Horn system pictures

[Mr. Widget]

Four months to build a pair of those Magico midbass horns? That's either bullshit or somebody doesn't know what they're doing.

...or they're getting paid by the hour.


Widget

[Steve Schell]

Well, I have to agree with Hoerninger in that the use of a direct radiator woofer seems an odd choice in an otherwise cost no object horn system. I have not heard the Ultimate, but everything in my past experience leads me to suspect that that woofer will not do the job that a good horn subwoofer would do. A horn sub is large, but not unreasonably so in the context of a system like that. The ones I have built have a footprint of about 2' by 8'.

I did enjoy speaking with Alon Wolf in Las Vegas this past January, and I really admire his pursuit of perfection. His Mini speakers (two ways) sounded as good as any speaker of that type that I've heard. Their build quality was spectacular as well.

[jack_bouska]

Hi Jack,

You have done some really fine work! I am impressed both by your logical approach to the design and the excellent execution of the many fine details; DIY at its best; you are a true craftsman.

You might consider posting some pictures of your project over on the Audio Asylum High Efficiency Speakers Forum. There have been several threads on the oblate spheroid waveguide there in the past, and Dr. Geddes has participated in these. You might want to do a search there for Dr. Geddes' past posts, as he has gone into considerable detail in explaining these waveguides.

http://www.audioasylum.com/forums/HUG/bbs.html

Steve - thanks for reminding me to review the Audio Asylum High Efficiency Speakers Forum - I started visiting that forum in late 2004, about the time Duke enticed Earl Geddes to start contributing. - I read most of Earls posts from late 04 into 05, but I have been so busy with work, family, and getting my own system completed, that I have not remained active in the forum (I was always only a lurker anyway).
A quick search/review of the recent archives reveals that Earl has remained active, and that I do have a lot of catching up to do - obviously many gem's of knowledge awaiting there for me to retrieve, I just need the spare time…..
I would consider posting a selection of images and measurements on the Audio Asylum forum, however the interfaces I have seen so far all appear to be ASCII only (unlike Lansing heritage forums, with imbedded image capability). Is it possible to post images inline with the text? The only other place I have seen for images would be in the user gallery.
Regardless, thanks for the tip, and as an aside, I'll mention (again) that I have started a new thread on the oblate spheroid waveguides, with loads more graphs and measurements, along with some descriptive analysis of the curves.
DIY Axially symmetric oblate spheroid CD waveguides, in solid Oak
full thread at:
< http://www.audioheritage.org/vbullet...390#post123390 >
Jack Bouska

[Woofer]

Nice low-impedance LP (recording series?) poster.

je

Yes, it is a good poster but when I found it, the snails had got to it, and someone had it all laminated, holes'n all. Still looks good though.
I'm embarrassed to say, that if you look slightly left past the L40 box and just barely visible alongside the partly covered Turbosound banner is the neck of a real Cherry 59 Les Paul Jr. barely sticking up through the pile of .... well for want of a better word, stuff.
Obviously, I don't play it much anymore!
Oops! Getting off topic again. Sorry all.

[JoshK]

First post on this forum.....just had to comment on Jack B's system. A member of another forum I participate on pointed these out. Excellent work!

I am venturing down a somewhat similar path, at least in some respects. I recently picked up a pair of JBL 2123H's, a quad of Lambda TD15x's and a pair of DDS ENG 1-90 waveguides (with the intention of using BMS 4552NDs probably). I have visited Dr. Geddes's home in Michigan when I was out there and was really impressed with both his research and his work in action.

I don't know the details of how it will shape up, I have some other unfinished projects to finish like my 6 channels of amplification (I am using a DEQX).

I'd love to see some more details about how you spun your waveguides. I don't currently have a lathe but was considering adding one to my woodshop. How did you manage to get the profile just right?

[jack_bouska]

First post on this forum.....I'd love to see some more details about how you spun your waveguides. I don't currently have a lathe but was considering adding one to my woodshop. How did you manage to get the profile just right?

Technique for turning waveguides or circular axially symmetric horns on a lathe is the same for any type of template driven wood turning.
1) mount stock and shape to circular
2) rough out outside and inside shape
3) a) stop the lathe,
b) move tool rest,
c) insert template and
d) judge where to remove stock
e) you can mark areas with pencil, by holding against stock and turning by hand
4) repeat steps in 3 until very close to final shape, then carfully sand to exact template match.

see some of John W's posts for more information, he is a much more skilled turner than I will ever be.
http://www.audioheritage.org/vbullet...ad.php?t=12671

Jack (living/working in Muscat Oman now)

[JBL 4645]

Quote



"In the late 1920s, cinema audio playback was dismal. Western Electric had a single driver on a large re-entrant horn. It didn’t sound very good, even after the company added a separate HF unit and extra 18-inch woofers. RCA’s competing system was no better.

Dissatisfied with these bulky, 5kHz bandwidth systems, MGM’s sound department head, Douglas Shearer, set out to create something better. Shearer asked John Hilliard to head the team, with Robert Stephens and Harry Kimball. Consultant John Blackburn suggested using James B. Lansing’s new high-performance components. Essentially, Shearer created a dream team with some of the best minds in audio. Other ideas came from William Snow, who worked with Harvey Fletcher at Bell Labs, and RCA’s John Volkmann and Harry Olson.

Known as the Shearer Horn, the two-way system had a large multicell horn coupled to Lansing’s new 284 compression drivers. One or more “W” bin folded horns loaded with two 15-inch Lansing woofers handled LF. On its debut, the Shearer Horn was a near-instant success, offering high-SPL/high-fidelity performance from a package that could be easily shipped and installed. Thousands of Shearer-style systems (from a variety of suppliers) were in theaters everywhere, and the system received a Technical Academy Award in 1936.

The Shearer Horn began the age of modern sound systems. Equally significant was its role in launching an entire industry of pro audio with an awareness for fidelity. The system’s lifespan was cut short by Altec A-4 Voice of the Theatre models in the mid-1940s (designed by Hilliard and Lansing), but innovations such as the “W” bin design stayed in use for another half-century."

[Steve Schell]

My Cogent Loudspeakers partner Rich Drysdale and myself helped to install and voice a custom horn system recently. The horns were built by metal worker extraordinaire Josh Stippich of Electronluv. Cogent supplied the midrange and bass compression drivers. Chris Brady of Teres Audio built the passive crossovers and was on hand to help finish things up. The plasma tweeters were built by Acapella in Germany. An Edgarhorn Seismic Subwoofer provided the lows below 60Hz.

That's yours truly in the third picture, and I'm 6'2". The tops of the bass drivers are almost 10' above the floor. A large architecture horn system like this can provide a stunningly natural, effortless reproduction of recorded events. Such a system doesn't have to be quite so huge and over-the-top design wise to be effective... of course it doesn't hurt either!

[grumpy]

gotta feel good to get those babies singing! Nice work, Steve. -grumpy

[Woofer]

I personally feel these should come under the heading of 'Weapons of Mass Destruction"
I know I'm devastated now in knowing that I could never reach such a state of Nirvana by owning anything as awesome as this.
Oh well.....

[Hoerninger]

I personally feel these should come under the heading of 'Weapons of Mass Destruction"

With this association you should have a look here:
http://audioheritage.org/vbulletin/s...66&postcount=6

I would very much like to listen to the horn system Steve has described. There is no reason to drive the amps to their limits.
___________
Peter

[Woofer]

With this association you should have a look here:
http://audioheritage.org/vbulletin/s...66&postcount=6

I would very much like to listen to the horn system Steve has described. There is no reason to drive the amps to their limits.
___________
Peter

Speechless.......

[sourceoneaudio]

That falls in the category of, HOLY BAT CRAP BATMAN!


Very nice indeed...............!

[glen]

The tops of the bass drivers are almost 10' above the floor.

Big, Beautiful Beasts
What's powering them?

[cvengr]

The tops of the bass drivers are almost 10' above the floor.

I'm in the middle of building some 4350 variants. I've tuned the cabinets lower making them about 23 inches deep instead of 18 in.

I don't have 2311 horns, but have a pair of 2390s with hartsfield lenses. Since the geometry of the 4350 baffle doesn't allow that lense, I've taken the baffles, and am considering rotating them 90 degrees, with 2235s closer together on the bottom, 2202 sealed in a box above them, close to them, and the 2240 with 2390 above, all using the same dimensions on the 4350 baffle.

Now here's my question.

Obviously in your arrangement, the voice coils of bass driver, and compression drivers are not on the same plane to produce a wavefront which is in phase upon emission from the speaker system.

With the 2390s, (Hartsfield horn and lense) my voice coils on the 2440 2" compression drivers are roughly a foot further from the baffle than the 2235/2202 voice coils.

Am I close enough to matching them in one plane, ala the 4430s, to warrant the extra effort in structurally supporting the horn in front of the baffle to improve sound stage and phasing?... or is that an obscure enough point which really isn't perceived?

I also have a pair of 2350s with adapters, for the 2440s, but those would extend out another foot to 15". Any tips are appreciated.

On a separate note, how have you found the best way to wire them up?
Short conductors to power amps then XLR back to source.