JBL Synthesis - Something BIG is on its way... [Archive]

JBL 4645

02-02-2009, 02:25 PM

Peter who in the blazes is Dave? You quoted the wrong name. Don’t tell me its snowing in Germany and the cold is affecting your judgment as well.:D

Well if it’s the Empire, I doubt I’m going to be that impressed… just kidding.:D

Well I wouldn’t stick a large horn next to CRT the colour will get bugged up!

A video projection screen will be top class with the stage JBL PA behind it and the subs stacked along the floor directly underneath the stage channels. The surrounds mounted to the walls at least a few for each side to give that true JBL defused surround sound with centre phantom, split-surrounds will rocket around the room with Apollo 13.
:banana:

What I think has happened he’s raided a JBL store and is presently looking for safe house to stash it all. :rotfl:

rdgrimes

02-02-2009, 02:58 PM

My money is on a new LS setup.

JBL 4645

02-02-2009, 03:17 PM

My money is on a new LS setup.

I found there ugly mug shot it isn’t pretty. :D

No that’s not LARGE enough. :D My money is on and even thou I’m strapped for cash its on the JBL cinema professional range.
http://www.lemondenumerique.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/05/jbl-ls-series.jpg

Thing is I don’t like mismatched speakers no matter what the manufacture says. To me matching is religious thing for LCR no matter how small or large matching LCR. ;)

hjames

02-02-2009, 05:14 PM

I found there ugly mug shot it isn’t pretty. :D

No that’s not LARGE enough. :D My money is on and even thou I’m strapped for cash its on the JBL cinema professional range.
http://www.lemondenumerique.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/05/jbl-ls-series.jpg

Thing is I don’t like mismatched speakers no matter what the manufacture says. To me matching is religious thing for LCR no matter how small or large matching LCR. ;)
You are nuts and have bad taste :barf:
Don't insult the LS speakers, monkey boy!:applaud:(re Buckaroo bonzai)
They are fine looking and will no doubt be a fine addition to the TiDome House of Sound and Vision...!

Can't wait to hear more 'bout it ~!

JBL 4645

02-02-2009, 05:21 PM

You are nuts and have bad taste :barf:
Don't insult the LS speakers, monkey boy!:applaud:(re Buckaroo bonzai)
They are fine looking and will no doubt be a fine addition to the TiDome House of Sound and Vision...!

Can't wait to hear more 'bout it ~!

I’m just religious about matching fronts. Sure they look wonderful well maybe three front towers, then you’ll have matching LCR, might cost a few more peanuts or two.:D

I just don’t understand why JBL makes speakers for home cinema and makes model that doesn’t look anything remotely close to what they have practiced for decades with cinema sound. Matching fronts is one of the golden rules.

Titanium Dome

02-02-2009, 05:59 PM

He's probably getting free money from the govt's bailout package. ;)

That's backwards, I'm afraid. ;) Like you and every other working stiff, I'm giving money to the government so it can bail out those bastiges who got rich off the problem and are now begging for help to maintain their fat, bonus-driven lifestyles.

At the same time, though, I'm investing money direct into the economy, supporting a brick and mortar JBL dealer, supporting warehousing and shipping jobs, supporting JBL/Harman manufacturing jobs, supporting JBL engineering and design jobs, supporting JBL/Harman research and development, and, god help me, supporting Harman International marketing jobs. This little investment will support more hard-working middle Americans (and perhaps some Chinese, though I'm not sure yet) than the billions flushed down the endless, gaping maw of the American financial sector and its elite, greed-filled minions.

Mikebake is right. This is one way I'm fighting the recession, and it won't be my last big purchase this year from a real business run by a hard-working man or woman. At first, I was going to stash everything away for tough times, but in many respects the money I have will not be worth more than it is now and times aren't much tougher than this. So the way to help others is to patronize their stores and businesses. Of course, I won't spend everything, but even a few bucks spent here and there multiplied by hundreds of people keeps a local business going.

Titanium Dome

02-02-2009, 06:04 PM

JBL 4645

02-02-2009, 06:05 PM

god help me, supporting Harman International marketing jobs.

:rotfl:
Give us a hint, what exactly are you getting that is so BIG!?

JBL 4645

02-02-2009, 06:09 PM

Little horns? Do you think I would...?

Give Us A Clue?
http://www.ukgameshows.com/page/images/b/bb/Give_us_a_clue_old2.jpg
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Give_Us_a_Clue

Now that is dead give away clue it has to be JBL Professional cinema PA.;)

Does anyone win a prize if we guess right?:D

hjames

02-02-2009, 08:05 PM

Little horns? Do you think I would...?
I think you are all about the sound, above any specific prejudice.
If the speakers in question sounded really good, I think you'd buy ...

Titanium Dome

02-02-2009, 08:33 PM

I think you are all about the sound, above any specific prejudice.
If the speakers in question sounded really good, I think you'd buy ...

You know me too well.

boputnam

02-03-2009, 05:38 PM

Little horns? Do you think I would...?Uh, no. That has me thinking... ( ;) )

Titanium Dome

02-03-2009, 05:54 PM

Well, I will admit that all that gushing about the 1400 Array, SAM1HF, and 800 Array piqued my curiosity. Then seeing Greg T.'s living room set up and reading how everyone wet their pants...

:hmm:

Zilch

02-03-2009, 06:06 PM

We'll be experiencing an avatar update, soon, apparently.... ;)

4313B

02-03-2009, 06:07 PM

Then seeing Greg T.'s living room set up and reading how everyone wet their pants...

:hmm:Greg never mentioned anyone wetting their pants... He is definitely not the type to allow such shenanigans...

boputnam

02-03-2009, 06:22 PM

Then seeing Greg T.'s living room set up ...Whoa. BIG bingo! Nice choice, dood. Really, a spectacular choice.

:applaud:

Titanium Dome

02-03-2009, 08:54 PM

All right. Even though actual delivery looks to be early next week, I might as well come clean (just like my bank account--ha ha).

It's a Synthesis® Two Array Plus (http://www.jblsynthesis.com/products/system_overview.aspx?prod=SYN2-ARRAY&Language=ENG&Country=US&Region=USA) (more here (http://manuals.harman.com/JBL/HOM/Product%20Information/syn2%20array.pdf)). It's got some of the standard Two Array system pieces and some of the One Array system pieces. It's an incomprehensibly stunning system. Hearing is in fact believing, but hearing is also an act of faith, because no amount of rational preparation can brace you for what you are about to hear.

I'm fortunate to have a pretty good room to put it all in, though there will be some modifications to the room and some new treatments to really bring out the best.

Of course, the "Plus" upgrades really add to an already excellent system, without adding expensive bits from the One Array that I really don't need or want.

Titanium Dome

02-03-2009, 09:04 PM

We'll be experiencing an avatar update, soon, apparently.... ;)

Well, maybe a composite... :dont-know

The harder thing would be changing my moniker. Horn Head? CD* (instead of TD)? SonoAss? SAM Horn? The permutations are endless.

I'll probably stick with what I've got. There'll still be a Performance Series multichannel music system in the house.

*Constant-Directivity, in case anyone was thinking compact disc.

Titanium Dome

02-03-2009, 09:15 PM

The shipping invoice reads just over 1000 pounds. so what's arriving on that shrink-wrapped pallet.

1x JBL Synthesis SDP-5 - THX® Ultra 2® Surround Processor/System Controller
1x JBL Synthesis SDEC-4000X* - Synthesis 12 Channel Input and 20 Channel Output Digital Equalizer System
1x JBL Synthesis S4000IC - High Grade Multi-Shield Braided Audio Interconnect Set - Connects SDP5 to SDEC-4000X and SDEC-4000X to S5160 & S800 Amplifiers.
2x JBL Synthesis S5160 - 5 x 160 Watt THX® Power Amplifier
2x JBL Synthesis S800 - 2 x 200 Watt, 1 x 800 Watt THX® Power Amplifier
3x JBL Synthesis SAM1HF - Synthesis® Array™ THX® Horn Module
3x JBL Synthesis SAM2LF - Synthesis® Array™ THX® Dual 8" Low-Frequency Module
2x JBL Synthesis S1S-EX - 18" (457mm) THX Ultra2 Subwoofer
4x JBL Synthesis S4Ai - Vertical or Horizontal Multipolar Flush-Mount THX® Surround Loudspeaker

Titanium Dome

02-03-2009, 09:19 PM

I didn't see the need to go all the way to the SDP-40HD in the One Array, since I've got no use for multiple zones and I already have top notch video HDMI switching. The SDP-5 will do everything I need and costs many thousands of dollars less.

Titanium Dome

02-03-2009, 09:21 PM

The Two Array's SDEC-3000 and passive Array crossovers were a little disappointing, so the SDEC-4000X was just what the doctor ordered. It's an amazing piece (well, kinda two pieces actually) of hardware and it does phenomenal things. It's well worth the upgrade.

Maybe someone here can expound on it more. This is why JBL sends out a tech to calibrate the system. It would be a crime for me to touch it.

Titanium Dome

02-03-2009, 09:24 PM

Instead of the Two Array's single S800 and S7150, the upgrade brings two S800 and two S5160 amps. That's a lot of heavy hardware, and the power ratings seem very, very conservative.

Titanium Dome

02-03-2009, 09:29 PM

The Plus substitutes two S1S-EX 18" subs for the S2S 15" subs. I know these subs are not universally loved here, and I also know the 4645 Pro unit costs a lot less, but I was very happy to make the move to the bigger subs. There's a discernible increase in power and dynamics, and it meshes very well with the SAM2LF, dual 8" bass modules. In fact, these tough little buggers allow the S1S-EX subs to really focus on the strongest part of their range, which is in the chest-pounding, groin-thumping octave.

Titanium Dome

02-03-2009, 09:32 PM

After hearing the S1A speakers from the One Array and the S4A1 from the Two Array, I definitely preferred the S4AI. Especially in my intended installation, the S1A would be problematic, so no reason to "upgrade" here when for me it seemed a downgrade instead.

Titanium Dome

02-03-2009, 09:41 PM

Of course the heart of the system consists of two amazing parts: SAM1HF and SAM2LF modules.

I'm very, very impressed with the HF modules. They have no horn-like deficits at all. It was a revelation to listen to them with my eyes closed (paradox, I know). It was a transporting experience, that exceeded my first encounters with the Performance Series Ti drivers by a mile. Now the PS Ti drivers got better--much better--after a few days listening, but I don't expect that the SAMs will, but who knows? In any event, the SAM1HF starts off at a higher level of performance that the PS can't achieve.

The real delight is the SAM2LF. It's a tough little f@#$%r that reminds me a lot of the HTPS400. It takes no prisoners and performs unbelievable feats. If the 800 Array is a fantastic speaker, the SAM1HF coupled with the SAM2LF is twice the speaker. Just mindblowing.

[email protected]

02-03-2009, 10:01 PM

May I ask how much this is setting you back?

BMWCCA

02-03-2009, 10:11 PM

May I ask how much this is setting you back?Well, you did. Though it might be considered rude to do so. ;)

[email protected]

02-03-2009, 10:14 PM

Well, you did. Though it might be considered rude to do so. ;)

:o:

Mr. Widget

02-03-2009, 10:48 PM

I'm very, very impressed with the HF modules. They have no horn-like deficits at all. It was a revelation to listen to them with my eyes closed (paradox, I know). It was a transporting experience, that exceeded my first encounters with the Performance Series Ti drivers by a mile...Dome, you were a hard nut to crack.

I truly hope they bring you years of enjoyment.

Widget

JBLAddict

02-03-2009, 11:19 PM

Well, I will admit that all that gushing about the 1400 Array, SAM1HF, and 800 Array piqued my curiosity. Then seeing Greg T.'s living room set up and reading how everyone wet their pants...

:hmm:

is there a thread with pix on the site?

Titanium Dome

02-04-2009, 12:06 AM

is there a thread with pix on the site?

Here's one of the threads that influenced the decision.

http://audioheritage.org/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=23210&highlight=1400+Array

To the gentleman who thought that discussing these things might be pointless, I hope he takes heart from the fact it influenced a major purchase of current JBL gear. I am glad the discussion took place.

Titanium Dome

02-04-2009, 12:27 AM

is there a thread with pix on the site?

The first part of this thread gives some good images, then it runs amok at the end.

http://audioheritage.org/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=19385&highlight=SAM1

Titanium Dome

02-04-2009, 12:35 AM

is there a thread with pix on the site?

THIS thread , showing what Greg Timbers has in his house in his personal system, was all I really needed to see. It just took a while to find a place to audition them and spend some time with them, since I was never asked to his house for a listen. :( (He's probably changing his phone number or moving out of state right now.)

http://audioheritage.org/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=9951

I mean, really, look at that. I won't have the 15" and 12", but I think the dual 8" and 18" bottom end will do just fine.

timc

02-04-2009, 01:56 AM

Congrats on a great purchase TiD. You have bought the system i have longed for since the day i saw the press release. Hope ill be fortunate enought to own it one day.

I believe you will have a great time ahead of you, getting it installed and nail all the small details.

Hm....now......What about putting some 2435's in those horns? ;)

-Tim

pos

02-04-2009, 02:10 AM

Congrats!
Guess it's time for you to change your avatar :D

If the 800 Array is a fantastic speaker, the SAM1HF coupled with the SAM2LF is twice the speaker.
And the 8" in these two speakers are quite different as well, distortion-wise :

Array 8:
http://audioheritage.org/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=121965&postcount=9

Synthesis 8:
http://audioheritage.org/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=224102&postcount=3

hjames

02-04-2009, 03:43 AM

Wow - what a system!
Nice arrangement in each of the 4 corners!

Greg Timbers home system, circa 3/19/2006 - pictures courtesy of 4313B from this other thread (http://audioheritage.org/vbulletin/s...ead.php?t=9951)

http://audioheritage.org/vbulletin/attachment.php?attachmentid=13892&stc=1&d=1142807250

Each of the four stacks consists of the 1500AL, the 1200FE, and prototype Array horns with 435Be and 045Be compression drivers bolted onto them (two stacks as shown in the picture and two behind me in the back corners of the living room). The center channel is the 880 Array prototype.

I believe the intent was to prove that compression drivers were viable for use in high performance loudspeaker systems designed for home high-fidelity applications. That intent has been realized in an undeniably splendid fashion.

The sound is effortless - powerful, dynamic, smooth, detailed. No resonances. No smearing. No distortion. No pain. You see horns and know there are compression drivers bolted to them. You don't hear horns with compression drivers bolted to them. Not in any traditional sense. It's a paradox.

http://audioheritage.org/vbulletin/attachment.php?attachmentid=29887&stc=1&d=1197175089

hjames

02-04-2009, 03:51 AM

Sam1HF and SAM2LF

Robh3606

02-04-2009, 05:36 AM

Nice set-up!! Did you purchase the system on E-Bay?? Looks like the same line up.

Rob:)

4313B

02-04-2009, 07:09 AM

And it looks like you purchased the electronics to do it all justice! :)

Very exciting Titanium Dome! :applaud:

JBL 4645

02-04-2009, 07:41 AM

I only have one word to say well five words actually.

:useless:

You suck Dome. :D Nice :applaud: did I miss the model or series type as there are so many of the JBL Synthesis.

JBL 4645

02-04-2009, 07:43 AM

May I ask how much this is setting you back?

I would say around $50.000 thousands dollars?

Titanium Dome

02-04-2009, 07:47 AM

May I ask how much this is setting you back?

Well, you did. Though it might be considered rude to do so. ;)

Nice set-up!! Did you purchase the system on E-Bay?? Looks like the same line up.

Rob:)

I bought it direct from an authorized Synthesis® dealer. You'll have to speculate on the rest. ;)

Hoerninger

02-04-2009, 08:15 AM

Congratulation!
____________
Peter

JBL 4645

02-04-2009, 08:19 AM

I bought it direct from an authorized Synthesis® dealer. You'll have to speculate on the rest. ;)

Well the Empire Leicester Square ultimate JBL custom THX was £250.000 grand and that is untouchable at 56KW making it the most powerful THX cinema in the whole of Europe.

Come on you can share how much you paid for it there is no shame. :D

Titanium Dome

02-04-2009, 08:29 AM

Congrats!
Guess it's time for you to change your avatar :D

And the 8" in these two speakers are quite different as well, distortion-wise :

Array 8:
http://audioheritage.org/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=121965&postcount=9

Synthesis 8:
http://audioheritage.org/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=224102&postcount=3

Yes, that info was quite illuminating. The Synthesis8 is light and tight (CMMD cones and Neo magnets help) and has a nice looking response from 60 Hz to 3 kHz. The heavier, smaller VC, paper Array8 looks similar from 60 Hz to 900 Hz, but after that it's bye-bye.

The 800 Array is a very nice speaker, but the SAM1HF and SAM2LF combo go to a different level of performance.

I checked into doing an Array 800-based 7.1 system and could get very nice prices on the units and subs, but it really didn't go to the level of the Synthesis®.

JBL 4645

02-04-2009, 08:46 AM

Pulease - thats so CRASS and quite RUDE!

... its not about what he paid,
tho I'd imagine he got a good deal,
Its all about the SOUND!

I'd say he's got a really cool system on the way -
wish he was closer so I could listen some time!

Congratulations, TiDome!

I’m not being rude we all, know what they go for each model range.

Yeah no doubt good deal and awesome JBL! :applaud:

Titanium Dome

02-04-2009, 08:49 AM

:)I think it's fair to say that every JBL Synthesis® dealer out there needs to make his or her own deals and needs to make a profit to stay in business. They don't want to have to meet or beat prices quoted by some clown (that's me) on the Internet. The husband/wife dealer team I dealt with was stand up, considerate, and a pleasure to work with. They were more than fair and very open.

I won't put them or JBL in a position to have to defend pricing or sales to past, current, or future customers. In this case, their desire to sell and my desire to buy found common ground and a purchase was made. Both parties are happy, and everyone walks away a winner.

I know we all like to report on our best deals, and I like to do the same. With products that are no longer in production or sold on ebay or in big chains, I'm more than willing to spill the beans. However, in this case, I would not want to be careless or casual and inadvertently make life any more complicated for these hard working small business folks.:)

Fair enough?

4313B

02-04-2009, 09:03 AM

Fair enough?Yep!

I think all we really care about are some pictures and your personal impressions once it all gets set up properly. :)
I assume the Dealer will help you with that as well?

BMWCCA

02-04-2009, 09:28 AM

Here's one of the threads that influenced the decision.
http://audioheritage.org/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=23210&highlight=1400+Array
To the gentleman who thought that discussing these things might be pointless, I hope he takes heart from the fact it influenced a major purchase of current JBL gear. I am glad the discussion took place.Hah! I enjoyed reading that thread again. Seems I've been a participant in a couple of these "speaker safari" threads to no avail. But that fatalist in me figures there was some reason for it. We'll see if the 4345s are it. Looks like Sub and me will be two old hippies with the air sucked out of ourselves while you all debate "nuance" in the home-theater forum. ;)

Michael Phelps is supposed to come over to listen to some Inagaddadavida with me as soon as I get them setup. I promised him I'd not be posting the photos here. :D

You're my hero, Dome. Can't wait to get the report. Get a drool bib!

Titanium Dome

02-04-2009, 09:51 AM

Yep!

I assume the Dealer will help you with that as well?

Yes, through JBL. I wouldn't know where to begin with the SDEC-4000X. :confused:

jblsound

02-04-2009, 09:58 AM

Titanium Dome

02-04-2009, 10:36 AM

I assume that this Synthesis dealer is not the Synthesis dealer that told you in '02 to take a walk, when you only wanted to buy a $10k PS system.:)

You assume correctly. :yes: Didn't even give that guy a call this time. :no:

jblsound

02-04-2009, 10:58 AM

You assume correctly. :yes: Didn't even give that guy a call this time. :no:
I know there are around 8 million people in the LA area. So how does that break down to the number of Synthesis dealers for that area?

Valentin

02-04-2009, 01:04 PM

I really envy you ti dome in a good way

please document installation and please comment if you will have the calibration using the new bass room algorithm form JBL

The JBL Synthesis SDEC-4500 is the most advanced digital equalizer ever offered by the brand. It optimizes the performance of a JBL Synthesis system in any room, using more than 200 bands of fully parametric digital equalization that can be adjusted from 1/100 octave to 4 octaves wide at +15dB to – infinity, between 20Hz – 20kHz, to correct dips and peaks throughout the frequency range.

In all rooms, there are powerful resonances that emphasize some frequencies and attenuate others. The
SDEC-4500 compensates for these irregularities with far greater precision than has ever been available before, to deliver extraordinary sonic accuracy that meets or exceeds the standards for professional theaters.

The SDEC-4500 is improved from previous models; it’s now capable of applying more precise equalization, with a greater number of adjustable frequency bands, to all of the main, center and surround loudspeakers in a home theater system, and to multiple subwoofers.

The SDEC-4500 also offers an easier-to-use PC “control panel” interface and numerous additional enhancements, including automatic arrival-time calibration for all the loudspeakers and drivers in a multichannel system; an improved Auto-Film-Screen-Compensation feature that automatically corrects for the attenuation in high-frequency output that can occur when a loudspeaker is located behind projection screens of various materials; automatic control capabilities with other JBL Synthesis components; and many other versatile features.

Because no two rooms are alike, the Harman Audio Test System, which interfaces with the SDEC-4500 (and other JBL Synthesis equalizers), allows a JBL® factory-trained-and-certified technician to custom-fit the sound of a Synthesis system to the room in which it is installed.

The Harman Audio Test System is a powerful 16-channel audio analyzer optimized for measuring loudspeaker and room interactions. The analyzer can be configured for either eight-input/eight-output operation, which is ideal for calibrating home theater systems, or for 12-input/four-output operation, which is well suited for use in an anechoic chamber or for car-audio-systems development.

The Harman Audio Test System uses multiple microphones (eight for a JBL Synthesis system) to measure different locations in a room, and applies proprietary digital-signal processing to analyze and correct for the room’s frequency dips and peaks.

The Harman Audio Test System supports 48kHz and 96kHz sample rates, with 20-bit resolution. Its input channels can be used as microphone inputs (with phantom power), or as line-level inputs. All 16 channels of A/D and D/A conversion take place in the Harman Audio Test System hardware, which interfaces with a PC and an SDEC-4500 (or other compatible JBL Synthesis digital equalizer) via Ethernet connections.

When used in a JBL Synthesis system, the Harman Audio Test System enables the achievement of flat in-room frequency response, or frequency correction to any desired target curve. Additional functions include automatic crossover optimization between the main speakers and the subwoofers in a multichannel system; automatic loudspeaker-level calibration; and a newly developed sound field management algorithm that minimizes the seat-to-seat variation in bass response in a home theater system to a far more effective degree than do other hardware and software solutions.

mikebake

02-04-2009, 02:19 PM

Who will be doing the physical installation?

demon

02-04-2009, 02:50 PM

YESSSS great choice titanium dome!
i hope to see some pictures soon to drule over. finally someone gets a really nice new system..!

cheers,
mikey

johnaec

02-04-2009, 04:01 PM

Ti - make me an offer on a pair of PS1400's I can't refuse!

John

Valentin

02-04-2009, 04:22 PM

while it lasts i would love a pair of pt800 for my HT

Mr. Widget

02-04-2009, 04:26 PM

while it lasts...Are you kidding me? TiDome has more back stock than Harman does. :rotfl:

Widget

boputnam

02-04-2009, 05:24 PM

...the SDEC-4000X was just what the doctor ordered. It's an amazing piece (well, kinda two pieces actually) of hardware and it does phenomenal things. It's well worth the upgrade.

Maybe someone here can expound on it more. This is why JBL sends out a tech to calibrate the system. It would be a crime for me to touch it.I love the description Valentin posted. I wish all the audiophile acoustic neophytes that argue against the merits of proper EQ would take note. Speakers impart energy into a room. The room responds. The signal must be filtered to moderate the room response. Simple.

And, I'll bet you could get pretty good at tuning to that room yourself, Doug, even though I'm guessing JBL doesn't let that Harman Audio Test System fall into laymans hands...

Rusnzha

02-04-2009, 05:50 PM

Congratulations Dome, I know you will have one of the best rooms on the West coast if not on the planet. :applaud:Looking forward to you getting it all together and checking out your observations.:coolness:

bone215

02-04-2009, 07:57 PM

soooooo, once the system is installed and all set up, then you start listening to your music collection and and and then who shall come and get you out of the area and take you back into the world???
I can see getting quite lost in that nice a system:)

Titanium Dome

02-04-2009, 08:57 PM

I love the description Valentin posted. I wish all the audiophile acoustic neophytes that argue against the merits of proper EQ would take note. Speakers impart energy into a room. The room responds. The signal must be filtered to moderate the room response. Simple.

And, I'll bet you could get pretty good at tuning to that room yourself, Doug, even though I'm guessing JBL doesn't let that Harman Audio Test System fall into laymans hands...

I'm not sure all the differences, but the SDEC-4500 (2008) is a newer version of the SDEC-4000 (2006).

From the 2006 release:

The JBL Synthesis SDEC-4000 digital equalizer optimizes the performance of a Synthesis multichannel system in any room by the application of ultraprecise multiband digital parametric equalization and leading-edge DSP technologies. In all rooms, there are powerful room resonances that overly emphasize some frequencies and attenuate others. The SDEC4000 compensates for these irregularities to achieve extremely accurate in-room response and the highest possible sound quality. The SDEC4000 has the capability of equalizing up to 16 main and surround channels and four subwoofers.

The SDEC4000 offers a wealth of additional advanced features, including automatic arrival-time calibration for all the loudspeakers in a multichannel system; an Auto-Film-Screen-Compensation feature that automatically corrects for the attenuation in high-frequency output that can occur when a loudspeaker is located behind a projection screen; and sophisticated overload protection.

The SDEC-4500 is an improved version, but I bet the 4000 will do a pretty fine job.

Titanium Dome

02-10-2009, 11:29 PM

Got three surprise packages tonight at 7 PM from UPS: two S800 amps and one S5160 amp. Those mothers are heavy. The S800s are 80# each in the box, and the S5160 is 90#.

grumpy

02-11-2009, 07:50 AM

"wheeeeeeee, doggie." -jethro

Titanium Dome

02-11-2009, 09:21 AM

Yeah, they're just boxes, but it proves I'm actually getting this system. :bouncy: (It's still unreal to me.)

Valentin

02-11-2009, 11:31 AM

wished i owned does boxes

congrats

Valentin

timc

02-11-2009, 12:18 PM

TiDome....damn you.....for just picturing the outside of the boxes!!!

You are killing me here.....

-Tim

Hoerninger

02-11-2009, 12:58 PM

You are killing me here.....

The whole is more than the sum of the parts ... JBL, tuned room, multichannel - and the music ...

OVERKILL!___________
Peter

Titanium Dome

02-11-2009, 05:45 PM

The main shipment just arrived. Because I live on a canyon, the truck couldn't come too close, so I helped the driver bring the load down.

Here's he getting it ready. It's the last load of the day for him.

Titanium Dome

02-11-2009, 05:48 PM

Here it comes down toward me on the lift gate. I almost dropped the camera as the pallet jack started to run downhill.

I got to "steady" the front while he guided from the back. IOW, if it got away from us, I was in front of 1000 pounds. :eek:

Titanium Dome

02-11-2009, 05:49 PM

Safe in the garage.

Titanium Dome

02-11-2009, 05:51 PM

A look from another angle. That's a lot of stuff!

Beatrice (the car) doesn't like to be crowded like that.

Titanium Dome

02-11-2009, 05:54 PM

The full package--NOT! Three amps are in the back. Where's the fourth? Where's the SDP-5? Where's the...?

There are still four boxes unaccounted for. Maybe later tonight...

Titanium Dome

02-11-2009, 05:59 PM

It doesn't look like much of a slope until you try to steady 1000 pounds and provide resistance. I felt like a very puny man trying to keep it slow and steady. I was constantly worried about getting my foot under the pallet.

But all's well that ends well, so now I'm a happy camper. After my back recovers and I get something to eat, it'll be time to inspect the shipment for unseen damage. One of the S1S-EX boxes looks a little crushed. :hmm:

BMWCCA

02-11-2009, 07:20 PM

After my back recovers and I get something to eat, it'll be time to inspect the shipment for unseen damage. You are very close to having way too much fun! :applaud:

JBLnsince1959

02-11-2009, 09:10 PM

I must be on the wrong forum... I could swear that I saw Ti-Dome unload ... HORNS!!!... Nope, impossible... i've just crossed over into the Twilight Zone for awhile;)

:applaud:

Mike Ronesia

02-11-2009, 11:05 PM

WOW! Very cool, can't wait to see the finished room.

That is a very steep slope with anything heavy. We have a slope like that and just a wheelbarrow of rocks can be very hard to manage.

Keep posting the pics please, it's fun to watch:applaud:

Titanium Dome

02-12-2009, 12:12 AM

So now I have 20 boxes in my garage, and I went through every one to check for any possible surprises. Luckily, 95% are in perfect condition. Unfortunately, one of the S5160 amps took a heavy hit on the back side and will have to be replaced.

It's depressing to see, but at least it'll be taken care of. The darn thing weighs 90 pounds, so if it got dropped, it was bound to self-destruct.

Titanium Dome

02-12-2009, 12:15 AM

All this was inside the bag. Every speaker connection is loose.

Mike Ronesia

02-12-2009, 04:15 AM

That's a bummer, I hope you don't have to wait too long for the replacement.

Fred Sanford

02-12-2009, 06:00 AM

I can't tell you how much more fun it is to see those pallets of gear knowing that I don't have to install it all! In the past, seeing a stack like that simply meant that deadlines were coming, and I had to start hustling.

Best of luck with the rest of the process, I'm sure you'll be pleased with the results.

je

4313B

02-12-2009, 08:18 AM

Unfortunately, one of the S5160 amps took a heavy hit on the back side and will have to be replaced.The whole point of shipping truck freight is to avoid situations like this.

***

Oh wait... I see the "Thank You For Giving UPS The Pleasure Of Effing Up Yet Another Fine Product" sticker in one of the photos... my mistake.

at least it'll be taken care ofThat's a plus. :yes:

So now I have 20 boxes in my garage, and I went through every one to check for any possible surprises. Luckily, 95% are in perfect condition.Unfortunately, you won't know for sure if any electronics have cracked boards until you fire them up. Hopefully you'll have none of that.

JBLnsince1959

02-12-2009, 09:15 AM

The whole point of shipping truck freight is to avoid situations like this.

absolutely amazing what Brown can do for you:banghead:. How is this even this possible? Sorry to see this Doug, but as we've learned over years you know how to handle things.

can wait to read about this once you get it up and running. Once again you've given me some ideas

all the best

Titanium Dome

02-12-2009, 09:45 AM

Oh wait... I see the "Thank You For Giving UPS The Pleasure Of Effing Up Yet Another Fine Product" sticker in one of the photos... my mistake.

absolutely amazing what Brown can do for you

Only the best delivery with Brown:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T8AzVK6BJ8Q

Valentin

02-12-2009, 09:55 AM

now thats the way too take it

Robh3606

02-12-2009, 10:28 AM

Gee that stinks. Where are the rings from?? Are those star washers and nuts to lock the speakers outs in place??

Rob:)

Mr. Widget

02-12-2009, 10:36 AM

That sucks... thank god you have insurance!

Widget

JBL 4645

02-12-2009, 10:52 AM

YOU SUCK:D

LOL that bulk is bigger than the car! :D

Is this B-Stock from home cinema store?

Those amps would have mega packing around it foam and cardboard I mean who has been chewing on the binding posts a dog!?:banghead:

BMWCCA

02-12-2009, 10:59 AM

I wonder how fast the forklift was going when it ran into the wall with your pallet?

Of course we're assuming it left JBL in perfect condition.

Or where did it come from?

JBLnsince1959

02-12-2009, 11:10 AM

Only the best delivery with Brown:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T8AzVK6BJ8Q

thanks for the video... very funny

Yes, this is just one of those sh*ty things that can happen. Obiviously someone dropped the pile somewhere...

any idea on how long to get another one?

JBL 4645

02-12-2009, 11:40 AM

Didn’t quite understand the video I’ll pretend I don’t understand what “brown” is? LOL :D

hjames

02-12-2009, 11:54 AM

Didn’t quite understand the video I’ll pretend I don’t understand what “brown” is? LOL :D

UPS has an ad campaign in the US
"Ask what Brown can do for you" - playing off the fact that the trucks and uniforms are brown ...

Its not like the ads from "The Groove Tube" (or was that "Kentucky Fried Movie") about "Brown 25 - another fine product from Uranus Corporation"
with visuals you don't even need to imagine ...

Titanium Dome

02-12-2009, 02:07 PM

Gee that stinks. Where are the rings from?? Are those star washers and nuts to lock the speakers outs in place??

Rob:)

I don't have a good shot of it, but this picture shows it. Look at the gold RCA inputs at the top. The closest one on the right still has the washer and nut on it. The other four were pushed in by the impact and the nuts were stripped right off the shafts.

Titanium Dome

02-12-2009, 02:14 PM

I wonder how fast the forklift was going when it ran into the wall with your pallet?

Of course we're assuming it left JBL in perfect condition.

Or where did it come from?

Actually it went from JBL Professional in Northridge CA to a Synthesis® dealer in the midwest who shipped it back to me in SoCal. Now to be clear it wasn't quite as goofy as it sounds. The dealer ordered and had it long before I bought it.

Valentin

02-12-2009, 02:41 PM

when will you receive the new unit

hope thy have it in stock

have you opened all your stuff to check it

imagine what a impact like this do to a horn

Valentin

02-12-2009, 02:54 PM

Ti dome

About the sedec 3000 and 4000 looks it is exactly the same as the bss sound web london products

probably with an software change

Titanium Dome

02-12-2009, 05:40 PM

Ti dome

About the sedec 3000 and 4000 looks it is exactly the same as the bss sound web london products

probably with an software change

Yes, BSS Audio is a Harman International company. It's based in the US in Sandy, Utah. The SDEC4000 units both have "Made In USA" on them, so I'm sure you're correct.

That's a clear advantage for JBL being in the Harman family. The Synthesis® line benefits from Lexicon and BSS Audio, the EON line benefits from AKG, Soundcraft, and Crown, the Performance Series gets Lexicon electronics, etc.

http://www.bssaudio.com/

John

02-13-2009, 01:07 AM

Titanium Dome

02-13-2009, 11:06 AM

Well after being in the freight tranportation bizz for the last 20 plus years I can say this.

Only Groceries should be stacked that high on a pallet.

Second, whoever stacked the boxes seemed to think having the boxes overhang the pallet was no problem, Wrong.

If the boxes were located within the pallet, they most likly would of made the trip unharmed.

These guys aren't in the freight business. It's UPS. :rotfl:

Apologies to any UPSers on the forum. It was just a joke. In fact, my son worked for UPS while in college, so I have nothing but utter respect for it. Or is that UDDER respect? ha ha The letters are brown.

BMWCCA

02-13-2009, 11:28 AM

Hopefully you'll be able to get a replacement in short order and not be tied up because the distributor who sold it to your distributor had incentive to move his stock-on-hand an has no more. Someone needs to take some responsibility, and quickly! I want to hear some music!! (Vicariously, of course. ;) )

doG's speed.

Mr. Widget

02-13-2009, 11:43 AM

Someone needs to take some responsibility, and quickly! I want to hear some music!! (Vicariously, of course. ;) )I think the contractors need to do their magic and the room tuning needs to happen before Dome can even call out the techs to set up and tune the system... patience my friend. Just remember how long it has taken to determine plus vs. minus in your significantly simpler installation. ;)

Widget

JBL 4645

02-13-2009, 11:56 AM

UPS has an ad campaign in the US
"Ask what Brown can do for you" - playing off the fact that the trucks and uniforms are brown ...

Its not like the ads from "The Groove Tube" (or was that "Kentucky Fried Movie") about "Brown 25 - another fine product from Uranus Corporation"
with visuals you don't even need to imagine ...

LOL I think it LOL that was funny thanks for clarifying that LOL.:D

JBL 4645

02-13-2009, 12:05 PM

I don't have a good shot of it, but this picture shows it. Look at the gold RCA inputs at the top. The closest one on the right still has the washer and nut on it. The other four were pushed in by the impact and the nuts were stripped right off the shafts.

