Sourcing 19 inch Audio Racks

[hjames]

I built my own simple rack for the 434x biamp system I'm using, got a pair of front rails off ebay and put nice wood on the side to match everything else, but I can see a need to redo it in a larger rack fairly soon, and rather than go taller, I can imagine using something like TiDome's rack here, but nicely finished wood sides and a top on it, maybe wheels on the bottom, and use something like this to mount everything!

So - is this a complete rack kit or can I just order up these pieces on my own and build something like this myself?


The racks are getting a final cleaning and mechanical inspection in preparation for the real installation.
http://audioheritage.org/vbulletin/attachment.php?attachmentid=39620&stc=1&d=1243730942
http://audioheritage.org/vbulletin/attachment.php?attachmentid=39501&stc=1&d=1243313676


http://audioheritage.org/vbulletin/attachment.php?attachmentid=35770&stc=1&d=1228682043

[BMWCCA]

http://www.raxxess.com/ :dont-know

[Fred Sanford]

http://www.middleatlantic.com/

:applaud:

Quick guess is that his look like Slim5s, not my first choice if you're looking to load it with heavy stuff & roll it on wheels. Can be done, though.

je

[BMWCCA]

Agreed. MiddleAtlantic is the best I've seen but pricing for us bottom-feeders is a bit much to handle. And then their best stuff is still not real wood like I think Heather wants. I've given up finding exactly what I want and if I ever again have a spare dollar to dump into equipment storage, I may have to just build my own or have our local Katz Audio (http://www.katzaudio.com/) build something simple for me.

[hjames]

Agreed. MiddleAtlantic is the best I've seen but pricing for us bottom-feeders is a bit much to handle. And then their best stuff is still not real wood like I think Heather wants. I've given up finding exactly what I want and if I ever again have a spare dollar to dump into equipment storage, I may have to just build my own or have our local Katz Audio (http://www.katzaudio.com/) build something simple for me.


Actually, my vision is to build a metal mini rack and sheath the sides with wood myself.
My current DIY rack is much more rigid than most of the kit wood racks that use those
IKEA type twist and lock corner hardware. Flat box cabinets are cool, but they get sloppy
once you wiggle it a few times. Its just not robust enough for any real movement,
or the kind of side to side stresses it gets as you pull it out, rolls it around, etc ...

Moneywise, buying that HK AVR 7300 tapped me out for a while anyway -
least until I sell the old receiver and some other stuff, but right now
I'm gathering info so I can collect pieces and sources for later ...

You know, for me its hobby fund rules - any buy begets a sale or two ...

[Titanium Dome]

http://www.middleatlantic.com/

:applaud:

Quick guess is that his look like Slim5s, not my first choice if you're looking to load it with heavy stuff & roll it on wheels. Can be done, though.

je

Nope. Looks similar though, eh? The one on the right has almost 600 pounds in it.

I got the pair used off off ebay for "Best Offer" and did local pick up for $50 total.

[Fred Sanford]

Nope. Looks similar though, eh? The one on the right has almost 600 pounds in it.

I got the pair used off off ebay for "Best Offer" and did local pick up for $50 total.

Fixed in place, or rolling on wheels (especially on carpet)? I can picture that rack twisting if moved while holding that load. Nice deal for the $, for sure.

We went a little heftier when racking up the big Synthesis systems...

je

[hjames]

Interesting - there are spacers in the Racks John has posted - but TiDome's gear is direct-stacked ...
does the gear itself have provisions of r extra airflow?
Seems like it could be a lot of concentrated heat that way, without the airspace ...

[Earl K]

Bud Industries (http://www.budind.com/) is a long time supplier of steel racking systems for the US market . They are not cheap .

Hammond Manufacturing (http://www.hammondmfg.com/) ( which is a Cdn outfit ) has a comprehensive line of racking systems ( at least up here ) . I don't know if these two companies are somehow connected or whether they're actual competitors .

