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Thread: A larger room, a pair of 4313B and maybe the need to upgrade?

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    Question A larger room, a pair of 4313B and maybe the need to upgrade?

    Hi gents,

    my brother who have, like me, a pair of 4313B, is now enjoying a 45 square meters room, add to that that its ceiling is at an average of 3 meter high. Quite a large room to fill with a bookshelf like the 4313B. Receiver is a Yamaha R-S700.
    I wonder if the bass reflex works at its best with that very deep room which is in fact much deeper as another room is straight after with no door and a large opening. You guessed it, bass are shy.
    Can the 4313B play at their best in large rooms or should we start looking for say a L65 or another big gun?

    Thanks!
    Matthieu

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    That's a rather large room for a bookshelf speaker. You could implement anything out there. The larger the better .

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    Administrator Mr. Widget's Avatar
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    The 4313B is a wonderful speaker... sitting atop a meter bridge in a control room or at home in a smaller room. You need a full sized speaker for your full sized room.

    As to recommendations? That is too wide a question. But as gasman suggests, look at big. The L65 wouldn't be on my short list in your situation.


    Widget

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    Senior Member grumpy's Avatar
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    I'd go 15" on the low end, L300/4333x/4430 or larger, top end type perhaps dependent on what else is in the room (more directional if hard walls, then you have some chance of control... less directional ala 443x if there is some room control/absorption)

    Certainly M2s or Everests would be fun.

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    Senior Member BMWCCA's Avatar
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    Budget??

    My usual answer is L7 but not sure how many made it across the Atlantic. Cheap, fun, accurate, cheap, room-filling sound.
    ". . . as you have no doubt noticed, no one told the 4345 that it can't work correctly so it does anyway."—Greg Timbers

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    So everyone agrees about the small 4313B vs real big room (mine does wonders in my 20sqm room). And the need of real big speakers...
    AFAIK L7 weren't sold here. Maybe TI6K or TI10K? Or even another brand...
    No budget right now, he won't buy it next week but we can think about the future if we win the lottery We keep in mind 15" then. But let me guess, these need beefy amps...

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    Quote Originally Posted by Malefoda View Post
    So everyone agrees about the small 4313B vs real big room (mine does wonders in my 20sqm room). And the need of real big speakers...
    AFAIK L7 weren't sold here. Maybe TI6K or TI10K? Or even another brand...
    No budget right now, he won't buy it next week but we can think about the future if we win the lottery We keep in mind 15" then. But let me guess, these need beefy amps...
    Kind of depends on what you buy, and what level of volume you prefer.

    I had a pair of customized L200s - 15 woofer, horn based midrange, 2405 slot tweeter - and while they were not deafening, I did enjoy them with a 65w/ch Jolida tube amp ... Most folks would go 150/200w/ch just for the firm solid bass, even if they don't crank it "stupid loud", as Zilch would say ...
    2ch: Oppo, JoLida 502CRC, JBL L212, 18ti,240ti; Heath AS101, Von Schweikert VR4
    7.1: Oppo BDP103D, B&K, UREI 809A, JBL B460

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    Senior Member BMWCCA's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Malefoda View Post
    We keep in mind 15" then. But let me guess, these need beefy amps...
    I run my 18s (4345) on a 200-watt Crown PS-400. They never break a sweat and I've never seen the IOC lights even blink when I play them "stupid loud".
    ". . . as you have no doubt noticed, no one told the 4345 that it can't work correctly so it does anyway."—Greg Timbers

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    Administrator Mr. Widget's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Malefoda View Post
    We keep in mind 15" then. But let me guess, these need beefy amps...
    This is a common misconception. Large speakers are typically more sensitive than more compact models and therefore often will work better with smaller amplifiers than their more compact cousins.

    I don't know much about your Yamaha amplifier, but it is rated at 100 wpc. It will likely do reasonably well with most JBLs.


    Widget

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    Senior Member martin_wu99's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Malefoda View Post
    So everyone agrees about the small 4313B vs real big room (mine does wonders in my 20sqm room). And the need of real big speakers...
    AFAIK L7 weren't sold here. Maybe TI6K or TI10K? Or even another brand...
    No budget right now, he won't buy it next week but we can think about the future if we win the lottery We keep in mind 15" then. But let me guess, these need beefy amps...
    For such big room,15'' is a nessary,to play JBL 15'' well,you need at least 200w/ch amps, push harder, get more
    46 lover

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Widget View Post
    This is a common misconception. Large speakers are typically more sensitive than more compact models and therefore often will work better with smaller amplifiers than their more compact cousins.

    I don't know much about your Yamaha amplifier, but it is rated at 100 wpc. It will likely do reasonably well with most JBLs.


    Widget
    Hi Widget, yep I did not notice that they were more efficient. Anyway a 15" cheaper than a L300 is the L200... Pro versions 4333 and 4320?
    Have to read about these and find used ones cheap, which can be impossible. Here in France we have a contender for theses classic JBLs, the brand Cabasse... will look there also.
    Anyone heard some big ATCs and how they compare?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Malefoda View Post
    Hi Widget, yep I did not notice that they were more efficient. Anyway a 15" cheaper than a L300 is the L200... Pro versions 4333 and 4320?
    Have to read about these and find used ones cheap, which can be impossible. Here in France we have a contender for theses classic JBLs, the brand Cabasse... will look there also.
    Anyone heard some big ATCs and how they compare?
    Big ATC is not so easy to drive as JBL do,ATC is more smoother than JBL,its mid-rang is the best ,very suitable for playing vocal and volin
    46 lover

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    @ Malefoda: Does Your brother have neighbours ...

    ... in the same house? Bass transmission can lead to troubles. This can limit the allowed playback volume.

    Ruediger

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    Stand-alone house! Lucky him... BTW, he said he is using the room in half: half kitchen and half living room, meaning that his listening couch is at 3m from the 4313Bs wich are at about half a meter from the back wall. No need to stuupid-high levels in the kitchen part, just loud enough on the couch.
    Maybe I'm wrong but I understand that bass response, even at 3m, is linked to the ability of the 10" driver/front port and enclosure to load the huge mass of air there, and a 15" will be at ease on that. True? I also understand that perceived volume at listening position is less because less reflections and more loss in air far away.
    If all my statements are true then 15" is required. If at a close 3m from speakers it is less problematic then maybe a punchy 12", à la 4312A, can add what is missing. Or a sub...

    Anyway we will try to measure and correct room response, start savings...

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    We've narrowed the choices to:
    L200/4320/4325/4331, L300/4333, S3100 MkI/MkII and Array 1400.
    Price wise the 4320 say the S8 are the cheapest, then cheap also the S3100. Other a double the price. As for me I then feel the S3100 is the bargain here.
    BTW, are some in need for complex amping to sing and other easy load to drive with an classic integrated?

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