UREI 813C Monitors - tell me more!

[hjames]

Heard a pair of these at a listening party over the weekend and I was QUITE impressed
with the sound and the dynamics of the system! They look big and heavy -
but were amazingly efficient 101db!) and played quite loud with a low power tube amp!

Apparently they are a 2 1/2 way system?
There is a helper woofer, and the concentric driver -
a woofer with a blue foam-edged thats got a 2425 driver behind it.

I gather the "concentric driver" is an 801c
and the other "helper woofer" is a 2215H.

I found brochures for them here:
http://www.jblproservice.com/pdf/vintage jbl-urei electronics/urei-813.pdf

and here:
http://thehistoryofrecording.com/Man...5C_Manuals.pdf

[louped garouv]

ive not heard the larger incarnations, but i am also impressed with the smaller 809A units, given thier size, performance is great

my understanding is that they were basically made to compete with the Altec monitors of the same ilk...

[BMWCCA]

ive not heard the larger incarnations, but i am also impressed with the smaller 809A units, given thier size, performance is great

my understanding is that they were basically made to compete with the Altec monitors of the same ilk...

Let me know if you'd like me to pick these up for you!

Still in working condition. Vintage UREI studio monitor speakers model 809 and Carver Magnetic field power amp. model PM175. Not willing to separate. http://richmond.craigslist.org/ele/4839835890.html

[Lee in Montreal]

Hey Miss James. I've tried to reply to your PM, but it seems you have exceeded your storage limit ;-)

Lee

[hjames]

Thanks for the comments Dave -
Can't wait to get started!

I'm still trying to sell off the 5 Vandersteens
I kinda figured it would take a while and I'm not going to cut my price in half just to move them ...
plus its outdoor season - the most I do is watch a movie or listen to some music now and then ...
mostly free time is outdoors!

[Ian Mackenzie]

There is some good information on the www about the Urie Time-Aligned monitors.

Edward Long developed a way of measuring delay of the horn and woofer with great accuracy.

This lead to research of a time aligned crossover network that used delay line principles in the form of a 10th order Bessel low pass filter. Bessel filter exhibit a flat extended group delay.

So this was hardly a gimmick.

Among other interesting features small light bulbs were used for current limiting.

[hjames]

Its an old post about a pair of UREI 809As with a carver PM-175 power amp ...
not sure I ever got back to you on this - but I did wind up making a saturday run to Richmond
mid-spring and picked up the speakers AND the amp, once I finally got her to move the price down further!

The carver sounds great but is in storage - the 2 UREIs needed surround replacement and are now
side surrounds in our TV/home theater room (and sound superb!

Let me know if you'd like me to pick these up for you!

[rusty jefferson]

I hope some folks with first hand knowledge of these speakers can contribute to this thread. They are very interesting, and there is really not much information on the web that I've come across.

My first exposure to them was at Sigma Sound Studios in Philadelphia back in the mid to late '70s. I believe the photo (from Sigma) is of the 813a, with the Altec 604 concentric driver. All of the control rooms at Sigma used (I believe there were 3 studios at this location, and 2 at another across town) the 813. They all were quite "dead" utilizing the 12'x12"x1-1/2" acoustic tile anyone who was in elementary school in the '60s would recognize from the auditorium. It covered the walls down to chair height, and ceilings. The doors into the control rooms were double (like entering a darkroom) and gasketed. The UREIs were capable of pressurizing these control rooms to the point of nausea. Bass so forceful, it could make you queasy.

The sound at Sigma was anything but "neutral". In fact, the control rooms were "tuned" using UREI Graphic EQ to enhance the music primarily being recorded there, "Philly Soul", or TSOP, "The Sound of Philly" (which was of course also a band), and Disco. Listen to records recorded at Sigma in that era, and you will undoubtedly recognize the "house" sound. The monitors were not soffit mounted in any of the control rooms. They were mounted with brackets that passed through the control room ceiling and were attached directly to the building structure.

As I recall, they used in house modified Crown amplifiers, but I don't remember what model(s).

