Page 12 of 14 FirstFirst ... 21011121314 LastLast
Results 166 to 180 of 208

Thread: Building my dream system, need lots of advise!

  1. #166
    Senior Member 1audiohack's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    Las Vegas Nevada
    Posts
    2,794
    I have heard very few systems that couldnít be improved upon with the proper addition of a 2123.

    Barry.
    If we knew what the hell we were doing, we wouldn't call it research would we.

  2. #167
    Administrator Robh3606's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2003
    Location
    Rocinante
    Posts
    8,181
    I have heard very few systems that couldnít be improved upon with the proper addition of a 2123.
    Yeah I really like those mega midrange drivers be it the 2108, 2122 or 2123. They can really add some snap in there!

    Rob
    "I could be arguing in my spare time"

  3. #168
    Senior Member jmpsmash's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2019
    Location
    Santa Clara, CA
    Posts
    181
    Quote Originally Posted by 1audiohack View Post
    I have heard very few systems that couldnít be improved upon with the proper addition of a 2123.

    Barry.
    I had to parse that a few times.... and still hope that's not what you meant.

  4. #169
    Senior Member jmpsmash's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2019
    Location
    Santa Clara, CA
    Posts
    181
    Quote Originally Posted by jmpsmash View Post
    I had to parse that a few times.... and still hope that's not what you meant.
    oh. pardon my poor comprehension of English. *NOW* I think (I hope) I understand what you meant.

    Initially, I thought you meant:

    I have heard very few systems that couldnít be improved upon after the proper addition of a 2123


  5. #170
    Senior Member 1audiohack's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    Las Vegas Nevada
    Posts
    2,794
    Sorry for being a goof.

    I absolutely love the 2123. I am a dynamics nut and the clear reality the 2123 so easily delivers makes me want to use them in every system I build.

    I have 10 more 2123Hís on the recone bench right now. It will be a sad day when these are no longer available.

    Barry.
    If we knew what the hell we were doing, we wouldn't call it research would we.

  6. #171
    Senior Member pos's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Location
    Paris, France
    Posts
    2,577
    Hey Barry, I'll take the opportunity to ask you something, as I trust your option/taste on those things.
    I know you love both the 2020H and 2123H, but what about the 2012H then?

  7. #172
    Senior Member jmpsmash's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2019
    Location
    Santa Clara, CA
    Posts
    181
    Hi Barry, that's a great endorsement for the 2123. I got lucky to find a pair on local CL a couple of months ago. They were brand new sealed in box, the seller (a nice gentleman) won't cutoff the sealing tape before I committed to paying.

    What in your experience would be considered a "proper addition" ? I plugged the TS param in and came up with a 0.5cu ft sealed box. I bumped it up to 0.67cu ft to account for the driver volume. I hope I am not that far off. It will be cut off around 250-300Hz at the bottom end. As for the top end, I will experiment with the 2397 before deciding, I have a whole lot more leeway there.

  8. #173
    Senior Member Ian Mackenzie's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2003
    Location
    Australia
    Posts
    7,365
    Quote Originally Posted by Robh3606 View Post
    Yeah I really like those mega midrange drivers be it the 2108, 2122 or 2123. They can really add some snap in there!

    Rob
    They are all discontinued drivers now. The 2123 was used in numerous SR installations and they are now popping up readily on eBay.

    I have heard them in rows of four in fixed installs with dual 2397ís and dual 15ís and itís nice.

    In the monitors you have to dial them each in with a good measurement set up and a simulator to make them work properly.

    If you search the 2123 there are a number of threads on the correct sealed enclosures, Xmax limits and differences with the other 10ís. As to using them
    Properly it requires the right tool and knowing how to use them. The limitation being most people use an RTA figure out whatís going on which does not have anything like the required resolution.

    I have read posts claiming the 2216nd supersedes the application of there 2123. In a Jbl designed system l am sure they both have admirers. But often these claim comes from reading someoneís opinions without actually having heard either or ever having had any experience with either.

    You really have to try these drivers yourself. Opinions are just opinions.

  9. #174
    Senior Member 1audiohack's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    Las Vegas Nevada
    Posts
    2,794
    Hello Thomas!

    You will laugh, I have never had any 2012ís. I look from time to time for them but havenít bought any.

    I recone just about everything I use and since JBL quality isnít what it used to be in the voice coil department, I try to build at least six at a time and 10-12 if possible so I can match pairs.

    I never see 2012ís as cores or in any quantity dang it.

    Barry.
    If we knew what the hell we were doing, we wouldn't call it research would we.

  10. #175
    Senior Member 1audiohack's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    Las Vegas Nevada
    Posts
    2,794
    Hello jmp!

    .5 to .65 cubic feet sealed filled with light loose fiberglass is the sweet spot for 2123ís when they are used like we are discussing as an upper mid bass / midrange.

    While the 2123 will play lower than 250 Hz it doesnít play with authority down there and I consider 250 the lower limit. With such a good woofer as the 2216 I would experiment with a little higher crossover to see what you like.

    A friend and I have a project going together with 2216Ndís, 2123Hís and 4338 horns with 2451SLís and I am voicing a system with 2245ís, 2123ís and 4338 and 2451SLís right now.

    When we get to voicing the 2216/2123ís I will share what we end up with there. I expect these drivers to be excellent together.

    Barry.
    If we knew what the hell we were doing, we wouldn't call it research would we.

  11. #176
    Senior Member jmpsmash's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2019
    Location
    Santa Clara, CA
    Posts
    181
    Great. Looks like I am right on for the box alignment.

    I think the 2216ND1 while can go up to 1kHz, it doesn't sound good up there. I look forward to hear what the 2123H can do.

    As for the 2397 baffle. I have an idea how to do it. it will take a good weekend of work which means it will have to wait a little while.

    I have to do more detail measurement. I meant to do the 2216ND1 dispersion measurement last weekend but was side tracked with other stuff.

    I will test out the 2216ND1/2123H/2397/etc combo first, get a good sense of how they sound, and then start doing improvement to make it perfect.

    This weekend's goal is to measure 2123H and measure 2216ND1. From that, I can figure out what crossover point will blend them well together, and then I can readjust with ears. Should be a fun weekend.

    Barry, look forward to hearing your findings too.

  12. #177
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Location
    Germany / Hamburg
    Posts
    629
    When using the 2123 midbass, you propably end up with a little higher crossover on the 2397. I guess something between 1,0-1,2khz....
    When using the 2216 woofer your crossover was around 0,8khz, right?

    The additional baffle for the 2397 should be much more important with the lower crossover.
    Maybe the higher crossover makes this additional baffle redundant...

  13. #178
    Senior Member jmpsmash's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2019
    Location
    Santa Clara, CA
    Posts
    181
    I think so. With the 2216ND1, the range is limited, I didn't like the sound of the 2216ND1 when pushed up to 1kHz, and 800Hz is stressing the 2397/2241 a little. With the more capable upper range of the 2123H, I have more option/headroom up in the 1kHz+ range.

    Or to put it another way, more stuff to play with.

  14. #179
    Senior Member Ian Mackenzie's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2003
    Location
    Australia
    Posts
    7,365
    300-1200 hertz is ideal for the 2123H.

    I would use the 2397 (vertical on axis) as the design point for the crossover and start with LR24 for the 2123H pass band.

    You can apply delay on the 2123H to get the crossover point smooth on axis. But the off axis nulls are always going to be a compromise. I would measure the 2397 +-10 degrees off axis vertically to see what its doing at 2 metres. Same with the 2123H.

    The 2123H relatively smooth but will require some shaping in the 800-1200 hertz region.

    With the Fostex perched atop the 2397 your going to be sitting down to listen to this anyway. I would go with 7000-8000 hertz and 3rd order slopes for the 2397 and the Fostex. The 2441/2397 should be the dominant driver your listening to. The 2123H and the Fostex just clean up and top and bottom of the 2397.

    If the 2397 still bothers you then you need to start looking at the Yuichi A290 or the FL version. The Tad TH4001 clones on Ebay are another option.

    Edit
    I suggest you keep this an all active affair and perhaps grab a minidsp HD 4 way module to get you started. If it all works out you can use the mini dsp settings for a better crossover later on.

  15. #180
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Location
    Germany / Hamburg
    Posts
    629
    How do you like those 2123īs ?

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Similar Threads

  1. Building a speaker system from bottom up
    By mortron in forum Lansing Product Technical Help
    Replies: 12
    Last Post: 07-20-2019, 02:43 PM
  2. Building a CC 3145 Crossover for my 4345s need advise
    By Ricpan in forum Lansing Product DIY Forum
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: 11-23-2017, 07:09 AM
  3. Dream system coming together, an update.
    By Doc Mark in forum Lansing Product DIY Forum
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: 08-03-2008, 10:13 AM
  4. The DIY dream -system
    By Niklas Nord in forum Lansing Product General Information
    Replies: 4
    Last Post: 07-17-2004, 10:14 PM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •