Does Anyone have any Info on the "RodSpeaker"

[Altec Best]

Does anyone have any information on the Altec Lansing "Rodspeaker" it came with 2 416 a 511E horn so it probably had a 288 and also a supertweeter I would like to build something like that I have all the componets Drivers,Horns,etc... But need some info on the overall all dimensions it looks like it had a dual port on each side of the 416 but I personally don't know too much about the speaker itself is there anyone out there that knows anything about this speaker would be greatly APPRECIATED and Thank You for any help anyone could provide Regards ~ A B

[Earl K]

http://www.audioheritage.org/vbulletin/attachment.php?attachmentid=42339&stc=1&d=1255401505

I find there's enough legible info on that scan to identify the person responsible for creating this custom speaker .

Download the pic & enlarge it some .

It reads ; "When Rod moved into his new home, he wanted the best speakers he could get --- and that meant hiring top audio consultant Rick Ricco to design and assemble them" .

- It's obviously a custom build using stock Altec parts ( from 1976 ) .

- To these eyes, the 2 tuning ports look the same ( in height & width ) to that found in the Model 19 .
- I can't see any reason why 416-8Bs weren't used in the already optimized size ( & tuning ) of the M19 enclosure .

- Since a tweeter is present ( even though Altec avoided their usage ) one might make an educated guess that a 288 was used on a 511E horn for maximum output .

- The tweeter may have an Altec 950-8A ( or a prototyper, since the mounting appears different, see below ;

http://www.audioheritage.org/vbulletin/attachment.php?attachmentid=22902&stc=1&d=1171384462

http://www.audioheritage.org/vbulletin/attachment.php?attachmentid=3054&stc=1&d=1090705344http://www.audioheritage.org/vbulletin/attachment.php?attachmentid=3055&stc=1&d=1090705418

- Resign yourself to the fact that you won't find these on eBay any time soon ( I've seen exactly one pair sold in the last 8 or 9 years ) .

- There's also a possibility the tweet is derived from the 6041-ST ( found in the 6041 speaker system -seen below ) .
http://www.audioheritage.org/vbulletin/attachment.php?attachmentid=3070&stc=1&d=1090894546

- Both tweeter types seem to share a sort of three point mounting system / which is fairly unique .

- OTOH, maybe it's just from someone else sporting that "europeon look" .

>< cheers :)

[Altec Best]

Earl, Thank You so much I appreciate your help very MUCH !!!! for the scan I was trying to find out more about it and as Usual you come through with the info !!!! Regards ~ A B :applaud:

[Altec Best]

Earl are those "tweets" for sale then if so contact me in an email and I'll send my phone # Thanks ~ AB :)


[email protected]

[Earl K]

Earl are those "tweets" for sale then if so contact me in an email and I'll send my phone # Thanks ~ AB :)

The tweets in the picture are not mine / they're from a past eBay sale that happened to catch my eye .

>< cheers :)

[Altec Best]

The tweets in the picture are not mine / they're from a past eBay sale that happened to catch my eye .

>< cheers :)


BUMMER !!!!!

[RussinOhio]

Hey! I remember that picture of the "Rod speaker" ad. I snapped that pic a few years ago on my work table. :applaud:

(Sorry for the glare and poor quality)


Russ

[Earl K]

Hey! I remember that picture of the "Rod speaker" ad. I snapped that pic a few years ago on my work table. :applaud:

(Sorry for the glare and poor quality)

Yeh , ya outta be horse-whipped ! ;)

You've got John here, all hot & bothered :o:

Do you still have that magazine ( which BTW, was ??? )

>< cheers :)

[RussinOhio]

Hi John,

Oh goodness no! THAT magazine got pitched out years ago. I pulled the ad page out of it and saved it though. (obviously:D)

Sitting next to the "Rod speaker" page out of the picture frame is an late 1980's early 1990's catalog featuring Altec/EV products. Catalog is titled: "Mk IV cinema products"....if memory serves. I have since given both ad page & catalog away. Can't remember whom I gve them to......either a member here or at another board.

