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Thread: Turntables , Vinyl , Welcome back!

  1. #406
    Senior Member RMC's Avatar
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    There's many lists of "best" TTs on the Web. As for this one I have my doubts re validity. Three AT models out of 7 total and those ATs are certainly not the best they have, but I figure price matters in the review.

    AT LP 120 best overall?? LOL, I own one and got rid of it, sent it upstairs to replace wife's old TT, put a rubber mat on it plus a low cost AT91 cart (up to 2.5gr) she's happy, and got myself a better LP5 (OK quality, but not great/outstanding). As for the other two ATs from the review they are lower range starter TTs so....

    Platter rotation wise LP120 is ok, but it comes with a CHEAP synthetic fiber mat. Tonearm wise its poor since it has too much friction to use any good low tracking force cartridge with it. Reviewer sure didn't try to balance the tonearm with any degree of precision. Not for real Hi-Fi with tonearm and AT95E cart supplied. Globally ok TT for lower cost Direct Drive DJ work VS pricier LP 1240 or Technics SL series.

    Since in the review they refer to the famous Technics SL-1200 took pics from a Canadian retailer Web site to get an idea on availability and pricing. The three most expensive Technics (5, 13 and 24K $!) out of six models shown are depleted, not in stock, maybe not even available?? That leaves SL1200GR, SL-1500C and SL-1200 MK7 (DJ), still not very affordable for most, but Technics TT seems to have become a niche product.

    BTW seen on another of those Web evaluation sites, this time for cartridges (think it was cartridge review something) I saw AT 95E HIGHLY RECOMMENDED! and mentioned can also put 95EX stylus on it as if it would make cart even better... Well I have both (shown in my BGW thread) and I don't share their view. 95E so so but for $10. more in the US (last seen) you can purchase the little better and ok 95EX, why bother with 95E. Finally, one guy showed on Net his response measurement of 95E and says its flat: notable high end peak and LF roll off, he might need an eye examination... Regards,

    Richard


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  2. #407
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    Yes, and I'd prefer any of my 1970ies to 1980ies Duals or Thorens over almost any of these Ľbestę TTs.

    Best regards!

  3. #408
    Senior Member RMC's Avatar
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    A PRECISION RE LP RECORDS

    Recently was somewhat pissed-off at vinyl records reissue prices (posts # 382 and 384), more so when trying to get younger folks interested in playing these. Also wondered if those were premium or had some magic.

    There's a piece of fine print information I missed when I first looked at the music catalog previously mentioned. The evil is in the details isn't it. Today had another look at that catalog and there it was.

    I enlarged the small print note at the bottom of vinyls page: "Advertised prices apply to regular vinyls." So they're not premium ones, no magic, standard vinyls. No wonder its small print down there. Nothing to help the cause nor my mood.

    With all due respect for some of my colleagues here who somewhat quickly justified such prices (e.g. inflation) I still can't buy that as THE explanation. Taking say 70's price, adjusting it for inflation, then saying this is it, seems like a shortcut to me.

    I think that would sweep under the carpet the fact that with reissues a number of important costs were all paid and amortized decades ago: studio time, recording equipment costs (e.g. tapes, rentals), musicians cost, jacket design and artwork, record company marketing of the group and album, etc. Not to be considered again.

    Today's record costs are mostly record pressing, jacket printing/packaging and a royalty to artist. Mentioned before smaller production numbers may also increase a little unit cost. But there's no new music creation, they don't reinvent the wheel, simply copy what already existed. By analogy, similar to members who clone 43 series boxes for example. They save big by not having to pay for engineering, lab time, marketing costs, etc.

    The catalog's vinyl records page title is "Vintage, but so trendy". So vinyl reissues appear to be marketed as fashionable items, insisting on vintage aspect and trend. Possibly reasons for fat margins?

    Concluding on a funnier note, if you're into "Love songs for robots", barely shown at top of pic, well its $35. plus 15% taxes, so $40. plus ship. Up to you to decide if yours deserves that treat or needs it. Maybe robots do need love songs too? Amen.

    Richard

    P.S. Tom, any good for Alexa?

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  4. #409
    Senior Member SEAWOLF97's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RMC View Post
    Today's record costs are mostly record pressing, jacket printing/packaging and a royalty to artist.
    we were batting around royalties in '08

    Royalties..how dey work ?????


    http://www.audioheritage.org/vbullet...ight=royalties
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  5. #410
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    Quote Originally Posted by RMC View Post
    A PRECISION RE LP RECORDS

    Recently was somewhat pissed-off at vinyl records reissue prices (posts # 382 and 384), more so when trying to get younger folks interested in playing these. Also wondered if those were premium or had some magic.

    There's a piece of fine print information I missed when I first looked at the music catalog previously mentioned. The evil is in the details isn't it. Today had another look at that catalog and there it was.

    I enlarged the small print note at the bottom of vinyls page: "Advertised prices apply to regular vinyls." So they're not premium ones, no magic, standard vinyls. No wonder its small print down there. Nothing to help the cause nor my mood.

    With all due respect for some of my colleagues here who somewhat quickly justified such prices (e.g. inflation) I still can't buy that as THE explanation. Taking say 70's price, adjusting it for inflation, then saying this is it, seems like a shortcut to me.

    I think that would sweep under the carpet the fact that with reissues a number of important costs were all paid and amortized decades ago: studio time, recording equipment costs (e.g. tapes, rentals), musicians cost, jacket design and artwork, record company marketing of the group and album, etc. Not to be considered again.

    Today's record costs are mostly record pressing, jacket printing/packaging and a royalty to artist. Mentioned before smaller production numbers may also increase a little unit cost. But there's no new music creation, they don't reinvent the wheel, simply copy what already existed. By analogy, similar to members who clone 43 series boxes for example. They save big by not having to pay for engineering, lab time, marketing costs, etc.

    The catalog's vinyl records page title is "Vintage, but so trendy". So vinyl reissues appear to be marketed as fashionable items, insisting on vintage aspect and trend. Possibly reasons for fat margins?

    Concluding on a funnier note, if you're into "Love songs for robots", barely shown at top of pic, well its $35. plus 15% taxes, so $40. plus ship. Up to you to decide if yours deserves that treat or needs it. Maybe robots do need love songs too? Amen.

    Richard

    P.S. Tom, any good for Alexa?
    then just don't buy or play new records dude prob solved
    it's simple economics it's called supply and demand for the reissues and new return on set up costs for both percentage of catalog
    negligible
    me personally I just realized that Van Halen's last record was a limited run on vinyl - now a copy'll cost me a 100
    sucks to be me, huh
    so now I'm going to hyperf&^king analyze it and like how come they didn't press more so I coulda scored at 30 or whatever
    the money is in publishing anyway always has been always will be
    a shit load off touring and concessions more than back in the day
    welcome to 2020

  6. #411
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    the majority knows the difference between 180 gram records and standard pressings and the fact that 180 can suck too be huge waste of time and money
    records not vinyls
    records or lp
    only hipsters and noobs call records vinyls

  7. #412
    On Holidays Ian Mackenzie's Avatar
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    Are you guys sure your not over thinking it?

    Most vinyl l bought in the 70ís and 80ís is at best well worn if not scratched here and there.
    The entrepreneurs in the vinyl re issue business know that. They also know there is plenty of new talent wanting to be put on vinyl. They are entitled to a profit margin as is the distribution chain. I would be surprised if the retail mark up isnít 100%. Itís simple.

    The notion that vinyl re issues are overpriced is something you either accept or you donít. If you canít afford them your going to say their over priced. Most people find a way of justifying any retail purchase if they really want it. The market knows people buy them because they are on the shelves.

    On You tube somewhere there is a documentary on the worlds the largest record plant in Europe.
    Itís a massive operation with a whole floor of mastering suites, a huge pressing plant and warehouses.

  8. #413
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ian Mackenzie View Post
    Are you guys sure your not over thinking it?

    Most vinyl l bought in the 70’s and 80’s is at best well worn if not scratched here and there.
    The entrepreneurs in the vinyl re issue business know that. They also know there is plenty of new talent wanting to be put on vinyl. They are entitled to a profit margin as is the distribution chain. I would be surprised if the retail mark up isn’t 100%. It’s simple.

    The notion that vinyl re issues are overpriced is something you either accept or you don’t. If you can’t afford them your going to say their over priced. Most people find a way of justifying any retail purchase if they really want it. The market knows people buy them because they are on the shelves.

