JBL-NOT!! - DIY 4351 Studio Monitor

[Ian Mackenzie]

Rick,

Great project and very nice job of the cabinets, would love to hear them.

Stick with the original idea and take it to the limit...forget the background noise, its a long way behind you.

Cheers

Ian

[saeman]

Stick with the original idea and take it to the limit...forget the background noise, its a long way behind you.

Thanks Ian - I hope to hear them myself in 2-3 weeks when the second cabinet is done. From that point I'll work on component upgrades and as I said before, try to do something exotic with the cross-overs. It's not likely that I'll move them along as I have too much time into putting them together. Very few out there can look far enough into a project like this to see the $$$ value in the cabinets. Original always fetches the big $$$. I've sold custom systems in the past and realized about $5/hour for my time. I built these for myself and hope to groom them into something real nice. Time will tell. "Trivia" from the old Bill Cosby series in the 70's. He always talked about taking wood shop when he was in school. When asked how he did, his reply was that he made a lot of mistakes, many mistakes. When he made a mistake he would cut a notch or two in it and give it to his mother telling her that it was an ashtray. So...... if these speakers fail to turn out great I can always cut a notch in them!! Regards - Rick

[JBLnsince1959]

Just a note to say how good everything looks. I'm not very good building stuff myself and I always admire someone who can. Also, design looks very well thought out.

Since I'm not good at building stuff, not much I can add to what the others are saying.

congrads

[John]

Just talked to the buyer on those westlake horns.

They are going to Hong Kong!!!

[Mr. Widget]

I shipped a set of mine to Hong Kong too... I guess they like 'em big over there.

Widget

[John]

Yes and even all beat up like that, that guy still got a steal at $200.00

[Ian Mackenzie]

Rick,

Cool.

You can alway mess with it later and having a baseline JBL design from the beginning makes sense but its a journey that I hope you enjoy.

As for mine oddly I restarted the madness after a 26 year drought with a 2 way Altec/ JBL 2397 system about 9 years ago (thats 26 years after my 1st attempt at building 4343's). I then added 077's (since Robert's in NY)..that was a given, then added an 8 inch Audax mid, then a 10 inch 2122 JBL mid (via Robert) and got hold of some 2245's for a nice 4 way. Then I switched to 2344a's which I thought was nirvana at the time and was back to a 3 way. As fate would have it I then made the mistake of hearing my 4343's at my brothers place. The result of that demonstration started me hastled Bo for 4345 measurements...the dang Yankee I love him for that. I bought a pair 2307's off Jon, compared the whole mess.... 2307+2308/2344/2397 and rebuild the cabinets into 4345...that was hard work. I thought the 2307/2308 with the 2122 and 2405 had the most neutral and accurate sound at the time and I am yet to prove to myself otherwise! (Hovlands in the crossovers does wonders as does a mountain of class A power!)

Finished the 4345's .......Game over Man , Game over.

But had I not screwed around with all the other stuff first I would not have appreciated just how good a prime JBL four way design can be.

So go have fun with it and enjoy.

Ian

[saeman]

Hello Ian: I loved hearing the itterations that you have gone thru before settling back almost to where you began. Sounds so familiar to what I have done. I did a bunch of custom things thinking my 4343's could be improved upon. Went to 2-way and 3-way as that's where I started with JBL, tried all sorts of driver combinations parked in cabinets from big to outrageous and then finally determined that my 4343's weren't so bad after all. I was a happy and settled camper until a buddy of mine gave me a demo on his 4350's running on about 1000 watts/channel of bridged Crown power. After a full demo of everything from Bach to Pink Floyd, I helped him move his house back on to the foundation and we started talking price. Brought them home 3 weeks later. Seemed logical to me. The 4350 was just one small step up from what I already had ??? I'm hoping that this 4351 project will yield some improvements in the system in a home environment. I'll surely keep you posted. Regards - Rick

[Tom Loizeaux]

Rick,
Don't be haunted by "what you could have done". You are going to have a pair of speakers that will sound better and image better then original JBL 4350s...and that's saying a lot!
Though a Westlake horn could improve things, and trying newer componants might give you a little more, there are usually little problems that come from making these kind of substitutions. It's usually a lot of work (and expense) to make a small gain in these kind of situations.
I'm sure you'll love your 4351s.
Maybe, down the road, with specific help from fellow Forum members, you'll try to upgrade these 4350 componants, but it's not something I think you need to deal with at this point.
I restored my 4343s and, except for upgrading the caps in the crossovers, kept everything stock. I do run them in bi-amp mode, but they are stock componants in original cabinets...and they sound great!

Tom

[Ken Pachkowsky]

As stated in my first message, you have done a great job and I am sure you will like the speakers you have built. When you’re ready to go to the next level you will find many opinions here.

I have had the privilege of owning factory built 4345's and 4350's as well as Westlakes. The 4345 systems smaller 1” 2421B combined with its longer horn assembly (2307/2308) sounds much smoother than a stock 4350 with (2392?) or whatever that stubby horn is. You can’t compare the sound of a stock 4350 horn to those of the 4345. The difference is staggering. A stock 4350’s horn is simply “ear shattering harsh”. On the other hand the 4345 horn is less harsh, even at high SPL’s.

That being said, a quality wood horn designed for and attached to any 2420/2421B/2440/375/2441 will simply out perform any of these older "stock" horn and lens systems hands down.

Take it from someone who’s owned all the above systems. Once you have listened to a JBL/TAD/Westlake wood horn system, you will never go back to the old standard metal series horns and plastic lenses.

In Ian’s well chosen words “Game over Man, Game over.

Enjoy your new speakers and if I can ever be of assistance don’t hesitate to ask.

Ken

[Ian Mackenzie]

Rick,

One thing to watch out for is pipe organ resonances with long thin ports.

Probably not an issue below 250 hertz but might be worth checking into.

Ian

[saeman]

Hi Tom and Ken: Your comments are much appreciated. This project was a deliberate effort to reorient the 4350 components into a more living room friendly array - floor space being the issue. To that end I'll be quite happy. Besides having my 4350's I now have a wall ensemble that will look much better. Any other improvements that arrise will be gravy. I expect getting the mids and highs up off the floor a bit will be an improvement. And as I said, I'll play with them and do some tweeking as time goes on. I'm sure they're here to stay - not remotely interested in carrying them up out of the basement.......But, you guys have peaked my interests in some other areas. Listening is half of my passion and building them is the other half. Nobody has to twist my arm to get me started cutting wood. I intend, later this year, to start another project and will definately tailor it to some of these great ideas. Thanks again

[saeman]

With completion of the grille set, I've finally finished physical construction of my 4351 monitors. Here's a few pics showing the final look (poor light until I get my room refinished). I hope to continue the project with upgraded x-overs (Lancer Style) and upgrade the woofs from 2231A to 2235H when I can locate a quad set. For now I'll just listen and enjoy having a little more floor space (I'll always own a pair of 4350's).

Rick

[saeman]

pics

[johnaec]

Outstanding!

John