Revisiting "Imaging"

[toddalin]

Hi Todd,

Can you a post a recording with wave file and stereo mics?

I don't have the capability. My recordings are done with a Nikon D750 DSLR taken at the approximate sweet spot. Obviously the stereo mics in the camera don't allow for much separation.

[Ian Mackenzie]

[Quote]

Quote Originally Posted by toddalin View Post
As I noted before, if you listen to Emerson, or lots of piano pieces, you hear the strings laid out infront of you and you hear the notes "bounce" from string to string left to right infront of you. This is never something you would hear in the rear world, but this is what the mics hear, and this is what I want to hear. I don't want to just hear someone playing the piano infront of me as in a piano bar.

Hello Todd;

Don’t you think that depends on where you are listening from? The polar responses of instruments are sometimes predictable but not always.

If you are at the keys, if the lid is open and the music rack is laid down you will certainly hear the piano low left to high right, just as you describe. I quite like that too.

In my youth I (kinda) played trombone, percussion and piano. I would way rather hear a trombone from the mouthpiece than the front. At least up close. (:

Barry.

Hi Barry,

You make a very good point. Looking at Todd’s post Todd is referring to the mic technique used to record a piano. Presumably two mics. I agree that the production values of a recording can be preferred to hearing a piano live but 25 yards back in the audience.

Being a percussion instrument a piano has a certain dynamic quality where the keys are felt as well as heard. As they say you can pick a live piano in a mall or walking past a house when someone is practicing. You loose that sitting a way back in the audience.

But what l think you’re talking about is the listening location at home relative to the loudspeakers. Are you near, mid or far field? And what is the impact on a piano recorded in this manner? Thats a bit tricky to figure out. But if the recording engineer did it with nearfield monitors and he then checked it with mid field monitors you would have to reason that the listening position would be mid field. I say this because the engineer generally does the mix for the formats being used. The point is who listens near field at home?

I hope that makes some sense.

I totally agree with Todd’s point.

Adding to the mix is that Todd has a dipole loudspeaker depending on how he used the AMT. This may well be the X factor in Todd’s descriptions of his system.

Because no two recordings are alike the recording is the most significant dependency on the production values as far as soundstage and imaging.

The job of monitors and loudspeakers at home is to translate those production values with minimal errors. Of the loudspeakers at home embellish certain traits and it’s to the listeners liking then it’s a success story. If you don’t accept the descriptions as posted that’s your problem.

All this would be much easier to discuss (translate) in a webinar which is something l am looking at on my new audio site.

[Ian Mackenzie]

Hello Ian,

Basically Widget is correct. In the case of the Array 1400, the drivers are aligned in the best way for an in polarity hookup through the crossover topology I chose. To have the drivers completely aligned, the horn would have had to move backwards by one complete wavelength at 800 Hz, making a non practical setup. Of course the UHF is in another time zone.

As for imaging, time alignment has little to do with it. Minimum diffraction enclosures which are extremely vibration free, system matching in terms of response and phase from the left to right channel and super narrow baffles are the most important issues.

The Arrays are easily at the top of their pay grade. They have their set of compromises as do all speakers. There is no perfect loudspeaker, nor will there be in the long term.

Widget is also correct in stating that perfect time alignment can only happen in one spot if the system has multiple drivers. CoAx speakers can sometimes do better in this regard, but are not very capable is most other regards.

Greg

[Robh3606]

Hello Ian

Glad you reached out to Greg. I am going to add this to the System Information on the 1400. It also clearly shows Greg's opinion of the importance of Time Alignment WRT imaging.

Rob