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Thread: carver holographic pre and 434x

  1. #1
    Senior Member gerard's Avatar
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    carver holographic pre and 434x

    I purchase a carver c1 holograhic preamplifier last month and decide try it with my 434x clones .

    My actual preamp is a french brand quiet unknown ; preamp is very detailed and analytic as some would like on a studio monitor speaker .

    Changing with The carver C1 gave me less dynamic and less stronger bass but improved a lot the soundstage .

    With many instruments or lot of people playing , I felt sometimes that each 434x was playing alone but with the holographic C1 working I am able to get a very very nice soundstage ; also the treble uhf is much present and dynamic ! .

    I would like to have some comments and share this experience .

    gerard

  2. #2
    Senior Member Steve Schell's Avatar
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    I once owned a Carver Sonic Hologram Generator, the stand alone unit. As I recall, the circuit cross feeds some signal into the opposite channel, reversed in polarity and delayed by the transit time between our two ears. The goal is to cancel out the sound of the left speaker reaching the right ear, and vise versa. It seemed to work fairly well with some speakers and some program material, but created a phasey, processed sound much of the time. It would be fun to try one again, as my speakers now are better than way back then- ears are probably worse, though.

  3. #3
    Senior Member Flodstroem's Avatar
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    I have purchased a Carver C1 to

    Hi gerard

    I bought one C-1 on eBay last year. It was a model that was only for 115V mains voltage and I had to change the power transformer to one for 230V mains (the old one was not switchable).

    Because of that I havnt listen to it yet, unfortunately.

    My main reason for buying that amp was in the first stage to get a good locking cabinet where I could put my own pre-amp into.

    When considering the original holographic generator I have decided to keep it and include it in the project (except for all old electrolytic caps, they will be changed to new ones, and maybe the IC amps to).

    The main project with the Carver is to change the power supply to a new one that is quiet and hum/noise-free and skip the small power amp. Then I shall mount a new phono-correction/MC pre-pre amp (class-A) and a new line output amp (also class-A, balanced + XLR).

    I will let you know when it is finished and how it sounds (but, I dont know how the originals sound), so, I cant do any comparisons between them

    Please let me know if you have any project going on for your Carver (if you have one), it could be fun to know if there is other members who have done improvements to the Carver C-1 pre amp.

    Regards
    Flodstroem

  4. #4
    Senior Member gerard's Avatar
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    Hi Flodstroem

    I bought my c1 in115 vac and use a 220 vac external tranformer .

    Of course I am very interested by your project change except there are a lot of caps and do not know how much I or you will spend for it !

    the sound of the C1 is average when listening normally , do not ask for precise and analytic or very strong bass ; but when you use the holographic , this is an other toy !!! specially with Cd .
    I listen mostly Jazz music and it needs a lot of presence for the Uhf with the cymbals and really you get an other dimension with the holography .
    it is a nice toy you have to use considering what you do .

    Also as I said my 434x are beautiful speakers but may be because they are Studio Monitor they do not have the soundstage and deep image soemone would like ( May be I am wrong but this is how I feel ) i recently listen to thiele speaker and I found them with too much coloration but a very very nice soundstage . ( I also ust consider I use it at home and have very bad reflections or too much - painted wall - marble etc ... )

    With the holography , my 434x are very nice when playing many instruments , I loose in anayltic but get a lot in 3 D ....

    First I intended to use the c1 with my 250Ti clone I am finishing but i might keep it for the 434x .

    Would like to know also experience with the 4000 and sunfire tube preamplifier , may be not holographic but tehre might be something like on the set up ????.

    Gerard

  5. #5
    Super Moderator jblnut's Avatar
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    I had a C1 a few years back that I used with my (then) L250's. I found it a nice, clean preamp and I really enjoyed the holo circuit. The MC phono section though was a bit noisy and I eventually sold it to buy a vintage Luxman. I think the C1 is a hell of a bargain if you're just moving into separates. It's very flexible with inputs and has decent tone controls. The best part is that they are on ebay all the time right around $100.

    I am still on the lookout for the ultimate Carver preamp -the tube hybrid C19. That one is a keeper...

    jblnut


    Quote Originally Posted by gerard
    I purchase a carver c1 holograhic preamplifier last month and decide try it with my 434x clones .

    My actual preamp is a french brand quiet unknown ; preamp is very detailed and analytic as some would like on a studio monitor speaker .

    Changing with The carver C1 gave me less dynamic and less stronger bass but improved a lot the soundstage .

    With many instruments or lot of people playing , I felt sometimes that each 434x was playing alone but with the holographic C1 working I am able to get a very very nice soundstage ; also the treble uhf is much present and dynamic ! .

    I would like to have some comments and share this experience .

    gerard

  6. #6
    Senior Member gerard's Avatar
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    Hello


    Jblnut ; do you have any pic or info on the C19 .
    I did not find anything on the web .

    Gerard

  7. #7
    Super Moderator jblnut's Avatar
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    The C19 was perhaps the last real innovation from Carver while he still ran the company of the same name. It came out in the early 90's just before he sold the company. It was a giant-killer preamp that used a real tube front-end. It got some great reviews and it sold for $1200. They sell periodically on ebay for $400-700 and one of these days I'm going to buy one...just to hear what the fuss was all about. I'm a bit of a classic Carver fan and this was his best preamp.

    jblnut


    Quote Originally Posted by gerard
    Hello


    Jblnut ; do you have any pic or info on the C19 .
    I did not find anything on the web .

    Gerard

  8. #8
    Senior Member gerard's Avatar
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    For 400 - 500 $ you can get a minimax or a dodd tube preamplifier ( looks nice !!) .
    Don't you think it should work better than a c19 ?.

    I don't have a tube preamplifier but I am afraid to buy a second hand one , I am not confident with tubes !

    Gerard

  9. #9
    Super Moderator jblnut's Avatar
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    Carver figured that out - they run at very low level and will supposedly last much longer that comparable tube amps. Like him or hate him, he did have some very novel and useful ideas for audio. He put tubes into several CD players to try and "soften" the sound that characterized the D/A sections of the day. By most accounts it worked so it was no surprise to see him come up with a tube preamp a few years later.

    I've never heard of the brands you mentioned - they must be more common in Europe than the US.

    jblnut


    Quote Originally Posted by gerard
    For 400 - 500 $ you can get a minimax or a dodd tube preamplifier ( looks nice !!) .
    Don't you think it should work better than a c19 ?.

    I don't have a tube preamplifier but I am afraid to buy a second hand one , I am not confident with tubes !

    Gerard

  10. #10
    Senior Member gerard's Avatar
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    Hi


    Dodd is purely Us brand :

    http://www.doddaudio.biz/products/elp.asp

    Eastern minimax is chinese and imported in Us ( only importer worldwide I believe )

    http://www.soundstage.com/revequip/e...ic_minimax.htm

    Gerard

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