The old JBL 2245 has always been recognised as being very musical but do any of the modern transducers surpass its performance. Has to be obtainable of course. I cross up to a pair of 1400pros.
The old JBL 2245 has always been recognised as being very musical but do any of the modern transducers surpass its performance. Has to be obtainable of course. I cross up to a pair of 1400pros.
I feel the newer ones are better. Higher power handling, longer vmax, etc. I think the 2242h was superior in every way.
I would use them for PA use though. So many 2245 failed out on the road that reconing was a regular thing.
I don't have much experience in the house. So what's you intended use?
I was amazed to get my hands on the 2258h and see it perform. It's so light I can't believe it. So then the 2268, 2278, 2269, 2279, and now the 2288 I haven't got my hands on. I've read of flaws like distortion or high heat loss of performance. I'm guessing that in the house, you wouldn't see the full benefits or even these possible flaws?
I want to try a unit in my 4 way active HiFi system.Originally Posted by engineerjoe
I feel the newer ones are better. Higher power handling, longer vmax, etc. I think the 2242h was superior in every way.I would use them for PA use though. So many failed out on the road that reconing was a regular thing. I don't have much experience in the house. So what's you intended use?I was amazed to get my hands on the 2258h and see it perform. It's so light I can't believe it. So then the 2268, 2278, 2269, 2279, and now the 2288 I haven't got my hands on. I've read of flaws like distortion or high heat loss of performance. I'm guessing that in the house, you wouldn't see the full benefits or even these possible flaws?
Define better? If you want more bomb proof then the newer woofers are hands down better, if you want more hi-fi... that's subjective, but you might prefer the 2269. It is the woofer that Kevin Voecks based his ultimate subwoofer on. Admittedly he was able to have Harman's transducer engineers rework the driver into a different beast, but is was similar to the 2269.
Widget
I would disagree with any negative thoughts on the 15" if I could. I would just give this example. A friend (concert business partner) and I went to a local theater to see Asia years ago. I had heard Clair Bros. systems before. I'm pretty sure they were there for this concert again using their S4 cabs. For those that don't know, they have all JBL drivers, 18", 10", 2" and super tweets.
The second the concert started and all the way thru, the sound was amazing. The vocals were crisp and clear. No fatigue listening to any freq. Full rich warm sounds. If I close my eyes, 30++, some years later, I swear I can still hear that concert. I can only give an analogy that it was like you were part of the band and the speakers were connected to you directly. They didn't sound tonal, or colored in any way. I couldn't distinguish the sources of the sounds, like horns and cone woofers.
From then on, my opinion of 18" woofers totally changed. I used to dismiss them earlier as being too muddy or colored, from the old W bins I heard. No one I knew of ever had them in their house. Hearing them in that theater makes me think you are right about them. Of course, all the stars need to align with time alignment, room resonance, etc., to be like that night in the theater. My old PA system built after that concert, my new PA system I'm building now, both have 18"s for the lows. I have had great success with them choosing the correct crossover freq. (and power) to help get them dialed in. I still like my old JBL 15"s for their overall versatility and output. I do use 18"s in my PA so I can't make a stand here.
Wait! I do now have a new JBL studio 550p 10" sub in my living room so I am open to change!…. and it's almost broken in.
Thanks Widget, my guess is that its the law of dinminishing returns and subjective. I cross the 2245s fairly high 160hz so it's a difficult act to better. I found the change from the 2123 to the 1400pro a huge improvement.
I agree with Widget you could go with a 2242 use the same box and tuning. But unless you are really pushing them hard I don't know how much benefit there would be.
Rob
"I could be arguing in my spare time"
I absolutely love mine!!! I have four of them stacked and I've yet to hear a better home-stereo subwoofer. To be fair, my room is acoustically treated with bass traps and other devices, but still, most high end subs I've heard don't seem to go nearly as low or as taught.
Would 2x15 inch per side be a better option as per the Everest? I find the efficientcy of the 2245s fine and believe they are more Hifi than the 2242s?
Probably a matter of taste here. I find the 15" version to be tighter and more punchy (up slightly higher freq towards 100). I find the 18" to be deeper ( closer to 40hz). IMO, the trouble is that with some music, the deeper 18" can be tiring to listen to for longer periods. Like a loudness button on a receiver, it's needed sometimes, and not other times.
I think that set to proper levels, both can be quite good. You can enhance a 15" so that with your eyes closed, you would think it's an 18".
I feel that an 18" sounds like an 18". Great, but not the same as a 15". Make any sense?
Notice that some of the subs out there are using 10". It's easier to enhance the bottom (in smaller rooms). It's harder to get that quick higher punchiness. Just my opinion here which maybe is not proper on this type of forum.
You must be talking about 2226H and 2242H drivers? I personally am not keen on them for hi-fi applications.
I have compared dual 2235H and single 2245H and the output is similar, though subjectively I preferred the sound quality of the 2245H.
In my experience a true extended low end response is never a bad thing. An exaggerated bottom end, say above 50Hz or so can get annoying, but having a properly balanced low end into the 20s is awesome when the material calls for it and is non-existent when the material doesn't have that content.
Widget
Yes, well very close. I forget the number exactly? I think they were 2205/6? 15" in my old JBL scoops? I ran E130/140s in my low mids. I forget what was in the folded horns used by others. I just ran them in clubs. The cabinets (and type of delivery) were big factors I'm sure. I got to try other's equipment when we went into "in house" systems.
Every once in awhile I would fire them up in a house or our warehouse for testing. I did later acquire 2225/6s.
I later toured with a sound system (w/INXS) that had Martin bins on the lows. They would fill an auditorium with bass and punch you in the gut in any seat. Again, was definitely the cabinet coming into play. I'm pretty sure they had both 15"s and 18"s for the bottoms. I never got any info on crossover points as I was just working for the warm up act for most of the '97 tour.
BTW I find your posts very interesting and always accurate with stuff I agree with. I'm not sucking up here. I'm just saying what I read.
I will bow out as again, I don't have a lot of home experience with this stuff. I have had it in my hands most of my life and feel like I should know what it does well.
Thanks
As the well known quote goes, "Opinions are like... everybody's got one."
These days I try to make it clear when I post an opinion that may not be widely held, versus those that are nearly universally held.
While I still agree with many of my older posts, I do sometimes wonder what the heck I was thinking 10-15 years ago... or last week.
Widget
After reading this thread so far I have to ask this question.I just sold my 2245s after abandoning my 4345 project because I'm planning on downsizing. So what are some recommendations for a compact woofer to complement my L300s that are using 2235Hs? Any ideas without spending a fortune? Thanks.
Tom
Hi Tom,After reading this thread so far I have to ask this question.
Tom
I think, looking from the hi-fi point of view, that it would be very, very difficult to get better driver, then 2231/2235 which is L300 bass driver, reproducing almost down to 30Hz.
regards
ivica
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