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Thread: Modifying L150A's for bi amp use - Technical advice needed!

  1. #16
    Administrator Mr. Widget's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DerekTheGreat View Post
    You're the same guy I referenced in a similar thread about biamping
    Indeed, I think about 5 or 600 watts would do it, but I need a recommendation of which amp or amp preamp combo would give me the warm, sweet sound I like from my Marantz 510M & 3600 preamp combo. I don't really want to move away from that as I built it to channel my father. And as for replacing the 150A's, that's a possibility, although they'd go downstairs. I've got close to $3k in them, so selling them would hurt my butt just wayyy too much at this point and I do like the sound quite a bit. There are plenty of L7's for sale though. I was looking to maybe purchase a set of XPL-200A's in the distant future to replace the L150A's...
    If your Marantz 510M is operating properly, when those peak lamps flicker, you are hitting peaks well over 300 watts. Any more power would likely result in virtually inaudible SPL increase, likely additional power compression, and eventual speaker damage.

    I would suggest you have likely hit the zenith for these speakers, and to move beyond your current performance plateau will require looking at alternative loudspeakers. You can certainly tweak the sound of your L150s by swapping caps, tweaking the networks, etc. While this may be fun and somewhat satisfying, you won’t appreciably “improve” them.

    If you have the space for another system, I’d look in that direction.

    FWIW: I used to own the 3800 and 510 without meters. They eventually went into a triamped system. That speaker system was a ground up DIY system and was loads of fun, and it was really a fundamental cornerstone of my speaker design learning process. FWIW: I worked on that system in the early 1980s.


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  2. #17
    Member DerekTheGreat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Widget View Post
    If your Marantz 510M is operating properly, when those peak lamps flicker, you are hitting peaks well over 300 watts. Any more power would likely result in virtually inaudible SPL increase, likely additional power compression, and eventual speaker damage...

    ...FWIW: I used to own the 3800 and 510 without meters. They eventually went into a triamped system. That speaker system was a ground up DIY system and was loads of fun, and it was really a fundamental cornerstone of my speaker design learning process. FWIW: I worked on that system in the early 1980s.


    Widget
    Sourced from this site:
    It provides insight from Marantz regarding those peak lights: https://stereonomono.blogspot.com/20...del-510-m.html

    "...Marantz tells us their design intent on the peak load indication system was to indicate the approach of clipping on peak transients, rather than an actual clipping situation. Thus, the system should not be considered as indicating an overdrive situation, as the LEDs will light up before actual clipping. the system tracks the power supply voltage so it will always give the same warning margin that clipping is approaching, regardless of the AC power line variations. While the circuit turns on in microseconds, the "hold" portion of the circuit keeps the LEDs lit long enough so they can be seen by the eye. The system indicates an actual overload condition by staying on more or less continually. Thus, 510 users should consider occasional flashing of the LEDs as full use of the normal operating range."

    But yes, I was concerned about the lights flickering at first until I came upon that. I don't run the system so that they're ever illuminated steadily. It is an experiment for sure, and should something blow up (hopefully just a tweeter) I'll replace it and then use my subwoofer to handle everything 50hz and below, using my equalizer to take the load of the 510M. Experimentation already shows that makes a noticeable decrease in flicker rate.

    You wouldn't still happen to have that 510M would you? I'd love to have it, or parts for that matter. The one I have has a dead VU meter, not that I use them, just would like it to be 100% operational.

    I do not have the space for another system.. I am looking at L7's... But I love the sound and aesthetics of these L150A's and really want to generate personal experience to save me from this mental anguish in the future: to try and modify the passive crossover to support biamping, acquire another 510M, throw it into the mix and see what happens.

    Orr, might you recommend a nice & mellow 500watt+ monster amp to use in place of my 510M? At least I'll still have the 3600 preamp driving it...

  3. #18
    Administrator Mr. Widget's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DerekTheGreat View Post
    Orr, might you recommend a nice & mellow 500watt+ monster amp to use in place of my 510M? At least I'll still have the 3600 preamp driving it...
    I am very familiar with the Marantz amp, and when I was a lot younger and arguably MORE foolish, I had the peak indicators flashing regularly.

    Regarding your 3600, I sold off my 3800 after a couple of years and moved up to a Threshold NS10 preamp... it was a very noticeable step up.

    Regarding mellow monster amps, I currently use a pair of Parasound JC-1s. They are rated at 450 watts into 8 ohms and have massive reserves. They were discontinued last year so you may find a used pair at a fairly reasonable price. I actually haven't paid attention. When new they were $9000 a pair so they are probably still a bit too steep.

    All that aside, I really don't think lacking power is your issue. You have a very competent amplifier there.


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  4. #19
    Member DerekTheGreat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Widget View Post
    I am very familiar with the Marantz amp, and when I was a lot younger and arguably MORE foolish, I had the peak indicators flashing regularly.

    Regarding your 3600, I sold off my 3800 after a couple of years and moved up to a Threshold NS10 preamp... it was a very noticeable step up.

    Regarding mellow monster amps, I currently use a pair of Parasound JC-1s. They are rated at 450 watts into 8 ohms and have massive reserves. They were discontinued last year so you may find a used pair at a fairly reasonable price. I actually haven't paid attention. When new they were $9000 a pair so they are probably still a bit too steep.

    All that aside, I really don't think lacking power is your issue. You have a very competent amplifier there.


    Widget
    Noted. Thank you for your responses and wisdom. It's appreciated.

    OOoo yeah, too steep for my blood and probably will be for life I'm afraid. If I could score something like that for $2k or less I'd jump on it. This year I've got a lot planned for the house so the hi-fi budget will most likely take a back seat. However, drafting up a wish list costs nothing so when I'm ready, that would become a reality.

    Thank you for the approval on the 510M, you're the first who hasn't told me to trash it. Compared to everything else I have to compare it to, my ears prefer it. And as mentioned, it is in place for sentimental reasons. I didn't expect to get so enthralled with music but so it goes..

  5. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Widget View Post
    ......Regarding mellow monster amps, I currently use a pair of Parasound JC-1s. They are rated at 450 watts into 8 ohms and have massive reserves. They were discontinued last year so you may find a used pair at a fairly reasonable price......
    Widget
    I was surprised to read this and was going to ask you if Parasound was stepping back, but I just read about the NEW model JC-1. Definitely not stepping back. I like their amplifiers.

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