Gold pleated what no XLR connections? Thing is do you think you got a good deal or raw deal on this wonderful JBL package. If it was me, I’d be barking mad :biting: on the phone. What we’re talking about here is the principle those connections shouldn’t be buggered up.

I remember when I got my B-stock Alesis RA300 the heat sink was pushed in on the left side :blink: as if it was dropped on the floor? Well they are mildly heavy!

Just wondering if someone had butter-fingers and dropped the amp on the floor?

Just saw this on FleaBay!
JBL S2A Dipole THX Synthesis Surround spkrs Free S&H!!!
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/JBL-S2A-Dipole-THX-Synthesis-Surround-spkrs-Free-S-H_W0QQitemZ200296579450QQcmdZViewItemQQptZSpeakers _Subwoofers?hash=item200296579450 (http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/JBL-S2A-Dipole-THX-Synthesis-Surround-spkrs-Free-S-H_W0QQitemZ200296579450QQcmdZViewItemQQptZSpeakers _Subwoofers?hash=item200296579450)

BMWCCA

02-13-2009, 12:10 PM

... patience my friend. Just remember how long it has taken to determine plus vs. minus in your significantly simpler installation. ;)Yeah, I know:
I've got a contractor coming by tomorrow to estimate some flatwork for me.
Some estimates for room treatments are on the way.
In the end, I'll probably do 80% of the work myself, so it'll be weeks, not days before this all comes together.. . . my concern was that Dome's new thread has already hit over the 100-post point so it's bound to jump-the-shark shortly! :D

glen

02-13-2009, 12:15 PM

Congrats Dome!

Fantastic system, this thread is going to require many emptyings of the drool cup.

JBL 4645

02-13-2009, 12:17 PM

Yeah, I know:. . . my concern was that Dome's new thread has already hit over the 100-post point so it's bound to jump-the-shark shortly! :D

You seem optimistic about his thread. I wonder what conduction the speakers are in please no foam surround no foam surround.

Titanium Dome

02-13-2009, 01:35 PM

Gold pleated what no XLR connections? Thing is do you think you got a good deal or raw deal on this wonderful JBL package. If it was me, I’d be barking mad :biting: on the phone. What we’re talking about here is the principle those connections shouldn’t be buggered up.

I'm happy without the XLRs. I got a good deal. I've been on the phone a couple of times with the dealer, and he's been pleasant and supportive. He's working with UPS to handle the problem.

Widget is 100% right. It will be a while before any sound comes out of this system. I haven't even had time to take anything out of the box after my initial, cursory inspection for shipping damage. I'm not even sure HOW I'll get some of it out. It's too much for a single person. I might be asking someone to come help me.

My goal is to have things set up before the end of March. I'm trying to discipline myself to do this right, at least within the limits of my budget.

Mr. Widget

02-13-2009, 02:02 PM

Yeah, I know:. . . my concern was that Dome's new thread has already hit over the 100-post point so it's bound to jump-the-shark shortly! :DNot to fret... Dome is the king of long threads. :D Take a look at his Performance thread... this is bound to double that.

Actually on that note, perhaps he'll see fit to start a new thread once the install begins. :bouncy:

Widget

JBL 4645

02-15-2009, 11:05 AM

Dome

I was thinking maybe you should test the loudspeakers out with other amplifiers, just to make sure their all working.;)

Titanium Dome

02-15-2009, 11:33 AM

Dome

I was thinking maybe you should test the loudspeakers out with other amplifiers, just to make sure their all working.;)

I'm flying my dad and his wife in today for a week's visit and his birthday. They'll get some relief from Ohio's hard winter. Tomorrow's a holiday, so maybe I can get him to help me with some of the bigger stuff.

OTOH, the ol' gaffer is going to be 84 on Tuesday, so I'd better take it easy with him. :o:

Titanium Dome

02-17-2009, 10:33 AM

rdgrimes

02-17-2009, 11:41 AM

UPS picked up the damaged S5160 yesterday, and it's on its way to "damage analysis." Hopefully, I'll get a reply (from the shipper) about its disposition in a couple of days.

Here's hoping... :thmbsup:

They will try to say it's worth 1/2 of what it is, and offer that amount. Been there, done that, although that was with used vintage gear. But it's for certain that the declared value is ignored in determining actual loss. Also expect the process to drag out for a month or more. :(

When I had shipping damage on a new speaker, it was Amazon that stepped up and took the loss by offering me a 20% rebate.

This is where you find out if the dealer is worth what they're getting for markup.

Mr. Widget

02-17-2009, 12:31 PM

They will try to say it's worth 1/2 of what it is, and offer that amount. Been there, done that, although that was with used vintage gear. But it's for certain that the declared value is ignored in determining actual loss. Also expect the process to drag out for a month or more. :(Not my experience. A UPS claims investigator came to my shop, took photos of the damaged box and contents and the shipper was sent a check for the full stated value. The shipper being a decent fellow sent the full amount on to me. I anticipated all kinds of grief, but both the shipper/seller and UPS were easy to deal with. The entire process did take a few weeks, but I suppose that is understandable.

Widget

rdgrimes

02-17-2009, 12:36 PM

Not my experience. A UPS claims investigator came to my shop, took photos of the damaged box and contents and the shipper was sent a check for the full stated value. The shipper being a decent fellow sent the full amount on to me. I anticipated all kinds of grief, but both the shipper/seller and UPS were easy to deal with. The entire process did take a few weeks, but I suppose that is understandable.

Widget
I guess my point was that it's really not fair for Dome to be waiting for anything. The dealer should be busy finding another amp and sending it to him post haste, leaving the financials to be worked out later. While UPS did do the damage, the shipper is responsible for inadequate packing of a very heavy amp. The dealer should be replacing it and handling the loss directly with UPS, leaving Dome out of the loop completely and in possession of the amp he paid for.

Mr. Widget

02-17-2009, 12:51 PM

I guess my point was that it's really not fair for Dome to be waiting for anything. The dealer should be busy finding another amp and sending it to him post haste, leaving the financials to be worked out later. While UPS did do the damage, the shipper is responsible for inadequate packing of a very heavy amp. The dealer should be replacing it and handling the loss directly with UPS, leaving Dome out of the loop completely and in possession of the amp he paid for....and if Dome had paid full retail for it I expect he'd demand nothing less... in this case he and the seller came to an agreement for this particular system... I imagine that the seller will do what's right, but loosing money on the deal isn't really fair and I am sure Dome realizes that. Besides, at a minimum, Dome is weeks away from having a room for this system.

Widget

rdgrimes

02-17-2009, 01:28 PM

...and if Dome had paid full retail for it I expect he'd demand nothing less... in this case he and the seller came to an agreement for this particular system... I imagine that the seller will do what's right, but loosing money on the deal isn't really fair and I am sure Dome realizes that. Besides, at a minimum, Dome is weeks away from having a room for this system.

Widget
All true, but I would be considerably less reasonable in light of having paid more for this system than most cars cost. I would expect true "white glove" service from the dealer regardless, unless that aspect was specifically excluded from the deal. If anyone is going to lose anything, it needs to be the dealer. So they might as well step up and make it right, sooner rather than later. Not hide behind the UPS claims process. I've shipped and received enough heavy amps to know that there's no excuse for that kind of damage. You assume it will get dropped/smacked and pack accordingly.
< End of rant. >

Mr. Widget

02-17-2009, 01:42 PM

All true, but I would be considerably less reasonable...Let's try to all be a little more reasonable... :bouncy:

Actually I think the amp was in a JBL box... maybe JBL needs to spend a little more engineering time on their packaging.

I think we have meandered enough here though.

So Dome, how are the room plans coming?

Widget

rdgrimes

02-17-2009, 03:30 PM

Actually I think the amp was in a JBL box... maybe JBL needs to spend a little more engineering time on their packaging.
Agreed, I've yet to see adequate packing from the factory either. Which is why they invented double-boxing. ;)

John

02-19-2009, 09:19 PM

Actually I think the amp was in a JBL box... maybe JBL needs to spend a little more engineering time on their packaging.
Widget

Like I already mentioned whoever put the pallet togeather with the cartons hanging over the edge of the pallet is the dude that started this mess. The carton would of been fine if it was within the pallet and not hanging over the edge!!!:banghead:

Titanium Dome

02-26-2009, 03:22 PM

Good news (I think) on the damaged amp front. The S5160 unit has gone from UPS to JBL for inspection and the likely outcome is a complete replacement. In the meantime the dealer sent me two S300s and two S150s to use.

Does anyone know who made these models? They're spankin' little beasts themselves, and I'll probably work some magic to get to keep them. Did they come from Bryston by way of Lexicon or were they Crowns originally?

Valentin

02-26-2009, 04:38 PM

none nore lexicon bryston nore crown

Titanium Dome

02-27-2009, 12:35 PM

Titanium Dome

02-27-2009, 12:38 PM

While I had the camera out , I thought :wtf: I'll get a group shot.

Well, it's mostly a group of boxes, but the wide angle lens got most of them in. I left one S1S-EX and two S4Ai boxes in the back and one S5160 is still missing.

timc

02-27-2009, 01:03 PM

Drooooool........

-Tim

mikebake

02-27-2009, 01:13 PM

That pile is going to sound great.

Hoerninger

02-27-2009, 01:23 PM

I'll get a group shot.

My wife was greatly impressed! (Me too :) )
____________
Peter

JBL 4645

02-28-2009, 10:52 AM

Here's a look at the two S300 and two S150 amps. They're in pretty nice shape.

It turns out upon further inspection they were made by UREI right there in Northridge. It says so right on the back. :bash:

http://www.audioheritage.org/vbulletin/attachment.php?attachmentid=37590&stc=1&d=1235763330

Dome

I’m puzzled :hmm: as to why only 4 amplifiers? Is there active crossover or loudspeaker management crossover system running each LF MF HF and sub bass of course, doesn’t seem like enough amplifiers?

I’m running only at least three Alesis RA300, for LF LCR one LFE.1 sub and one centre back surround, Two Marantz 1050 are running HF LCR one Marantz 1030 sidewall surrounds. The Marantz will be replaced as soon as I have the dosh to get several more RA300 and larger amp for the sub bass.

So in all I’m running six stereo amplifiers at present. Each sidewall surround will be powered separately as soon as I can get around to it, so the number of amps will be ridiculous.

Anyway it’s still a nice line-up, I’d get more amps.
:applaud:

timc

02-28-2009, 10:55 AM

They only replace the damaged amp.

-Tim

JBL 4645

02-28-2009, 12:52 PM

They only replace the damaged amp.

-Tim

You mean they replaced the amps that had the binding posts chewed up by some hungry dog? Those are replacements. Hmm, 4 aren’t enough for the hassle plus we’re talking principle of the matter, they should have thrown in 10 more amps for free. :D

Titanium Dome

02-28-2009, 06:39 PM

These are to cover the gap between when the S5160 gets replaced and getting the system set up. Of course, the reality is that the S5160 is likely to show up before I need these, but I'm happy to have them anyway.

Titanium Dome

03-01-2009, 03:10 PM

I though you might enjoy looking at one of the pigtails that comes with the system. This one is for the SAM1HF, SAM2LF, and S1S-EX combinations. Naturally, it would connect to an in-wall panel with six female RCA outs.

Titanium Dome

03-01-2009, 03:11 PM

It's ULTRACAP 12-2.

Titanium Dome

03-01-2009, 03:13 PM

There's a ton of interconnects in half a dozen bundles. Here's the smallest, thus easiest to handle for a picture.

Titanium Dome

03-01-2009, 03:15 PM

The JBL Synthesis RCA connectors on one end will go to sources or to amps.

Titanium Dome

03-01-2009, 03:16 PM

The green adapters go to the SDEC units.

Titanium Dome

03-01-2009, 03:18 PM

No, it's not Monster Cable. The braided cable is made by Straight Wire.

timc

03-02-2009, 04:07 AM

Of course. you wouldnt want to have a gay wire.

-Tim

JBL 4645

03-02-2009, 05:05 AM

Of course. you wouldnt want to have a gay wire.

-Tim

What they have, bent 10 bob wires? Gay-wire-rights. :D

Please what does a “gay wire” mean?

hjames

03-02-2009, 06:48 AM

No, it's not Monster Cable. The braided cable is made by Straight Wire.

What they have, bent 10 bob wires? Gay-wire-rights. :D

Please what does a “gay wire” mean?

Be careful!!

hjames

03-02-2009, 06:53 AM

No, it's not Monster Cable. The braided cable is made by Straight Wire.

Of course. you wouldnt want to have a gay wire.
-Tim

What they have, bent 10 bob wires?
Gay-wire-rights. :D
Please what does a “gay wire” mean?

Be careful!! :applaud:

My guess it means the signals only keep to their own kind ...

None of this reverse polarity woofer stuff like BMWCCA had to fool around with ... none of that positive lead wanting to go negative - no!

Nope, for TiDo, he'll just have to check the screws and slip it into place ...

http://audioheritage.org/vbulletin/attachment.php?attachmentid=37732&stc=1&d=1235945788

JBL 4645

03-02-2009, 07:28 AM

Be careful!! :applaud:

My guess it means the signals only keep to their own kind ...

None of this reverse polarity woofer stuff like BMWCCA had to fool around with ... none of that positive lead wanting to go negative - no!

Nope, for TiDo, he'll just have to check the screws and slip it into place ...

http://audioheritage.org/vbulletin/attachment.php?attachmentid=37732&stc=1&d=1235945788

So the leads is just another fancy way for XLR I can see three screws so there most be positive negative and ground, no because I’ve never seen this type before its only the ends that makes it difficult to connect to other amps or processors that don’t support these connections. Most interesting lead

BMWCCA

03-02-2009, 07:29 AM

My guess it means the signals only keep to their own kind ...:D Unlike my connections that can swing both ways!
Often the outward manifestation of black versus red, plus versus minus, can be deceiving, or simply have opposite polarity from what you might think. Never "wrong", just maybe "different".

T-dome's connectors are young. Give 'em a while to find their way.

grumpy

03-02-2009, 07:50 AM

TD... a modest recommendation before you connect it all up 'permanently'...
get some clear heat-shrink tubing, put it over the number labels, then shrink it.
Those labels will eventually fall off, otherwise.

Titanium Dome

03-02-2009, 09:17 AM

SEAWOLF97

03-02-2009, 10:01 AM

Oh Man , the "Jonas Brothers 3D Concert Experience" is gonna sound sweet on that system. :D :blink: :bouncy:

grumpy

03-02-2009, 10:39 AM

only like this:

SEAWOLF97

03-02-2009, 11:31 AM

only like this:

You dont like the TARP buster system ?

Oh , the eye openers ? CWO got me back to Ludwig Van ...:applaud:

boputnam

03-02-2009, 12:36 PM

The green adapters....Not "adapters", per se, but Euro Connectors (3-pin detactable terminal blocks). :)

Titanium Dome

03-18-2009, 11:04 AM

Apparently the issues with the damaged S5160 are solved, and a new one is on its way.

Also, I'll be keeping the two S300 and two S150 Synthesis® amps. har har :bouncy:

louped garouv

03-19-2009, 01:15 PM

damn, that garage is filled!

looks like fun!

Titanium Dome

03-19-2009, 11:07 PM

damn, that garage is filled!

looks like fun!

It's all stacked down in the bottom floor now. Fangio has a couple of picture of it which I hope he'll post at some time.

I had to make room for my GF's new Chrysler Crossfire convertible in the garage. No room for discussion there... :no:

Fangio

03-19-2009, 11:57 PM

... a quick stop at the Dome-icile to see the Synthesis® boxes
Quite an extensive package. Looking forward to hear more about the installation process, and final finetuning. :yes:

Thanks a lot for your hospitality Doug. :) Beautiful home, and it was a perfect afternoon.

MikeBrewster77

03-20-2009, 08:09 PM

Hmmm, tough call - did she get the turbo charged SRT-6? With a 5.1 second 0-60, that might be worthy of usurping your JBL's for garage space... ;)

Since we're waiting on the install for listening notes, and chance we'll get test drive impressions on the Chrysler? :D

It's all stacked down in the bottom floor now. Fangio has a couple of picture of it which I hope he'll post at some time.

I had to make room for my GF's new Chrysler Crossfire convertible in the garage. No room for discussion there... :no:

Titanium Dome

04-03-2009, 09:32 AM

She loves the car; it's not the SRT.

I have an '89 Chrysler's TC by Maserati, and I've always had a hard time convincing her to go for top-down rides in it. With her Crossfire, she puts the top down all the time. Go figure. She drives to work with the top down. She takes her co-workers out to lunch with the top down. She meets me for dinner with the top down. She drives home with the top down.

In the TC, I installed an all-JBL system in place of the Infinity. In her Crossfire, she still loves the Infinity system, which sounds pretty good, BTW.

I've driven the car just once, and I have to say it handles and drives just fine. I was impressed with its stability. However, the little four-cylinder turbo in my TC is actually more aggressive. I suppose if I drove the Crossfire without her in the car I'd push it harder. ;)

Titanium Dome

04-09-2009, 07:38 PM

To the Synthesis® dealer's credit, they got tired of waiting on the repair of the S5160, so they're just going to send a brand new replacement instead. They did this without my asking. I've been so involved in the daily drama of the room that I haven't thought about the equipment, so this was all the dealer taking charge of the process.

I must say I'm gratified.

(Yes, I know this contradicts an earlier post.)

JBL 4645

04-25-2009, 11:58 AM

Pictures please.

I think Tdome means this the JBL S516. "Impressive most impressive".
http://www.harmanaudio.com/images/products/front_large/S5160.jpg

GeneralPower Bandwidth5Hz – 100kHz, +0,–3dB Power Rating (20Hz – 20kHz, <0.03% THD, All Channels Driven) Output 8 Ohms160 Watts per channel into 8 ohms, all channels driven Sensitivity (2.83V @ 1m)1V in = 100 Watts out (THX standard) 1.25V in = 150 watts Frequency Response20Hz – 20kHz, +0,–0.25dB Input Level/Impedance28k OhmsSignal-to-Noise Ratio>100dBDamping Factor(8 ohms): >400 # of Amplifier Channels5Total Harmonic Distortion<0.03%, 20Hz – 20kHz Distortion>0.03%Dimensions
(H x W x D)7" x 19" x 19-1/2"
178mm x 484mm x 495mm Weight88 lb/40 kg Power Consumption1800 Watts MaximumBTU Per Hour785 BTU Average
1024 BTU Maximum

Loffen

05-02-2009, 05:57 AM

Congrats on your new set up! :applaud:

Was this the set that had a couple of rounds on Ebay a some months ago ?

Titanium Dome

05-02-2009, 07:37 AM

Congrats on your new set up! :applaud:

Was this the set that had a couple of rounds on Ebay a some months ago ?

Thanks. It's all a bit daunting, really, and whatever you pay for the gear is only the beginning of your spending.:spchless:

AudiogoN maybe? This was an authorized dealer transaction. I didn't do it through ebay.

boputnam

05-21-2009, 06:46 PM

All...

Keep the thread going, but please parse the room design, construction and treatment discussion to the sister thread: JBL Synthesis - Room Design and Treatment (http://audioheritage.csdco.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=25102).

Keep this one fresh for Doug's (or other's) reports on the system, and impressions once it get's installed and performing.

:)

Titanium Dome

05-21-2009, 11:49 PM

Bo, I've just volunteered you to help me create this unique opportunity:

http://audioheritage.org/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=252329#post252329

Thanks in advance. :D

BMWCCA

05-22-2009, 06:55 AM

I've driven the car just once, and I have to say it handles and drives just fine. I was impressed with its stability. However, the little four-cylinder turbo in my TC is actually more aggressive. I suppose if I drove the Crossfire without her in the car I'd push it harder. ;)Most likely an impression from differing NVH (Noise, Vibration, and Harshness) values. Interesting cars, both of them, but noisier, rougher running cars give the impression of more speed, otherwise the fart-can exhausts so popular today wouldn't have such an (infantile) audience. If yours is the 4-cylinder turbo, then it's the K-car engine—with nice Cosworth heads if you're lucky enough to have the manual-transmission version—and bits and pieces selected just for the TC project, but it's still a Chrysler K-car 4-cylinder engine the basics of which are now thirty-year-old technology. Actual power output on yours will, IIRC, depend on whether it had a manual or automatic transmission. The Crossfire is a living legacy of the Daimler takeover of Chrysler and one of the better examples of the transfer of Mercedes technology to a Chrysler-badged product. Even if the TC and the Crossfire have comparable hp and torque specs, the older, rougher car can still feel "quicker" but that's like saying an L100 sounds "better" than an L112. ;)

For your GF, you might see if anyone makes on of those air-deflector screens for your TC like what is integrated into the Crossfire and most modern convertibles. Women, especially, prefer the still-air cabin environment these produce.

Mike Ronesia

05-22-2009, 01:34 PM

For your GF, you might see if anyone makes on of those air-deflector screens for your TC like what is integrated into the Crossfire and most modern convertibles. Women, especially, prefer the still-air cabin environment these produce.

That makes it too much like a sunroof. What's the point of a convertible if you don't feel the air move?

Titanium Dome

05-26-2009, 11:11 AM

Glad to see you're still making steady progress.

It's not surprising to hear to about Chris' suggestion for the bass. Since it's not currently practical for you to isolate the listening room from the gym area, the bass would leak out anyway. And since the system is intended to fill a much bigger space with bass to begin with, that's a practical approach.

Have you thought about breaking in the speakers prior to installation? If not, I would strongly urge you to do it. The initial hours of speaker operation typically see a significant improvement in sound quality.

Otherwise you could possibly end up with a brighter character to the system than you would like during the initial auditions and this could affect calibration, as well.

Since you have so many amps and speakers to break-in it will probably make life easier to do just 1 amp and 2 speakers at a time. (I usually play white noise for 24-48 hours at a medium volume.) If you reverse the polarity on the speakers and put them face to face, that reduces the amount of sound being transmitted into the room (and reduces the chances of you hearing the white noise from another room). Although, this may not help when doing the surround speakers (because of their dipole design), but it it will for the fronts.

Once the room is finished, I'll schedule the calibration. Chris will have control over the final install, including what gets wired where.

Prior to his arrival, I will unbox everything and give it an integrity test. This will include some pre-conditioning using the venerable and trusted Soundcraftsmen AS2000.

JBL 4645

05-26-2009, 11:29 AM

Why this thread is beginning to be bit like watching Shuttle launch in pre-tests before lunching.:D

http://l.yimg.com/eb/ymv/us/img/hv/photo/movie_pix/universal_pictures/apollo_13/ed_harris/apollo.jpg

Synthesis 1 flight controllers listen up. Give me go, no go for launch.

LCR.
Go!
Sub bass.
Go!
Amps.
Go!
EQ.
Go!
Surrounds
Go!
Acoustics
Go!

Lunch control this Dome control we’re go for lunch.:D

Allanvh5150

05-26-2009, 12:26 PM

Titanium Dome

05-26-2009, 12:44 PM

I will write this: setting up a Synthesis® system is not your typical open the box, wire it up, and fire it up procedure.

One could just open the boxes and hook stuff up in a room, and it would work. it just wouldn't work the way it was intended. It might even sound pretty darn good.

This is one of those serious efforts that I just want to do as right as possible.

I've never put this much effort into a room, but the system will pay me back if I do. I've never been crawling around under the house to pull two matched 20 Amp circuits through to a room that already has plenty of plugs in it, but the system will reward me. I've never used expensive, four strand wire for biamping all channels, but the SDEC4000 and all those amp channels are there for a reason. All the exact measurements, acoustic panels, diffusers, paint, lights, holy crap!

It's hard as hell to keep all that gear in the boxes, but I'm determined to make a best effort here and not pull it out 'til there's a space worthy of the equipment and an infrastructure worthy of it as well.

The launch is closer. I can feel it. Not much longer now. T minus three minutes and holding. ;)

JBL 4645

05-26-2009, 02:44 PM

That looks more like an Apollo launch, Ash...

Allan.
Well Al, I, think the Dome, is just a few weeks, from officially launching his home cinema.

I recommended
Apollo 13
The Dream is Alive

To lunch the JBL Synthesis into orbit.:D

JBL 4645

05-26-2009, 02:55 PM

It's hard as hell to keep all that gear in the boxes, but I'm determined to make a best effort here and not pull it out 'til there's a space worthy of the equipment and an infrastructure worthy of it as well.