Anyway, I'm glad the pic has been preserved:applaud:......


Russ

[Altec Best]

Hi John,

Oh goodness no! THAT magazine got pitched out years ago. I pulled the ad page out of it and saved it though. (obviously:D)

Sitting next to the "Rod speaker" page out of the picture frame is an late 1980's early 1990's catalog featuring Altec/EV products. Catalog is titled: "Mk IV cinema products"....if memory serves. I have since given both ad page & catalog away. Can't remember whom I gve them to......either a member here or at another board.

Anyway, I'm glad the pic has been preserved:applaud:......


Russ

Hi Russ, Earl was right I was about to head into a cold shower right up until I got to the part were you say "I have since givin them away and can't remember to whom":banghead: Earl also was right about being horse-whipped but first you should have been "Bum-Rushed" :biting: and then whipped."Glad the picture has been preserved" I can't even read it.:crying: What did your camera have a melted lens on it.:bash: Well I guess the search continues I feel like I have been going in circles looking for that Picture :spin: Anyway Russ if you can remember what you did with it.And maybe get a close-up scan of it would appreciate :nanana: if you can't then :moon: Just Kidding Russ, if you can find let me Know Thank You ~ JOHN :D

[RussinOhio]

"Glad the picture has been preserved" Just Kidding Russ, if you can find let me Know Thank You ~ JOHN :D

Hi John,

I was glad it was "preserved"....not that it would do anyone else any good!:D ....but only for my own sense of deja-vu! I should have stated that. My bad.

Ah yes, NOW I remember! Search "Rod speaker" over at the Altec board and my original posting of the thread/pic will come up. It was a back in '07, I'd post a link here to save you the search but I don't know if that is against the rules here or not.

Funny! A member in that very thread asked if I could post a better pic so he could read it! I told him: "hell....I'll mail it to ya if you want!"

....So thats where it went:banghead:

Russ

[Altec Best]

Hi John,

I was glad it was "preserved"....not that it would do anyone else any good!:D ....but only for my own sense of deja-vu! I should have stated that. My bad.

Ah yes, NOW I remember! Search "Rod speaker" over at the Altec board and my original posting of the thread/pic will come up. It was a back in '07, I'd post a link here to save you the search but I don't know if that is against the rules here or not.

Funny! A member in that very thread asked if I could post a better pic so he could read it! I told him: "hell....I'll mail it to ya if you want!"

....So thats where it went:banghead:

Russ

Now that is deja-vu and don't that beat all :crying: :crying: :crying: now I wish I was the guy receiving the mail !!! JOHN :banghead::banghead::banghead::banghead::banghead:

[RussinOhio]

Ok, I pm'd you over at the altec board with a link to the thread......

russ

[Altec Best]

Ok, I pm'd you over at the altec board with a link to the thread......

russ
Yes I got it Thanks Russ :)

[robertbartsch]

I remember the Rod Stewart speaker ads too.

At the time the ads came out I had a VOTT system with 416As woofers, 806 compression drivers and 811 horns that were purchased new in 1974. Later in 1977, I added JBL 077 slot tweeters and networks to extend the UHF response.

I'm not sure why Altec did not put the super tweets into production but they made a few tragic mistakes that, unfortunately, eventually led to their ruin.

Great designs and products are critical but bad management will destroy a business faster than anything else.

[Altec Best]

I remember the Rod Stewart speaker ads too.

At the time the ads came out I had a VOTT system with 416As woofers, 806 compression drivers and 811 horns that were purchased new in 1974. Later in 1977, I added JBL 077 slot tweeters and networks to extend the UHF response.

I'm not sure why Altec did not put the super tweets into production but they made a few tragic mistakes that, unfortunately, eventually led to their ruin.

Great designs and products are critical but bad management will destroy a business faster than anything else.

That's for sure they ruled the motion picture sound for half a century.Unfortunately they didn't know how to run a business.Because in my opinion they made the best.Western Electric invented most of the drivers,Altec Lansing perfected them,and Jbl's are just copies of Altec's but Altec management sucked,if they were any good I would still be buying Altec Gear and not on eBay. Robert did you get those plans I posted on the model 19 cabinet plans.Regards ~ AB

[MikeBrewster77]

...Jbl's are just copies of Altec's...

Ehhhhh .... :(

I think they both had their fair share of successes, but a little history always helps to frame the context in which it might be far too easy to make gross over-generalizations as well.

http://www.jblpro.com/company/history/

[Altec Best]

Ehhhhh .... :(

I think they both had their fair share of successes, but a little history always helps to frame the context in which it might be far too easy to make gross over-generalizations as well.

http://www.jblpro.com/company/history/

Sorry Mike no offense I forgot this site is mostly JBl fans.I am and always will be a Altec Fan there isn't a JBL speaker on the planet that has the CLARITY of Altec. But keep in mind that is my Opinion.And I'm sure your opinion is for JBL that's what makes the world go around if we all liked and did the same things this world would be quite BORING :yes: IF I OFFENED YOU MY APOLOGIES :hmm: Regards ~ AB

[RussinOhio]

I am and always will be a Altec Fan there isn't a JBL speaker on the planet that has the CLARITY of Altec.

Hi John,

Like yourself....I too am an Altec disciple....model 19 in particular....but have you ever heard JBL's L-300 summit? Granted they are not easy to come by for an audition for obvious reasons, but you'd do yourself a favor in hearing a set someday if you can. Not tryin to sway you away from Altec...lord knows!:D.....just sayin'!

It is difficult for me to explain, and it may not make sense.....but I prefer my Altec nineteens over JBL L-300's......even though I consider the L-300 a superior system in many ways.

Russ

[robertbartsch]

AltecBest:
Yeh, thanks. I found a cite that has electronic versions of blue prints for Altec cabs here:

http://home.earthlink.net/~jmarkwart/id14.html

I now own about ten JBL systems including several with compression drivers and I can say none of the JBL products have a more natural clear sound and more dynamic range as the old Altec VOTT.

On that note, I attribute the superior dynamic range of Altecs to their ultra high sensativity.

Thats why I'm building a pair of Model 19s as my next project.

[Altec Best]

AltecBest:
Yeh, thanks. I found a cite that has electronic versions of blue prints for Altec cabs here:

http://home.earthlink.net/~jmarkwart/id14.html

I now own about ten JBL systems including several with compression drivers and I can say none of the JBL products have a more natural clear sound and more dynamic range as the old Altec VOTT.

On that note, I attribute the superior dynamic range of Altecs to their ultra high sensativity.

Thats why I'm building a pair of Model 19s as my next project.

Robert you won't be disappointed I have done blind sound tests in my listening room with many differant people comparing my Klipsch Cornwall II's and my model 19's and the model 19's come out on top everytime the people I make sure they can't see the speakers and then I play differant music switching between speakers A & B and everyone thinks the 19's sound better.:D Regards ~ AB

[Altec Best]

Hi John,

Like yourself....I too am an Altec disciple....model 19 in particular....but have you ever heard JBL's L-300 summit? Granted they are not easy to come by for an audition for obvious reasons, but you'd do yourself a favor in hearing a set someday if you can. Not tryin to sway you away from Altec...lord knows!:D.....just sayin'!

It is difficult for me to explain, and it may not make sense.....but I prefer my Altec nineteens over JBL L-300's......even though I consider the L-300 a superior system in many ways.

Russ

Hi Russ, no I never had the pleasure of hearing the L-300's I stopped searching for speakers when I brought the 19's through the door into my home.And thought this is all I'll ever need and after Dave rebuilt my XO's they are sounding better than ever.I can't stress that enough if there are people out there with original Crossovers still in there 19's change them(Capacitors & Resistors) you won't beleive the differance I was floored after installing them no break-in needed here.WoW I am now looking for another set of 19's for obvious reasons :D:applaud: Regards ~ JOHN

That are close to my home for shipping reasons and I want the Oak veneers.

