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  1. #361
    Senior Member RMC's Avatar
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    Sea,

    My periodical search for acceptable phones has been a big disappointment, but i'm not desperate to the point of getting 99 cents store cans. Might have one gram of faith left in this adventure. I'll see what dealer has to say for Canadian pricing on the Fostex RP. Maybe a deal like the Tascam CD? Not holding my breath though... and they might also have no stock! Soccer ball for the HD25 Light could end up being the right thing...

  2. #362
    Senior Member RMC's Avatar
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    Might not need a soccer ball to "salvage" the Sennheiser HD25L phones after all, wife's household stuff to the rescue...

    Asked boss during lunch if we have a soccer ball or similar, but she gave all we had to young family who bought the house next to us, daughter being an adult.. but i'm still a kid! Well, she's a resourceful lady having me look at a couple of things she has in absence of a ball.

    Some would entail too much phones stretching to my liking, don't want to damage the Sens either. Then comes an old plastic mixer bowl she rarely uses. Looks like a good candidate to reduce phone's ear compression, making them more comfy. They're already light and sound is ok.

    Makes a nice sporty looking bowl with phones on it, or a somewhat weird looking headphones holder, depending on view, LOL. Not perfect but pretty good, might well do the job. Guess Sennheiser now has a new model, the "HD25L mixer bowl", lol. Gotta do what you have to do, if it works that's what matters. (2 pics)

    HD 25 Light still exists but specs changed a bit. Most notable to me is while the ones on-hand were made in Western Europe, the newer version doesn't seem, think its in low-cost Eastern Europe or Asia. Product Code number and country of origin (2 pics) has changed for almost the same headphones (now Article No. 508664) as seen on Sennheiser Canada. Depending on which unit one would rather have, product code number is your friend.

    After hours on their new "bowl stand" tried them on shortly and seems like a good improvement. Will phones revert back to initial ear compression++ or will they soften for good with time spent on stretching? (For wife question might be: will she ever see her old mixer bowl again? lol). Don't want to keep it forever either.

    Any clue/advice on how long should "bowl treatment" of phones go on for? Once in a while, always when not in use, few hours here and there, only an hour before using them, etc? Thanks.

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  3. #363
    Senior Member RMC's Avatar
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    Noted some manufacturers (e.g. Fane Acoustics, Peerless, etc.) deleted from their Web site tech info related to older drivers. With new drivers being added, carrying info for the old ones too makes things "heavier" and costing money i guess for more server space.

    Not a good trend for any heritage... They seem to be keeping the recent past, drivers discontinued not very long ago, but apart from this haven't seen more info for the manufacturers i checked! Things not going in the right direction.

    On the other hand the used gear listings on LHF, EBay, etc., or equipment people already own, show nice old stuff. So audiophiles considering a legacy purchase, or have bought one already, are sometimes left with little or no data available, having to ask left and right to get it, sometimes with little success.

    The beauty with paper it survives all along, yeah love paper. Plus a number of well made drivers can have a very long life, longer than manufacturers would prefer (to sell a replacement), or longer than they'd like to keep the spec sheet alive...

    Had a 90's Solen catalog and when i got their 2004 or so edition shown here (last one printed it seems) i threw away the older one, dumb me... but did keep the 90's pages for the drivers on-hand (still own most). These pages cover a few more models since there's usually two drivers per page, but that's about it though. Haven't thrown away any other stuff since...

    That catalog deals with every brand and thing Solen sold back then and probably some more since there are manufacturer models they didn't necessarily stock and sell, but are shown in the catalog.

    As thick as 500 sheets of copier paper, its printed on both sides, so a thousand pages and a LOT of tech data, some getting harder to find, other simply doesn't exist anymore, due to server cleanup mania... Erased!

    Keep your old paper catalogs, brochures, tech sheets, you may still need them sooner than later for legacy gear...

    As a bonus you get a full page clear pic of some Peerless driver specs and TS as compiled by Solen (there's another half-page of it). Note their address top left is the old one, and the Made in Denmark for Peerless top right is a thing of the past (China now). Peerless being used here as an example only. Another post will follow soon.

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  4. #364
    Senior Member RMC's Avatar
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    British Fane Acoustics is another example of driver data deletion. Stop supporting gear is an increasing trend.

    They've been making speaker components for 50+ years. Over time they made a whole lot of models. Looking at their archives today its surprising how little there is, not going back far. The 41 cone drivers archived (plus horns) may seem like many however its nothing compared to what they manufactured. Those 41 are the models discontinued not that long ago, but whole driver series have simply vanished. Data missing for the Crescendos, Classics, Studios, Custom/OEMs, some Colossus series, etc. representing numerous drivers.

    Fane was distributed in the US for a while, not anymore it seems, but there might still be used drivers available there. They remain present in Europe, Asia, Canada, etc. A US member told me before he used some Fane drivers, comp. driver/horn and/or tweeters (can't remember exactly), he mentioned liking them. I have a couple Fane too.

    About mid 80's Fane issued a nice book of enclosure plans indicating for each design driver models that can be used, along with a typical response curve with one of the woofers. Which of the 3-5 drivers mentioned is the most suitable? What would be LF response using another woofer among the 3-5 suggested? Hard to say, specs and TS are gone for the ones in the plans. With specs/TS one could "cross-reference" in other brands (find equivalent).

    Fane provided drivers to a number of companies, like Turbosound for sound reinforcement, as well as to Hiwatt and Trace Elliot for guitar cabs as e.g. Here the most interesting aspect is Fane made a spec sheet for the Custom Range, which includes 21 OEM cone drivers. JBL sold drivers to OEMs in the past but can't recall seeing a specific tech sheet grouping them in one place like Fane did, also indicating which model or part number they replace.

    OEM parts don't always come with a technical pedigree of the device. My impression is that if one has the opportunity to purchase or pull out cone drivers from an older Turbosound cab for example, with their model or part number we might be able to trace its specs and TS to use it in another enclosure (DIY). Maybe not for more recent Turbosound cabs since sometime ago it was purchased by Behringer which has a habit of using China mfr.

    While a number of manufacturers show interest in shortening their heritage/legacy, i'd prefer to extend it when possible. Simply because this gives people more choices/options to consider. When one is limited by gear availability (some JBL are hard to find) or by budget constraints its nice to have alternatives, even to be able to mix component brands if need be. Data availability is the key though.

    Therefore if your project is not moving because of lack of info or some part(s) and you're considering other brands to fill the gap(s), such as used Fane driver(s), well i've kept my Fane paper documentation going back a few decades, including specs and TS for many of them. In case you can't find Fane driver(s) tech info you're looking for on their Web site let me know here, i may be able to help. Useful in deciding to buy or not to buy an older/used.

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  5. #365
    Senior Member SEAWOLF97's Avatar
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    doing some cleaning and discovered that I own one of these (web pic)

    no idea how/when I acquired
    Attached Images Attached Images  
    I know my life would look all right ..
    if I could see it on the silver screen

  6. #366
    Senior Member RMC's Avatar
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    Wolf,

    I remember these, nice amp, don't know how you do it but you always end up having the gear i like, BGW, ADS, etc... No idea? Simple it just rains on you lucky guy...

  7. #367
    Senior Member SEAWOLF97's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RMC View Post
    Wolf,

    I remember these, nice amp, don't know how you do it but you always end up having the gear i like, BGW, ADS, etc... No idea? Simple it just rains on you lucky guy...
    I was/am searching for a certain MD deck for a customer . haven't located it, but did find a better one.

    Also a couple of Nak decks that went quickly ... 9 TT's and not sure how many receivers

    Did not even look into audio graveyard #2 (ie: bedroom #3) yet.
    I know my life would look all right ..
    if I could see it on the silver screen

  8. #368
    Senior Member RMC's Avatar
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    Yeah, must be some nice stuff hidden in that other bedroom graveyard... Can't designate any bedroom as an "audio graveyard", i could get killed for this! But i do admit trespassing on laundry room, basement living room, the cat's room! anywhere in the basement boss hasn't mentioned as a red line... yet.

    Wouldn't "Gear Wolf" be more suitable than Seawolf? Since you're not getting your feet wet anymore (off Navy ship) but rather getting your ears full of music.

    Btw Fostex RP phones $200. + taxes here. Dealer can't give me a good deal on them, only a small discount, maker and distributor don't want to see them being discounted, they keep a relatively rigid price structure to prevent that. Don't like commercial politics, product's image, dealers' margins, limited distribution, reduced competition sort of thing. So i'd try to stay away from that, plus phones weight.

    Keep "doctoring" the Sen HD25 light. They go back to ear compression even after days on the "mixer bowl" stretcher, can wear them 30-60 min (better than before) and then they get too tight again. Small trick i use is to wear them a little more forward than centered on the ear, helps somewhat comfort wise and since they have say 2 db extra bass, wearing them forward a bit reduces LF just enough to take care of that issue. For now wife isn't getting mixer bowl back, lol

    RE post # 363 second pic (Peerless), opened the catalog randomly for a pic of the type of driver info per page but hadn't realized (remembered) they made 2" dome midrange drivers, shown on the right page. Not as good looking as the ADS model, but still. Looked again at the older catalog and on the next page saw they even had a third dome mid, this one was somewhat horn-loaded for increased sensitivity. Interesting finds from the past, not sure they still make dome mids at all, seached today in the present Web catalog and found none...

  9. #369
    Senior Member SEAWOLF97's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RMC View Post
    Wouldn't "Gear Wolf" be more suitable than Seawolf? Since you're not getting your feet wet anymore (off Navy ship) but rather getting your ears full of music..
    I just use an old Navy callsign
    ( https://www.kpbs.org/news/2018/sep/1...ble-seawolves/ ) .... yup, GW would be more appropriate , but set in my ways.

    have been ordered by SWMBO to start divesting and NOT acquire more (easy to comply , since supply has dried up)
    I know my life would look all right ..
    if I could see it on the silver screen

  10. #370
    Senior Member RMC's Avatar
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    RE "have been ordered by SWMBO to start divesting and NOT acquire more"

    OH! When boss says this, it doesn't look good for your stockpiles... Not getting more i can understand, though sadly won't be seeing any new interesting finds from you

    But divesting? For my part can't consider that option, its "part and parcel" of me, would be like losing an arm and a leg at the same time!

    Hopefully you'll be able to keep enough to still have fun...

  11. #371
    Senior Member RMC's Avatar
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    Received wednesday from Solen Asian Hi-Vi Research tweeters on sale about half price i ordered. Nice 1" textile dome, and a metal faceplate. The number of mounting holes on that plate might be what scares people, hence the clearance pricing?

    Had prior look at tech sheet and these will be perfect for another pair of small satellite speakers i want to add, having already some small SB Acoustics (Europe) woofers to go along with those tweets.

    For $11.78 Can (around $8-9. US) its a good deal for such hi-fi application or similar one. They had 10 in stock, now down to 8. Each unit has the same serial number indicating it might be a matched pair??

    They show being grey on Solen and Mfr spec sheet but i received black ones, even prefer that, since all my diy cabs are painted white which makes a nice contrast when having black drivers on a white cab, like that.

    Not high power HF stuff, but not the objective here anyway. More interested in good sounding than gross output. Sensitivity rated 91 db but 2.83V at 4 ohm is 2W, for 1W this would mean 88 db. Might still have to pad these a little. Being 30W units, each will produce 103 db, and a pair 106 db, which is enough for small satellites. Can biamp them with the 2214H cabs for a 3rd way.

