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Thread: 2245h in a fireplace

  1. #16
    Senior Member audiomagnate's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by svollmer View Post
    I have four 2245H's in four 10 cubic foot boxes stacked in a closet next to my room. In the room, you can only see the front of the boxes. I desperately wanted to do them as IB's, using the closet as the cabinet, but alas, it didn't have enough volume according to an IB website calculator I used at the time (pretty sure it was the Cult of IB).

    If anyone has an IB sub in the Washington metro area, I'd love to hear it and learn if I can actually get rid of those boxes.
    10 x Vas of the driver is the "rule," so that would be 4 x 29 x 10 or 1,160 ft3, close to a 10 ft. cube. If your closet isn't that big you can vent up to the attic, basement, outside or other adjacent space. The best thing about the IB website is their motto, "Hear the bass, bot the box." That pretty much sums it up. I've been building subs for over 40 years (damn I'm old!) but IMO this is the way to go. My next move is to find another 2245 and cut a new baffle.

  2. #17
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    Does your flue rattle at all?

    the reason you don't hear it outside is probably because of the height. Bass is omni directional but only to a point. Your radiation is radiated out in all direction from the plane of the top of the chimney.

  3. #18
    Senior Member audiomagnate's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by NickH View Post
    Does your flue rattle at all?

    the reason you don't hear it outside is probably because of the height. Bass is omni directional but only to a point. Your radiation is radiated out in all direction from the plane of the top of the chimney.
    I have run sweeps down to 1 Hz and there are no rattles, except the ones in the room I had to track down. I'm sure if I went up on the roof I could hear it, but from down in the yard I can't hear anything at all, even at fairly loud levels.

    To to answer a previous question, it rains a lot here but I've never seen water in the fireplace. Leaves do make it down here and I will fix that by placing a screen at the top of the chimney.

    I do plan on getting a second woofer but I'm enjoying my system immensly as it is. Oddly enough, classic rock like Steely Dan is what I'm enjoying right now, not pipe organ or dub step. It's fun hearing these albums I've heard hundreds of times - usually with great conventional subs - the IB way. You don't realize how much box sound subs put out until it's gone. I'm going to have to get my regular mains, modded L200s, down here. The only downside is I get nodes and antinodes in this rather large room, around 20 x 70 feet. My sub swarm is better in that one respect. I may have to strategically locate a conventional sub or two, at a lower than normal level, to fix that. Or I could build some more IB's and into the feed the backwaves into the unfinished part of the basement... Hmm.

  4. #19
    Senior Member svollmer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by audiomagnate View Post
    10 x Vas of the driver is the "rule," so that would be 4 x 29 x 10 or 1,160 ft3, close to a 10 ft. cube. If your closet isn't that big you can vent up to the attic, basement, outside or other adjacent space. The best thing about the IB website is their motto, "Hear the bass, bot the box." That pretty much sums it up. I've been building subs for over 40 years (damn I'm old!) but IMO this is the way to go. My next move is to find another 2245 and cut a new baffle.
    Thanks! So, my closet is approximately 280SF, but because it's in the basement, I didn't sheetrock the ceiling and the joists provide four 10"x16" (approximately) openings that lead into an adjacent closet. The adjacent closet might get me pretty close to 1,160 ft3. If it does, will that work?

  5. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by svollmer View Post
    Thanks! So, my closet is approximately 280SF, but because it's in the basement, I didn't sheetrock the ceiling and the joists provide four 10"x16" (approximately) openings that lead into an adjacent closet. The adjacent closet might get me pretty close to 1,160 ft3. If it does, will that work?
    It's plenty- the rule of thumb is to minimize any box rolloff, you won't see any pertinent rolloff in that sized space

  6. #21
    Senior Member audiomagnate's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by svollmer View Post
    Thanks! So, my closet is approximately 280SF, but because it's in the basement, I didn't sheetrock the ceiling and the joists provide four 10"x16" (approximately) openings that lead into an adjacent closet. The adjacent closet might get me pretty close to 1,160 ft3. If it does, will that work?
    Definitely plenty, you just have to make sure the backwave is isolated from the frontwave, and that everything is structurally sound. I also read somewhere that a box as small as 4x Vas acts pretty close to an IB.

  7. #22
    Senior Member svollmer's Avatar
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    Great; thanks very much to you both.

  8. #23
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    Coool idea! The fireplace dvd just tops it up!

  9. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by audiomagnate View Post
    One you've gone IB, you can never go back to boxes or cardboard tubes..
    phrase isn't original .
    But place is!
    I think there is quarterwave resonance but enough\very low(??)
    el goregrind es cultura

  10. #25
    Senior Member audiomagnate's Avatar
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    I've been playing around with slopes, eq, phasing, power, rear chamber (i.e the fireplace) damping, etc. for the last few months. I'm a little bummed that the best bass isn't located at my LP and moving a fireplace sub isn't an option. Besides that, I am extremely happy with this setup. There was a bit of a peak/resonance at 70 Hz, but that was cured with a steeper slope, and a lower crossover point. I can't hear 10 Hz, but it does something to the house way upstairs somewhere so I know it's putting out sound down to there, which makes me grin for some odd reason (14 Hz used to be my lower cuttoff so it's nice to a little more extension). If you happen to have an idle fireplace that also happens to be located in a good spot relative to your LP, I highly recommend this cheap and easy to implement (and "un-implement" if you have to) setup. The next step might be to add another 2245h as there's just enough room, but I'm pretty happy with things as they are to tell the truth.

