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Thread: midbass

  1. #1
    Senior Member Jakob's Avatar
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    midbass

    Hi!
    What driver would You choose for midbass-range in a four way system (200Hz-1kHz)? I can get my hands on LE10A and 2123H, but maybe You would recomend something else?
    -Jakob

  2. #2
    Tom Loizeaux
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    The 2123H would be hard to beat!

    Tom

  3. #3
    MJC
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    The 112A or 112H are very good mid-bass drivers. They are 8". But they are very hard to find as they were only used in the L212 towers.

  4. #4
    Senior Member Jakob's Avatar
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    What about the 8" 2110? I´ve heard it sounds quite good.

  5. #5
    Senior Member Guido's Avatar
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    I recomend the new 2012H.
    I use them in my 4343 which are original exept the midbass. I will post pictures and comments within the next weeks cause I'm not completely finished with them now.
    BUT the 2012 sound great.

  6. #6
    Senior Member DavidF's Avatar
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    Jakob, please allow me to correct some terminology. Mid-bass frequencies are centered around 50-60 Hz. For 200-1000 we are definitely in the midrange. This is the primary fundamental range (perhaps a little higher to 1200 Hz or so) where transient qualities, without colorations, are so important. A driver in this range should be as light and small as possible to preserve the transient benefits. Practical considerations may require more weight (to reduce distortion) or more size (higher sound levels). Better control of the cones in the midrange band usually call for powerful magnet structures which often runs contrary to full bass response (huge magnetic motors can limit bass response and typically produce a rising frequency response curve). Therefore, a bass-mid 8-inch designed for a two-way system does not need low bass response it was designed for in a 4-way system. Instead, we would prefer a driver optimized for the mid range. For home use, an 8-inch driver may be optimal and the best compromise in sound quality, dispersion, and transient considerations. For very high sound levels, large rooms, or pro use, a 10 or 12-inch is used. SO, the best current 8-inch JBL for home use could be the 2118. Older models like the 2108H or the 112H are better yet, but difficult to find. A ten-inch would better mate well with a 15 or 18-inch bass drivers on the crossover from bass to mid around 200Hz, but should be limited on high-end crossover to around 800Hz. Still, if high SPLs are needed, the 10-inch may be the minimum size. Another interesting option (I have not tried this but seems practical on paper) is to use a three-way-plus-sub with the big-motor 10” LE111 (a-la the 4313 monitor and L110, or the LE10H in the L96) which has fine mid response but lacks a little in low bass. Cross this over at around 80Hz on the low end and 800 Hz on the high. The sub would best be inserted with an active crossover using the big 18-inch JBL.

    David F

  7. #7
    MJC
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    [QUOTE]Originally posted by DavidF
    [B]Jakob, please allow me to correct some terminology. Mid-bass frequencies are centered around 50-60 Hz. For 200-1000 we are definitely in the midrange. This is the primary fundamental range (perhaps a little higher to 1200 Hz or so) where transient qualities,

    The L212 is a 4 way, when taking the ultrabass into consideration. The 12" sub crosses over to the 3 way towers at 70htz. The 112a/h is called a mid-bass driver, operating in the range from 70htz to 800htz. The le5-9 is the midrange going from 800htz to around 3000.
    So by your terminology the ultrabass is operating in the mid-bass range as well as low bass.
    But when these or any speaker system are used for hometheater the receiver or pre/pro determines the crossover from the sub.

  8. #8
    Senior Member GordonW's Avatar
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    Hm, we always used a quite different definition of "bass", "midbass", etc, in our work...

    "Bass", was defined as 0-100 Hz.

    "Midbass" was defined as approximately 100-250 Hz.

    "Midrange" was generally defined as about 250-2500 Hz.

    "Treble" was everything above 2500 Hz.

    Sometimes we made subdivisions; ie, sub-bass was about 0-50 Hz, bass was 50-100Hz, midbass was about 100-200 Hz, lower midrange was 200-700 Hz, upper midrange was 700-2000 Hz, lower treble was 2000-6000 Hz, and upper treble was from 6000 Hz up.

    As for drivers- we usually defined them by the LOWEST frequency they would have to encounter. For example, the 2123, since it is capable of going down to about 100 Hz, would be considered a "midbass". The LE10A, since it has a usable bandwidth down to just below 50 Hz, usually, would be considered a "woofer" or "bass" driver. OTOH, the 2245, since it can easily go into the 20s, is obviously a "subwoofer", or "Sub-bass" driver... though, it is oftentimes operated as a "woofer"... ie, up to above 100 Hz...

    This seemed to be the general convention, plus or minus a few Hz, at most all the audio-related businesses I've worked at over the last 20 years...

    I guess it really just depends on the locale...

    As far as the 2123 is concerned, in this application... either it or the 2118, are VERY hard to better, as far as realistic, tactile, visceral midbass "impact" is concerned, while maintaining excellent speed and control. For thier bandwidth, they're among the best available, IMHO and IME...


    Regards,
    Gordon.

  9. #9
    Administrator Robh3606's Avatar
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    Interesting thread!

    I use 2122 as my midrange driver but have 2118 and M209-8's that I am going to use in a future project. Both those 8" drivers sound really good and I agree are hard to beat. Never done a comparison to the 2122 which I think really kicks! Never had the pleasure of hands on with the 112 but I really liked the L212 when they came out. Couldn't afford them though

    Someday

    Rob

  10. #10
    Alex Lancaster
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    Thumbs up

    How about a 2202, they were used in the 4350 and 4355, precisely in that freq range, also they are efficient and can take a lot of power, depending on the model.

    Alex

  11. #11
    Senior Member DavidF's Avatar
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    Sometimes we made subdivisions; ie, sub-bass was about 0-50 Hz, bass was 50-100Hz, midbass was about 100-200 Hz, lower midrange was 200-700 Hz, upper midrange was 700-2000 Hz, lower treble was 2000-6000 Hz, and upper treble was from 6000 Hz up.
    __________________________________________________

    Thanks, Gordon, for your perspective without the “slam”. In my perspective, I peg the bass range from 20-160Hz. In two ranges, that would be low bass (20-40Hz) and bass (40-160Hz). By octaves, that would fit into low bass (20-40), mid bass (40-80) and upper bass (80-160).

    DavidF

  12. #12
    Member locanti's Avatar
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    Hi all

    I used a pair of D216 front loaded with a modified pair of 4333 for 2 years and I just find they're great in the range of 320Hz to 1200Hz.I tried so many midrange drivers the past 8 years such as AUDAX(POLYDAX in US) PR170MO,BEYMA 5M30 OR 8M60, full range drivers such as FOSTEX(208 serie) or SUPRAVOX(215rtf for those who know what I'm talking about) and many others.I even tried a pair of LE10A (No punch) and 125A(Too boomy)that I can say that a 8 inch driver with the lighter cone as possible is the best solution for home use if you want clarity and punch in the midrange bandwith.Hope this can help.

  13. #13
    Senior Member Jakob's Avatar
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    Thank You all for your input!
    It is astonishing how much helpful information this forums members can get You!

    I never got any feedback regarding the 2110H. Please let me know if this is a driver to spend money on!

    Thanks!

    -Jakob

  14. #14
    Senior Señor boputnam's Avatar
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    even tried a pair of LE10A (No punch)
    That surprises me, a bit. I've had wonderful results with those. Made some L26's a whole new, more aggressive animal...

    Have you tried the LE10H, too? It really surprises, in the proper cabinet. Whoowa...

    Don't know the 2110H, sorry...
    Last edited by boputnam; 07-16-2003 at 06:48 PM.
    bo

    "Indeed, not!!"

  15. #15
    Obsolete
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    "I never got any feedback regarding the 2110H. Please let me know if this is a driver to spend money on!"

    The 2110/2110H is the Pro version of the D208/D208H

    These drivers are no longer serviceable from JBL.

    "I even tried a pair of LE10A (No punch)"


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