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Thread: New Poll At My Altec User's Board, And I'd Like YOUR Opinions!

  1. #31
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    Originally posted by Don McRitchie
    Currently, main monitors are only used in large commercial studios.
    Don,

    Where can one find all those names an address?

  2. #32
    Senior Member 4345's Avatar
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    I think JBL would be the most qualified to build a vintage type speaker. They are still made in the USA and have the best brand name in the world.

    My suggestion would be an Alnico "377" driver. Same magnetic structure as a 375 but with an updated diaphram.

    Also an updated 15" woofer with an Alnico magnet. Without the foam surround. I HATE FOAM.

    Perhaps they could combine the two components in a nice enclosure.

    Given what you see 150-4's and 375's go for on E-Bay, they should have no problem selling TONS of them.

    Unfortunately, it seems as if JBL either does not like money or has no idea what is going on in the world of audio. I would imagine they could sell more of the speakers described above in a week than they will sell of the Revel speakers in a year.

  3. #33
    Webmaster Don McRitchie's Avatar
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    Where can one find all those names an address?
    I have no idea. Mark Gander, Vice President of Marketing for JBLpro made the comment that there were less than 2000 major studios worldwide. They obviously need to know the size of their market for product planning, but I did not dig further to find out the origin of that statistic.
    Regards

    Don McRitchie

  4. #34
    Senior Member MikeM's Avatar
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    Altec Big boys

    I think there will be a very limited market for the duplex and large 2 way monitors. we are talking pry 10,000 a pair most people are not prepared to spend this . Ive owned The duplex and large 2way systems. they are great in their time and prefer the altec compession drivers over regular jbl. The altec fanatics know ware to get them if they need them!
    Von Schweikert VR-8
    Canary Ref. 1 300B monoblocks. 300Bx16

  5. #35
    Administrator Mr. Widget's Avatar
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    Originally posted by Giskard
    "Unfortunately, it seems as if JBL either does not like money"

    Sure they do, they simply choose not to sell their high end product to a country full of Walmart shoppers.

    "or has no idea what is going on in the world of audio."

    JBL definitely knows what is going on in the WORLD of audio. Again... that WORLD doesn't include a nation full of Walmart shoppers. Besides, the United States taxpayers are too busy wasting billions of dollars blowing up and then rebuilding Iraq. They don't have leftover cash to waste on loudspeakers, school programs for their children, or development of alternative energy sources.
    I am sorry Giskard, but I have to violently agree with you.

    The way I see it, if we spent the 3 to 5 billion a month we are spending in Iraq on finding alternatives to oil, we wouldn't need to be in the Middle East looking for oil, supporting bad governments like the Saudis, who scare, kill and piss off a bunch of people who then kill, scare and piss us off, Sadam wouldn't have been able to get so powerful because he would have been the leader of a farming nation instead of an oil machine... oops I went too far again!

    Widget

    Last edited by Mr. Widget; 08-04-2003 at 04:04 PM.

  6. #36
    Administrator Mr. Widget's Avatar
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    What does this have to do with Altec?

    Actually it does relate back to Altec. As Altec became more and more involved with the US Military Industrial Complex they lost a bit of their focus in other areas. When the Cold War ended so did their military contracts. That was the end for Altec. Had they stayed a smaller company designing and building the world's finest theater sound systems, we would probably be listening to movie soundtracks mastered on Altecs and played back through them as well!


    Oh, did I mention I used to live in Berkeley? I'll get off my soap box now.

  7. #37
    RIP 2010 scott fitlin's Avatar
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    so

    Had they done this or that....

    Had they not been bought up by Gultan, then by Telex...

    But all this has happened, and the once great Altec company is no more. And its a name that has been trashed as well, by manufacture of computer speakers and other walmart type items!

    My question is can Altec really be brought back to life, and can they manufacture components that are the best product for the job?

    Secondly, do the parties involved have means neccesary for competitive marketing strategies that are so important to succes of great products!

    Lets look at JBL for a minute. They may not be the JBL of the past, but they sure got great marketing. As far as marketing goes, JBL, ( Harman ) does KNOW what they are doing!

    I remember the early 90,s. And unlike the 70,s and 80,s, when Altec was a revered brand, installers and contractors no longer held Altec in such high esteem! This is definitely an area which will require hard work! The products that come to market will have to be of the HIGHEST quality! Can Iconic, or GPA manufacture this class of product, even if they dont sell in the tens of thousands?

    And, of course, can they actually manufacture goods that have the sound Altec had?

  8. #38
    Moderator / Treasurer/Marketplace Czar boputnam's Avatar
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    Blue Light Special...!!

    Regrettably, that won't get the attention of us large-format JBL hounds - we don't shop at WalMart. Giskard is right - with everyone shopping for bargins regardless of country of origin, margins must be kept thin to keep prices from reaching astronomical levels, and with that, there is simply not enough volume to justify an American-based business plan. Large format fanatics are either unfortunately - or blessedly - few in number.

    Cabinet size simply is an issue. Even though everyone that hears the 4345's has to wear lobster bibs at the house, they go home to their cute little 5.1 systems and pathetic sound - but at least it doesn't interfere with their decor. We are using the 4345's as a focal point - to do otherwise is missed opportunity. But most maintain their decor as if Sunset Magazine is doing a photo-shoot in their 'hood. How moronic.

    Don sums it up: Even if we're lucky enough to have Harman/JBL re-invigorate the true - true - Pro line, it will be components, and not systems. Big stuff just won't sell.

    It is beholden on everyone with large format monitors to record what they can about the species - but that's only if we think someone later will care...

    Signed,

    Darwin
    bo

    "Indeed, not!!"

  9. #39
    RIP 2010 scott fitlin's Avatar
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    Actually

    I believe there is a small "niche" market that will buy purpose built items. But, its not a giant market like it once was.

    So you have to keep the company of moderate size and do small production runs.

    If the products sound of the utmost quality, they will find their respective homes. Theres always a nighclub, auditorium, theatre, amusement park, or whatever that wants the BEST!

    And then there are hi fi gurus that gotta have it no matter what. Again, a small market, but one that does exist!

    For me, the real question is, can they make goods that make me say I HAVE to HAVE this? Or, will it just be wannabe copycat clones?

    Big Stuff can sell in smaller numbers. As long as Big stuff is the Best Stuff.

  10. #40
    Senior Member 4345's Avatar
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    JBL definitely knows what is going on in the WORLD of audio. Again... that WORLD doesn't include a nation full of Walmart shoppers. Besides, the United States taxpayers are too busy wasting billions of dollars blowing up and then rebuilding Iraq. They don't have leftover cash to waste on loudspeakers, school programs for their children, or development of alternative energy sources.

    ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    Giskard,

    Sorry to get your feathers ruffled. However, I disagree with you. It is easy to blame it on the consumer. Perhaps the Marketing folks at JBL who designed the K2-S9800 blame the consumer as well. The truth is, that they just are not giving the American consumer something they want to spend big bucks on.

    Not all Americans shop exclusively at Walmart. If that were the case, we would not see so many Lexus' or Mercedes' on the road. You can't buy them at Walmart!

    JBL would be smart to design a speaker based on its classic designs. Perhaps a 15" and 2" driver in a traditional style cabinet as I described ealier. Price should be around 10K retail.

    Other companies are doing this quite effectively. Mcintosh, Harley Davidson, Fender, Gibson, Neumann, AKG, BMW, to name a few, are building vintage style equipment and selling it well. NO! I don't want to buy a pair of Revel Speaker to go with my Mcintosh tube amps.

    Not only does this marketing strategy result in strong sales today, but will help maintain the brand name for the future. Perhaps JBL does not see the need for maintaining its reputation for quality in the consumer market. Given the growth in home theater and other forms of home entertainment, I think this is a mistake.

    Mr. Widget is right about Altec. They forgot about certain segments of the market when other segments were doing well. Later, this blew up in their face. JBL might be able to learn a lesson from Altec's mistakes.

  11. #41
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    Google searches for studio monsters often show recording studios bragging about their equipment or else Japanese audio stores.

