Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast
Results 1 to 15 of 42

Thread: An Affordable Music Server

  1. #1
    Administrator Mr. Widget's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2003
    Location
    San Francisco
    Posts
    9,720

    An Affordable Music Server

    I recently set up a music server and thought I'd share the details for those considering adding one. The route I took was very simple, very affordable, and sounds remarkably good. It can be improved upon and I may at some point, but for now the convenience of having almost all of my CDs at my finger tips and in stunningly good quality has been ear opening. I find myself creating playlists, and playing music that I hadn't bothered to play in years. It is good to break out of the normal rotation.


    Background and system details to establish a point of reference... if you don't have the patience to read through this part go directly to The Server to get the set up details.


    The audio quality of the server described below will likely satisfy almost anyone. I am a pretty picky customer and have been happily using it in my "above average system". My digital playback reference is my obscenely expensive and IMO obscenely good Mark Levinson No 512 SACD player. The ML No512 uses an Esoteric disc spinner with an exotic clocking system, data buffer, and unique DAC. I have not heard every digital playback system... but this one is the best one I've heard, or put another way; I haven't heard a better one.

    I have done extensive comparisons between my Mark Levinson No 512 SACD player and my Wadia via my Bryston DAC or the new server through the Bryston DAC. Disc depending the ML No512 can sound somewhat better or indistinguishable. Typically I do prefer the No512 but can't always put a finger on it. I have balanced the two to within 0.1dB and made numerous double blind comparisons. At the most extreme, the ML No512 has more air and space between the instruments and even the notes if that makes sense. That said, the differences are typically so subtle there is no point in loading a silver disc unless I'm really going to focus. Originally I was considering adding a Berkeley Audio Design Alpha USB and possibly their Alpha DAC. While I'm sure these would be a step up over the Bryston DAC and a simple USB cable, I doubt the Berkeley Audio Design pair will exceed the ML No512 and since the difference is already so close to the point of diminishing returns, I've decided to live with the compromise.

    I also have had a Sonos Connect as a source in my system with a S/PDIF connection to my DAC. Most of my music resides redundantly on a NAS drive which Sonos can access. While I love the convenience and the Sonos user interface is great, the sonic compromise has led me to rarely use it.

    FWIW: My system consists of a Mark Levinson No326S analog preamp, some analog phono gear, the already mentioned ML No 512, the Bryston BDA-1 DAC, a Wadia 170i dock, a Meridian 500 CD transport, a Meyer Sound CP-10 EQ employing (2) narrow band cut filters per channel for some room issues, a pair of Parasound Halo JC-1 mono blocks, and a pair of DD66000/DD67000 speakers. (DD66000s upgraded to DD67000s).




    The Server:

    I was given a "mid 2010" Mac Mini from a friend. You can pick one up on eBay for $200-$300. This model has a built in CD read/write drive which is very convenient and is current enough to support the latest free software updates. The newer models do not have a built in disc drive, have faster connections and processors, but also cost more. I bought an external 2T drive, but this is optional. Mac Minis have an HDMI output, Toslink optical, and USB outputs. If you connect to an AVR you can use the HDMI or optical output. If you connect to an external DAC you will probably want to use the USB output. (With my DAC the optical did not sound as good as the USB.) If you are playing files with higher resolution than Redbook and want to use the USB output you may need a USB to S/PDIF converter.

    I am using the computer's built in iTunes application as the server's backbone. I have imported about 620 CDs (Some Apple lossless others are uncompressed) into this computer's iTunes library and cleaned up the duplications, album art issues etc. I then picked up the free "Remote" app for iPads and iPhones and loaded it on my phone and my iPad. This computer is dedicated to my music system. Since there are no other applications running on it, once set up I removed the monitor and keyboard. My only interface with the server is via the Remote app. From my listening chair I can use the app to create playlists and to search by song, album, artist, or composer. When you hit play it is instantaneous, you can hop from song to song, jump from one genre to another on the fly and it is amazingly quick.

    That's it. All you need is the $200 computer a USB cable to connect to the DAC of your choice or connect to an AVR with an HDMI or Toslink cable. If you want to avoid the monitor and keyboard like I did you will need an iPhone or iPad. I really like the Remote app. If you do not own an iPhone or iPad, you can pick an older iPhone for $50 and use it as a small iPad (no plan needed but you do need your own wifi).

    You can go to Computer Audiophile and spend gobs of time and money, and geek out to your heart's content, or you can do what I did and get a pretty damned good bang for your few bucks.


    Widget

  2. #2
    RIP 2021 SEAWOLF97's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    in "managed decline"
    Posts
    10,054
    I've been doing a similar thing with a large (19 inch screen) Sony Vaio dual core laptop. That's the one that I took in trade for the cheap L7's.

    It has optical o/p and hdmi. 4 USB ports. Run it to an external DAC . The DVD drive does an admirable job on CD ripping.

    Never felt the need to connect up a remote , I just let it go on either a playlist or shuffle. iTunes is OK, but is frustrating on Windows.

    It runs out to the BGW pre & amp and eventually to the 250Ti's. No complaints about the produced sound.


    All that said ..... the same CD sounds 3D and even better on the stand alone ARCAM CD player. If I ever got serious about it, would just connect the deck to the Sony.

    I do dub from that deck to Minidisk which allows portability between all my MD connected systems. The disks are really superb sounding. I did a demo for the buyer of my second pair of 250's , the soundtrack from the movie "V for Vendetta" , a dub that was on MD (prior to acquiring the ARCAM) . He was blown away and assumed that I was spinning a SACD.
    Some kind of happiness is measured out in miles

  3. #3
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Christchurch, NZ
    Posts
    1,400
    I have been using a Mac mini in the same way for quite a few years now. The only difference in my system is that the Mac mini connects wirelessly to an Apple TV and then via optical cable to my main system. Super easy and it works pretty well.

    Allan.

  4. #4
    Moderator hjames's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Location
    NoVA - DC 'burbs
    Posts
    8,547
    Thanks for the heads up, Mr Widget!
    Quote Originally Posted by Allanvh5150 View Post
    I have been using a Mac mini in the same way for quite a few years now. The only difference in my system is that the Mac mini connects wirelessly to an Apple TV and then via optical cable to my main system. Super easy and it works pretty well.

    Allan.
    I go the mac Wifi route as well ...
    I have roughly 50k tracks on a 3TB drive connected via eSATA to an early 2009 Macpro upstairs in my office -
    most tracks are lossless but my wife does occasionally buy pop tracks from Amazon or the ITMS (@ 256kbps).
    Stream over the latest, greatest Airport Express/Extreme (802.11ac format) - into a AudioAlchemy DAC and a Jolida 502 CRC tube Amp upstairs,
    or into an eMotiva DAC, B&K amps, and the UREI speakers downstairs.

    None of this is lexicon/Bryston level gear, but it works well on a scrounger's budget

    I do have a couple of older macMinis on a shelf - think they are intel era ones.
    Not sure the exact age, but sounds like it'd be worthwhile to look into them further, for direct-tied server!
    2ch: WiiM Pro; Topping E30 II DAC; Oppo, Acurus RL-11, Acurus A200, JBL Dynamics Project - Offline: L212-TwinStack, VonSchweikert VR-4
    7: TIVO, Oppo BDP103D, B&K, 2pr UREI 809A, TF600, JBL B460

  5. #5
    Administrator Mr. Widget's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2003
    Location
    San Francisco
    Posts
    9,720
    Quote Originally Posted by SEAWOLF97 View Post
    Never felt the need to connect up a remote, I just let it go on either a playlist or shuffle. iTunes is OK, but is frustrating on Windows.
    If you ever get a chance, give remote access a try. It fundamentally changed my listening habits and significantly broadened my listening repertoire.

    Quote Originally Posted by Allanvh5150 View Post
    I have been using a Mac mini in the same way for quite a few years now. The only difference in my system is that the Mac mini connects wirelessly to an Apple TV and then via optical cable to my main system. Super easy and it works pretty well.

    Allan.
    "Super easy" is key. With so little cash outlay and very little effort, I was able to make this remarkably convenient addition to my system.


    Quote Originally Posted by hjames View Post
    Thanks for the heads up, Mr Widget!

    None of this is lexicon/Bryston level gear, but it works well on a scrounger's budget

    I do have a couple of older macMinis on a shelf - think they are intel era ones.
    Not sure the exact age, but sounds like it'd be worthwhile to look into them further, for direct-tied server!
    By connecting it directly to a quality DAC it also gives you top drawer sonic performance, but even if you took the analog audio out directly from the Mac Mini, it wouldn't suck and you could still have all of the convenience.

    Are you using the Remote app?


    Widget

  6. #6
    Moderator hjames's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Location
    NoVA - DC 'burbs
    Posts
    8,547
    Absolutely! Remote app makes all the difference! Its radically changed my listening behaviors.

    Sometimes I'll be reading a copy of MOJO Magaine and I can pick out music tracks to play and listen to
    while I read about an artist or band ...
    Or just put on some nice jazz by selecting an artist, or a genre (ECM Jazz) for instance ...
    Or make up playlists I really like "Quiet Storm" (Smokey, and Lonnie Liston Smith and Marvin and ...)
    Very easy, very affordable ...


    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Widget View Post
    If you ever get a chance, give remote access a try. It fundamentally changed my listening habits and significantly broadened my listening repertoire.

    "Super easy" is key. With so little cash outlay and very little effort, I was able to make this remarkably convenient addition to my system.

    By connecting it directly to a quality DAC it also gives you top drawer sonic performance, but even if you took the analog audio out directly from the Mac Mini, it wouldn't suck and you could still have all of the convenience.

    Are you using the Remote app?


    Widget
    2ch: WiiM Pro; Topping E30 II DAC; Oppo, Acurus RL-11, Acurus A200, JBL Dynamics Project - Offline: L212-TwinStack, VonSchweikert VR-4
    7: TIVO, Oppo BDP103D, B&K, 2pr UREI 809A, TF600, JBL B460

  7. #7
    Member tinpan's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2014
    Location
    Fredericksburg VA
    Posts
    67
    Mr Widget, have you tried the coax out of your Sonos to a DAC. Just wondering if you could hear a difference.

    Funny you mention that Mac 2010 as a music sever. Once i figured out that Apple made it easy to set up a server like that I was onboard. It took me a while to figure out to connect via USB to a Dac, once I did, it was game over. The sound was great. My second revelation was using the SPDIF/toslink to a DAC instead of audio cable from the airport express for my remote systems. Eventually I migrated to Apple TV's for my wireless connections to my music set ups.

    Apple really could have owned that market if they embraced Flac instead of forcing everyone to convert to AIF. 24 bit would have also been nice. Eventually I migrated to Sonos. For some reason I have a half dozen or so systems connected and the biggest challenge I had with using Apple for a music server was all of the security updates. It was really frustrating to sit down to listen to music and half to update all those Apple TV's before you could listen to music. The other challenge I had was all the wireless dropped connections. I've been an Apple fan since I made a living selling Mac's in the 1980's. It used to be you could just set their stuff up and it worked. I found it frustrating to be in the groove listening to an album only to have it stutter and miss. The direct connection from my Mac to Dac worked flawlessly, the wireless just wasn't quite up to snuff.

    Now I have a Synology DS215 NAS with all of my music on it and I connect to Sonos Connects to all of my systems. Those are connected via coax to dacs. I can sit down with my iPhone and listen to any system in the hou..hou..well it's more of a compound.

    Tidal is a nice subscription to add as well. That way I can try and album and if I like it, order it.

    Fun stuff

  8. #8
    Moderator hjames's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Location
    NoVA - DC 'burbs
    Posts
    8,547
    I agreed with you - the older Airport Express wallwarts used to drive me crazy with the occasional drop outs ...
    but with the Airport extreme mini-tower and the newer white rectangular hockey pucks, I've not had an iTunes dropout yet ... The new ones are:


    • IEEE 802.11a/b/g/n
    • Simultaneous dual-band 2.4GHz and 5GHz


    Now if they'd just accept FLAC in iTunes and on their phones ....


    Quote Originally Posted by tinpan View Post
    Mr Widget, have you tried the coax out of your Sonos to a DAC. Just wondering if you could hear a difference.

    Funny you mention that Mac 2010 as a music sever. Once i figured out that Apple made it easy to set up a server like that I was onboard. It took me a while to figure out to connect via USB to a Dac, once I did, it was game over. The sound was great. My second revelation was using the SPDIF/toslink to a DAC instead of audio cable from the airport express for my remote systems. Eventually I migrated to Apple TV's for my wireless connections to my music set ups.

    Apple really could have owned that market if they embraced Flac instead of forcing everyone to convert to AIF. 24 bit would have also been nice. Eventually I migrated to Sonos. For some reason I have a half dozen or so systems connected and the biggest challenge I had with using Apple for a music server was all of the security updates. It was really frustrating to sit down to listen to music and half to update all those Apple TV's before you could listen to music. The other challenge I had was all the wireless dropped connections. I've been an Apple fan since I made a living selling Mac's in the 1980's. It used to be you could just set their stuff up and it worked. I found it frustrating to be in the groove listening to an album only to have it stutter and miss. The direct connection from my Mac to Dac worked flawlessly, the wireless just wasn't quite up to snuff.

    Now I have a Synology DS215 NAS with all of my music on it and I connect to Sonos Connects to all of my systems. Those are connected via coax to dacs. I can sit down with my iPhone and listen to any system in the hou..hou..well it's more of a compound.

    Tidal is a nice subscription to add as well. That way I can try and album and if I like it, order it.