>< cheers :)

[Chas]

http://www.rittal.com/products/

[Titanium Dome]

Interesting - there are spacers in the Racks John has posted - but TiDome's gear is direct-stacked ...
does the gear itself have provisions of r extra airflow?
Seems like it could be a lot of concentrated heat that way, without the airspace ...

Well, again (and I'm not being sarcastic) these units were installed by the guy who was the Synthesis® honcho until January of this year. He did the spec design and is on the patent for the S4Ai, did the sourcing of the Synthesis® electronics, and knows the systems inside out from soup to nuts.

He had a firm idea on how to stack them and in what order. I had a ton of 1U ventilated spacers on hand if needed. He stacked the amps one on top of the other without hesitation, with me occasionally getting my fingers pinched in the back. :( We had a lot of space left in the second rack and could have spread it out if needed.

Originally, I planned on having forced ventilation from the closet to the outside, but he felt it wasn't necessary. After running them for several hours, I have to agree.

The S5160 and S800 both have fans, so they're self cooling. Space between is not needed, although there's no law that says you can't space them as far apart as you want. Even though the faceplates are touching, there's still an air gap between the chassis in back.

The S400 uses radiant cooling, hence no fan. That's why it's on top and why there's a ventilated spacer above it. Since it's currently not used in the system, it poses no heat generation issues anyway. When it's hooked up for 2nd zone use, it will only be on when the second zone is in play.

[Titanium Dome]

Fixed in place, or rolling on wheels (especially on carpet)? I can picture that rack twisting if moved while holding that load. Nice deal for the $, for sure.

We went a little heftier when racking up the big Synthesis systems...

je

There are no wheels, but there are stainless steel balls in sockets bolted to the bottoms. This is nice, because they're heavy enough that I couldn't move them more than a couple of feet at a time without the rollers when they were empty.

If you look carefully at the left rack bottom, you'll see it's actually sitting on slats to level it and to raise the balls off the floor. The right rack has several more supporting slats due to the extra weight. There's no intention of moving them while loaded. That's why there's provision for a 30" access door on the back side of the closet.

I have no intention of crawling around, over, or behind these things. ;)

[BMWCCA]

At the risk of offending anyone again by speaking freely on this site: I've seen recommendations for racking fan-cooled amps without spaces between them specifically to increase the cooling. Crown does this, but then their amps have flow-through from front-to-back. The very shape of the Synthesis front panels seem to cry out for direct stacking though, and make an impressive audio shrine. I suspect that closet will be getting a lot of views. :applaud:

[hjames]

Well, again (and I'm not being sarcastic) these units were installed by the guy who was the Synthesis® honcho until January of this year. He did the spec design and is on the patent for the S4Ai, did the sourcing of the Synthesis® electronics, and knows the systems inside out from soup to nuts.

I had a ton of 1U ventilated spacers on hand if needed.

Thanks! I should have known you had it well covered, but I'm cautious about such thing (and it sounds like you are too!) - and it just seemed it should have airspace ...
I also like interspersing blank panels because it gives the possibility of room for adding gear later, if need be ... but thats something I learned when we wired up a 200,000 customer 64 channel CATV headend 20 some years ago ...

And yep, its a gorgeous looking stack, no mistaking that!
Wish I could be there for your fine-tune setup session ...!!

All in all, looks like a very cool project!
Kudos to you sir!

[Fred Sanford]

Well, again (and I'm not being sarcastic) these units were installed by the guy who was the Synthesis® honcho until January of this year. He did the spec design and is on the patent for the S4Ai, did the sourcing of the Synthesis® electronics, and knows the systems inside out from soup to nuts.

He had a firm idea on how to stack them and in what order. I had a ton of 1U ventilated spacers on hand if needed. He stacked the amps one on top of the other without hesitation, with me occasionally getting my fingers pinched in the back. :( We had a lot of space left in the second rack and could have spread it out if needed.

Originally, I planned on having forced ventilation from the closet to the outside, but he felt it wasn't necessary. After running them for several hours, I have to agree.

