2216Nd Projects

[4313B]

I received some information on the M2 enclosure design yesterday and thought I would post it here.

2216Nd in M2 enclosure:
Vb = 130 liters
Fb = 27 Hz

One of the guys made the attachment up for me yesterday and it shows two PEQ points in the FILTERS section to the lower right. Please don't confuse this simulation with the actual DSP applied to the M2 system using the Crowns.

I have also attached the S4700 EDS for reference.

2216Nd in S4700 enclosure:
Vb = 135 liters
Fb = 32 Hz

Finally, I have attached the 2216Nd EDS.

[pos]

Very interesting, thank you!

I thought the M2 was tuned around 21Hz.
The enclosure design shows a +8dB eq at the 27Hz tuning frequency, whereas the M2 crossover has a +4.7dB eq at 21.5Hz (and an addition shelving).

Interesting read also about the S4700. Definitely a nice and well behaved system!
The passive crossover voltage curves are a good complement to the active curves from GT you posted last year: http://www.audioheritage.org/vbullet...l=1#post354856

[4313B]

I thought the M2 was tuned around 21Hz.
The enclosure design shows a +8dB eq at the 27Hz tuning frequency, whereas the M2 crossover has a +4.7dB eq at 21.5Hz (and an addition shelving).

Yes, the actual system seems to come out a lot better than the simulation.

[4313B]

RobH3606 received the very first pair of 2216Nd's (M2, S4700) courtesy of Jerry Moro.

pos and I should have a lot of fun with these. These drivers are ridiculously good. I kind of feel bad about making fun of their 3-inch voice coils early on. Obviously Jerry knew exactly what he was doing.

I haven't decided yet if I am going to keep two pair, it is awfully tempting to build a pair of 4435-style enclosures for home theater use. The best waveguide that I have at present is the PT-H1010, pretty much a bolt-in for the older 2344.

Hopefully pos will post about his impending project.

[grumpy]

Fun, fun, fun, (fun)

[bubbleboy76]

RobH3606 received the very first pair of 2216Nd's (M2, S4700) courtesy of Jerry Moro.

pos and I should have a lot of fun with these. These drivers are ridiculously good. I kind of feel bad about making fun of their 3-inch voice coils early on. Obviously Jerry knew exactly what he was doing.

I haven't decided yet if I am going to keep two pair, it is awfully tempting to build a pair of 4435-style enclosures for home theater use. The best waveguide that I have at present is the PT-H1010, pretty much a bolt-in for the older 2344.

Hopefully pos will post about his impending project.

This will be fun!

Are they better than 1501AL? Or in between 1501AL and 1501fe in performance?

What is the price of those things? Priceless?!

I am interested if you will sell some.

[1audiohack]

HA!

gibber, a friend and I had this exact conversation yesterday evening and I nearly spoke your last post verbatim.

I don't know if we are right but, we sure think alike.

Barry.

[ivica]

RobH3606 received the very first pair of 2216Nd's (M2, S4700) courtesy of Jerry Moro.

pos and I should have a lot of fun with these. These drivers are ridiculously good. I kind of feel bad about making fun of their 3-inch voice coils early on. Obviously Jerry knew exactly what he was doing.

I haven't decided yet if I am going to keep two pair, it is awfully tempting to build a pair of 4435-style enclosures for home theater use. The best waveguide that I have at present is the PT-H1010, pretty much a bolt-in for the older 2344.

Hopefully pos will post about his impending project.

Hi 4313B,

interesting project. I can imagind that 2216 can be very good low mid bass driver. what would be crossover freuency when using PT-H1010, if You want to use with 2216. I can say around 1kHz. But for low bass section, and UHF, any suggestion?

regards
ivica

[4313B]

Have you start some of your projects?

I have not been nearly as productive as I had wanted with respect to loudspeaker projects this summer. I haven't finished drawing up plans for some M2 enclosure clones. I have managed to veneer and finish my 4338/4365/Everest II hybrids. Hopefully I will be able to load the components this weekend.

I mention Everest II only because all the components are DD67000 components, including the passive filters (formerly 4365 filters).

Not a very impressive iPhone photo.

[Aaron]

In the past the LE10-H got praise mostly because it had no really nasty faults...that's it. I suspect this new beast will be more of the same. A driver that commits no major sins at all will probably make for a pleasant listening experience. It may not the best in any particular way, but I think you could call it very well optimized.

[grumpy]

Reduced dynamic compression.

[gibber]

Reduced dynamic compression.

There's two aspects to dynamic compression, i believe.

In a large level scale context, most modern designs tend to be much better than the units they replace. Some say this started with SFG ferrites taking over from the earlier alnico's, but i actually believe it was most visible (sorry: audible) during the time when one to the next ferrite/neo iteration was done, just compare 2225 to 2226 at ++ volume.

Second aspect is small scale or "inner" dynamic contrast. It is my (entirely personal) feeling that the newer high power coils and cones do swallow a lot of fine detail IF -big if- you don't use the large scale benefits. Because if you do, those will outshine (sorry: outsound) the benefits in inner dynamics the lighter coils / lighter cones do in my opinion have [i also interpret Aaron's "no major sins" comment this way, the newer structures tend to swallow fine detail + fine dynamics and avoid sharp breakups plus yield extra reliability in exchange].

2216Nd can perhaps combine both benefits by going for a smaller / lighter 3" coil. I have no access to this engineering miracle, hope you can post on how it sounds when you get it.

Ralph

[bubbleboy76]

Reduced dynamic compression.

Can that be seen in the specs?

[withTarragon]

Yes, this is an older thread, but an interesting one.

Did many, or any, of these projects come to fruition?
I am guessing folks probably used ported cabinets with internal volumes between 130-145 liters and vent tuning between the mid-20s to the low-30's Hz. My guesses are driven by specs for the M2 cabinet and the S-4700 cabinet. I don't know of any other cabinets that use the original 2216-nd woofer.

Please share what you found or measured or photographed. I am quite interested since I recently received a pair of these woofers. They need a good home.

Thanks,
-Tom

[hlaari]

They look great!
nice veneer and blue front baffle, do you also have the original 4338 grill for them?

I have collect most of the parts for my 4365 project except H4365 horns but I hope to get them soon