Charge coupled passive crossover networks

[4313B]

I'm the original poster of this thread. All I was looking for was factual information. I had no axe to grind. It was an honest and sincere question. But instead of going through all of this, why did you not give me the above information at the time of my original post????????????? No! You had to pontificate about your great knowledge and experience and what an idiot that I and others are. ("Internet asshats" to be exact) But I agreed with your technical analysis! WTF?

Tom

Really? I had to pontificate? From my perspective this entire thread was a troll thread coming off the other troll thread on this subject from last week. In any case, I am done justifying anything to any of you. This thread is proof positive that all the other threads, including my Techbot section, were a waste of my time. This forum is a complete waste of my time. It offers me virtually nothing but grief.

I think it's just been a touchy subject around here lately.

It has been a "problem" since ~ 2004... so yeah... I should have stopped responding after the first thread way back then.

[BMWCCA]

Really? I had to pontificate? From my perspective this entire thread was a troll thread coming off the other troll thread on this subject from last week. In any case, I am done justifying anything to any of you. This thread is proof positive that all the other threads, including my Techbot section, were a waste of my time. This forum is a complete waste of my time. It offers me virtually nothing but grief.

It has been a "problem" since ~ 2004... so yeah... I should have stopped responding after the first thread way back then.

I would suggest that many here enjoy the fruits of your labor and are listening to their CC systems in blissful ignorance to the tempest-in-a-teapot created by this "discussion". Please don't judge the value of your time and efforts by the loose talk of those who haven't taken time to understand. The overwhelming majority here appreciate both your and GT bringing these innovations to our attention.

I find the details and data collected on this site to be an invaluable resource, not only for those here currently but especially for those sure to follow our interest in JBL systems in the future—particularly since they will be going forward without any reasonable expectation of support from the manufacturer, given their current goals and actions.

Let's try and keep this group together for the sake of the JBL heritage, which I always figured was the point of this enterprise in the first place.

All who agree with me, please feel free to post in support of the sharing of legacy system information—and ways to improve them.
No more shooting the messenger!

[gasfan]

+1

[badman]

Really? I had to pontificate? From my perspective this entire thread was a troll thread coming off the other troll thread on this subject from last week. In any case, I am done justifying anything to any of you. This thread is proof positive that all the other threads, including my Techbot section, were a waste of my time. This forum is a complete waste of my time. It offers me virtually nothing but grief.

It has been a "problem" since ~ 2004... so yeah... I should have stopped responding after the first thread way back then.

It'd be a shame to lose you. People are bad about pre-searching- at DIY audio there's a function where the new thread asks you to check a box saying that you've searched, and alongside that shows some likely topic matches. Not sure how effective it is, but at least it's something. Part of the challenge of forums is that threads blow up quickly, meaning sorting through tons of posts for tiny 'lil nuggets of info, and search functions, for whatever reason, aren't very good on any forum I've used.

[Ed Zeppeli]

Part of the challenge of forums is that threads blow up quickly, meaning sorting through tons of posts for tiny 'lil nuggets of info, and search functions, for whatever reason, aren't very good on any forum I've used.

Agreed. Not to mention the off-topic stuff that comes up. I've gleaned lots of info from seemingly unrelated threads about a product that had nothing to do with the OP topic. It makes searching at times difficult but also makes this place interesting.

[BMWCCA]

People are bad about pre-searching- at DIY audio there's a function where the new thread asks you to check a box saying that you've searched, and alongside that shows some likely topic matches. Not sure how effective it is, but at least it's something. Part of the challenge of forums is that threads blow up quickly, meaning sorting through tons of posts for tiny 'lil nuggets of info, and search functions, for whatever reason, aren't very good on any forum I've used.

On nearly any forum I use Google Advance Search which allows my search to be restricted by domain name.
This is how it works in Chrome:
Enter what you want to search for in Google.
When the results page opens, click the little "gear" button in the upper right to open "options" and choose "Advanced search"
Enter "audioheritage.org" in the site or domain box and search again.

Particularly useful when searching for things like JBL or L7 which this site's search function completely ignores!

[Ed Zeppeli]

Interesting. Another way...

Go to the site you wish to search

http://www.audioheritage.org/vbulletin/

In front of the address type in your query plus site:

So for L7 it would look like;

L7 site:http://www.audioheritage.org/vbulletin/

[BMWCCA]

Interesting. Another way...

Go to the site you wish to search

http://www.audioheritage.org/vbulletin/

In front of the address type in your query plus site:

So for L7 it would look like;

L7 site:http://www.audioheritage.org/vbulletin/

Correct. Same thing Google Advanced Search does. It looks like this in the search box: L7 site:audioheritage.org

[cooky1257]

I'll put my hands up and admit that my searching is usually pretty poor or unsuccessful so am guilty of posting questions that may have been answered a decade earlier.
Thankfully I've been met with courteous and helpful responses from a great community(including the man himself GT).
I'm sure the lifers here have seen it all before and can get irritated sometimes but it would be a shame if laymen folk got to feeling intimidated into lurking rather than partaking.

[Ed Zeppeli]

I'm sure the lifers here have seen it all before and can get irritated sometimes but it would be a shame if laymen folk got to feeling intimidated into lurking rather than partaking.

I sometimes feel it's my duty to respond to any question I feel fit to answer just to alleviate the old guard of the monotony.

[srm51555]

I would suggest that many here enjoy the fruits of your labor and are listening to their CC systems in blissful ignorance to the tempest-in-a-teapot created by this "discussion". Please don't judge the value of your time and efforts by the loose talk of those who haven't taken time to understand. The overwhelming majority here appreciate both your and GT bringing these innovations to our attention.

I find the details and data collected on this site to be an invaluable resource, not only for those here currently but especially for those sure to follow our interest in JBL systems in the future—particularly since they will be going forward without any reasonable expectation of support from the manufacturer, given their current goals and actions.

Let's try and keep this group together for the sake of the JBL heritage, which I always figured was the point of this enterprise in the first place.

All who agree with me, please feel free to post in support of the sharing of legacy system information—and ways to improve them.
No more shooting the messenger!

Agree 100%. The project history and performance evaluations on this site is invaluable, I mean heck the only reason I'm even documenting my M2 build is for someone's future reference. I already know what's inside.

[johnlcnm]

4313B,

And all the super knowledgeable folks here. History in the making. I am sure a lot of this would be long lost in another decade or so. This is a historical document in the "21st century style."

Your knowledge is paramount to me and anyone else interested in the JBL heritage.

Regards,

John

[Ian Mackenzie]

I think it faircto say thatvin luxury goods industry called Hi End audio (that has has zero growth for 30 years) that is full of snake oil merchants people have every right to be sceptical particularly new members to the forum.

While charge coupled crossover is novel its not unique to JBL and JBL are not by any means lily while with their approach to marketing over the years.

Ie imaginary equivalent tuning
http://www.audioheritage.org/vbullet...ivalent-Tuning

The JBL engineers know their stuff but with JBL marketing its the tail waging the dog at times.

[ivica]

I continue to see claims inferring that charge coupling capacitors of passive crossover networks significantly improves the sound quality. To be specific, I recently constructed a pair of the Nelson Pass modified L300 crossovers (http://www.firstwatt.com/pdf/art_l300.pdf) for my L300 clone system. The system has now been up and running for a few weeks of testing and I have to say sounds pretty darn good to me. However since, like most of us, I’m always looking for something a little bit better. Therefore, I was toying with the idea of putting together a pair that was charge coupled to see if there would be any perceptible improvement in the sound. To be candid I am quite skeptical that there would be any perceptual or measurable differences in sound to anyone other than bats or young dogs (to paraphrase my LH friend Wagner). I think I have a basic understanding of the charge coupling concept relative to the bad effects due to dielectric absorption and mechanical resonance/microphony of capacitors, but can anyone really hear this stuff?

I’m anxious to get
the opinions of those that have actually done this. Thanks.

Tom

HI TJM,

We have to be aware that most of the electrical components are not ideal, so I belive that using CC network while applying DC polarization of the used capactors wolud be possible good solution, especially for midbass, VHF and UHF drivers.
Regards
Ivica

[tjm001]

Thanks. I have ordered the parts and I'll soon know for sure. After all the previous responses to this post I am quite confident it will to say the least!
Tom