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Thread: Off Topic Forum

  1. #46
    Senior Member kingjames's Avatar
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    TI-Dome has a way of writing what I'm thinking. I never really could put my feelings into writing ain't sure of the right words.

    Take a look at this thread it has generated more response's then any of the thread's in a lot less time.Seem's popular to me.

    I tried just for my sake to read every post in every thread to see what it's like. I must say I don't know how you moderator's do it. It is very time consuming and not a very likeable job to do. I must hand it to you. I was bored with a lot of the stuff and in those area's I was reading every other 10 words just to get through it. You people have to read everything to make sure the rules are being obey.Man what a job it is indeed and to think you do it on a volunteer basis is even more admirable.

    I don't know why it is so important to keep the world event's out of this forum,it appears to me that these event's are just as imporatnt as JBL. I like to think of the Off Topic area as the area where people exchange idea's in real life with people with the same passion's. This I believe makes it more easy to talk to fellow member's.It is pretty easy to figure out a member's view just by reading his or her's off topic material.

    It's September 11th 2001 and the World Trade Tower's were just hit by airplane's and I can't post this here and let people know in real time.

    The earthquake that just rocked California where JBL'S archives were just lost and can't post that here.

    Tsunami just wiped out over 225.000 people and can't post that here.

    These are all things that have a profound effect on the whole world and just because you can't post these event's here in real time doesn't mean they didn't happen.

    I think people no matter where they are need to be informed and the faster the better in some cases.

    This is not You-tube or the other forum's that where everything goes,this is LHS the foremost authority on anything JBL and it's members do have different views and this is a good thing.

    Off topic area is vital and bears a connection with JBL whether you believe it or not.

    Allow postings of headlines but make the reply's private only. Just a thought. Guess I'll shut up now. Everyone have a nice day and I guess no headline means no sad news.

  2. #47
    Senior Member kingjames's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Audiobeer View Post
    I don't know......I guess I'm one of those people that just has to look at the car wreck even though I know it's awful and could scar my memory for life.
    LHS is not a 2 lane country road where you have no choice put to see what happened in the other lanes instead this is a 4 lane highway where you have the choice to look or not. If you decide to look it is your own fault if you drive the rest of the way with bad feelings.

  3. #48
    Administrator Mr. Widget's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Titanium Dome View Post
    You guys provide a valuable role here without getting much credit, and I thank you for your dedication and contribution. This time I think you missed it.
    I may be wrong, but my recollection is that you have pretty much felt we missed the mark on most of these controversial subjects.

    The fact of the matter is that maybe ten or twenty people (I am probably being very generous here.) are very disappointed in our action. We expected you might be and we respectfully disagree with you. We did not come to this decision lightly and I believe it was a unanimous decision among the moderators to take this tact.

    To those of you who are disappointed in our decision, I am truly sorry. As you undoubtedly must know, I too have enjoyed posting there, however the overall sense of tension and discord that seeped into all of the discussion forums was pretty obvious. We Moderators and Administrators feel that the enjoyment of bashing our favorite political piņatas or other carrying on with our other off topic discussions was simply not worth that level of discord. Feel free to disagree, but try not to validate our decision on this thread.
    Thank you.


    Widget

  4. #49
    Senior Member porschedpm's Avatar
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    I support the moderators' decision to remove the Off Topic Forum. I believe all LH Forum discussions should at least attempt to focus on Lansing and/or audio related topics. After all, the name of the forum IS the Lansing Heritage Forum. If a member wants to share off topic subjects with their Forum buddies, perhaps they should consider using the PM function. Realistically though, OT subjects will still crop up (just like this thread is in Forum Announcements). But I don't believe we need a separate section in the forum that invites OT discussions that too easily turn into heated discussions. In my opinion, the proliferation of these OT threads since the OT Forum was opened up has tended to dilute the focus of the LH Forum. It also makes for a more cluttered Forum, especially when doing a search for new threads or a particular topic. Couple this with other costs in terms of the Moderators limited time and the additional hard drive space, and soon the costs outweigh whatever perceived benefit there might have been for having a separate OT Forum. Keep up the good work, Moderators.

    Ed S.

  5. #50
    RIP 2013 Rolf's Avatar
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    I rest my case in this thread. I have a large wall of stone I must convince to move. This will be easier than getting true here.

