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Thread: M2 Master Reference Monitor Purchase

  1. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by Don McRitchie View Post
    The three pictures illustrate the room. The M2's will be going in my living room to replace the Altec Model 19's currently shown. As the space is my living room/dining room, there is no real opportunity for physical room treatments. Hence the reliance on DSP and room EQ.
    Very nice room you have and even if this will be hard to say but there will always for certain be room anomalies that DSP or room EQ cant handle.

    I understand that room treatment is of no option for you, but there is no short cuts here. If a problem is related to a room acoustical problem there will always be around despite the use of EQ. If a say to take the rooms problem out of the equation, it will let the speaker or system perform for the better.

    I prefer that the rooms anomalies is to be dealth with first and then apply any necessery EQ to tail your own subjective listening tuning knowing that the rooms problem is fixed, just makes that job easier.

    I also see that the speakers will be in their respective corners to close to sidewalls creating side reflections to your disadvantage. The bass will trigger all the room modes and there is no space to move them around. The measurements will show if this is the case or not.

    I hope that you dont have that mush of problems from the room and wich you best of luck.

  2. #32
    Senior Member pos's Avatar
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    Of course passive treatment is the best option, but even without this the M2 is at an advantage compared to other speakers because its off axis response is coherent and smooth.
    That will make reflexions less intrusive.

    The room is not that bad already, it is symmetrical where it needs to be, with a heavy rug on the floor and exposed beams on the ceiling. And there is even a cat.
    Speaker placement (distance from the walls), toe-in (reduction of first reflexions) and/or a little bit of passive treatment on first reflexions specular positions (heavy curtains on the sides, that can be gathered in the corner when not listening) will already go a long way in obtaining a very good response in the upper range.
    Low frequency modes can clearly not be handled here, and EQ will help reducing the most offending ones at the listening positions (cut, no boost there).

    Regarding the corner placement, the existing Altec speaker is much larger than the M2. The M2 will see a larger frequency range radiated to the rear wall behind the speaker (higher baffle step frequency), and this might cause problems in the ~100-300Hz range (comb filtering from the direct+reflected signal from the rear wall).
    Placing an absorber panel behind the speaker might be a good solution, and not too intrusive visually (Primacoustic or GIK Acoustic broadband panels, the thicker the better...)

  3. #33
    Senior Member Valentin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Don McRitchie View Post
    This will be my first request for input (with likely many to follow) in setting up an M2 system. I would appreciate advice on buying a measurement platform that I would like to keep under $1k. Is it possible or even desirable to go for a multi-mic setup within this budget or am I better off with one higher quality mic recognizing that tuning becomes more complex? I will be using a Win7 laptop with a generic motherboard based sound processor. I know a multichannel input/sound card would be required for a multi-mic setup and could use recommendations for one if that approach is viable. Otherwise, I am led to believe it is possible to use a single mic if it has a usb connection with no additional soundcard. I could use confirmation and/or suggestions.

    As for software, JBLPro has used both Smaart and EASE to set up M2's and both are effective but pricey solutions. I am aware of the freeware REW and that would be my first choice. Does anyone have any concerns with using that software? I would like to have a measurement platform in place before the M2's arrive either late this week or early next so any timely input would be appreciated.
    congrats Don

    if you have a ipad or iphone i can recomend the studio 6 digital software and the itest mic wich is sold by audiocontrol and has been calibrated

    it is recomended for the measurments of the REVEL subwoofer system and software


    http://www.studiosixdigital.com/audi...cisionmic.html

  4. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by Valentin View Post
    congrats Don

    if you have a ipad or iphone i can recomend the studio 6 digital software and the itest mic wich is sold by audiocontrol and has been calibrated

    it is recomended for the measurments of the REVEL subwoofer system and software


    http://www.studiosixdigital.com/audi...cisionmic.html

    Another forum member here and I (following his enlightened example) purchased the Dayton Audio iMM-6 calibrated mic. I purchased the Studio 6 Audio Tools, successfully loaded the mic's calibration file, and the darn thing works like a charm.

