Results 1 to 15 of 21

Thread: Way off topic - article in The Australian

Hybrid View

Previous Post Previous Post   Next Post Next Post
  1. #1
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2003
    Location
    Colorado
    Posts
    311

    Way off topic - article in The Australian

    John Nebel

  2. #2
    RIP 2011 Zilch's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Location
    Berkeley, CA
    Posts
    9,963
    The Jihadist goal of a pan-Islamic nation, Friedman's "New Caliphate" federation, is well documented. After the Taliban established the prototype state in Afghanistan, the Saudis first appreciated that they, themselves, were at risk. Core Al-Qa'ida may be seen as a Saudi "ex-patriot" movement, in which context what has happened, and is happening, makes sense.

    The objective is to control Middle-Eastern (and beyond) oil and use it to strangle occidental (Western) secular modernism as enemy of Islam (think "Crusades" here). If it weren't for Saudi ties to the West, OPEC would have done it years ago. Thus is democracy branded an "infidel institution." Indeed, there IS an inherent conflict between personal freedom and fundamentalist theocracy (read "burqa"). The West worked through that in the 16th century, as I recall. It's about power, is what.

    WMD were an obvious pretense for a move into Iraq. There was a certain irrationality to it at the time, as the UN inspectors were about to conclude they didn't exist. But, as Friedman points out, that move was strategic: it's no coincidence that BOTH Iran and Saudi Arabia become "surrounded" as consequence, not to mention the actual oil reserves there.

    There are larger issues, of course, key among them being the legitimacy of the abstract "cause" of each side. However, 9/11 sealed the engagement for America; we're in it now, and the enemy is tangible....

  3. #3
    Dis Member mikebake's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2003
    Location
    Lima, Ohio, USA
    Posts
    2,152
    Quote Originally Posted by Zilch
    The Jihadist goal of a pan-Islamic nation, Friedman's "New Caliphate" federation, is well documented. After the Taliban established the prototype state in Afghanistan, the Saudis first appreciated that they, themselves, were at risk. Core Al-Qa'ida may be seen as a Saudi "ex-patriot" movement, in which context what has happened, and is happening, makes sense.

    The objective is to control Middle-Eastern (and beyond) oil and use it to strangle occidental (Western) modernism as enemy of Islam (think "Crusades" here). If it weren't for Saudi ties to the West, OPEC would have already done it. Thus is democracy branded an "infidel institution." Indeed, there IS an inherent conflict between personal freedom and fundamentalist theocracy (read "burqa"). The West worked through that in the 16th century, as I recall. It's about power, is what.

    WMD were an obvious pretense for a move into Iraq. There was a certain irrationality to it at the time; the UN inspectors were about to conclude they didn't exist. But, as Friedman points out, that move was strategic: it's no coincidence that BOTH Iran and Saudi Arabia become "surrounded" as consequence, not to mention the actual oil reserves there.

    There are larger issues, of course, key among them being the legitimacy of the abstract "cause" of each side. However, 9/11 sealed the engagement for America; we're in it now, and the enemy is tangible....
    What, if I might ask, is your occupation?

  4. #4
    RIP 2011 Zilch's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Location
    Berkeley, CA
    Posts
    9,963
    Quote Originally Posted by mikebake
    What, if I might ask, is your occupation?
    IRS says I'm an Inventor

    Am I too wordy?
    It's old stuff, actually. More here.

    After 9/11, Al-Qa'ida said: "America, ask yourself why this happened."

    It'd be good if more of us tried to figure it out....

  5. #5
    Webmaster Don McRitchie's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2003
    Location
    Winnipeg, Canada
    Posts
    1,753
    I am not interested in starting a political debate and will drop out if this thread takes that turn. I just want to point out a problem that I have with articles of this type. It is all assertion with no evidence. Its premise is that the current administration is playing a "much deeper game" with the war in Iraq but provides absolutely no evidence of who developed this game plan, who the current players are, and most importantly, any documentation that such a game plan existed before the war began. It would have you believe that an administration that has publicly disavowed Realpolitik as part of the previous administation's failed foreign policy, is actually a master of the craft. Not to mention that this approach is 180 degrees opposed to the current administation's stated vision of moral clarity in foreign affairs. Again, all of this without a shred of evidence. That the article makes no mention of the fact that book's author and company are considered to have strong right-wing and corporate ties, does little to aid its objectivity.

    I have no problem with discussion and debate on the the merits of the war in Iraq and believe an honest discussion would be very healthy (although not here). I do have a problem with thinly disguised spin being portayed as objective analysis.
    Regards

    Don McRitchie

  6. #6
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2003
    Location
    Australia
    Posts
    7,942
    I'm surprised of the awareness outside the 52 states, well I suppose there is some relevance

    The article reads like a documentary to upstage 60 minutes, not exactly fact and plenty of fiction.

    The Australian doesn't exactly employ award winning Journalists as a rule. Recommended newspapers are The Financial Review and The Age.


    This is our real threat on the next month or so

    http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au...5E2702,00.html

  7. #7
    Dis Member mikebake's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2003
    Location
    Lima, Ohio, USA
    Posts
    2,152
    Very interesting, and, I believe, accurate.

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Similar Threads

  1. Subwoofer Article
    By kevinkemp2001 in forum Lansing Product General Information
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: 02-09-2005, 06:37 PM
  2. Japanese 4343 article
    By Guido in forum Lansing Product General Information
    Replies: 7
    Last Post: 12-09-2004, 02:25 AM
  3. 4435A (A - Australian) monitors
    By jarrods in forum Lansing Product General Information
    Replies: 5
    Last Post: 02-29-2004, 01:55 AM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •