Hi Riessen-

I think the vintage Marantz receivers/amps sound way better than most Pioneers from the same period. In fact, a few select models of Marantz amps are stellar! I (IMHO) don't think vintage Pioneers are the same caliber.

I also think McIntosh made a few bad amps, too. They also made excellent ones, of course. Like Widget says- you get some stinkers.

As far as there being value left in vintage Pioneer receivers- I agree (somewhat). If for anything else- they did have excellent tuners! I just wouldn't settle for one in my main system when for the same money (under $300) you can do a LOT better. For those people that swear by those older Pioneers- I wonder how many other amps they have listened to in a side by side comparison. (??)