JBL 4367 first listen

[4313B]

Those are really nice B!! Great job!! I am sure they sound fantastic. Are you using the 476 Mg or Be on them?

Thanks! They have 476Be's. My 476Mg's are bolted onto M2 waveguides and sitting on the shelf along with the 2216Nd's.

[bubbleboy76]

Very interesting information. Thanks Greg.

That just can't be done in such a compact horn as those in the 4367 and 4365. BTW, those two horns behave very similarly with neither having a major edge on the other in measured performance. They are not, however interchangeable physically and would require different EQ.

Nice to know, as an 4365 owner

Also keep in mind that the M2 is full active. It has separate amplifiers, electronic and digital crossovers and a lot of EQ bands. All kinds of things large and small can be fixed with that kind of horsepower. The pure passive systems can only have a little shaping and perhaps a few low Q correction filters. In spite of that, there is often a musicality to passive systems that purely electronic ones just can't match.

Time-alignement is a very nice feature of the active dsp setup, too me. Especially for these systems with a large offset of the drivers.

I used some concrete blocks to elevate the 4367's when I did Demo's at the factory. 6" to 8" height really helps. The systems are too short for typical American use. The trick is to get something that doesn't rock or tip. You will eat the bass kick immediately if any enclosure movement is allowed. The woofer kicks really hard and if any energy is consumed moving (rocking) the enclosure due to it not being properly coupled to the floor, you will lose bass kick and impact. The proper use and need for spikes (or equivalent) is not BS. It is based in sound theory and is easily demonstrable.

Hmmmm, me putting the speakers on casters was maybe not so good, after all...

[1audiohack]

Those cork 130A gaskets are not glued onto the frames of the 1501AL-2's.

Now that is something I would have never thought of! That makes that whole speaker look so classically cool. I haven't put the rubber rings on my 1501-1's and might have to try that look.

Barry.

[bubbleboy76]

They do have a "live music" sound that is most difficult to achieve purely with direct radiators.

This is what I love with my 4365s

Live concerts on blu-ray sometimes gives me goosebumps, like I was there.

They are time-machines as well. Especially when listening to Neil Young -Live at Massey Hall 1971. There must be some synergy with this recording and my system, I never want to go back to the future when listening to this one.

[Retroman]

"He has a McIntosh MEN-220 digital room correction device so both speakers were auto corrected for the comparison. After correction the significant natural deep bass extension advantage of the 1400 was minimal*. The quality of the bass on the 1400 was it's biggest drawback. It was subjectively thicker and slower with less snap and impact than the 4367 and noticeably more muddy despite being corrected. Coherence from top to bottom was compromised on the 1400 for this reason."

What power amp was used for this comparison? The results you describe are in-line with mine when using a Mac power amp with autoformers to drive the 1400s'. I tried an MC402 and then a 302, both producing ponderous, ill-defined bass/mid-bass. Switched to Electron Kinetics Eagle 400 monoblocks and also a Crown Studio Reference 2 and the differences were night and day. The Macs sound warmer and sweeter in the mids' and top-end, but they are a poor match for the woofer section with their relatively higher output impedance and significantly lower damping factor.

[pos]

Hmmmm, me putting the speakers on casters was maybe not so good, after all...

No problem, you don't have 2216nd : your 1501Fe do not have kick to start with

[bubbleboy76]

No problem, you don't have 2216nd : your 1501Fe do not have kick to start with

There are so much second harmonic distorsion when you speak, so I can not hear what you are saying!

[bubbleboy76]

No problem, you don't have 2216nd : your 1501Fe do not have kick to start with

Jokes aside, I have always wondered how much more kick 2216nd has compared to my 1501fe. Maybe Greg can shed a light on that?
The specs I can read and understand, are in favour of 1501fe...

[audiomagnate]

...Switched to Electron Kinetics Eagle 400 monoblocks...

I'm impressed! Nice amps. I'll bet they had a ton more "kick" than a transformer coupled McIntosh.

[tom1040]

"He has a McIntosh MEN-220 digital room correction device so both speakers were auto corrected for the comparison. After correction the significant natural deep bass extension advantage of the 1400 was minimal*. The quality of the bass on the 1400 was it's biggest drawback. It was subjectively thicker and slower with less snap and impact than the 4367 and noticeably more muddy despite being corrected. Coherence from top to bottom was compromised on the 1400 for this reason."

What power amp was used for this comparison? The results you describe are in-line with mine when using a Mac power amp with autoformers to drive the 1400s'. I tried an MC402 and then a 302, both producing ponderous, ill-defined bass/mid-bass. Switched to Electron Kinetics Eagle 400 monoblocks and also a Crown Studio Reference 2 and the differences were night and day. The Macs sound warmer and sweeter in the mids' and top-end, but they are a poor match for the woofer section with their relatively higher output impedance and significantly lower damping factor.

That was my feeling as well. I had a McIntosh MC402 and the 1400 Arrays. I switched to a pair of Marantz MA9-S2 monoblocks and the bass tighten up considerable. Currently in process of getting the 4365's and wondering if a MC452 would 'work' with this speaker? Perhaps a pair of MC601's? I loved the Mc402 on my JBL S/2600's I had but that was only a 12" woofer. Some have indicated that McIntosh cannot drive the larger woofers as well. Is the 1501FE hard to drive/control like the LE-14H3 is with middle of the line powered McIntosh amps?(up to 400 wpc)

[Mctwins]

Hallo!

I am very satisfied with my Crown MA5000i and pushes the bass on my 4365 with great result. I have also great bass treatment due to my Varitunes V4 and V6 that helps alot to control the 4365. The one gives the other.

I do belive that one MC452 is more than enough to drive 4367 or 4365.

[bubbleboy76]

That was my feeling as well. I had a McIntosh MC402 and the 1400 Arrays. I switched to a pair of Marantz MA9-S2 monoblocks and the bass tighten up considerable. Currently in process of getting the 4365's and wondering if a MC452 would 'work' with this speaker? Perhaps a pair of MC601's? I loved the Mc402 on my JBL S/2600's I had but that was only a 12" woofer. Some have indicated that McIntosh cannot drive the larger woofers as well. Is the 1501FE hard to drive/control like the LE-14H3 is with middle of the line powered McIntosh amps?(up to 400 wpc)

This norwegian guy tried dual mc601 on his 4365, and was not completely satisfied. I think he uses dual mc1.2 now. There are pics in the end of the thread:
http://www.hifisentralen.no/forumet/...ftet-mitt.html

[jpw]

McIntosh MC-452 works great with my 4367's. The MC-452 clearly has subjectively more bass control and quickness than the older MC-402. In fact it is better across the board. If you choose to use room correction so that bass peaks are removed and bass response is flat, you might find that an amps bass control becomes less of an issue. MC-601's which I also have, other than being more powerful, are so close to the sound of a 452 that I can not reliably tell them apart.

[max432]

Received my 4367's yesterday. I've put in about 12 hours of listneing time so far and all I can say is wow. When I close my eyes I can visulize being at specific concerts where I saw the artist in my college days. Memories that have been locked away 30+ years!

I would not consider myself an audiophile and most audiophiles would not either but my Mcintosh MC302 amp, C50 preamp, and now the 4367's do exactly want I want. Allow me to get lost in the music.

[tom1040]

McIntosh MC-452 works great with my 4367's. The MC-452 clearly has subjectively more bass control and quickness than the older MC-402. In fact it is better across the board. If you choose to use room correction so that bass peaks are removed and bass response is flat, you might find that an amps bass control becomes less of an issue. MC-601's which I also have, other than being more powerful, are so close to the sound of a 452 that I can not reliably tell them apart.

Interesting. Have you heard the 4365 with the McIntosh MC452?