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Thread: 4350 Driver Impedance

  1. #1
    Senior Member Woody Banks's Avatar
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    4350 Driver Impedance

    Howdy All
    Are the 2405 & 2440 compression drivers in the 4350 16 ohm. The schematic of the 3107 indicates a 8 ohm load. I am still in the gathering phase of my 4350 hybrid project and would like to at least use the correct diaphragms for the 3107's.

    Woody

  2. #2
    Senior Member Guido's Avatar
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    The 2405(H) measures between 5.7 and 6.7 ohms and is a 8 Ohm Transducer. Doesn't matter what's written on the foilcal.
    Right Dia is D16R2405

    The 2440/2441 measures between 7.3 and 8.6 ohms and is a ~16 Ohm Transducer.
    Edit: Right Dia is D16R2441 (or D16R2440 maybe NLA) = Wrong!
    Right Dia is D16R2440 (D16R2441 not with the 3107)

  3. #3
    Administrator Mr. Widget's Avatar
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    For the 3107 you definitely want the D16R2440 diaphragms... not because of the impedance but for the proper response curve. The 2441 and 2440 drivers/diaphragms are not interchangeable in this design.

    Widget

  4. #4
    Senior Member Guido's Avatar
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    YEP! Widget is right! NOT with this network.

  5. #5
    Senior Member glen's Avatar
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    Will 3107 work with 2445?

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Widget
    For the 3107 you definitely want the D16R2440 diaphragms... not because of the impedance but for the proper response curve. The 2441 and 2440 drivers/diaphragms are not interchangeable in this design.

    Widget
    How will 3107s work with 2445 drivers ?
    I was planning to use these in my own 4350/westlake style system:
    Bass = 2x1601a
    active crossover to:
    Midbass = 2123H
    High = 2445H (with westlake/2397 style horn)
    UHF = 2405

    Need to modify 3107s?
    Start from scratch?
    glen

    "Make it sound like dinosaurs eating cars"
    - Nick Lowe, while producing Elvis Costello

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  7. #7
    Senior Member glen's Avatar
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    How about these?

    Quote Originally Posted by 10 Watt Street
    That's pretty close to what I was envisioning, too bad I've already gotten all my drivers together.
    Don't have the horns (that he's not including).
    Maybe I should look into the sierra audio monitors for reference though, thanks for the tip.
    glen

    "Make it sound like dinosaurs eating cars"
    - Nick Lowe, while producing Elvis Costello

  8. #8
    Administrator Mr. Widget's Avatar
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    You should pick option B

    Quote Originally Posted by glen
    How will 3107s work with 2445 drivers ?
    I was planning to use these in my own 4350/westlake style system:
    Bass = 2x1601a
    active crossover to:
    Midbass = 2123H
    High = 2445H (with westlake/2397 style horn)
    UHF = 2405

    Need to modify 3107s?
    Start from scratch?
    Start from scratch.... it is your best option since the only thing your system will have in common with a 4350 is the slot tweeter.


    Widget

  9. #9
    Senior Member Woody Banks's Avatar
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    It seems like the 3107 is going to be the Achilles heel of this whole project. I will put those puppies on epay and purchase active crossovers to relpace them after I complete my gathering process.
    To date I have (4) 2230A's , (2) 2202A's and a pair of Westlake style wooden horns (60% complete). I also picked up a pair of ME 120HS drivers from Mr. Bluster that I want to use instead of the 2202A's. The 2202A's are a lot like me: gray and tired looking! The ME 120's should kick some serious ass! If indecision killed, I would have been dead a long time ago.
    Mr. Widget's project has inspired me to do a column with curved sides instead of the original wife haters.
    Thanks for the help on my crusade.
    Woody


  10. #10
    Senior Member Guido's Avatar
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    I don't think those ME120's will kick more ass than the 2202.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Woody Banks
    snip:....'Mr. Widget's project has inspired me to do a column with curved sides instead of the original wife haters.' Woody
    I dreamed up a four way project that sounds somewhat similar. Where is this thread??

    It's based on a 4350 driver array (with a cd substitution). I was thinking of tracing the shape (smith horn curve) from a "top view" perspective onto multiple pieces of plywood(think many 3/4" horizontal cross sections until tall enough). Smith horn curve on the front baffle, straight sides and recess for a screw in rear baffle. Then assemble pieces with glue/clamp/screw until I have a front baffle that mimics the smith horn shape. In decending order (top to bottom): A 2405 slot on top, the smith (resting in a contoured cubby), 2202H midrange below the smith (heavily chamfered to eliminate deflections), and a 2235H side firing sub. A 3107 network modified to accomodate a 2435HPL CD (eventually- custom active crossovers). Lots of shaping/smoothing and a laquer finish. Steamed bentwood frame for the grill cloth.
    Any LH members used similar build technique to this? I'd like to hear any supporting or objective arguements.

  12. #12
    Administrator Robh3606's Avatar
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    "I was thinking of tracing the shape (smith horn curve) from a "top view" perspective onto multiple pieces of mdf (think many 3/4" horizontal cross sections until tall enough). Smith horn curve on the front baffle, straight sides and recess for a screw in rear baffle."

    The stacked and routed sections you describe is how the the TAD SOTA speaker enclosures are done. CNC routed glued with rods like alignment pins if I remember right. Very expensive way to go though. Just do a basic layout on a 4X8 and you will go through lots of them to get the height with lot's of waste as well. It certainly has advantages as you can contour to get damn near any shape you want. Try a search for TAD forget the speaker model number.

    Rob

  13. #13
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    [QUOTE=Robh3606The stacked and routed sections you describe is how the the TAD SOTA speaker enclosures are done. CNC routed glued with rods like alignment pins if I remember right. Rob[/QUOTE]

    RATS!
    As humanity ages- our collective ideas are becoming realized. As a result- there seem to be fewer and fewer original ideas left in the world these days.
    Well, at least I know my concept has some merit...
    Thank you!

  14. #14
    Administrator Mr. Widget's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Robh3606
    The stacked and routed sections you describe is how the the TAD SOTA speaker enclosures are done. CNC routed glued with rods like alignment pins if I remember right. Very expensive way to go though. Just do a basic layout on a 4X8 and you will go through lots of them to get the height with lot's of waste as well. It certainly has advantages as you can contour to get damn near any shape you want. Try a search for TAD forget the speaker model number.
    For anyone considering this approach... the folks at TAD have had so many production problems with this technique, that they came out with an alternate lower cost design that did not require this technique. Fabrication isn't the main problem, it is what happens at all those glue joints as the wood naturally expands and contracts.


    Widget

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Widget
    snip'....it is what happens at all those glue joints as the wood naturally expands and contracts.'
    Widget
    Thank you Mr Widget; Excellent information, as usual.
    I'm planning a scaled down model in reinforced cardboard
    I wonder if threaded rods (running vertical) bolted with threadlock would help? Those same rods could be extended on the bottom to create spiked feet. In addition- I could slap a few thin sheets of liquid fiberglass reinforcement to the outside- forming a skin to hold the joints secure (a $50 cost). I'm not bound by the large scale manufacturing roadblocks that TAD must have encountered. Look at the complexity of that design!!!




    My concept is far more primitive by comparison.
    I already have a stack of 20+ sheets of 3/4" marine grade plywood just sitting (home reno project never realized). That should give me a good $$ headstart. I love the 2397- but I cringe at the deflections- evident when perched atop a square cabinet. Also, the deflections evident by the radius protruding from a flat baffle. I'm currently obsessed with finding an ideal, contoured front baffle technique...
    People must think I'm nuts for taking on such a huge project, and my wife would agree. But consider this: The 4350 is a given performer. That is a non variable. A few simple tweaks and a far superior cabinet design- I think it's worth the effort. I may end up with something better- maybe worse. I can always re-use the drivers!

    The 4350/3107/M552 might work for this configuration initially, but it's obvious that I'll have to rework it all to correct for the 2435. That should be fun...()


    The more I incorporate my architectural education into audio- the more I see the K2 (9800) as an ideal enclosure. JBL really burned pencils on that one!!

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