    Fun stuff
    2ch: WiiM Pro; Topping E30 II DAC; Oppo, Acurus RL-11, Acurus A200, JBL Dynamics Project - Offline: L212-TwinStack, VonSchweikert VR-4
    7: TIVO, Oppo BDP103D, B&K, 2pr UREI 809A, TF600, JBL B460

  9. #9
    Administrator Mr. Widget's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2003
    Location
    San Francisco
    Posts
    9,720
    Quote Originally Posted by tinpan View Post
    Mr Widget, have you tried the coax out of your Sonos to a DAC. Just wondering if you could hear a difference.
    Absolutely! I have a Sonos Connect with a coax feeding another input on my DAC. I love the Sonos interface and it's vast streaming capability.

    I have a NAS that I use as a redundant back up and have listened to the same tracks via Sonos vs. disc spinner vs. the Mac Mini. Sonos unfortunately isn't in the same league, at least with my DAC in my system.

    I use Sonos mostly as a streaming source and NPR. I never really use it to listen to music if I have the music on my hard drive.


    Widget

  10. #10
    Senior Member tjm001's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2015
    Location
    Potomac Falls, Virginia, USA
    Posts
    225

    Speaking of affordable...

    Greetings Mr. Widget,


    I very much like your idea about the "mid 2010" Mac Mini music server. I’m going to try to pick one up and try it. But as of now all I have tried as far as music through a computer has been downloading a few FLAC files on my Windows 10 PC. I then played them through a USB Dragonfly Red dongle DAC into my old Rotel Preamp and old Rotel amp into my L300s. Not enough material to make any major decisions on whether to spend big bucks on a DAC or a new disc player. Especially stuff like your Mark Levinson No 512 SACD player, Wadia and Bryston DAC!


    I’m really curious as to how a little $198 Dragonfly Red DAC really sounds coming out of your music server compared to your DAC? I’d be happy to send the little bugger to you to find out. Unless, of course you already know the answer. Thanks.


    Tom

  11. #11
    Administrator Mr. Widget's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2003
    Location
    San Francisco
    Posts
    9,720
    I'd be game to give it a go. I'm familiar with the Dragonfly line of USB DACs but I've never listened to one.

    Before you buy a Mac Mini realize that Apple does not support Flac. Any content you have in that format would need to be run through software to convert it to Apple Lossless or AIFF. Not a big deal but it adds a hassle factor. Any CDs that you bring into iTunes via the Mac Mini's CD drive are easily saved in one of these formats directly.


    Widget

  12. #12
    Senior Member tjm001's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2015
    Location
    Potomac Falls, Virginia, USA
    Posts
    225
    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Widget View Post
    I'd be game to give it a go. I'm familiar with the Dragonfly line of USB DACs but I've never listened to one.

    Before you buy a Mac Mini realize that Apple does not support Flac. Any content you have in that format would need to be run through software to convert it to Apple Lossless or AIFF. Not a big deal but it adds a hassle factor. Any CDs that you bring into iTunes via the Mac Mini's CD drive are easily saved in one of these formats directly.


    Widget
    Great! I'll PM you for address to send to. Thanks.
    Tom

  13. #13
    Senior Member Ed Zeppeli's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    Nanaimo, BC
    Posts
    609
    Speaking of DACs I'm trying to avoid converting twice from my Sonos Connect, into an analogue preamp and then into a dbx driverack.

    Slightly off-topic but for a short run would it be within the realms of possibility to go from S/PDIF out (rca) into AES/EBU (xlr) using just a homemade cable and/or adapter?

    This seems like my simplest solution to go from Sonos Connect directly into the Venu360 and avoid the extra conversion process. I'd use the Connect for volume control.


    Thanks,

    Warren
    DIY Array, 2242 sub, 4408, 4208, Control 8SR, E120 Guitar cab, Control 1, LSR305.

  14. #14
    Senior Member audiomagnate's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    Colorado and Georgia
    Posts
    1,022
    You can use a Chromecast Audio, with BubbleUPnP server and Logitech Media Server on your PC, and the paid version of the BubbleUPnP app on an Android phone or tablet. Total cost is under $40 and it streams up to 24/96 files (flac or wav), from the hard drive, or even the cloud without a PC. You can also use it for Tidal and other streaming services if you're OK with CD quality.

  15. #15
    Senior Member grumpy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2003
    Location
    SoCal
    Posts
    5,742

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Similar Threads

  1. music server questions
    By brett_s in forum General Audio Discussion
    Replies: 30
    Last Post: 11-16-2011, 10:49 AM
  2. Network Music Server
    By jerry_rig in forum General Audio Discussion
    Replies: 31
    Last Post: 12-30-2010, 08:31 PM
  3. Music Server
    By Uncle Paul in forum Miscellaneous Gear
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: 01-10-2006, 09:58 PM
  4. Cannot find server...
    By boputnam in forum Forum Feedback
    Replies: 63
    Last Post: 03-19-2005, 08:31 AM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •