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Thread: Speed of sound

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    Speed of sound

    For those good on maths a question. What would be the delay between two channels if I had 6 feet difference in speaker câble length delay wise and high frequency cancellation?Hope my question is clear!

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    Senior Member grumpy's Avatar
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    speaker -cable- length difference?
    something on the order of 6 nanoseconds.
    -not- going to cause any audio cancellation by itself... more likely to cause aesthetic or OCD-type irritation...

    speaker -distance- difference?
    roughly 10 milliseconds.

    delayed room signals (echoes) or bad driver phasing or even damage to some component (as possibilities) could be involved if you're using a mono test signal/noise/music and there's a cancellation when both speakers are on, but not when only one is playing.

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    Senior Member grumpy's Avatar
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    (full disclosure: it would bother me)

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    Senior Member RMC's Avatar
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    I think i'm with the new boss here, lol (Grumpy) on this question, though not sure i understand correctly some of his writing.

    Looking at the delay aspect from a different perspective than his, here's the thing. The Rolls Digital room/speaker Delay shown has as its shortest delay setting 32 milli seconds which is about equivalent to a 32 feet distance. My understanding is that if a smaller delay than 32ms or 32 ft was really significant in a room the manufacturer would probably have included even smaller delays?

    In other words the delay or distance involved might not be large enough to warrant some action to remedy. Naturally i assume that speaker wires used are not undersized creating a resistance issue (level), likewise for a capacitance issue that may create some high frequency rolloff.

    I have some high frequency cancellation stuff, from Eargle/Hoge, due to cable length, capacitance, resistance, etc but its more relevant to microphone cables than speaker cables.

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    Administrator Robh3606's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by maxserg View Post
    For those good on maths a question. What would be the delay between two channels if I had 6 feet difference in speaker câble length delay wise and high frequency cancellation?Hope my question is clear!
    For speaker cable??? Not going to matter. No delay and HF difference simply won't be audible if there is any.

    Rob
    "I could be arguing in my spare time"

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    Speed of sound…in a wire

    Thank for your answers! Yes my question was only about different speakers cable lenght. Assuming that I’m listening exactly at the center, only that there is a 6 feet longer for one side.

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    Senior Member grumpy's Avatar
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    Boss… that’s funny.
    Since the word cancellation was used, not loss or attenuation, I assumed the question was related to two or more sources being heard or measured at one location (this could include echoes from a single source). Not sure if that helps or hurts my feeble explanation of what could have been happening. Hope we helped the questioner

    More like speed of light in a wire… roughly.

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    Senior Member Uncle Paul's Avatar
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    IIRC from my tech school days, electricity travels about 90% of the speed of light. That's about 165,000 miles per second or 871,000,000 feet per second (VERY rough numbers). If the long cable ran to the Moon and back that would be an audible three second delay. Even several feet would not induce an audible or likely not measurable delay.

    I am certain that a Golden Ear somewhere would hear it, or at least claim to...

    Aesthetically, though, it would bug the crap out of me to be even an inch off. Part of my enjoyment is how things look in addition to how they sound. When I make speaker cables I use pants, heat shrink, purdy cable sleeves that cover the word Belden a hundred times and even bright shiny spades that are electrically as effective as the cheapo crimp on ones at home depot.
    "Zobel is as zobel does"

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    Senior Member RMC's Avatar
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    Don't worry about boss, was simply a little humour marking your introduction in a new role here as i understand it. Hopefully you'll still have some spare time, in between issues, to visit the crowd as you did here...

    The OP's original title was "Speed of sound", later became "Speed of sound... in a wire" as i now see. I was lured by the speed of sound title hence the delay aspect shown, which btw didn't change the fact "I think i'm with the new boss".

    The speed of light in a wire also crossed my mind since electricity in a wire isn't in itself speed of sound, but i didn't change my post (the carrots were already cooked).

    Richard
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    Quote Originally Posted by maxserg View Post
    For those good on maths a question. What would be the delay between two channels if I had 6 feet difference in speaker câble length delay wise and high frequency cancellation?Hope my question is clear!
    If you're going to sweat the delay for 6' of speaker cable, you may also want to loose sleep over the difference in wire resistance and capacitance and their effect on the frquency response.

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    Senior Member grumpy's Avatar
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    "marking your introduction in a new role here as i understand it"

    New fearless leader? news to me ... (and not me).

    I'm with Uncle Paul though... aesthetically, I want my speaker cables to be the same length.
    It just feels better.

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    Moderator hjames's Avatar
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    I think Grumpy of AudioKarma fame (the so-called "new Boss" ??) is different than our Grumpy here on Lansing Heritage ...


    Quote Originally Posted by grumpy View Post
    "marking your introduction in a new role here as i understand it"

    New fearless leader? news to me ... (and not me).

    I'm with Uncle Paul though... aesthetically, I want my speaker cables to be the same length.
    It just feels better.
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    That story came from one person who claim that would be phase différence for on the side with 6 Moore feet longer! I told him no difference! But he continued to argue…So thanks guys for your answers and… humor!😁

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    Senior Member grumpy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by hjames View Post
    I think Grumpy of AudioKarma fame (the so-called "new Boss" ??) is different than our Grumpy here on Lansing Heritage ...
    Ah. Makes sense. Haven't experienced that mixup for many years... but enough of that. Congrats/condolences to whomever is willing to herd the cats.

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    Quote Originally Posted by grumpy View Post
    Ah. Makes sense. Haven't experienced that mixup for many years... but enough of that. Congrats/condolences to whomever is willing to herd the cats.
    Easy mistake and one I made when first joining AudioKarma. Did you ever finish those nice furniture-grade, 18" cabinets from San Diego?

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