The launch is closer. I can feel it. Not much longer now. T minus three minutes and holding. ;)

I would have had it opened the moment I had it in my possession. LOL Why hold off Dome, get it out of the boxes mate and set it up.
:applaud:

Found this video last you might find it exciting

JBL Synthesis shows a 27 seat cinema room featuring the new JBL Everest speakers (IFA 2007)
http://uk.cinenow.com/videos/896-jbl-synthesis-shows-27-seat-cinema-room-featuring-new-jbl-everest-speakers-ifa-2007 (http://uk.cinenow.com/videos/896-jbl-synthesis-shows-27-seat-cinema-room-featuring-new-jbl-everest-speakers-ifa-2007)

80sKid

05-27-2009, 12:11 PM

JBL 4645

05-27-2009, 12:19 PM

That's an interesting video. I wonder if that room is permanent or is was constructed temporarily just for that event. They didn't make it clear.

It's too bad we weren't given a glimpse of the equipment room.

Yeah that sucks doesn’t it I mean they had plenty of time, to get off there asses :D and walk around the room, it wasn’t as if they where watching anything.

I think it was made up for the show exhibition it would be nice as permanent room.

Titanium Dome

05-27-2009, 03:45 PM

MikeBrewster77

05-27-2009, 03:49 PM

... how can one man hold a friggin' 90 lb. amp and thread the mounting bolts at the same time?

Extremely carefully! ;)

JBL 4645

05-27-2009, 05:17 PM

It looks like Chris is ready to guide me through the equipment maze, maybe this weekend. If I'm lucky, I'll be laboring all of Sunday assisting with installing those d@#n big-a$$ed amps in the racks. I mean, really, how can one man hold a friggin' 90 lb. amp and thread the mounting bolts at the same time?

Then he'll connect all the cabling and we'll wire up the speakers. I'll be watching and learning, hopefully without annoying him too much. ;)

After that, he'll make arrangements with JBL/Harman to get the calibration equipment and we'll set the date for that.

T-3 days and counting this is mission Dome control.

Load the first one on the lower level then mounting the second and third should be easy for one person.:)

Well good luck this Sunday Dome, and make sure you’ve got plenty of refreshment to keep him, happy even if it’s orange juice.

Heave Dome! Heave!:D

http://www.bible-topten.com/302.jpg
Damn good film, damn good film, classic!

Titanium Dome

06-01-2009, 08:57 PM

Now that the gear is out of the boxes and connected--though not completely installed or calibrated yet--it's time for some closer looks and impressions.

You can see how we got to this place by reviewing this thread starting on page 13: http://audioheritage.org/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=25102&page=13

So we'll start at the rack. At the top of the left rack is a Furman PM PRO Series II 20 Amp PDU (power distribution unit). All of the sensitive electronics are connected to this amazing unit.

The Synthesis® amplifiers are direct to the dedicated circuits. I don't like limiting them in any way, and Chris calls them arc welders anyway. He said he spec'd them down to a total grounded connection short and 0 Ohm load without damage.

The Furman gives a nice status display without being flashy, and it has a protected power switch.

Below that is the SDP-5 (Lexicon MC-8) with it obligatory JBL blue display. I've got a lot of reading to do to catch up with this baby, but the good news is I can run it our of the box without too much trouble.

I already programmed my Harmony 1000 to run it. As time goes on, I'm sure there will be things the Harmony doesn't do that the JBL remote will, but for daily operation the Harmony will control everything, including the sources.

Speaking of sources, under the SDP-5 is the OPPO 981HD, which has a nicely matching blue display.

Below that but not hooked up or turned on is the Mitsubishi LD player.

As much as possible I avoided using the flash on these pictures. I used the night setting to try to give you a bit more detail and less flash glare.

Titanium Dome

06-01-2009, 09:03 PM

Looking at the same gear from the back, it's easy to see the Furman is a true 20 Amp device.

The SDP-5 has the usual plethora of connections, though no HDMI. What's up with that, JBL Synthesis®?:wtf:

Thankfully the OPPO has the chips to decode what the JBL cannot, so it'll do some of that duty, and I'll go HDMI direct to the projector for video.

Titanium Dome

06-01-2009, 09:10 PM

At the top of the right rack you see the SDEC-4000X and SDEC-4000P. These are very sophisticated. It's all HiQ Net stuff, and it runs like a network all the time. The changing displays actually update themselves with IP addresses and network conditions, as well as the time. Once the calibration is done, I think there will be green/red LED displays in the little windows where you see the numbers 1, 2, 3, 4. What does it mean? :dont-know

I don't know how legible the display will be. It's hard to photograph. You'll just have to come see for yoruself.

Given the level of complexity, it's no wonder the pair retails in the mid teens. You want to talk about active crossovers? I got your active crossovers right here. :moon:

Oh, I mean right here:

Titanium Dome

06-01-2009, 09:25 PM

The backside looks like your typical corporate network server running 24/7. I was falling off a five gallon bucket when I snapped the photo, so there are some motion artifacts.

It makes me think I want to put a glass door on the back. It's freakin' sweet when you walk into the dark room.

Titanium Dome

06-01-2009, 09:28 PM

Here's the obligatory look at four of the five amps lit up with blue LEDs. It's got to be seen to be appreciated. Heh, no bucket to fall off this time, just lousy picture taking.

Titanium Dome

06-01-2009, 09:32 PM

In back, the front main speakers use two channels each. The 14/4 wire makes this easy to track. Red/black for HF, green/blue for MF and upper LF.

Titanium Dome

06-01-2009, 09:35 PM

The subs use the S800s in bridged mode. Oh no! Look, the subs are bi-wired.:spchless::rotfl:

Titanium Dome

06-01-2009, 09:40 PM

Here's a SAM1HF (Synthesis Array Module 1 High Frequency) full in the face. That's Ti on top and Al underneath. It's the least horn-sounding horn I've heard.

It has none of the honking, ringing, sibilant, shrill, or piercing qualities I hear in 95%+ of all horns I've listened to, vintage or otherwise.

Can't wait to hear it dialed in! :bouncy:

Titanium Dome

06-01-2009, 09:50 PM

The SAM2LF (Synthesis Array Module 2 Low Frequency) units have two amazing 8" Al drivers. They remind me more and more of the fantastic 12' Al cone driver in the HTPS400: fast, clean, precise, articulate, powerful, fully dynamic--WOW!

This might be the best 8" driver ever and the biggest surprise of the system, even more so than the SAM1HF drivers. I swear someone is in the room with me. I've looked around a dozen times at nothing because the SAM2LFs convinced me something was here.

Right now I'm listening to some country swing fiddling, and with my eyes closed, I'm right in the tent at the Lucas County Fair listening to the fiddler slice up the lingering summer heat. It's uncanny, the haunting reality of my childhood memories and the aura it invokes. This is just unreal, it's so real.

Can this rig really sound even better? We'll see.

Titanium Dome

06-01-2009, 09:58 PM

Right now the woofers are fighting each other a bit. That'll be taken care of by the calibration. Even with a bit of competitive muddiness, they have nearly unlimited power. With Crystal Method's Legion of Boom on, I can feel it in my chest, my legs, my arms, my b... never mind. :scold:

The front sub is lying down; the rear is standing up. These are not butt-kickers. They're ass-kickers, body beaters, head bangers. :yes:

One they're in phase and fully powered, watch out!

Titanium Dome

06-01-2009, 10:00 PM

Here's a better look into the ports. Each one exudes palpable air motion, even from a foot away. This is some serious woofing.

Titanium Dome

06-01-2009, 10:08 PM

The S4Ai is upside down for ease of connection. When mounted it will go right side up, which in this case means with the single Ti tweeter at the bottom.

Chris said when he spec'd it, it had to "do everything." It can di-pole, bi-pole, and direct radiate. It fits between 16" on center wall studs. It can be mounted in the ceiling. The four driver module can be rotated. The direct radiating woofer and tweeter can go at the top or at the bottom. It can be hooked up three different ways. (We chose the simplest.)

The four driver module has an acoustical foam in it.

It's a beauty, with three Ti tweeters and an inverted dome 8" driver, the perfect combination for a Titanium Dome Inverted Dome Metalhead. I'm back in home territory. The 360 degree soundstage is a bit incomplete until calibration, but even roughed in and unmounted, it's easy to hear the magic.

All in all, it's an amazing accomplishment that was almost two years in the making.

JBL 4645

06-02-2009, 03:16 AM

Well it looks impressive.:applaud:

Mike Ronesia

06-02-2009, 04:40 AM

Thanks for taking the time to share the pictures. Do you have time off work this week to work more on it?:bouncy:

Robh3606

06-02-2009, 07:21 AM

It has none of the honking, ringing, sibilant, shrill, or piercing qualities I hear in 95%+ of all horns I've listened to, vintage or otherwise.

Can't wait to hear it dialed in! :bouncy:

Do I sense a moniker change coming??:D Glad you like them as much as you do. That is one awesome set-up. Nice pictures too. So have you decided what movie you are going to watch first??

Rob:)

oznob

06-02-2009, 07:30 AM

So have you decided what movie you are going to watch first??

Rob:)[/quote]

The depth charge attack on U-571 is a real wall shaker! It will also test your surround calibration very well. My uncle is a THX certified installer and has a bunch of set-up discs. I will ask him if he has an extra or two, if you need them that is.

Congrats on a great system Doug!:applaud:

Mark

Titanium Dome

06-02-2009, 07:42 AM

Titanium Dome

06-02-2009, 07:45 AM

My uncle is a THX certified installer and has a bunch of set-up discs. I will ask him if he has an extra or two, if you need them that is.

Congrats on a great system Doug!:applaud:

Mark

Thanks.

There's definitely nothing in the house now that will fit the task. I have DVE, but it's way below the standard of this equipment.

Once Chris is done, I think I'm pretty much on my own unless I want to pay him or someone else to come back.

4313B

06-02-2009, 07:56 AM

Titanium Dome

06-02-2009, 07:57 AM

Thanks for taking the time to share the pictures. Do you have time off work this week to work more on it?:bouncy:

It's near the end of the fiscal year, so I have to use up vacation time. I've got two days reserved this week and one next week.

Mr. Widget

06-02-2009, 06:42 PM

Yeah, that's a hard one, but I keep thinking Master and Commander might be it. It has so much variety to it.It does sound fantastic, but I am not sure I could sit through it again. There are so many good choices for sound, but if I am going to sit through a couple of hours of movie, I really want to enjoy the movie as well as the sound.

I must say, I am drawing a blank right now for best movie with best sound... maybe stick with that pick.

For a good subwoofer workout there are a number of scenes in The Incredibles that will really plumb the depths at a significant power level.

Widget

jblsound

06-02-2009, 07:14 PM

Thanks.

There's definitely nothing in the house now that will fit the task. I have DVE, but it's way below the standard of this equipment.

Once Chris is done, I think I'm pretty much on my own unless I want to pay him or someone else to come back.

My favorite, fairly current movie, is SHOOTER, starring Mark Wallberg. I played that for my old army buddy when he was here in March. he jumped out of his seat at least once.

Another good movie is THE PEACEMAKER starring George Clooney, that's the one he plays the part of a Green Beret trying to find a a missing bomb in Russia.

mikebake

06-02-2009, 07:23 PM

Wow! So cool. :D
The green shade is my envy.

mikebake

06-02-2009, 07:26 PM

Bombs and blasts are nice, but it is nice to have some sweet music and subtlety in at as well.

jblsound

06-02-2009, 07:41 PM

Bombs and blasts are nice, but it is nice to have some sweet music and subtlety in at as well.

True, that's why I like my SUB1500s, more than just a boom box. Another movie that has plenty of boom and music is Pirates of the Carrabean.

JBL 4645

06-03-2009, 06:48 AM

Yeah, that's a hard one, but I keep thinking Master and Commander might be it. It has so much variety to it.

Storms on the sea
Cannon rounds
Intense dialogue
Intimate dialogue
Little sounds of nature
Singing
Stringed instruments
Big musical score
Lots of multichannel effects

It's a definite contender.

It will have pulsating effect for the first brief few seconds as the splitters of wood showers around your head.:p
Richard King sound effects editing was spot on the money that earned Oscar 2003.

LFE.1 track only! I’d keep the subs for LFE.1 only unless that AVP is as smart as Dolby cinema processor, no pun, I’d be surprised if it will route low end to the subs in Dolby stereo pro-logic mode and keep LCRS out of the subs when in (Dolby stereo/dts5.1).

If not use one sub for LFE.1 and the other for LCRS sub bass extension this way you want over taxi the LFE.1 or smear or mask it as I have found.

http://i282.photobucket.com/albums/kk279/SpectrumsubbassLFE13417/MasterandcommanderLFE1track.jpg

My favorite, fairly current movie, is SHOOTER, starring Mark Wallberg. I played that for my old army buddy when he was here in March. he jumped out of his seat at least once.

Another good movie is THE PEACEMAKER starring George Clooney, that's the one he plays the part of a Green Beret trying to find a a missing bomb in Russia.

Another excellent choice! Particularly the atomic bomb explosions and its impossible to create the real thing impossible because it would kill you instantaneously, or the sound system would be the first to go LOL if played too loud!:D

There’s only two parts where its used the rest has neat chest bass kicking effects. “Those f%()kers you can shoot” :D The bridge truck sequence or the on foot chase though New York city.

http://i282.photobucket.com/albums/kk279/SpectrumsubbassLFE13417/ThePeacemakerMassivecinematicexplos.jpg

I think the Dome is going to have a few exciting listening weekend afternoons or maybe the whole god damn day! I would if I was you!:p

Have you decided on name yet or are you still starching your head wondering what name to christen the home cinema?

I’d call the MegaDomeTheatre :D

How about the THX WOW! There’s a DVD copy version on ebay I mean if you do a search you’ll be bound to find at least a dozen or so.

Hmm, that’s one test disc I haven’t yet done waterfalls on, maybe I’ll do it now!

I’m surprised JBL or seeing its part of the THX home cinema spec, they didn’t provide a THX laserdisc LOL I mean THX WOW DVD.

hjames

06-03-2009, 07:11 AM

JBL 4645

06-03-2009, 01:57 PM

Or for something contemporary - try the action "comedy" -
Wanted - With James Macavoy, Morgan Freeman, and Angelina Jolie (http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0493464/)

Its a subtle sendup of all the newer action movies and has all the good stuff - Shooting, train wrecks, car stunts, bullets bending on their path - all kinds of fun and kick-butt audio, too!

Brilliant action fun and the rat scene towards the end damn funny.:D

http://i279.photobucket.com/albums/kk123/IndianaJones34/WANTEDregion2.jpg

http://i282.photobucket.com/albums/kk279/SpectrumsubbassLFE13417/WANTEDchapter1theywherejustdecoysgo.jpg

http://i282.photobucket.com/albums/kk279/SpectrumsubbassLFE13417/WANTEDchapter15bulletbendingtraincr.jpg

Mike Ronesia

06-03-2009, 02:04 PM

I need to add that to my Netflix list!:applaud:

Titanium Dome

06-07-2009, 08:21 AM

JBL 4645

06-07-2009, 11:51 AM

The JBL DACS system is reserved for next weekend! At this point, we're not sure if it will be Saturday or Sunday for the calibration. Find out more here:

http://audioheritage.org/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=254607&postcount=19

Oh, for pete’s sakes just get it set-up will you.:D

It’s looking good so far well done on some sweaty armpit hard work.:applaud:

Titanium Dome

06-08-2009, 09:13 PM

I told Huikyong that I was 95% done and that I'd cleaned out most of the construction debris, so suddenly she said, "Show me."

We went down, and she said, "You did a good job. It looks very nice."

Then, "Let me hear it."

Well, okay, so I grabbed the Pink Floyd Dark Side of the Moon DVD-A, Alan Parson quad mix, and played it. She sat through the whole thing, actually listened to the whole darn disc with me! :D

I thought it might be too loud, but she was not complaining at all. "It's so clear, so open, so spacious. I don't feel like those women are screaming; their voices are beautiful, expressive, articulate." "This sounds just like a clock shop at 12 Noon. Hey, there are clocks over there, and back there, they're all over." "You know, that sounds like a real cash box. That sounds just like an old adding machine." "The bass is very powerful, but I don't feel like it's driving me out of the room. My chest is vibrating, but it doesn't sound all boomy and loud. Why is that?"

The title of the thread, "Something big is coming," never anticipated something this big. She actually loves and admires the system! :banana:

Mike Ronesia

06-08-2009, 09:52 PM

You just got the best review you could ask for from the only critic other then you that matters.:applaud::applaud:

Life just doesn’t get any better then that. Job well done! Now get out some gettin busy music.;):bouncy:

hjames

06-09-2009, 03:59 AM

Congratulations - SAF and good sound too!!
I'll bet this is gonna be a whole lot of fun!
Wish I was closer for the tuneup sessions!

Kudos to you!

I told Huikyong that I was 95% done and that I'd cleaned out most of the construction debris, so suddenly she said, "Show me."

We went down, and she said, "You did a good job. It looks very nice."

Then, "Let me hear it."

Well, okay, so I grabbed the Pink Floyd Dark Side of the Moon DVD-A, Alan Parson quad mix, and played it. She sat through the whole thing, actually listened to the whole darn disc with me! :D

I thought it might be too loud, but she was not complaining at all. "It's so clear, so open, so spacious. I don't feel like those women are screaming; their voices are beautiful, expressive, articulate." "This sounds just like a clock shop at 12 Noon. Hey, there are clocks over there, and back there, they're all over." "You know, that sounds like a real cash box. That sounds just like an old adding machine." "The bass is very powerful, but I don't feel like it's driving me out of the room. My chest is vibrating, but it doesn't sound all boomy and loud. Why is that?"

The title of the thread, "Something big is coming," never anticipated something this big. She actually loves and admires the system! :banana:

MikeBrewster77

06-09-2009, 06:20 AM

She actually loves and admires the system!

She's a keeper! :D

Nice job though - blending aesthetics and good sound is always a challenge, and it seems as though you've pulled it off quite admirably.

It's amazing how truly good equipment completely changes how SPL is perceived.

You're gonna have a blast with this setup! :)

Best,
- Mike

jblsound

06-09-2009, 08:05 AM

And the system isn't even calibrated yet!:applaud:

Hoerninger

06-10-2009, 04:12 AM

"This sounds just like a clock shop at 12 Noon. Hey, there are clocks over there, and back there, they're all over." "You know, that sounds like a real cash box. That sounds just like an old adding machine." "... Why is that?"
:banana:
The goal is reached - audio nirvana?
So, what is left? Glorification!
Or should I have said calibration?

Congratulations, TiDome!
____________
Peter

Titanium Dome

06-13-2009, 10:12 PM

Okay, we'll pick up the calibration itself here, as that is part and parcel of the JBL Synthesis® experience. While Chris assembled the equipment and patched everything together, Grumpy and I set up the mics.

Well, actually, it looks like I'm just lost.

Titanium Dome

06-13-2009, 10:15 PM

Here we go. Mics on the seats, mics behind the seats, little boxes and wires everywhere.

Titanium Dome

06-13-2009, 10:17 PM

...and action...

Titanium Dome

06-13-2009, 10:19 PM

The subs come first, and there's work to do.

Titanium Dome

06-13-2009, 10:22 PM

A little bit of this and a little bit of that (I'm totally lost now) on the software EQ controller...

Titanium Dome

06-13-2009, 10:24 PM

...and the sub output changes to this. Woo-hoo! Solid at 20Hz and heading down into the teens.

Titanium Dome

06-13-2009, 10:30 PM

At this point, a technical issue developed which will require a return visit. Chris was more than gracious and will come back next week. So even though the calibration isn't complete, we have everything correctly phased, placed, and the subs in fine shape.

Huikyong and I watched a movie tonight, and she simply commented: "It's the best movie experience I've ever had."

I thought, yeah, well wait 'til the rest is done. :bouncy:

grumpy

06-13-2009, 10:37 PM

:applaud:

MikeBrewster77

06-13-2009, 10:53 PM

Huikyong and I watched a movie tonight, and she simply commented: "It's the best movie experience I've ever had."

Marvellous! That's about the best praise you could hope for! :applaud:

Congrats!!! :)

JBL 4645

06-13-2009, 11:10 PM

EQ isn’t it a bitch! :banghead::D Opps he’s got to travel back. I’d fill that fridge up with his favourite beverage.:D

Mike Ronesia

06-14-2009, 04:30 AM

Huikyong and I watched a movie tonight, and she simply commented: "It's the best movie experience I've ever had."

What did you think? Did you get any quality listening time before you started so you can hear and feel the difference Chris makes?

Titanium Dome

06-14-2009, 08:13 AM

What did you think? Did you get any quality listening time before you started so you can hear and feel the difference Chris makes?

Well, as I rushed to finish up some small details (though apparently not everything) I put on two things repeatedly:

Dark Side of the Moon DVD-A
Just Dance

I know it makes me look like a heathen, but I can't get enough of that dance trax/club mix beat, so there it is. It's bass heavy and thumping, as you might guess.

The thing that's most apparent is the obvious improvement in the cleanness and consistency in the bass. It's a major improvement.

Another thing that I was glad to hear was there was very little loss in the center channel audio once the screen was in place. It was far less than I expected. Once he gets the center channel calibrated, I doubt I'll be able to hear any difference at all.

Finally, getting the four additional diffusers up balanced the room better. Now the diffusion is uniform, and the sense of space is unbelievable. :bouncy:

Hoerninger

06-14-2009, 09:14 AM

Titanium Dome

06-14-2009, 09:47 AM

TiDome, how do you judge the localisation within the soundstage and the perception of details with the vertical horns and the absorber pannels behind the front?
In my actual room where I listen - it is no listening room - there are so many unwanted reflections that it is a great improvement when I hold my hands behind my ears for better directivity - unfortunately.
____________
Peter

It's actually quite clear. The sound comes from the front soundstage very precisely without any unwanted reflections off the front wall. The horns' dispersion seems to provide very clear positioning for instruments, for example.

Localization for the surrounds is better now that all the diffusers are up. I've corrected the diagram to show the dispersion better and to show the direct radiating sound from the 8" woofer and Ti tweeter at the bottom.

(The red arrows add the direct sound and the orange represent the diffused sound. Of course arrows cannot show dispersion patterns per se, so no one needs to point that out. It's obvious.)

Mr. Widget

06-14-2009, 10:39 AM

...I can't get enough of that dance trax/club mix beat, so there it is. It's bass heavy and thumping, as you might guess.Will you use the room for serious music listening as well as for watching movies? For most types of music you would want a flatter sound than you would for a theater, however if you primarily listen to bass heavy dance music, maybe you would want the same room curve for both.

In your previous HT setup did you find one curve worked for both applications?

Widget

grumpy

06-14-2009, 05:10 PM

I can second the quality of the room... whatever treatments were there, they
were effective. The room did -not- sound like a normal room that size, either
speech or with music. With the movie going, the sound field seemed defined
by the recording, not the room (would have been difficult to guess room
size if blindfolded, listening for audio clues).

The brief before/after bass-EQ adjustments also seemed effective in
"tightening up" the bass and reducing apparent room influence ... but then
I was looking over Chris' shoulder, seeing where the adjustments were made
toward a "standard" curve, so this result was what I was expecting... I have
performed a similar (if less comprehensive and time-efficient) EQ process
with an analog parametric EQ at home. Having hardware to run averages
(and probably more) with 8 positioned microphones is a distinct
advantage.

It should be quite a further improvement when a DACS-based measurement
system can be employed to finish up the non-sub EQ/delay alignments.

FWIW, the SDEC-4000 units appear to be JBL versions of the BSS
BLU-series that use the London Architect software. Powerful stuff.
More so than old version of the Harman "HiQnet System Architect"
software I've played with. The software and products (JBL/BSS/dbx)
in this category (multi-in/out dsp engines) seem to be merging.

Heres a pdf manual of a JBL version:

http://www.tomtom.sk/buxus/docs/download/Owner%5C%27s%20Manual%20-%20SDEC3000,%20SDEC4000%20(English).pdf (http://www.tomtom.sk/buxus/docs/download/Owner%5C%27s%20Manual%20-%20SDEC3000,%20SDEC4000%20%28English%29.pdf)

nlsteele

06-14-2009, 05:11 PM

In your previous HT setup did you find one curve worked for both applications?

Not to put words in TD's mouth, but something tells me with networked active EQs and crossovers, he can probably change the curve on the fly between different albums, much less different purposes (e.g., HT vs. Music). Good show that. :)

Titanium Dome

06-14-2009, 09:51 PM

Will you use the room for serious music listening as well as for watching movies? For most types of music you would want a flatter sound than you would for a theater, however if you primarily listen to bass heavy dance music, maybe you would want the same room curve for both.

In your previous HT setup did you find one curve worked for both applications?

Widget

When all is said and done, I don't know the SDP-5 well enough to to comment on its capabilities, but I do know from a cursory examination of the manual that there's a load of customization options there. I'll ask if more than one set of values is possible.

Having said that, Grumpy and I listened to the Performance Series MCH system and the S/2600 stereo pair afterward, and I think I might prefer them for music reproduction, respectively. Grumpy offered to come back and help me with some EQ for each system, and I just might take him up on it.

Despite the One Array's superiority for cinema reproduction, I must admit that listening to the Performance Series afterward on MCH music was very gratifying, especially with Grumpy's suggestions on channel balance.

Additionally, the S/2600's stereo performance with the Panasonic digital receiver was quite convincing. Since my right ear is shot, I'm temped to trust his two good ears (and equipment) to help me get maximum reproduction from these two excellent systems.

Mike Ronesia

06-14-2009, 10:22 PM

I must admit that listening to the Performance Series afterward on MCH music was very gratifying, especially with Grumpy's suggestions on channel balance.

Additionally, the S/2600's stereo performance with the Panasonic digital receiver was quite convincing. Since my right ear is shot, I'm temped to trust his two good ears (and equipment) to help me get maximum reproduction from these two excellent systems.

I'll supply the steaks and beer if you two come to my place and help me set mine up with all that skill and knowledge you guys have.:cheers:...Heck I'll even give you a place to crash.:yes:

JBL 4645

06-15-2009, 12:43 AM

JBL 4645

06-15-2009, 01:05 AM

Seriously Dome can you get spot on directivity with films since that was your main goal as your film nut like me?

Can you hear without effort or stain clear dialogue panning and at the same time clear centred dialogue over the left/right competition with surrounds muted this helps to focus on three things. LCR!

If you where to play I mean Snow White pass. Hmm that’s matrix version of The Blues Brothers I have region 2 version in six-track Dolby stereo. Is that Soylent Green? And the question is now that you spent a fortune have you had to make cut-backs on food at the supermarket? Are you eating Soylent Green? :D

Or have you performed a blind listening test with a Sent of woman? Or maybe if you stick Conehead on it will improve directivity in sound? :D

Oh, you have Independence Day and the bass to sub bass surprisingly doesn’t go below 20Hz its deep its loud but. I’m trying to think with my Conehead hat on? There is neat sound pan with the bi-plane from front to back or sidewall surrounds on side 1 chapter? I only have the region 2 DVD I sold the THX laserdisc years ago, not sure if its chapter 7?

List the title of film laserdisc and DVD that you have so far.

http://www.audioheritage.org/vbulletin/attachment.php?attachmentid=39602&stc=1&d=1243711226

Titanium Dome

06-15-2009, 06:27 AM

jblsound

06-15-2009, 09:21 AM

Localization for the surrounds is better now that all the diffusers are up. I've corrected the diagram to show the dispersion better and to show the direct radiating sound from the 8" woofer and Ti tweeter at the bottom.

For movies, one wants not to be able to localize the surrounds, right?
At times, you do want localization, like when a plane is flying from the left rear to the right front, for instants.
But in a movie like Twister, when you're in the middle of a tornado, you just want the sound all around.

nlsteele

06-15-2009, 10:09 AM

For movies, one wants not to be able to localize the surrounds, right?
At times, you do want localization, like when a plane is flying from the left rear to the right front, for instants.
But in a movie like Twister, when you're in the middle of a tornado, you just want the sound all around.

If I'm not off my rocker (pardon me if I am) in-phase sound sent to a particular channel should be localizable intentionally, in-phase sound sent to a pair should be localizable to the centerpoint between the two, and out-of-phase sound sent to two should be un-localizable. If your surrounds were creating too many reflections it would make it more difficult to differentiate the conditions of in- and out-of-phase, especially with the contemporary surround and rear surround arrangements of 7.x.

jblsound

06-15-2009, 10:42 AM

If I'm not off my rocker (pardon me if I am) in-phase sound sent to a particular channel should be localizable intentionally, in-phase sound sent to a pair should be localizable to the centerpoint between the two, and out-of-phase sound sent to two should be un-localizable. If your surrounds were creating too many reflections it would make it more difficult to differentiate the conditions of in- and out-of-phase, especially with the contemporary surround and rear surround arrangements of 7.x.
If connected properly, all the speakers are in-phase. But like the two examples I mentioned, the plane would be localized, but if the sound effect is being in the middle of a tornado, the sound is whirling all around. There might be a bit of localization, but mostly its mass kaos.

There are some DVD-A disc that have the sound panning across the back and across the fronts creating a racetrack type of sound image, but that's not the norm.

nlsteele

06-15-2009, 10:51 AM

If connected properly, all the speakers are in-phase. But like the two examples I mentioned, the plane would be localized, but if the sound effect is being in the middle of a tornado, the sound is whirling all around. There might be a bit of localization, but mostly its mass kaos.

There are some DVD-A disc that have the sound panning across the back and across the fronts creating a racetrack type of sound image, but that's not the norm.

Yeah, you're right that the poles of the speakers would be physically in-phase, but you can still send an out-of-phase signal to two of them (reverse polarity for the signal to one channel of the two) ala the THX optimization tests on any THX disc. So for a scene like the tornado in twister, you can send out-of-phase signals to the multiple pairs, creating an entirely unlocalizable, but fully surrounding sound. :)

JBL 4645

06-15-2009, 01:41 PM

We watched the first part of Master and Commander, and near the beginning you see the ship's bell being rung in the middle of the screen. I exclaimed, "Man! That sounds like it's ringing right out of the bell."

Pans are very good, but will be even better when the fronts are fully calibrated.

And the distance from screen! Would you like to have front row because the nearer the wider and wilder the fronts sound even in cinema. The further you move back the stereo starts to narrow.

I’ll give that moment a another listen again!

Jesus Christ! I just back home and have bath and cat is going batshit! running around like blueass fly bumping into doors!:blink: See what I have to deal with? :D

Edit: 10:20 hours UK summertime

The ships bell is heard centre with half of its sound on front right left is free from the bell sound it kinder sway rather like Doppler shift to give the since of moving sound.

A few voices are heard over C/R no difficulty at 9 feet to present listening distance.

Then again I can mute anyone of the LCR LF/HF fronts for monitoring or figure out a way of adding a little delay on one of the HF to make some pain the ass Dolby stereo 4:2:4 front LCR work without having to strain to listen so to speak.

jblsound

06-15-2009, 02:50 PM

Yeah, you're right that the poles of the speakers would be physically in-phase, but you can still send an out-of-phase signal to two of them (reverse polarity for the signal to one channel of the two) ala the THX optimization tests on any THX disc. So for a scene like the tornado in twister, you can send out-of-phase signals to the multiple pairs, creating an entirely unlocalizable, but fully surrounding sound. :)
Same with DVD setup disc. It sends an in-phase and then an out of phase signal to each pair of speakers, working around in a circle, for the purpose of checking for proper phase setup. I mis-read what you were saying.

nlsteele

06-15-2009, 03:08 PM

I mis-read what you were saying.

That just puts you in a lot of good company. :D

JBL 4645

06-15-2009, 03:21 PM

Same with DVD setup disc. It sends an in-phase and then an out of phase signal to each pair of speakers, working around in a circle, for the purpose of checking for proper phase setup. I mis-read what you were saying.

It’s not too hard to spot the difference once you know what to listen for.

Like the phase test for centre back when listening to the signal (in and out of phase the outer phase goes to the matrix rear on Dolby pro-logic decoder or the overheard surround channel!)

If you also placed the signals from LCRS into mixer and use a single output to one speaker and play those test singles it’s somewhat different.

There’s manufacture I think its called Leader who make some rather costly audio test gear I mean costly. Its got some fancy features on some of the products to align the sound system up.

LEADER
http://www.leader.co.jp/english/index.html

AES E-LibraryVisual Monitoring of Multichannel Stereophonic Signals
http://www.aes.org/e-lib/browse.cfm?elib=7836

Titanium Dome

06-15-2009, 04:56 PM

Well, I'll settle for the JBL DACS and be happy. ;)

As for sound in the surrounds, it needs to be both localized and not localized, depending simply on the intent of the mix.

JBL 4645

06-16-2009, 10:13 AM

The art or technique after a bit of trail and error was (the spacing of the monopoles along the sidewalls) the cost in the long run was no drearier than pair of dipolar/bipolar surrounds for x10.

Three on each sidewall spaced out.

Centre back a bit tighter closer together for soild centre back without that sodden hole its soild in the middle and to the outer sides.

I think you should first mute LCR/sub bass and just listen to the monaural matrix surrounds from Dolby stereo 4:2:4 mix or DVD that has monaural surrounds there are plenty out there from the 70’s 80’s era only handful was realised with split-surrounds/stereo surrounds.

Also you won’t need the THX turned ON as this eliminates the need. I haven’t used the THX ON for months now, plus you have that annoying hand sawing effect on right surround channel if you play some pink noise all channels and mute LCR you’ll hear it

That Chris guy should be able to get the tone spot on to be within a few 0.5 db or what ever spot on so the hiss from centre matches the hiss or close enough in frequency otherwise too much from centre might mask the surrounds and vice-versa.

The Blues Brothers region 2 DVD mobile as it flies over the bridge has music on the split-surrounds followed by roaring overhead duck! Effect!

What are we doing here?

You promised you’d visit the penguin the day you out.

Yeah. So I lied to her.

You can’t lie to a nun

We gotta go in and visit the penguin.

No fu&king way.:D

Oh, no I thought it was suppose to be five years.
Didn’t you get five years?
No, sir, not you.

Interesting sound fact is the fogy LCR dialogue track on The Blues Brothers Dolby 5.1 mix. It has mildly spill over to left/right but its clearly focused on centre and this type of mix is also found on early Todd-AO The King and I South Pacific The Sound of Music West Side Story soundtracks and newer later few Dolby stereo 70mm like Cocoon Apollo 13 Star Trek II the Wrath of Khan Wargames and a few more.

Come on. Seriously, the food here is really expensive. The soap is f&*_king $10! LOL

We’re on mission from God.:D
How much for the little girl?
What?
The women? How much for the women?
Your woman I want to buy your women.
Your little girl. Your daughters. Sell them to me.
Sell me your children LOL LMAO
Maitre d’!

This film cracks me up!

The fu*^king Nazi party PA horn is heard over LCRS
I hate Illinois Nazis.
LOL

They all jump the bridge LOL we’re gonna kill that son of bitch.

(Ray Charles) chapter 22, Ray’s Music Exchange has nice beat without sub bass extension as the LFE.1 adds its own discrete beat kick.

Twist it shake it, shake it baby.

Chapter 23, The flamethrower was decent enough as the flame licks out from centre with mild left/right then whips over the surround or around my ears makes me flitch. There’s defused and stereo effect happing at the same time.

Hey Jake, there’s got be at least seven dollars change here. WTF! They just got blown up for second time and they don’t bother to ask questions? LOL

To monitor the city, county and state police on their CB’s LOL
Mr Blues is gonna f%^(k up.
And when he does…LOL
He better pray the police get to him before we do.
[Nazis smilling]

Oh, no things are about to get ugly. LOL this films a classic laugh. Can’t say much about the sequel thou it was pants.
The Good old Boys LOL

We're talk to Bob.

Back in 5 minutes!

Chapter 44 the guns cocking along the LCR with a few single cocking sounds on surround left and right. Whoops! Jail House Rock LOL
The discrete isolated instrumental on the split-surrounds beats along with the fogy vocal LCR and the accompanied LFE.1 supports the rest of music nicely to the final end credit role over black.

I’d like to add some LCRS sub bass extension and keep LFE.1 discrete. I need you, you, you!