The S5160 and S800 both have fans, so they're self cooling. Space between is not needed, although there's no law that says you can't space them as far apart as you want. Even though the faceplates are touching, there's still an air gap between the chassis in back.

The S400 uses radiant cooling, hence no fan. That's why it's on top and why there's a ventilated spacer above it. Since it's currently not used in the system, it poses no heat generation issues anyway. When it's hooked up for 2nd zone use, it will only be on when the second zone is in play.

I wasn't in on the design or rack layout for the particular project pictured, but I do trust the guys who were, and I know we had JBL involvement. I'm sure you're fine, we had the luxury of lots of real estate & lots of $$$, so we did the best we could with it. My pic post was not in any way a critique of your layout, I hope it wasn't taken that way.

This rack was actually for the smaller theater in that particular house, we hadn't yet started on the bigger one at the time I was there & took pictures. This theater's projectors needed outside consultation as well - triple-stacked rear-projected CRTs. :bouncy:

je

[Fred Sanford]

There are no wheels, but there are stainless steel balls in sockets bolted to the bottoms. This is nice, because they're heavy enough that I couldn't move them more than a couple of feet at a time without the rollers when they were empty.

If you look carefully at the left rack bottom, you'll see it's actually sitting on slats to level it and to raise the balls off the floor. The right rack has several more supporting slats due to the extra weight. There's no intention of moving them while loaded. That's why there's provision for a 30" access door on the back side of the closet.

I have no intention of crawling around, over, or behind these things. ;)

So, those are from the AXS series, probably. Designed to be installed above floor level, and roll out on tracks & jack stands. The steel balls keep the rack rolling in the tracks. Essentially still the Slim5 rack to start with.

Access door = smart. :applaud:

je

[Titanium Dome]

I wasn't in on the design or rack layout for the particular project pictured, but I do trust the guys who were, and I know we had JBL involvement. I'm sure you're fine, we had the luxury of lots of real estate & lots of $$$, so we did the best we could with it. My pic post was not in any way a critique of your layout, I hope it wasn't taken that way.

This rack was actually for the smaller theater in that particular house, we hadn't yet started on the bigger one at the time I was there & took pictures. This theater's projectors needed outside consultation as well - triple-stacked rear-projected CRTs. :bouncy:

je

No worries there; I didn't take it that way.

I imagine with the relatively small size of my room and the ample headroom in all that power, those amps will hardly ever break a sweat. Now if I had 10,000 cu. ft., they'd have to work much harder.

We turned the volume up to -20 on the SDP-5, and it was very loud. Once I get the absorbers and diffusers installed, maybe it can play a bit louder. He said that once the calibration is done, it will sound better the louder it gets until your ears bleed and your tympanic membranes pop. :bouncy:

I thought that system in your picture was in your basement. :p



Kidding of course!

[Titanium Dome]

So, those are from the AXS series, probably. Designed to be installed above floor level, and roll out on tracks & jack stands. The steel balls keep the rack rolling in the tracks. Essentially still the Slim5 rack to start with.

Access door = smart. :applaud:

je

Yes, that looks right. Those rails are bitchin' and I kinda wish I had some of my own. :yes:

[Fred Sanford]

No worries there; I didn't take it that way.

I imagine with the relatively small size of my room and the ample headroom in all that power, those amps will hardly ever break a sweat. Now if I had 10,000 cu. ft., they'd have to work much harder.

We turned the volume up to -20 on the SDP-5, and it was very loud. Once I get the absorbers and diffusers installed, maybe it can play a bit louder. He said that once the calibration is done, it will sound better the louder it gets until your ears bleed and your tympanic membranes pop. :bouncy:

I thought that system in your picture was in your basement. :p



Kidding of course!

Not my basement, some ginormous house in Joizy. Smaller rack with media-entry components in the back of the theater, these big racks are through the doors & down the hall, just past the bowling alleys.

Don't remember the room dimensions, but this can give you an idea - one shot from behind the screen, one taken when almost finished.

je

[Fred Sanford]

Actually, my vision is to build a metal mini rack and sheath the sides with wood myself.
My current DIY rack is much more rigid than most of the kit wood racks that use those
IKEA type twist and lock corner hardware. Flat box cabinets are cool, but they get sloppy
once you wiggle it a few times. Its just not robust enough for any real movement,
or the kind of side to side stresses it gets as you pull it out, rolls it around, etc ...

Moneywise, buying that HK AVR 7300 tapped me out for a while anyway -
least until I sell the old receiver and some other stuff, but right now
I'm gathering info so I can collect pieces and sources for later ...

You know, for me its hobby fund rules - any buy begets a sale or two ...

Take a close look at Ti's racks lying on their sides- there are rectangular cutouts up top & bottom, you can line up cleats on your home-made wooden side panels that catch & hang on those openings so your sides are removable. Been there, done that.

Doesn't hurt to call or at least research Middle Atlantic's offerings, just so you know what to jump for if they come up for sale used.

je

[lgvenable]

Out of curiosity, how did you handle the walls to handle sound reflection etc, With some type od insulated wallboard, and then carpeting over?

I'd be curious at exactly how your walls and ceilings set up, as I'm ready to do a room with a low of flat surfaces. I love the wainscoating and the finish on the your theater room. It looks larger than my first house.
Larry

[Fred Sanford]

Out of curiosity, how did you handle the walls to handle sound reflection etc, With some type od insulated wallboard, and then carpeting over?

I'd be curious at exactly how your walls and ceilings set up, as I'm ready to do a room with a low of flat surfaces. I love the wainscoating and the finish on the your theater room. It looks larger than my first house.
Larry

That's not mine, it's one of my ex-company's clients. That particular installation was one I was helping out on & not managing, so I don't know many particulars about it. I believe it was fabric over padding, but can't tell you much more than that.

We often consulted with these folks on the more critical rooms:

http://www.wsdg.com/

...but I don't know if they were involved in the pictured project.

je

[boputnam]

I've seen recommendations for racking fan-cooled amps without spaces between them specifically to increase the cooling. Crown does this, but then their amps have flow-through from front-to-back. Hi, Heather...

Phil raises a point to consider. Current pro amps have flow-thru ventilation, either front-to-rear or rear-to-front. Your amps have massive heat sinks at their rear (I cannot find a picture but remember... ;)). Conceivably, when running they will set-up some very effective upward convection of hot air which will rise up and out the back of the rack. You may not need to leave air flow spaces during racking - but you might place your hand on the surfaces of the amps and see what you think. And, do not plan on the rack being flush with the wall, nor encased. If those are your plans, you should consider fan assist and leaving ventilation spaces.

My QSC's and Lab Gruppens all stay very cool on the outer case. And, these days, I never seen a SR contractor leave ventilation spaces. My biggest areas of concern are my racked tube pre-amps and the DSP's - these generate a great deal of heat and I must use external fans. :(

If you update your amps for any reason, and they have flow-thru ventilation, no spaces are needed. :)

[BMWCCA]

Even the old convection-cooled Crowns (PS-series) had accessory fans and chimney ducts that attached to the rear cooling fins specifically for mounting more than one together in rack installs. Even so, they recommended ventilation at the top and bottom of the rack itself and allowing 1.75" between the top and bottom of their amps. Now I'm not doing that at home in my 4345 bi-amp (DC300A-II, D150A-II) system and have had no problem, but that is the recommendation. A thermometer inside the enclosed glass-door cabinet seldom shows more than a 10ºF rise over ambient room temp and that's in an un-airconditioned house. I did cut some large holes in the back mainly for access, and enlarged them when hooking up the CC networks. Not ideal but they seem to tolerate it well.

[boputnam]

Two words - "Expansion Space"You are a genius!

Once a rack is stuffed, you cannot buy extra RU on eBay. :p I'm forever out of RU and always shuffling gear...

[Fred Sanford]

You are a genius!

Once a rack is stuffed, you cannot buy extra RU on eBay. :p I'm forever out of RU and always shuffling gear...

+1 :(

je