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Thread: L166 Horizon restored - but some questions left

  1. #1
    Senior Member Fangio's Avatar
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    L166 Horizon restored - but some questions left

    Hello guys,

    funny, just read a thread that could have me who started it... ok here's the next newbie who just entered the forum now, after reading a bit here and there recently. For sure a fantastic source for JBL enthusiasts, and i can say i am one, since the 70s too. So be warned, my 1st post will be a bit longer.

    In 1977 (as an 18 years old) i sold my first real worthfull speakers, two Bose 901 to my brother (he still has them). I was dreaming of a pair of L65 or studio monitors at that time too, but also couldn't afford them and purchased a set of L166 Horizon from a friend who had them only half a year. They came out of the legendary PX-shop for members of the US army here in Berlins Clayallee, where normal natives didn't have access usually and were loaded with 122A, LE5-8 and 066 each. Serial numbers are 19474 and 19629.

    At that time they were taken to several parties to be responsible for the music, and the cabinets suffered a bit. These elder signs of wear they had all the time until presence, when a refoaming of the woofers became neccessary. I've had that done recently by a local specialist, he did a good job, replaced the midtone calottes which were damaged by my little cousin a few years ago and refoamed the subwoofers. But a little surprise was the way he glued the foam surrounds to the cone of the subwoofers. You can see it here (left/right column is before/after):

    http://www.iworld.de/homes/fj/horizon/

    So, i have some questions to the pro's here and would appreciate any hints a lot:

    - does this harm the acoustics in any way (beside the fact it wasn't optically welcome)
    - is it true that glueing them behind the cone is a much more tricky procedure (the guy does this as professional since 20 years but isn't a JBL specialist, although he should have seen how they were originally)
    - is there a way to redo it, or too late
    - would you say i could live with that, or is that not acceptable, and has this to be redone. In last case i would need new cones?
    - what else could be done, to make them even better (LE5-8s are a bit faded, huh)
    - also more general L166 classifications inside of the JBL spectrum would be great, or simply opinions about them .

    Anyway, i really like how they sound again now. No difference in my ears, its more a question of originality, and acceptable tolerance.

    Also a furniture restaurator did an overhaul of the cabinets. Better than new, with only minimal visible marks left, and a silk glance they never had before. I also have the grills and badges of cause, and will publish more and better pictures later if anyone is interested.

    English is my 2nd language, please forgive me when it sounds poor.
    Many thanks in advance,
    F.

    Ah, i forgot: the L166 are hooked up to an onkyo receiver from nowadays usually, but right now i listen to them connected to my vintage marantz 4270 again, which i've also revived, a few days ago. Was sitting 10 years in the cellar but still works perfect.. still a nice combination in my eyes.

  2. #2
    Senior Member Don C's Avatar
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    As you know, the best way is to put the foam behind the cone.
    But I have seen at least one case where JBL themselves varied the foam position, I have two LE-14A. One has grey foam mounted behind the cone, the other has its original Lans-aloy in front of the cone.
    I also had two LE14H-1s, both had been refoamed with the foam in front of the cone. I never liked that, but they sounded fantastic, so I never changed them.
    So perhaps if JBL could allow variation in the position, we can grumble, but accept either position as well. As long as it sounds OK.

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fangio
    - does this harm the acoustics in any way (beside the fact it wasn't optically welcome)
    It could conceivably make a minute difference, but if so, the difference would be so small that it probably would require test equipment to tell.
    - is it true that glueing them behind the cone is a much more tricky procedure (the guy does this as professional since 20 years but isn't a JBL specialist, although he should have seen how they were originally)
    Yes, it is more work to correctly glue the foam on back. It's too bad so many people take the easy way out...
    - is there a way to redo it, or too late
    The results would probably be too messy if you tried to redo them.
    - would you say i could live with that, or is that not acceptable, and has this to be redone. In last case i would need new cones?
    I would definitely just live with it. I really think you'll notice no difference in sound at all. Maybe sometime in the future, a complete recone may be in order, but until then, I think you'll find they're fine.

    John

  4. #4
    RIP 2011 Zilch's Avatar
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    Your L166's are beautifully restored.

    The location of the foam seems largely an aesthetic issue, not performance. They look just fine to me.

    In another 25 years, you can have the surrounds redone, maybe.

    Calotte: a small, brimless cap.

    You've taught ME some English here today. A nice word, that....

  5. #5
    RIP 2013 Rolf's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fangio
    Hello guys,

    In 1977 (as an 18 years old) i sold my first real worthfull speakers, two Bose 901 to my brother (he still has them).
    Yes, I remember them. Good, if installed correctly.

    Quote Originally Posted by Fangio

    At that time they were taken to several parties to be responsible for the music, and the cabinets suffered a bit. before/after):

    http://www.iworld.de/homes/fj/horizon/
    I also remember bringing my 4333A's to A LOT of partys in the 70's.

    Looks like a really good job has been done with your speakers. ENJOY E'm

    Rolf

  6. #6
    Senior Member Guido's Avatar
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    Good Job

  7. #7
    Senior Member Fangio's Avatar
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    First, i'd like to thank all those who answered, for the reassurance and also for some warm applause. Just great

    So fortunately the result is ok, or bearable, in more critical eyes. i was looking for some other 122A already, but seems they are pretty rare on ebay. Interesting is the fact that Harman Germany as distributor offered me a complete reconing for the woofers and midranges - for around 400€+ i could have had them done like new, only the bare metal chassis would have survived. So its not true that JBL isn't delivering these parts anymore, although i've heard that from some other reconers. But pricing is similar to Mercedes in the car market..

    As i've seen there are several ppl who offer refoaming kits on ebay too: is this guy known here, and are his kits recommended, or not:

    http://cgi.ebay.com/BEST-Speaker-Foa...QQcmdZViewItem

    Thanks.

    One more thing: the feedback here has encouraged me to add some more pictures, as promised: http://www.iworld.de/homes/fj/l166_horizon/

    Hope you like them. To be honest iPhoto did most of the job, but in case the admins here think one or two might be good enough to add them to the gallery, just let me know.
    Cheers, F.

  8. #8
    RickL166
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    You've done a fantastic job of restoring those Horizons. The L166s are classics and are still my favorite JBL bookshelf speaker, ever!!

  9. #9
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    Thumbs up good job!

    Very nice recovery of classic speakers. Well done.

    iPhoto is pretty capable for free. I use it all the time, only resorting to PhotoShop when major work is needed.
    Out.

  10. #10
    Regis
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    You should be proud of the great job you did restoring those speakers! I liked the composition of the shots, with the before/after side-by-side view. Many of us, would've saved time and performed similiar processes at the same time on both speakers, so it's rare to get pictures like this (...at least in my limited JBL experience, thank you). Very, very nice and I hope you like them better than the 901's!

  11. #11
    Member Jakeisuseless's Avatar
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    Man, I wish mine were that pretty....
    Excuse my ignorance.

  12. #12
    maggnepan
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    thank yiou for the very nice photos...now for the answer to one of your questions: The horizons were jbls most accurate bookshelve speaker ever and were designed to be very flat in freq response. They put in a radical for the era dome tweeter said to have the widest bandwidth of any jbl high freq driver. The speaker was more linear than any other bookshelve jbl, but at a price: it is not as efficient in db as the other jbls, and is notorius for being able to gulp down lots of transistor watts and not sound compressed in any way. they were very well received by jbl dealers and the public both. for best sound all the controls should be set at flat, and the grills removed for best sound and theyi soud best on stands at least 24 inchs off the floor and that really opens up the sounds and lets the woofer sound flat and deep...and deep it can sound...better deep bass even that the L65 you mentioned....they are very detailed sounding and were regularlly displayed in the dealer stores and the most natural sounding jbl along with the L300s....enjoyl,,,,i have 2 pair and are my fave bookshelve jbl......

  13. #13
    Senior Member Fangio's Avatar
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    thats Rick Cobb, and after spending more time reading older threads in this forum, i've found out his work is appreciated.

    Again guys, i have to thank YOU. The feedback here is really more than expected, and makes me a bit proud indeed. As mentioned in an other thread recently, it's good to know where to share this passion, very enjoyable. A bit sad that i saw the knowhow some days too late, to order the correct way refoaming the woofers, after all these years i had the speakers.

    all the controls should be set at flat, and the grills removed for best sound
    my experience too, the grilles were mostly not installed, and thats probably the reason why the LE5-8s have suffered a bit. It have always been sunny postions where they were.

    they sound best on stands at least 24 inchs off the floor and that really opens up the sounds and lets the woofer sound flat and deep...and deep it can sound...better deep bass even that the L65 you mentioned....they are very detailed sounding and were regularlly displayed in the dealer stores and the most natural sounding jbl along with the L300s...
    woohoo, really? Hmm, bigger cabinets.. size doesn't matter? Maybe not all L65 owners will agree...
    About the standing – very interesting. I'll check that out this weekend.

  14. #14
    Senior Member briang's Avatar
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    Well done!

    Superbly restored. Thanks for keeping the L166s alive. They really do look fantastic.
    Paying debt to Karma...

  15. #15
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    Hey, sounds familiar!

    Fangio, I have a similar story. When I was about the same age as you, I too bought a pair of L-166's. Like you, I wanted a pair of L-65's but couldn't afford them. I found a store in San Jose selling their JBL floor models for 1/2 price, so I got my pair of Horizons for $426. I made a big mistake selling them about 20 years ago, and I just recently reacquired a pair. I won't be making the same mistake twice!

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