Well, I've decided that I need to get out of this town, for at least a day, and I've never been into a Fry's to see what they've got, so off I go tomorrow morning. The bad part of that I know Sac is hotter than it is here. But I'll be on the road about 6:30AM, so I'll be there before the store opens. Get in, check it out, hopefully the Studio Ls, and then whatever I decide to do after.
Originally Posted by MJC
Road trip!
Good luck. I hope you're successful.
Out.
Originally written by JBLnsince1959
I don't know about the center for the Studio Ls, but I replaced my S-Center with a Beta C360, and it was so much better. The Infinity blends very well with the S412s & S38s and is very transparenent. It doesn't stick out like a sore thumb like the S-Center did. The S-Center was like some kind of effects box -- I would have liked to try playing electric guitar through it, because it sounded more like a small vintage Marshall tube amp than anything else. Cool for guitar, not so cool for CD listening. The Infinity gave me a major improvement in my overall sound. Now if I only had the money for a Lexicon RV-8.and for a minute listened to the beta's ( with the C.M.M.D. cones) NOT BAD and a REAL surprise for $499 speakers ( each I believe)!!!!! Don't think I would buy the Beta's ( they had them on sell for $327 - CHEAP!!) But I want to do an A/B comparison for fun. At first blush ( which can be wrong, I only listened for a minute) they sounded more open and airy....
PS -- Love your avater -- speaking of cracks, gross stuff cracks me up!
Russ...I think there's something to the C.M.M.D. cones and i'll like to hear more...JBL has some form of ceramic cones used in a ultra-high end HT setup ( don't hear much about it)
I was very surprised by what I heard with the C.M.M.D. cones....
I haven't been a fan of Infinity designs for the bigger models like the INTERLUDE 60 with side firing woofers ( 4 way with 12" powered woofer), .. would be fun to buy and play around ( maybe build a real box for the transducers). If they were'n't side firing thenI would buy them in a heart beat and use for center channels.....Seems like they have some great cones but are struggling with basic designs....alot of their stuff seems to copy older designs by JBL....now it looks like they are big into array speakers with a series of SMALL shit-ass speakers ( 31/2") so they don't stick out OR in the wall speakres
It's a sad day as this may be the real future of speakers.
We'll need to PM each other about you guys coming up and maybe we can make some time to go listen to those also.
as far as the avatar Well..By-Cracky...this may be temporary.. as I said to Dome..."once the shock and humor wears off then it just becomes another asshole on the forum..."
Whit was soooooo much prettier...
Let's PM about next weekend if you guys are still able come up..
Have a safe trip and hopefully the Studio L's will be there
Good luck
I made it to Fry's in Sac yesterday. That place is the size of a Costco! Four audio rooms and three or four HT rooms, so they were headed in the right direction, compared to BB, but that's where it ends. The HT rooms were filled with large screen TVs only. Guess someone forgot to tell them you need a 5.1 audio system for HT as well.
One of the audio rooms that had JBLs, only had a Sony receiver for a source, no cd or dvd players. That room had the Studio L820 bookshelf speakers, LC1 and other JBLs, no 890. I ask the sales guy, when are you getting the 890s in. Checks on the computer and sez, "we show them in stock". I ask why they're not on display.
So he brings ONE out and hooks it up in another room that had a H/K745 receiver and a dvd player. I drop in one of the cds, that I brought, this sounds pretty sweet. Another sales guy comes in, and I tell them, if you guys expect me to buy these, you better get a pair connected.
So while I'm listening to one, they dig another one out and set it up in the other room and then drag the first one over there.
As it turns out, they had completely sold out their first shipment of 890s, including the original display pair. And then weren't able to get any for at least two weeks. They said they had just got these in, but no one had enough sense to put a pair back on display! If you want sales, well...
As JBLnsince1959 has said, these speakers sound great, especially for the price. These are a much better system than either the Studio or Northridge series. So much so that decided to bring a pair home, and give them a REAL test drive. And I've got 30 days to decide if they stay.
Being that these are full range speakers I've been running them w/o any subs. Played the 1812 Overture, for the first time with no subs. The canons didn't shake the room, like they would with subs playing, but those dual 8" woofers are no slouches either.
So far the highes haven't come forward, as they did in the sound rooms, but I would think that my HT/LR is not as live(thicker carpet, pad, on wood floor, instead of concrete and bigger padded recliners).
The 890s don't like EQ, at least with no subs in the mix. Also they didn't like the "Dolby vs 2SP REF", which my L212s love, it makes their wide soundstage even wider. I don't know why there would be a difference. When I tried the Dolby vs 3SP REF, which brought the center L212 into play, it was as it should be. Of coarse, vs is virtual surround, which to me isn't even close to surround, but it does expand a stereo soundstage.
So to this point I'm not hearing the overall soundstage and as clear highes that I've been used to, but I'll continue to test. More later
Looking for highs
Great story, and true to my own experience at Frys. The associates are under trained, their sales acumen is zero, and they never know what they do or do not have. One must always ask, even insist to learn the truth about what's in stock.
You make a very important point about the room eating the highs. The following sidebar comments are general in nature and are not meant to reflect your particular situation.
Sometimes we get so caught up in sound absorption and bass management that we lose the high end. By the time we add carpeting, drapes, sound panels, furniture, bass traps, plants, diffractive surfaces (book shelves, open cabinets, wall fixtures, etc.), we suddenly wonder, Where'd the highs go?
My garage has a concrete floor (surprise, surprise) and mildly textured ceiling, but the walls are replete with all kinds of storage. Some of my JBLs sound better in there than anywhere else I've put them, and a few are way too bright in there. My LR sucks the treble out of everything incluidng the Performance Series but it's great for bass mangement; thank goodness for calibration and EQ!
Back to your situation, I'm sure you'll find the highs if you seek them, and they won't be in the same place as you find the highs from the L212s. Good luck, and great tale.
Out.
Sometimes we get so caught up in sound absorption and bass management that we lose the high end. By the time we add carpeting, drapes, sound panels, furniture, bass traps, plants, diffractive surfaces (book shelves, open cabinets, wall fixtures, etc.), we suddenly wonder, Where'd the highs go?
This morning I turned on the MC channels and tried the Dolby vs 2sp, it was working much better, but it wasn't right at all last night with cds. I also tried the eq, it brought in the highs, but the bass was not good. I can run the L212s either way, just a matter of taste. Still haven't added the sub1500s yet, will later today.
If I was to keep the Ls in the HT I could remove the 12" subs, being the Ls go to 28htz, and just run the two sub 1500s.
The Studio Ls and the L212s seem to be a much closer timbre match, than when I had three L55s up front and the L212s on the side. When action moved front to back it was way off. Didn't notice that last night watching Twister.
I will try the Ls back here in the MB, in place of the L55s, to the sides of this 32" screen, connected to a Marantz receiver later this month.
MJC
I'm working so not much time to add much, except to say that yesterday I had a chance to sneak out and listen to the Studio Ls' again, only this time I also listen to the Infinity Beta's and JBL Venue series...
compared to to the other speakers ( A/B testing) the studio L's sounded "darker" and fuller, the Infinity beta's with their C.M.M.D. cones were far more brighter, open, clear and precise in the Mid and highs than the Studio L's. the Venue's were also brighter than the Studio's ( doesn't mean better tho)
I'll have to listen when I can take someone...it's hard to do the switching and listen to..
so far I'm thinking.... "if only I could get the studio L's with the C.M.M.D. mids and highs"
I'll have to do much more fine listening to study the difference, particularly in the mid-bass and bass area...
I didn't listen to any Infinitys yesterday, should have, but the sound room which seemed to have the most speakers only had a receiver for a source. That's the room they ended up putting the 890s after I'd listened to one of them on a H/K and a dvd player, in another room.compared to to the other speakers ( A/B testing) the studio L's sounded "darker" and fuller, the Infinity beta's with their C.M.M.D. cones were far more brighter, open, clear and precise in the Mid and highs than the Studio L's. the Venue's were also brighter than the Studio's ( doesn't mean better tho)
I guess some people are just too lazy to properly set up a sound room with enough gear so a customer can do a proper audition.
But having heard the Infinity Preludes a few years ago, I know what you mean about the highs. They are some of the most neutral speakers I've ever heard.
MJC
I think I'm a little confused as to your setup..are you using these HT or 2 channel, or both....what are they begin run by??
http://www.soundstage.com/revequip/jbl_l890.htm
Not so enthusiastic review from a reviewer who owns Vanderteen 1C. They have measurements too.
It was hard to give this guy any serious credit after reading this paragraph:
IOW, "I'm biased toward specialized and boutique brands because they give me a special feeling." I do think he made some effort to be fair, although the bit about him having perfect memory about the sound of some speakers that weren't there and comparing them favorably against the Studio Ls is just foolish.My own audio interests have led me to a more intimate engagement with music, one with a heightened sense of involvement defined by parameters (soundstaging, detail retrieval, overall musicality) that my 16-year-old self would never have understood, let alone cared about. And to that end, I enjoy exploring the world of specialized audio manufacturers big and small, but all focused on the thrilling, accurate re-creation of music.
Out.
I'm using them right now as my main L/R in a HT/music setup, along with 5 L212s. But its just to hear how they perform. They are being run by a H/K 635 receiver and a Parasound amp.
I'll also try them back in the MB's audio setup, where I have the L55s.
The chance that I'm going to keep them is only 50%, at best. I've got 4 weeks to decide before I take them back to Fry's.
They sounded fairly good at the store, so I thought I'd buy them to see if I might want them to replace the L55s.
From what I've heard so far, there is no chance they would replace the L212s. The soundstage of the mirror image L212s is better, and the 890 highs haven't come thru, as they did in the store. Plus they don't seem to like any EQ. They are nice sounding speakers, but not up to the par of the L212.
Consider this, the pair of 890 list for $1798, in '06 $, the L212s were $2000, list in the late '70s, if I adjust for inflation, that would be about $8000 now. Making the comparision of the two unfair. But they should be an upgrade from the L55s.
This test of the 890s is really in frustration of not being able to do an audition of the PS over the last 4 years, short of buying them off the Harman online store before ever hearing them.
yes, that would be comparing a $1700 pair of speakers against a $8000 pair of speakers..no contest...
If the highs are not there then I would look at your equipment or setup...audio stuff is funny...some things just don't mix well. everything I had that wokred great with the 4430's didn't work at all with the PS..I had to start over from the interconnects on up...
I'm flabbergasted at the last review...these speakers are ANYthing but bright..I'm not sure where the guy is coming from..
As far as the PS series, Before you buy from the web Pm me about something...when i get time ( OK, when I feel like it) I have some things to say about the PS series..what they are...and what they are not...
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