Page 3 of 5 FirstFirst 12345 LastLast
Results 31 to 45 of 70

Thread: Solid State vs. Tube Amps

  1. #31
    Senior Member duaneage's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Location
    The First State
    Posts
    1,584
    I never thought that the source material and music I listened to would matter much with SS or Tubes. I have heard both and prefer my SS amps. I run Yamaha M-45 amps and I like them. They are MOS-FET amps with a unique biasing circuit that runs AB up to 5 watts and Class A above 5 watts. Prevents the crossover distortion push pull SS amps are plaqued with.

    For the record I think the warm sound of tubes comes from two places.

    1. Overdriving the amps because they don't have enough power and we want more sound.

    2. Different dampening charactoristics - tubes offer good speaker control, better than many SS amps.

    One downside to tubes for sure is the danger of a broken speaker wire. An open circuit to the speaker may cause damage to the tube amp.

    The MOS-FET offers tube like charactoristics, but of course there are now electronic signal processors that claim to do the same thing. Winamp has a plug in that simulates valve sound even.

  2. #32
    Senior Member "Duke" Spinner's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Location
    Upstate New York
    Posts
    144
    Quote Originally Posted by duaneage
    with a unique biasing circuit that runs AB up to 5 watts and Class A above 5 watts. .

    That ....would be Unique .....i think you have it backwards.....

  3. #33
    Senior Member Ian Mackenzie's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2003
    Location
    Australia
    Posts
    7,103
    Yes some amps are biased for a few watts into class A, other have a sliding bias scheme. The Sony Power Jfet amps for the best of breed for some time.

    I can't stand SS amps that are not biased to some degree into classA. Class A and little or no feedback offers the best sound in imh & experience. That comes at a heft price for the consumer unless you dabble with making your own.

    Fortunately the best designs are both brilliant and at the same time simple in their execution for a diy guru.

    If you look at the Beta curves for a transister or a fet, they are non linear with both voltage ane current. Mosfets tend to sound fizzy and less dynamic unless biased hard at 50 c temp into class A. BJTs are just plain hard and bright unless biased hard and then have great detail and ambience.

    With tubes it depends on the design and the tubes which vary tonally from one brand to another. The better amps are single ended triodes and are relatively low powered..they sound very refined and detailed with only a hint of warmth.

    JBLs sound very nice with a class A mosfet or BJT imho because they bring out the micro transient details so well.

    There is some very interesting Tube stuff coming out of China, cheap and well made.... could be the way to go for your horns.

  4. #34
    Senior Member duaneage's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Location
    The First State
    Posts
    1,584
    Quote Originally Posted by "Duke" Spinner
    That ....would be Unique .....i think you have it backwards.....
    Just what the manual says...........

    There is a switch that sllows the amp to run pure class A at all times but it does run warmer when that is used

  5. #35
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Posts
    814
    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Widget
    The painting on the left is a faithful reproduction of a red wall. The photo on the right is of a white(?) car, near Paris(?)....

    Widget
    Old thread, I know. But Widget- this is one of your best postings(IMO). ...couldn't stop laughing! Thanks!

  6. #36
    Steve Gonzales
    Guest

    Update

    I have lived with my system in a triamped configuration now = Yamaha SS M35 35wpc driving four 076's, a VTL model 45 EL34 based tube amp driving SIX JBL 1" throat compression drivers, 2420's on 2312's, LE85's on 800hz McCauley elliptical mouth horns and 2421's on JBL 2397 Smithhorns and a Yamaha M80 driving 1pr of LE14A's and a pair of LE14H's. I use a JBL M553 electronic crossover. The VTL is to die for!. Dead quiet, wonderful resolution/soundstage and with the electronic crossover, more than enough power to drive all of them, believe it or not, with no soft clipping at very high SPL's (that I can detect). So my opinion of tube amps is that if you can find the right one, you could be VERY happy with the results. I have to thank Dave Brink for this wonderful gift. It gave me the luxury of starting with a sweet amp and not have to do much else. I will try different EL34's like, Mullards and maybe Telefunken later. I will also search for a tube amp to drive the 076's too. I know there are diehard SS guys out there and I respect that. I say that the proof of what the right tube amp, in the right configuration, is music to my ears, Regards, Steve G.

  7. #37
    norealtalent
    Guest
    Only my best for my best, My Friend

  8. #38
    Senior Member Michael Smith's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    Melbourne, Australia
    Posts
    175

    Interesting Analogy from Widget (red wall/white car)

    Hey Widget
    I nearly spilt my wine,the picture of the white car is taken in Melbourne Australia,St Kilda Road to be exact just near the Arts Centre.The car is an Oz Ford
    Where did you get Paris from? Ian Mckenzie must be spending too much time at the Tardis,or he doesn't read your posts.
    Thanks for the giggle
    Michael

  9. #39
    Junior Member Merkin Berfel's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Location
    Hooterville, Ohio
    Posts
    10
    Once I learned one simple truth the tube vs SS argument was over.... All tube amps use an output transformer and transistor amps are directly coupled. The only exceptions to this rule that I know of are the early McIntosh SS amps (2105/2300) and the recent high-dollar Macs. The Macs that are considered a little less desirable are the direct-coupled models from the 80's.

    I hear the difference the most in the mid-bass. When I played bass guitar in copy bands in the early 80's I could hear the bass lines more clearly on the speaker in my old black & white TV than on my stereo. The problem didn't get solved until I got my first MC2100 back in '85.

    The oracle that taught me about audio had both tube and SS Macs over the course of time and he maintained that there was little difference in sound between them.


  10. #40
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Posts
    814
    Solid state for the bottom end-tubes for the mids and highs. Get the best of both worlds, IMO. It's a popular method because it works very, very well.

  11. #41
    norealtalent
    Guest
    Quote Originally Posted by Merkin Berfel
    Partial... he maintained that there was little difference in sound between them.
    Still looking for WMD's, eh?
    I will concede that a very high quality SS amp can be wonderful when directly compared to some tube amps. However, if I go down in my basement and break out a vintage motorola console ss amp and a vintage motorola console tube amp, so that I am comparing equitable pieces of equipment in regards to pricepoint and technology, the difference will be staggering. Tubes have advantages over SS(sound, tuneability, secondary house hold heat source), as quality SS has advantages over tubes(maintenance free reliability, excellent ballast for tall racks.) Both can be very pleasing and sometimes both will not. For a realistic comparison, equitable pieces must be used with no other variables allowed. With this as your test bed, then you can get accurate results from which to form an opinion. For my taste and from my experience, I'll take the tubes on top. Even high end SS amps cannot do what a little el84 can for accuracy, speed, transparency and depth. I love all those esoteric terms we've come up with to create BS sales techniques. Bottom line, give me tubes or give me transistors, just don't give me bose!!!

  12. #42
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2004
    Location
    Central Coast California
    Posts
    9,018

    Smile JFET/MOSFET

    My two FA1000.5 amps put me in the sweet spot between tube-like sound, SS reliability and power, and affordability. JFET input stages and MOSFET power outputs do a nice job, and the variable impedance-matching switch actually seems to work.

    At some point, I may spend the time and money to "tube up" one stereo system, but despite all the positive comments from tube owners over the years, I've not been bitten by the tube bug. If I do go that direction, I hope to discover something better, rather than just surrendering to peer pressure.

    Yes, peer pressure still exists in my mid-fifites.
    Out.

  13. #43
    Senior Member Ian Mackenzie's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2003
    Location
    Australia
    Posts
    7,103
    I think the trad tube amps like the Quads and Dynaco's are more a relaxant to the hard edge of SS from the same era. But if you compare those to the current day Cary, CJ or AR they are far less Trad Tube sounding. The problem is they also tend to be expensive and maintaining match output tubes is also expensive while the RCA input tubes are becoming rare as hens teeth.

  14. #44
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2003
    Location
    Toronto
    Posts
    1,114
    Quote Originally Posted by norealtalent
    Still looking for WMD's, eh?
    I will concede that a very high quality SS amp can be wonderful when directly compared to some tube amps. However, if I go down in my basement and break out a vintage motorola console ss amp and a vintage motorola console tube amp, so that I am comparing equitable pieces of equipment in regards to pricepoint and technology, the difference will be staggering. Tubes have advantages over SS(sound, tuneability, secondary house hold heat source), as quality SS has advantages over tubes(maintenance free reliability, excellent ballast for tall racks.) Both can be very pleasing and sometimes both will not. For a realistic comparison, equitable pieces must be used with no other variables allowed. With this as your test bed, then you can get accurate results from which to form an opinion. For my taste and from my experience, I'll take the tubes on top. Even high end SS amps cannot do what a little el84 can for accuracy, speed, transparency and depth. I love all those esoteric terms we've come up with to create BS sales techniques. Bottom line, give me tubes or give me transistors, just don't give me bose!!!
    Agreed, SS can't be beat on the bottom, although I have been experimenting with the Plitron Vanderveen Specialist Series toroids for a few years. I normally run them with four KT88's per channel, no global feedback, fully balanced and with regulated power above 100-200 Hz and to my ears, they are the cats meow.

    But, the odd time when I run them full range, they are pretty darn good at LF. The F3 at around 140 Watts is about 14Hz! Not too shabby for a couple of tube amps...

    If any of you like building stuff, I highly recommend trying them.

  15. #45
    Junior Member Merkin Berfel's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Location
    Hooterville, Ohio
    Posts
    10
    Quote Originally Posted by norealtalent
    if I go down in my basement and break out a vintage motorola console ss amp and a vintage motorola console tube amp, so that I am comparing equitable pieces of equipment in regards to pricepoint and technology, the difference will be staggering
    Does the Motorola SS amp have an output transformer or is it direct-coupled? Was it meant as a serious piece of hi-fi equipment? I'm only trying to say that the debate has more to do with whether or not an amp uses an output transformer than whether it's tube or SS.

    Anybody A/B'd a Mac MC275 with an MC2100?

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Similar Threads

  1. Varic on solid state???
    By rloggie in forum Lansing Product Technical Help
    Replies: 9
    Last Post: 01-09-2005, 09:30 PM
  2. Speaking of neato little tube amps...
    By GordonW in forum Professional Amps
    Replies: 9
    Last Post: 04-30-2004, 07:17 AM
  3. Cary Audio Tube amps
    By John in forum Professional Amps
    Replies: 11
    Last Post: 02-08-2004, 05:27 PM
  4. Amp for bass driver
    By Ken Schwarz in forum Lansing Product General Information
    Replies: 20
    Last Post: 08-29-2003, 07:26 PM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •