stay also.:)

[ronaltronics]

Hi Tom,

Way to go on your purchase, James is a great man. The 1400's always impress me. The 2600's you own with the asymetrical horn lens are a totally different beast. If you remember there also was a 3100 at the time with a 15 inch woofer that crossed over at even lower than the 2600's. The 2600's and 3100's do not even come close to the technology in the Array series especially the 1400's. From what I am aware of the drivers from JBL are about 40% improved over the technology from just 5 years ago in sound quality and that's HUGE. If I remember I was selling the S2600 and S3100's about 10 years ago so back then they where a great speaker(Lot's of fun especially under large power loads). The 1400 Arrays are a much more refined and detailed speaker as you read in James review posted on this thread. I think the 1400's will blow you away, Are you debating selling your 2600's now Tom?

[tom1040]

No. I think I will keep them. They are basically in new condition and are loads of fun. However, I have not listened to them since I have the Array's. I think I may buy a new cdp however.:D

[polar_bear_0104]

hey tom,

been out for a while but i'm most definitely jealous of your 1400s. heard one 2 years ago and loved it. i wonder now what am i missing with my 3100s..

can't afford gear changes for now and while the 3100s are not bad, i'm sure the 1400s are an improvement across the board...

cheers
:)

[tom1040]

I have never heard the S3100's. I suspect they are somewhat similar to the S2600's -- only better. The Array's are less efficient, however they sound much smoother and with alot of detail. I think the S3100's are a great speaker as I love the S2600's and I want to keep them because they have the 'special' soundstage and are unique in design. I supplemented my S2600's with a Tannoy ST50 supertweeter and I think it helped with the HF.

The Array's are just spectacular. Best speaker I have heard. :)

[polar_bear_0104]

hey tim,

thanks for responding. i'm happy with the 3100s....so it's good to know it can't be all that bad...but i'm definitely aiming for the 1400s at some point...

cheers

[ronaltronics]

Hey Polar Bear,

I have sold the 2600 and 3100 and both were amazing speakers and IMO. I still think to most speakers out there they would give alot of them a run for the money. The Array series is just more refined as I said and I call them a real TOE TAPPING loudspeaker if you know what I mean. They just suck you into listening more and more.I don't know where in Canada you are,But you can look me up.
Google Maps (http://maps.google.ca/maps/place?hl=en&source=hp&um=1&ie=UTF-8&q=altronics&fb=1&gl=ca&hq=altronics&hnear=Ontario&cid=14313267583255325678)

[tom1040]

:p Havin' a great time with these, thanks.

[tom1040]

If anyone has a link to the Sterophile review I would love to read it. (my local bookstore doesn't have it-however they had about 35-45 different Gun mags:biting:)

[tom1040]

The "audiophile bargain" of $11K+ makes my transaction a steal-or so it seems. Regardless, bottom line? sounds good to me..:applaud:

[tom1040]

From the Bryston forum, it appears that James Tanner, The VP @ Bryston and the person I bought my Array's from, convinced the reviewer of Stereophile to actually do the review based on his own write-up which I posted in this thread.

The man has power.

[JBLAddict]

From the Bryston forum, it appears that James Tanner, The VP @ Bryston and the person I bought my Array's from, convinced the reviewer of Stereophile to actually do the review based on his own write-up which I posted in this thread.

The man has power.

wow, it sure would be swell if JBL could themselves convince the likes of Stereophile to review their products, rather than rely on the luck of an adjacent vendor doing this for them!!! :banghead:

[4313B]

wow, it sure would be swell if JBL could themselves convince the likes of Stereophile to review their products, rather than rely on the luck of an adjacent vendor doing this for them!!! :banghead:I think the beginning of the end started with the near sale a few years back (Some folks saw this coming at the beginning of the last decade). The bet is that they'll be sold/broken up in the next few years. They seem real reluctant for anyone to know that they are fast becoming just another prototyping company. They have some high energy fast talking front guys and they source pretty much all their stuff from third party vendors. There are very few people left to keep the dump from becoming the complete antithesis of everything Lansing.

[Mr. Widget]

I think the beginning of the end started with the near sale a few years back (Some folks saw this coming at the beginning of the last decade). The bet is that they'll be sold/broken up in the next few years. They seem real reluctant for anyone to know that they are fast becoming just another prototyping company. They have some high energy fast talking front guys and they source pretty much all their stuff from third party vendors. There are very few people left to keep the dump from becoming the complete antithesis of everything Lansing.While I more or less agree, you have to give them credit for allowing JBL Pro to continue to develop top flight gear and for JBL Consumer to allow GT to come up with 1400 Arrays and the new Everests. I personally had very little interest in the JBL Consumer line prior to these relatively new systems.

Will there be anything great to follow? Now, that's the question.


Widget

[4313B]

While I more or less agree, you have to give them credit for allowing JBL Pro to continue to develop top flight gear and for JBL Consumer to allow GT to come up with 1400 Arrays and the new Everests. I personally had very little interest in the JBL Consumer line prior to these relatively new systems.

Will there be anything great to follow? Now, that's the question.


WidgetI give credit to certain folks and their supportive co-workers for fighting the good fight but several of them are gone now and it remains to be seen how things shake out in the coming months. :(