    The recommended xo above 2khz is too optimistic, realistically should rather be 3+ khz in view of tweeter Fs. Plan to use 18 db/oct., instead of 12 db/oct. crossover, at least on the high-pass side for protection. DCR measured with a precise multimeter is 3.9 ohms each. Well, then the old rule of thumb to determine a driver's impedance (DCR X 1.25) sure doesn't apply in this case since driver impedance and DCR are practically the same.

    They have reasonably flat response, out to 25 khz, doubt my ears would get there. In a case such as this one (limited power capacity) its preferable having to EQ down instead of going up since the latter sends more power to the drivers. EQing down about 2 db @ 10 khz they'll show even better linearity.

    Whereas many focus most of their attention on the woofer, i tend to concentrate as much or more on the HF device. In a conventional 2-3 way system the driver having to reproduce the widest bandwidth is often the tweeter, not woofer or mid. A good reason to pay attention to this.

    What you see on small woofer cone pic isn't dust, dirt or defects, these are made using natural fiber cone material, so fibers can be seen on it...

    Richard

    EDIT: Tweeters pic looks distorted, they don't seem to be round, i'll try posting another pic.

    HI-VI RESEARCH x1a.pdf

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  12. #372
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    Bought recently from a fellow in Maryland, through Ebay, an orphan Vifa H25TG35-06 horn loaded tweeter which is identical to a pair purchased from Solen early 90's and still have. Purpose was to have some spare parts for mine. Initial pricing was too high for what he had (not mint cond) but when he reduced it i pulled the trigger.

    Sadly its the second time i receive driver(s) with wood screws magnetized to driver magnet!, plus in this case also a loose tiny screw in a small cavity on driver side not belonging to tweeter. This is playing with fire, during rough shipping the screws could puncture the tweeter's dome, or the mid driver cones from the previous time...

    This model getting hard to find across North America, spare parts too, both in acceptable condition. There might be more available in Europe where they originally came from (Denmark). Even the tech sheet is rare, i have it from keeping some pages of a 90's Solen catalog. Like the driver, sounds good, not aggressive like some boosted SR.

    The "Peerless by Tymphany" on seller ad shown is incorrect for this driver since at the time it was made Vifa was still a separate company manufacturing some nice stuff in Europe. Peerless later purchased Vifa, then killed it, and eventually moved production to China, with implications on quality... I know from buying a similar pair of Peerless H26TG06-06 (China) not long ago and they don't match the good old ones Vifa made. Sole reason i got that China pair is the deal on it and testing, H25 being long discontinued, otherwise wouldn't have bought it.

    In my book the H25 is possibly the most well mannered, horn loaded +, tweeter i know of, having frequency response flatness worthy of control monitors, this with no crossover corrections nor EQ, simply as is! (about +/- 1 db from 2.5khz to 16khz (17khz @ -2db). If 16-17khz isn't high enough then i suggest you look at JBL 4430/5 specs, for +/- 3db). H25 horn dispersion isn't mentioned in the tech sheet, however with an angle finder i previously measured about 80-90° conical. Being horn loaded = more directional, therefore increased off-axis roll-off vs hi-fi.

    Haven't had time yet to take apart the Ebay H25 so not convinced at this time if the dome is the original one. My first impression is that its an original Vifa dome but not necessarily the factory one, i.e. a fit most Vifa replacement, like the one in stock shown here (one reason didn't want to pay seller's initial asking price). Will also check its frequency response with the RTA when i get time.

    The dome is field replaceable. Three tight fitting "U" shape brackets hold both driver halves together, one is the horn, the other being tweeter body with double chamber, magnet and exposing the dome. Not complex servicing.

    The DCR measured is on spec at 4.6 ohm even though the Bay driver shows a dent on the back (other reason not to pay initial asking). The response graph indicates voltage used is 2V giving 1W at 4 ohms, however the H25 is rated at 6 ohms, which may influence level. The mic distance was .5 meter maybe to compensate for voltage? The rule of thumb to determine driver impedance (DCR X 1.25) seems to work here at 5.75 ohms, close to 6 ohms.

    Subsequent H models from Vifa, and specially from Peerless, haven't matched the H25 performance. For second best, a H26TG35-06 made in Denmark would be the closest, but not a clone nor an improvement (e.g. would require a little EQ for flatness). Have three versions of that driver's tech sheet, two from Vifa, 1992 and ? (they seem the same, one having newer look), and one from Peerless Rev. 1 dated 2012. I'd try to avoid the Peerless version of the tweeter since it could be made in China.

    On the other hand, later than the H25, Vifa started to put a Denmark flag sticker on drivers they made to show origin i assume, a good way to recognize one i guess. As for other similar horn loaded models Peerless made, and they made quite a few, i've looked at many of them, they didn't come close, not as refined, mostly noise makers.

    *Please don't repost the attached pics on other Web site(s).

    Richard

    EBay seller web page
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    Loose screws magnetized on driver magnet, no apparent damage caused
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    Pic previously posted, the H25 pair is the one on the left
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    The used & orphan H25 bought on EBay
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  13. #373
    Senior Member RMC's Avatar
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    DCR for the driver purchased, right on spec
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    Arrows show one of three each "U" shape brackets to separate horn from body giving access to dome
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    Frequency response curves for H25, exceptionally flat on-axis for a horn driver (1db per line)
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    The dome replacement kit from Vifa, not specific to H25, might still fit, have other Vifa drivers
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  14. #374
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    TASCAM CD-200SB PLAYER UPDATE

    Went to dealer yesterday to pick up the 2nd Tascam CD player had ordered. A month wait with Covid restrictions and 80% of audio distributor and dealer staffs still working from home. However, was glad to see more repair techs back to work and busy, though still only about half of them have returned now. No Touring or live shows...

    As mentioned before the 2 RU CD-200SB is an importer/distributor's Demo (not a store demo that everyone plays with), last unit available then its over. Distributor had said its rated very good condition, i'd say excellent shape. I'm impressed at how nice it is, better than expected, making the good deal even sweeter. No scratch or dent, missing the remote but rarely use these anyway, and owner manual i have in the computer. Full warranty given is more valuable to me.

    Things look like it might have been shown at a few trade shows for Pros, but barely used. Its clean and I get some indication on prior use from looking carefully at the connectors on the back, for scratches from connect and disconnect on RCA's outer shell and on male XLR's gold plated pins. There's very little on them, a good sign.

    Dealer mentioned "If you don't like it for whatever reason, bring it back within 30 days and i'll return it to Tascam distributor." Pretty much risk-free. That's what i like in dealing with a Pro dealer, no hard sell or BS, customer has to feel good about it, the long-term relationship is more important in their view vs a quick made sales commission.

    Well, spent about two hours listening to it, haven't tried yet all the features i don't really need, but my impression is that returning this unit would be pure madness. This is a keeper, works well and sounds good. At 10.4 lb its relatively heavy compared to standard consumer models, maybe a sign of quality build. The adjustable phones output i used for initial testing with the Sen HD25L has enough juice to make you deaf i guess.

    One would think by now making these CD players isn't rocket science anymore, yet i counted 8 circuit boards inside the unit! One for XLR's, another for USB/SD card, third one for CD transport, one for main power supply, etc., having four PC boards on each side of the center located CD transport system. BMW mentioned previously (post # 341) that Tascam and TEAC share some parts, i can confirm this with a pic of a small TEAC circuit board inside the unit. Can't say for all of them though.

    Talking about the important CD transport, i hoped having the new, improved and better performance TEAC CD 5020-A transport for Pro gear (described post # 334, 3rd pic). Didn't see info in the owner manual nor on the Tascam price list i posted (post # 342) about what model transport system is used in the CD-200SB player. This is what prompted me to remove the unit's top cover and check for myself. Happy to report the CD 5020-A transport is used in that player too, as shown on a pic. Another bonus, makes my day...

    Richard

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