  6. #51
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    Nice post Mr. Widget!
    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Widget View Post
    The fact of the matter is that maybe ten or twenty people (I am probably being very generous here.) are very disappointed in our action.
    You are pretty generous...

    I'd recommend looking forward to the proposed site upgrade and hope it actually happens. Don has mentioned significantly expanding the Library on a new test site as well as adding in a number of profiles and the English version of the four Stereo Sound articles on the Everest II.

  7. #52
    Senior Member kingjames's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Widget View Post

    The fact of the matter is that maybe ten or twenty people (I am probably being very generous here.) are very disappointed in our action.
    I will say this is at least 50% percent of the members that have posted more than 10 times.

    There may be quite a few members but if you look at the posting of thread's you will see only a handful that participates.

    DIY has a lot of project's but I keep seeing the same 10 to 20 people all the time.

    More traffic is in the Lansing Marketplace than in the DIY area's.Wonder why?

    You could make this a read only site where the same 10 to 20 people do the posting and everyone else just comes to read. This wouldn't be very human though (not a good idea).

    Out of all the area's on this forum you will find the same names who do most of the posting.

    So, Mr.Widget your number's are quite high if you consider who is doing most of the posting here.

    In this thread I have counted 13 against and 10 for,looks like a little less than 50%. The one's that respond here are as you will find are the same 20 to 30 people who respond all the time. So where do you get your numbers from?

  8. #53
    Senior Member duaneage's Avatar
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    The OT forum was turning into an ugly venue for political discussions where no one wins and no one gives any ground. THere are plenty of websites for that where you can lock antlers with other people, the only difference here was you battled with JBL types and you got to see their speaker posts as well. So the next time someone you argued with in OT posts something audio related, a nasty spat might develop. I won't name anyone, but sniping occurred quite regularly between a few people.

    I dropped more than a few opinions there but it needed to go. It is a Lansing heritage site we are on after all.

  9. #54
    Senior Member kingjames's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by spkrman57 View Post
    I come here for audio only!

    Just my 2 cents worth!

    Ron
    If you come here just for audio then why is the OT area important to you?You're not another one of those that like's looking at car wrecks,are you?

  10. #55
    Dis Member mikebake's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rolf View Post
    In Europe these ways of doing things like this ended in 1989 when the Berlin wall fell apart.
    Well, that kinda cements my opinion on OT; closing it was an excellent idea.

  11. #56
    Senior Member kingjames's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by duaneage View Post
    I won't name anyone, but sniping occurred quite regularly between a few people.
    Then you deal with those few people and don't close the area that had the most following.Too many times have the most suffered because of deed's done by the few.

  12. #57
    Senior Seņor boputnam's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Titanium Dome View Post
    ...it intentionally moved to diversify itself in order to reflect the interests of the members beyond pure Lansing Heritage...
    Uh, no. Actually, OT was created to sweep all the irrelevant rubbish into.

    Quote Originally Posted by Titanium Dome View Post
    For better or worse, this is the form that the community was given, and once given, it should not unilaterally be taken back...
    Doug, this is your weakest argument. We tried it - it did not work here and served to distract and detract, to cause members to fume and led to spats. There were more infractions occuring in OT than anywhere else.

    By your logic one should never try something because there is no chance for reconsideration, no chance to learn and revise a strategy? Nonsense. We learned and revised the structure of LHS toward it's roots.
    bo

    "Indeed, not!!"

  13. #58
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    Quote Originally Posted by kingjames View Post
    There may be quite a few members but if you look at the posting of thread's you will see only a handful that participates.

    DIY has a lot of project's but I keep seeing the same 10 to 20 people all the time.

    More traffic is in the Lansing Marketplace than in the DIY area's.Wonder why?
    DIY has become a joke, as was foreseen by a few astute individuals. A few people took it over and decided that they had all the answers and all the time in the world to dispense those answers. I think maybe 10 to 20 people actually care what gets posted in DIY these days. I've gotten more notes and phone calls of disgust about that section of the forum than even OT. It's a dead issue for me.

    There are a few people who have made this place their pub. My suggestion would be to find another place to hang your hat. Think about opening your own personal website and put all your bullshit on it. That's what other people do. If you don't have the talent to open your own website then pay someone to do it for you. That's what other people do.

    The Marketplace stays because it provides a nice service to those who are serious about their hobby. I think a few more moderators need to be moved to that area though. As Mr. Widget has stated, we aren't in the business of getting to the bottom of shady deals. If you can't use the Marketplace in a reasonably professional manner then you get booted into the ether. Pretty simply concept. It's a resource. Refrain from polluting it.

    This website is used daily by people none of you even know, and you will never know. JBL refers to it all the time. JBL refers their customers to it all the time. Why? Because despite the very best efforts of a few to make it their personal blogfest it still contains a wealth of information for those who come in, get it and leave to go apply it. Most people simply don't have the time or inclination to spend their days hanging around on a website, Lansing Heritage or otherwise. Maybe the lost souls should go find something else to do. Save a whale or write a congressperson or volunteer at a hospice. Send each other emails or call each other on the phone. Forums are terrible for getting points across. As Don as said - based on what alot of these people post - we sure wouldn't want to meet most of them in real life. And that's a fact! Now, most of you are probably just fine in real life but let it be known that you do not come across that way on a forum.



    Also - some of you might think you have "buddies" at certain companies but I encourage you to think again. You might see yourself as a "resource" but others see you as a "time sponge"; Time they really don't have to waste. I really don't know how to put it tactfully so I'll just say - some of you have been making real pests of yourselves at certain companies with your little obsessions... I'd suggest getting over those obsessions.

  14. #59
    Senior Seņor boputnam's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Giskard View Post
    DIY has become a joke, as was foreseen by a few astute individuals. A few people took it over and decided that they had all the answers and all the time in the world to dispense those answers. I think maybe 10 to 20 people actually care what gets posted in DIY these days. I've gotten more notes and phone calls of disgust about that section of the forum than even OT. It's a dead issue for me.

    There are a few people who have made this place their pub. My suggestion would be to find another place to hang your hat. Think about opening your own personal website and put all your bullshit on it. That's what other people do. If you don't have the talent to open your own website then pay someone to do it for you. That's what other people do.

    The Marketplace stays because it provides a nice service to those who are serious about their hobby. I think a few more moderators need to be moved to that area though. As Mr. Widget has stated, we aren't in the business of getting to the bottom of shady deals. If you can't use the Marketplace in a reasonably professional manner then you get booted into the ether. Pretty simply concept. It's a resource. Refrain from polluting it.

    This website is used daily by people none of you even know, and you will never know. JBL refers to it all the time. JBL refers their customers to it all the time. Why? Because despite the very best efforts of a few to make it their personal blogfest it still contains a wealth of information for those who come in, get it and leave to go apply it. Most people simply don't have the time or inclination to spend their days hanging around on a website, Lansing Heritage or otherwise. Maybe the lost souls should go find something else to do. Save a whale or write a congressperson or volunteer at a hospice. Send each other emails or call each other on the phone. Forums are terrible for getting points across. As Don as said - based on what alot of these people post - we sure wouldn't want to meet most of them in real life. And that's a fact! Now, most of you are probably just fine in real life but let it be known that you do not come across that way on a forum.

    Also - some of you might think you have "buddies" at certain companies but I encourage you to think again. You might see yourself as a "resource" but others see you as a "time sponge"; Time they really don't have to waste. I really don't know how to put it tactfully so I'll just say - some of you have been making real pests of yourselves at certain companies with your little obsessions... I'd suggest getting over those obsessions.
    Thanks, Giskard.

    I prepared a lengthy and patient response including much that you posted. Then just before hitting "ALT-S", I got really cross at this whole exchange.

    We labored this for-ever. We - the mods - even fought amongst ourselves over dealings with and within OT. What emerged, clear as a damned bell, was what OT was doing to the perception of LHS, and to interaction in the JBL and JBL-related-thingy forums.

    I remind myself that we anticipated just this sort of backlash, girded for it, and went ahead and did what was best for LHS.
    bo

    "Indeed, not!!"

  15. #60
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    Yeah, I wouldn't have bothered typing it but I had to sit here and wait on other things anyway so what the heck.
    You guys are infinitely more patient than I am with this stuff.

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