  11. #26
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    wonder if putting a couple of 2245's in boxes and tuning them so they act as bass traps passively (not being run) at the high nodes, or putting in bass traps in the corners so as to redistribute the energy in the room might be useful. Also, wonder if deflector baffling the woofer might redistribute the energy better into the room, or cut off excess energy in a particular direction.

    How does your flat screen manage not to essentially shake apart when you drive it so close by?
    When faced with another JBL find, Good mech986 says , JBL Fan mech986 says

  12. #27
    Senior Member audiomagnate's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mech986 View Post
    wonder if putting a couple of 2245's in boxes and tuning them so they act as bass traps passively (not being run) at the high nodes, or putting in bass traps in the corners so as to redistribute the energy in the room might be useful. Also, wonder if deflector baffling the woofer might redistribute the energy better into the room, or cut off excess energy in a particular direction.

    How does your flat screen manage not to essentially shake apart when you drive it so close by?
    That seems like a real waste of a pair of 2245's. The room is 63 feet in one dimension and not at all regular; I really don't think I need bass traps. What would help is a swarm to even out nodes and anti-nodes, but a swarm of IB's is tough to implement and I don't want to add any boxes into the mix. The TV is more than a foot away from the woofer. Wavelengths in this region are extremely long (20 to 120 feet) so your deflector and vibrating TV comments don't make a whole lot of sense to me (the TV is about 12 inches away from the baffle). The only vibrations I'm getting are very far from the source and structural and audible (by me anyway) only when I sweep down into the subsonic range (10 Hz in particular), so I'm going to stop doing that. The bottom line (pun intended) is that this setup works wonderfully well and is incredibly cheap and easy to implement. This is by far the cleanest, most effortless, unobtrusive, uncolored (not a hint of "thump"), musical bass I've ever heard, and I've been building and buying massive subs and going to shows since 1977. Back in Colorado I had a swarm of 15s and 12s in custom made massive boxes that sounded very nice and probably had more "punch" (and floor impact) but this is much more satisfying, and now I'm thinking "punch" might not be such a good thing. I absolutely love the way this thing sounds. It's totally addictive and puts a huge smile on my face every time I listen, which is way more often that in the past. Visitors just shake their heads and say "wow." It really is that good. I'm becoming an IB (and 24 bit) evangelist. My next move is to simply cut a new baffle and add a second 2245 as well as a second bridged 620B for 1200 watts total. It's probably overkill as I don't listen all that loud but it couldn't hurt.

  13. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by audiomagnate View Post
    That seems like a real waste of a pair of 2245's. The room is 63 feet in one dimension and not at all regular; I really don't think I need bass traps. What would help is a swarm to even out nodes and anti-nodes, but a swarm of IB's is tough to implement and I don't want to add any boxes into the mix. The TV is more than a foot away from the woofer. Wavelengths in this region are extremely long (20 to 120 feet) so your deflector and vibrating TV comments don't make a whole lot of sense to me (the TV is about 12 inches away from the baffle). The only vibrations I'm getting are very far from the source and structural and audible (by me anyway) only when I sweep down into the subsonic range (10 Hz in particular), so I'm going to stop doing that. The bottom line (pun intended) is that this setup works wonderfully well and is incredibly cheap and easy to implement. This is by far the cleanest, most effortless, unobtrusive, uncolored (not a hint of "thump"), musical bass I've ever heard, and I've been building and buying massive subs and going to shows since 1977. Back in Colorado I had a swarm of 15s and 12s in custom made massive boxes that sounded very nice and probably had more "punch" (and floor impact) but this is much more satisfying, and now I'm thinking "punch" might not be such a good thing. I absolutely love the way this thing sounds. It's totally addictive and puts a huge smile on my face every time I listen, which is way more often that in the past. Visitors just shake their heads and say "wow." It really is that good. I'm becoming an IB (and 24 bit) evangelist. My next move is to simply cut a new baffle and add a second 2245 as well as a second bridged 620B for 1200 watts total. It's probably overkill as I don't listen all that loud but it couldn't hurt.
    Aren't you going to need a second faux fireplace too? So much for incredibly cheap!

  14. #29
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    Anne seems to be very concerned about chimney saftey, she left the same message on another board this morning

    http://discussions.probrewer.com/sho...gh-Attic-Space

    Or she's a spammer.

  15. #30
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    Very cool project. Sorry to jump in so late but I somehow missed the post.

    Now you can see why I've become such a fan of Linkwitz Labs LX521.4. It is an amazingly articulate and coherent speaker system and surpasses anything else I've ever owned. I agree with your open baffle comments. Woofers when they are free to breath, front and back with no cabinet, produce amazing detail. The only drawback, is over driving them. You've hinted at doubling the 2245's. I see your last post is about a year ago. Did you ever do that? Did you use a MiniDSP to help smooth the frequency response and how high of frequency do you run them?

    Very cool project!!!!

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