Here are some associated links, not really about the UREI, but the studio and the sound:

http://arpjournal.com/1834/capturing...sound-studios/
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sigma_Sound_Studios
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Philadelphia_soul

[Rapidan]

Hi Heather, long time no see!

Those 813's were completely ubiquitous in larger control rooms during the late 70's and all through the 80's. You'll get different opinions as to whether the pre-JBL Altec loaded ones, or the later JBL loaded versions are better. I'd go with later. The real gimmick was the crossover, a "time-aligned" unit for which many claims were made. Whether it was significant or not, who knows. The blue foam is said to reduce reflection inside the horn throat, and is a Urei trademark.

I also own a pair of 809A's, driven by a Fisher X100-3. Very impressive system with an overall sound similar to 813's, but a lot less deep bass. They came from our mutual friend.

The JBL Monitor paper sheds pretty good light on these: http://www.cieri.net/Documenti/JBL/T...1,%20No.15.pdf

[rusty jefferson]

...The JBL Monitor paper sheds pretty good light on these: http://www.cieri.net/Documenti/JBL/T...1,%20No.15.pdf

That's a great link. Thanks for sharing. I don't know if that's in the Library, but it should be.

.... Interestingly, I had exactly the same impression that JBL tech paper says: "Some engineers subjectively describe the imaging of the Time Align as existingin front of the enclosures, while the Bi-Radials seem toplace the image in perspective behind the plane of theenclosures. ". ..

Mine don't exhibit this characteristic, however they are not soffit mounted, and I don't know if that's a factor. Mine are about 7 ft (the baffle) from the front wall, and the image is on plane with the speakers, and back to that wall. I have noticed that particular pieces of electronics I've tried will move the image further forward.

The helper woofer in the last gen 813C that came through the shop was the 2234HPL ( no foilcal, rubber tire ) while the coax was the E145 with the 2425HS ( again without foilcal, tire ).

A local studio also has a pair soffett mounted with that woofer. Perhaps they ordered it that way??

I'd be curious to know, too. I found this thread about 2234/2235 comparisons, perhaps Giskard or Widget would have an opinion on the 2234/2215 swap out. I don't think I've ever seen a published crossover point for the 2215 in these speakers. Anybody?

http://www.audioheritage.org/vbulletin/showthread.php?19-What-was-the-couse-with-2234H/page3

[grumpy]

a bit more info:

http://www.jblproservice.com/pdf/Sys...I%20Series.pdf

the bx was an odd duck, in comparison (veneer, form factor).

[subwoof]

The only reasoning I can think of is that both the E145 and 2215 share the same VERY deep magnetic gap depth with short voice coil - maximum linearity but at additional cost of the oversized magnetic structure.

ALL the earlier versions did not share this design due to multiple brands / model changes.

sub

[Dave M]

a bit more info:

http://www.jblproservice.com/pdf/Sys...I%20Series.pdf

the bx was an odd duck, in comparison (veneer, form factor).

813BX (floor standing model) might have different low frequency response than the other soffit 813s.

I wonder if anyone has any information about it.

[hjames]

Anyone have thoughts or experience with the UREI 809s?
I gather they have the 12 inch coaxial and not the 15 inch -
so they would be a little smaller and lighter - easier to move ...

I have seen there are both model 809, and an 809A model ...

http://www.jblproservice.com/pdf/URE...s/809A-L,R.pdf

Seems the 813C is listed as 101db sensitivity, the 809A is only 93db sensitivity ...
But the frequency response is listed the same for both, surprisingly.

[hjames]

I looked and found a pair of 809A on ebay that turned out to be local in Falls Church, VA.
Subwoof gave me some tips on setting up a pair of 2214s as "helper woofers"

http://www.audioheritage.org/vbullet...I-809A-Project

Anyone have thoughts or experience with the UREI 809s?
I gather they have the 12 inch coaxial and not the 15 inch -
so they would be a little smaller and lighter - easier to move ...

I have seen there are both model 809, and an 809A model ...

http://www.jblproservice.com/pdf/URE...s/809A-L,R.pdf

Seems the 813C is listed as 101db sensitivity, the 809A is only 93db sensitivity ...
But the frequency response is listed the same for both, surprisingly.