    Does anyone have an estimate of how many of the large systems remain in the US?

    I'd bet that most of the systems which were made have survived although they may have left the country. People do seem to treat these systems with a good deal of respect.

    The market does appear to be in equilibrium - there are about the right number of systems available, however, current prices are a bargain compared with replacement cost so there is probably not a lot of room for new manufacture.

    John Nebel

  12. #42
    Administrator Mr. Widget's Avatar
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    " The market does appear to be in equilibrium - there are about the right number of systems available, however, current prices are a bargain compared with replacement cost so there is probably not a lot of room for new manufacture."

    I am afraid for those that want to venture into this market that John is right.

    Every hifi store I go into says that if it wasn't for HT they would be closing their doors. Many of these shops still carry fine music playback systems, that they carry out of their own personal passion. This explains why you can't find a decent piece of audio gear in a Walmart type of store like Best Buys. They have no passion.

    Hey 4345,

    What have you got against Revel? Their $10K speakers are quite good. I have been disappointed by some of their newer less expensive models, but their high end models are great.

  13. #43
    Senior Member GordonW's Avatar
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    Dunno, I work at a hi-fi store, and I can tell you, if it wasn't for 2-channel audio, we'd likely not be here. Home theatre buyers are too fickle in the beginning, and unwilling to change/upgrade things once they're installed. OTOH, 2-channel music listeners, are STILL buying such unheard of things as turntables (we sold more of those in the last 12 months than any year in our history), relatively large speakers (Tannoy, Vandersteen and Boston Acoustics), and lots of related items such as phono preamps, integrated amps (we sell at least 3 NAD integrated amps for each NAD HT receiver!) as well.

    I'm seeing signs of saturation in the HT market- seems like everyone that wants one, HAS one. OTOH, it's not that the 2-channel market is dead... it's that a lot of the big (and some not-so-big) companies have forgotten what makes the music listener tick: EXCITEMENT. It's all about making things BETTER. Better built (which is why we restore and sell LOTS of vintage gear!), cooler looking (interesting cosmetics, such as the S&S German-built racks, Rega electronics, VPI Aries/Scout turntables, etc), or just plain more reliable and better sounding. There's a LOT more to audio, than the "generic black boxes" sold at Wal-mart, Tweeter or Best Buy... and a few people figure that out, every day...

    There are still the faithful out there... and from what I'm seeing, I wouldn't be surprised by a bunch of the current "HT in a box" owners, to one day decide "why do I NOT have better sound?"... I'm seeing signs of that (a "flight to quality" as would be put in stock-market terms) here and there... I just want to be there, when they do decide that, in mass.

    Regards,
    Gordon.

  14. #44
    Administrator Mr. Widget's Avatar
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    Gordon, that certainly sounds encouraging. Usually they say that California leads the trends. I hope in this case that it isn't true. Virtually all of the better stereo shops here have a turntable. A few even have one that is hooked up to a preamp with a phono section. It is really a bummer to go into the room that used to showcase the best speakers and systems and now see a huge display of some sort with a booming sub and last weeks action DVD playing.

    Don't get me wrong, there are actually still a couple of very good audio stores left in the Bay Area, but they are becoming more and more rare.

    Back once again to Altec, do you think your store could or would sell an 8 to 12 cubic foot Altec type system. There is a store near my home that had a heck of a time getting rid of the demo pair of Tannoy Churchills they had. They were trying to demo them in their hall because all of the demo rooms were full of @#$%.

  15. #45
    Your Memory Lives On RIP Tom Loizeaux's Avatar
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    Not all recording and mixing studios are dumping their large monitors...just JBL large monitors! I've seen a number of studios replace JBL large monitors with large Genelec monitors! It's not the size they are unhappy with, I just think they want to show their clients the "latest and greatest" - to give their clients the comfort of "these tracks must be great, they were done at a state of the art studio!"
    Of course WE benift from these "cast off" JBL monitors, but JBL needs to look at these markets and decide if they want to be a player. All their low end consumer gear puts their credibility in question.

    Tom

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