    I'm too ignorant to give any advice on using this with the M2, but I will say I can get some very accurate info on what the Timbers Arrays are doing in my big-ass room where I can't do any significant room treatments. It's way more info than I'm qualified to use, so cold-tuning just speaker placement and toe-in as my control methods, the iPad/Dayton mic combo really lets me see the changes wrought by even minute adjustments.

    Of course, I'm focusing on one listening position, not multiples, because I want the "perfect" seat, and everyone else be damned.
    Out.

  5. #35
    Webmaster Don McRitchie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pos View Post
    Don, look slike you are in good hands

    What correction hardware will you be using?
    I'll be using the DSP's in the Crown iTech 5000HD amps.

  6. #36
    Webmaster Don McRitchie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bobecca View Post
    Very nice room you have and even if this will be hard to say but there will always for certain be room anomalies that DSP or room EQ cant handle.
    I am under no illusions about the capabilities of DSP and room EQ. As with all things in life, I will be working with a degree of compromise. I do not have the option of a dedicated sound room so the M2's will have to fit into the environment of my living/dining space pretty much as is. I'll just learn to live with whatever issues the electronic processing can't address. Regardless, the end result will be an order of magnitude better that what I am currently listening to.

    Don

  7. #37
    Webmaster Don McRitchie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pos View Post
    The room is not that bad already, it is symmetrical where it needs to be, with a heavy rug on the floor and exposed beams on the ceiling. And there is even a cat.
    I actually have two cats - one for each speaker. I'm a big stickler on symmetry.

    Seriously, the absorber panels behind the speakers could be doable. I just need to determine how big an issue it is.

  8. #38
    Senior Member Valentin's Avatar
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    Name:  objetivo en cuarto M2.jpg
Views: 750
Size:  74.3 KB
    from what i have read the gray line should aproximate the in room reasponse

  9. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by Don McRitchie View Post
    I am under no illusions about the capabilities of DSP and room EQ. As with all things in life, I will be working with a degree of compromise. I do not have the option of a dedicated sound room so the M2's will have to fit into the environment of my living/dining space pretty much as is. I'll just learn to live with whatever issues the electronic processing can't address. Regardless, the end result will be an order of magnitude better that what I am currently listening to.

    Don
    No problem, I understand the dilemma. Been there and lucky with an dedicatet room as long one can keep it.

    Still, it will be intresting to follow your next step

  10. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by Valentin View Post
    Name:  objetivo en cuarto M2.jpg
Views: 750
Size:  74.3 KB
    from what i have read the gray line should aproximate the in room reasponse
    Any good links out there to share? I like to read.

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  12. #42
    Senior Member Valentin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bobecca View Post
    Any good links out there to share? I like to read.

    http://www.amazon.com/Sound-Reproduc.../dp/0240520092

  13. #43
    Senior Member SEAWOLF97's Avatar
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    My library has it ... on hold for me now
    “If you think that’s the dumbest thing you’ve ever heard,
    just wait a couple minutes!”

  14. #44
    Webmaster Don McRitchie's Avatar
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    Status Update

    Had a bit of a snafu with shipping. That's been fixed and I was told that the speakers and amps were shipped out today by truck from JBL's Canadian distributor in Montreal. The road distance from Montreal to Winnipeg is about the same as from New York to Kansas City, so they'll take a few days to get here. I am told they should be delivered on Thursday. That works out OK as the measurement gear and preamp/processor are all arriving at the same time. The Altec Model 19's have just been sold so they should be departing the day before their replacements come through the door. More to come as all the pieces come together.

    Don

  15. #45
    Administrator Mr. Widget's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Don McRitchie View Post
    Status Update

    Had a bit of a snafu with shipping. That's been fixed and I was told that the speakers and amps were shipped out today by truck from JBL's Canadian distributor in Montreal. The road distance from Montreal to Winnipeg is about the same as from New York to Kansas City, so they'll take a few days to get here. I am told they should be delivered on Thursday. That works out OK as the measurement gear and preamp/processor are all arriving at the same time. The Altec Model 19's have just been sold so they should be departing the day before their replacements come through the door. More to come as all the pieces come together.

    Don
    Exciting!!!

    Keep us posted... Model 19s to the M2s. That'll be huge!


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