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  1. #76
    Senior Moment Member Oldmics's Avatar
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    Cool !!!!!!!!!!! Speaker Origami

  2. #77
    Moderator / Treasurer/Marketplace Czar boputnam's Avatar
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    Hell - that last one looks like the Flying Nun doing a phaser scan...

    Good one, Zilch!
    bo

    "Indeed, not!!"

  3. #78
    RIP 2011 Zilch's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by boputnam
    Hell - that last one looks like the Flying Nun doing a phaser scan...
    Heh. I was gonna expedite the process with a Chinese takeout container.

    [Angles were wrong, tho.... ]

  4. #79
    Senior Member JuniorJBL's Avatar
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    Awesome!

    That is cool .

    I am going to get the dimensions in the next day or so.

    Thumbs to the Zilchster

  5. #80
    Senior Member Akira's Avatar
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    i like the three cab solution the best. the key is, you are always stuck with that covered buttress that hides the speakers, making it impossible to setup the perfect splayed cluster. i think that is the main impediment to this install and the source of your problems. my guess is that the room doesn't sound that bad. is there a balcony in the rear center? what is the distance from stage to back wall? this is where the 4th cab could work well. in a 3 cab solution i feel that all speakers should be vertically aligned with horn down.
    installation is mostly common sense. when you look at the paper design it all comes together--three sided overhang...three acoustic sources. a very simple solution has now eliminated the biggest obstacle.
    it kind of gets you scratching your head thinking, "why didn't i think of that?"
    hat's off to you zilch.

  6. #81
    Senior Member JuniorJBL's Avatar
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    Design

    There is no balcony in the rear. The stage is about 30' deep with seating for the choir. We are also working on deadening the stage area to deal with feedback issues.

    It does appear that the 3 cab solution would be the best .

    We shall from this point on call this "Zilchster mode"
    Unless someone has a better name, Zilch?

  7. #82
    Senior Member Lancer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zilch
    Zilch only does "Quick and Dirty."
    Yes. Please work on rectifying that. Altec and JBL aren't based on Quick and Dirty. You've done a great job reading up on everything I've posted the past five years. Drop the "quick and dirty", increase attention to detail, round out your data acquisition gear and I think you'll pretty much have it.

    Thanks

  8. #83
    RIP 2011 Zilch's Avatar
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  9. #84
    RIP 2011 Zilch's Avatar
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    I believe a four-cab solution can also be found that will fit within the screened buttress and may provide better (wider) coverage at the sides, but it'll require re-aiming of all of the cabinets.

    Once Shane makes his more accurate model, he'll be able to see by moving his triangles to the various likely locations, including clustered pairs at the corners.

    See top of P.5 here, but using only two cabs, for example:

    http://www.jblpro.com/pub/install/V_SP_Array_guide.pdf

    He also has the 40° horizontal, 60° vertical option still available.

    The present alignments seem to keep the direct field well off the stage. I'd guess the feedback problem is coming from side or rear-wall reflections....

  10. #85
    Senior Member JuniorJBL's Avatar
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    Feedback

    Quote Originally Posted by Zilch

    The present alignments seem to keep the direct field well off the stage. I'd guess the feedback is coming from side or rear-wall reflections....
    Also comes from loud monitors.
    The people who play are kind-of do it my way ore I cant do it. They like to have monitors so loud that they hear themselves like singing to the car radio when you drive down the road.
    No experiance here

    We also have a full Shure wireless headset system and not many want to use it.

  11. #86
    RIP 2011 Zilch's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JuniorJBL
    Also comes from loud monitors.
    Use a multi-channel dynamic feedback destroyer.

    That'll fix 'em....

  12. #87
    Moderator / Treasurer/Marketplace Czar boputnam's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JuniorJBL
    Also comes from loud monitors. ... They like to have monitors so loud
    Close to Zilch, but more hands-on: Have you EQ'd the monitor feeds as best you can? I mean REALLY rung them bastards out until the troublesome frequencies are not so excited and your GBF is increased substantially?

    Either do it the old fashioned way, or run them through that dbx 260, get a curve, and pose it onto your monitor graphic(?) EQ's. Be harsh, man - and NOTCH!! DO NOT BOOST - this is a source of much of your trouble. Us SR guys know...
    bo

    "Indeed, not!!"

  13. #88
    RIP 2011 Zilch's Avatar
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    Interesting. Same system in slightly different cabs for different purposes:

    http://cgi.ebay.com/JBL-VS3115-SR473...QQcmdZViewItem

    SR4735X (left) and VS3115:
    Attached Images Attached Images   
    Last edited by Zilch; 11-10-2005 at 11:50 PM. Reason: Corrected cab ID. I know nothing....

  14. #89
    Moderator / Treasurer/Marketplace Czar boputnam's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zilch
    Interesting. Same system in slightly different cabs for different purposes:
    Hey, Shane...

    Looking at them cab's, when/if you get one on ground level for any period of time, you should collect some time-alignment measurements. Since you're running them bi-amped, you have a chance to improve the coherence, if needed.
    bo

    "Indeed, not!!"

  15. #90
    Senior Member JuniorJBL's Avatar
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    Monitors

    Quote Originally Posted by boputnam
    Close to Zilch, but more hands-on: Have you EQ'd the monitor feeds as best you can? I mean REALLY rung them bastards out until the troublesome frequencies are not so excited and your GBF is increased substantially?

    Either do it the old fashioned way, or run them through that dbx 260, get a curve, and pose it onto your monitor graphic(?) EQ's. Be harsh, man - and NOTCH!! DO NOT BOOST - this is a source of much of your trouble. Us SR guys know...
    I have rung them out but I have not used the driverack that is a good idea.
    I have 2 DBX 1/3 octave graphics.(2 monitor channels) And yes always cut cut cut!

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