[hjames]

Sorry Mike no offense I forgot this site is mostly JBLfans.I am and always will be a Altec Fan there isn't a JBL speaker on the planet that has the CLARITY of Altec. But keep in mind that is my Opinion.And I'm sure your opinion is for JBL that's what makes the world go around if we all liked and did the same things this world would be quite BORING :yes: IF I OFFEND YOU MY APOLOGIES :hmm: Regards ~ AB

Well, opinion is your right, of course, but bad facts deserve to be corrected.

[Altec Best]

Well, opinion is your right, of course, but bad facts deserve to be corrected.

They are not bad facts !!!!!!!!!! They are my preferences from my Ears !!! As yours are for no doubt JBL. My listening room sounds fantastic and that is all that matters to me.:applaud:Regards ~ AB

[robertbartsch]

I've listened to many L300s and they are a truly great American classic. To my ears, they are very flat in frequence response from top to bottom.

The Altec VOTTs, however, sound more realistic to my ear and the most compelling difference between these two is the superior dynamic range of the VOTT.

In addition, if you like very loud music, the Altecs out shine in this category too. In a home setting, these babies can get very loud and not show any signs of stress.

One shorfall is that they trail off pretty fast above 12kHz. I've used the 077 slots to augment UHF and this arrangement works well.

[Altec Best]

I've listened to many L300s and they are a truly great American classic. To my ears, they are very flat in frequence response from top to bottom.

The Altec VOTTs, however, sound more realistic to my ear and the most compelling difference between these two is the superior dynamic range of the VOTT.

In addition, if you like very loud music, the Altecs out shine in this category too. In a home setting, these babies can get very loud and not show any signs of stress.

One shorfall is that they trail off pretty fast above 12kHz. I've used the 077 slots to augment UHF and this arrangement works well.

Robert, Good point now that is one area that I feel that JBL has a better driver is the tweets as Altec didn't beleive in tweets much that is why most of their systems have been 2-way which I feel was a mistake they should have dealt with those frequencies alittle better than just using 1 driver for the mids and highs.But they didn't have more problems with their XO's when using a 2- way system.Jbl 077 Tweets is one of the finest tweeters ever made. AB

[Skywave-Rider]

I made some scans:
42664

42665

42666

[grumpy]

Might that "supertweeter" just be a 1" driver bolted to the back of a plate?
Have seen that done before on $$$$ monitors of yore. Not that I care all
that much... just looking at visual clues, especially in the lightened up
enlargement. :dont-know

[Mr. Widget]

Might that "supertweeter" just be a 1" driver bolted to the back of a plate?Looks like it to me... and with that bolt pattern it would likely be an 800 series Altec beaming right into Rod's knees.

I have no idea if that speaker system was any good, but I am certain that in the photo at least, it was not placed optimally for any serious listening. Overall I do think the Model 19 with the larger 511 horn would likely be the best Altec ever, and if this system was implemented with a proper super tweeter and the JBL 4435 style bass management, I think a really excellent speaker would be possible.


Widget

[Altec Best]

I made some scans:
42664

42665

42666

No

[mikebake]

http://www.deephousepage.com/smilies/conf45.gif

[mikebake]

http://www.deephousepage.com/smilies/kos.gif

[demon]

besides the amusing quarrel i find this thread quite informative.
the "rodspeaker" ad is simply hilarious, and the speaker itself looks interesting. good proportions in my opinion.
im happy having learned about it.

cheers,
mikey

[Mr. Widget]

besides the amusing quarrel i find this thread quite informative.
the "rodspeaker" ad is simply hilarious, and the speaker itself looks interesting. good proportions in my opinion.
im happy having learned about it.I felt exactly the same way.

In fact this sort of thing is what keeps me coming back to the forum. There is always something new to discover...

Too bad about the personality issues though.:banghead:


Widget

[RussinOhio]

Have to wonder where this system is today, if it still exsist at all.


Russ

[Earl K]

I made some scans:

Thanks for doing that / they've been extremely useful . :thmbsup:

What magazine did you find them in ? ( R.E.P. , db Magazine, Modern Recording, ???? )


Might that "supertweeter" just be a 1" driver bolted to the back of a plate?
Have seen that done before on $$$$ monitors of yore. Not that I care all
that much... just looking at visual clues, especially in the lightened up
enlargement. :dont-know

- Yes, that's sure what the new scans appear to show, to these eyes .


Looks like it to me... and with that bolt pattern it would likely be an 800 series Altec beaming right into Rod's knees.

- OTOH, "Apparent Beaming " may not be as great, as one would assume .
- That sudden ( 70 - 90 degree ) termination of the throat will encourage some HF diffraction / giving a wider pattern than what's "seen" . Fostex tweeters use this phenomena to some effect . http://www.madisound.com/catalog/images/madisound/product/t500amk2.jpghttp://www.madisound.com/catalog/images/t900a-v2.jpghttp://www.madisound.com/catalog/images/madisound/product/T925A.jpg
- ie; it could be worth simulating this UHF setup and then measuring the polar patterns .
- I still agree that the low speaker placement in the picture is pretty poor .



besides the amusing quarrel i find this thread quite informative.
the "rodspeaker" ad is simply hilarious, and the speaker itself looks interesting. good proportions in my opinion.
im happy having learned about it.


I felt exactly the same way.

In fact this sort of thing is what keeps me coming back to the forum. There is always something new to discover...

Too bad about the personality issues though.:banghead:

Widget

- Yea ( too bad about all that noise ) .
- Sometimes I choose to get involved in a thread because I feel the "concept" has some merit and hasn't yet been explored here ( to date ) or in any of the other usual forums .

<> cheers :)

ps ; I'm not finished here ( unless the op gets back on his soapbox ). I'm just catching up on some wiring projects that are for this weeks' work .

[Mr. Widget]

- OTOH, "Apparent Beaming " may not be as great, as one would assume .
- That sudden ( 70 - 90 degree ) termination of the throat will encourage some HF diffraction / giving a wider pattern than what's "seen" . Fostex tweeters use this phenomena to some effect . Interesting notion.... it would be interesting to follow up on, though I don't feel any 1" drivers are true super tweeters.


Widget

[Fred Sanford]

Pretty sure I'd first seen that ad in Playboy.

je

[John]

Think I saw it in Rolling Stone.:thmbsup:

[Skywave-Rider]

No

Hi,
Can't respond to your PM, tried.
To answer your question,
I used an Epson Workforce 310 scanner/printer. Too small to do the entire ad in one scan.

I don't understand why you replied "no" and quoted me saying "I made some scans" in your post number 30.
http://audioheritage.org/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=268687&postcount=30

Maybe something was deleted by you or the moderator? Just seems odd. Anyway, I don't come to this forum too much, perhaps I missed something.

Good luck with your speaker building.





Thanks for doing that / they've been extremely useful . :thmbsup:

What magazine did you find them in ? ( R.E.P. , db Magazine, Modern Recording, ???? )

Earl, I bought a repro of the ad from a guy on EBay. It's a great ad. :D I have it next to my 9844s in my office. I'd wondered for a long time what that tweeter in the RodAd could be.

[BMWCCA]

Can't respond to your PM, tried.
Best is on "vacation" from this forum for one week. Try him again in about five days.

Maybe something was deleted by you or the moderator?.
I think you may have hit upon the reason. ;)

[Skywave-Rider]

Best is on "vacation" from this forum for one week. Try him again in about five days.

Not necessary, I'm sure he read my response.

Have fun, kids.

[robertbartsch]

Are the tweeters in Post 36 above "one-offs" except Fostex or are they conversions of other production 1" compression drivers with custom fabricated horns?

They remind me of 075 bullet nose tweeter designs that have been "ripped-off" and modified using some metal stock and a lathe for the unique horns.

I'm reasonably sure JBL had patents on 075 tweets but they were introduced very early and patents run out in 15 years.

Anyway, these are interesting. I don't believe I have seen any of these before now.

[Earl K]

Are the tweeters in Post 36 above "one-offs" except Fostex or are they conversions of other production 1" compression drivers with custom fabricated horns?

Those 3 are all current Fostex tweeters available from Madisound. (http://www.madisound.com/manufacturers/fostex/speakers.php)
They've been making similar "bullet style" tweeters like that, since the 1980s .
Here's are some pics of the more affordable models ;
http://www.madisound.com/catalog/images/madisound/product/T90A.jpghttp://www.madisound.com/catalog/images/madisound/product/FT96H.jpg


:)

[Doc Mark]

Interesting notion.... it would be interesting to follow up on, though I don't feel any 1" drivers are true super tweeters.


Widget

Morning, Mr. Widget, and All,

I got to thinking about this, and remembered that I have a pair of Altec MR902-16HF drivers, that came to me without the little Mantaray horn. I used them, for many years, in a PA situation, and later in my home stereo, and always with much satisfaction. I always thought that, without the MR horn (which Altec rated as offering 60°x40° dispersion), they were nothing more than regular 902 drivers, and used them as such, crossing over to them at 1,200 HZ (Community Horns/ 60x40). They always came across to me as sounding very smooth and (dare I say it?!) "sweet"! ;):D

Since Altec rated this driver, with it's "Tangerine phase plug, up to 20KHZ, it's very possible that they did use it behind the plate in those "Rod Speakers", as a HF tweeter driver. I know that, somewhere down in the Hobbit Hole, I have a magazine with that original ad that began this thread, don't have time to dig for it, right now. Interesting, nonetheless..... Take care, and God Bless!

Every Good Wish,
Doc

[4313B]

there isn't a JBL speaker on the planet that has the CLARITY of Altec.Unfortunately that's just flat out gross misinformation.

Perfectly fine for posting in DIY though. :rotfl:

Have to wonder where this system is today, if it still exsist at all.Rod was on Letterman the other night. I wish Dave had asked him. :banghead:

[Allanvh5150]

Rod was on Letterman the other night. I wish Dave had asked him. :banghead:

Maybe I could find out...I know one of his ex wives:D

[Ian Mackenzie]

Perhaps the point not covered here is back then when the Rod Speaker was around the definition of a great loudspeaker was not the hifi diddle dee crap that people associate hi end audio with today.

By virtue of the very high sensitivity of the dual 416's this type of system has massive dynamic range and relatively low distortion. (Even more sensitive than the 4350). Therefore it probably sounded quite good at live levels compared to an AR3. The distortion levels of most domestic hi end audio loudspeakers would still not compare to the Altec..its just the laws of physics.

[srm51555]

No affiliation, not sure if pictures could be added to the thread for reference.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/The-Rod-Speakers-Vintage-one-of-a-kind-Altec-Speakers-only-other-pair-/251950072872?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item3aa9650428

[hjames]

No affiliation, not sure if pictures could be added to the thread for reference.
(had link to an ebay ad that will be useless in 6 months- thus removed)

Sure enough - I downloaded the pictures from the eBay Ad
and am posting them here, per your request!
65502

65503655046550565506

[hjames]

And the rest of them (website Limited to 5 images allowed per post)

6550765508655096551065511

[HCSGuy]

Quote from listing:

"These are a pair of vintage Altec component speakers custom built for Rod Stewart's house, and are the only other pair in in existence.




You are bidding on a one of a kind speaker system just like the system Rod Stewart had in his house, built and designed by Top Audio Consultant Rick Riccio. The Speakers are setup to be BI –amped and are a wonderful sounding speaker system whether listening to Rock n Roll, jazz or even classical Music."

I interpret this as "These speakers were designed by the guy that did Rod's house, but aren't the ones that actually went into his house" Sound about right?

[Altec Best]

Awesome speakers ! Wish these were for sale a few years ago ! :banghead: :(

Thank You for posting the links and photos ! :)