    On You tube somewhere there is a documentary on the worlds the largest record plant in Europe.
    It’s a massive operation with a whole floor of mastering suites, a huge pressing plant and warehouses.
    agreed, if you can't afford records or feel the price is somehow unjust there are plenty of other delivery options out there
    15 to 25 for standard fare
    25 to 50 for really nice stuff excellent quality from quiet vinyl to good mastering
    more than reasonable
    as for pressing plants, popping up like weeds in the good ole U.S.of A.

  9. #414
    On Holidays Ian Mackenzie's Avatar
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    Back to your local channel.

    l have over the past couple of years bought a selection of reissues of my favourite albums l like to play regularly. These old albums have since worn out.

    The Stanton 681EEE was good in its day but a well ridden road eventually requires re surfacing! Amusingly it was the neighbors who complained bitterly at my front door of groove jumping when l played “Wish You Were Here” on the 4343’s with 350 watts on the woofers back in the early 80’s. There was no problem with the with the headroom from the 700B (threshold of clipping 450 watts).

    Prior to that l had bought a carton full of albums from a shop in Times Square. I also have a collection of original release albums from Miles Davis and others.
    Back in the day it was obvious that locally pressed albums were shy on quality of the imports. I have a huge stash of older import labels. I also have my Sheffield Labs direct to disk stash.

    I am slowly replacing the more commercial albums and labels with new releases.

    Not had time to listen to the Prime at length yet. But it seems to deliver significantly quieter backgrounds and reveals much more of music in the groove.

  10. #415
    Senior Member SEAWOLF97's Avatar
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    How Will the Fire At Apollo Masters Affect the Local Music Industry?

    https://www.portlandmercury.com/blog...music-industry
    we never fail to fail, it is the easiest thing to do

  11. #416
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    guess which reviewer wrote this gem ??

    .
    no fair peeking....

    Frankly speaking, I donít like lists. Itís bad enough to pick 5 best albums over a year, never mind 50 over a decade. Itís worse to have to almost arbitrarily list them in descending order, but thatís the self-assignment so thatís what Iíve done. While I was already Social Security eligible a decade ago, many people found my behavior to be that of a 4 year old, so perhaps thatís why my pal Malachi, the siteís other ďregular writerĒ and I get along so well.






































    https://www.analogplanet.com/content...ions-playlists
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  12. #417
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    Freudian slip ?

    >> Extensive life testing showed that praying at low tracking force has significant advantages in extending the life of both the stylus and the record, provided that no mistracking occurs

    http://shure.custhelp.com/app/answer...Considerations

    Design Considerations of the V15 Type IV Phonograph Cartridge by L. R. Happ
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  13. #418
    Senior Member RMC's Avatar
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    Yup, provided that ...

    Can't open the Shure link btw, another Win 10/Edge gremlin??

    Richard

  14. #419
    Senior Member SEAWOLF97's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RMC View Post
    Yup, provided that ...

    Can't open the Shure link btw, another Win 10/Edge gremlin??

    Richard
    it's been moved here ==>> https://www.shure.com/en-US/support/...Considerations

    didn't read thru to see if they've corrected that typo.

    still shows up on Google.

    High Fidelity Phonograph Cartridge - Technical Seminar - Shure
    www.shure.com › en-US › support › find-an-answer › high-fidelity-p...

    Oct 17, 2017 - Extensive life testing showed that praying at low tracking force has significant advantages in extending the life of both the stylus and the record, provided that no mistracking occurs. ... An extensive study of record warps resulted in an explanation of the need for optimizing cartridge compliance.
    we never fail to fail, it is the easiest thing to do

  15. #420
    Senior Member RMC's Avatar
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    Tom,

    Thanks for the corrected Shure link, it works!

    Appears like good text but soooo long, read parts quickly here and there and its interesting. V15IV owner manual contains some of that stuff also.

    Web page has nothing where I could save it to hard disc, but found a work around to do it from Win Edge: Parameters, More tools, Open with Internet Explorer; then when in IE with the Web page: Tools, File, save as...

    Lots of screwing around but saved it, tested it and its working. Funny part though is old Win 7 IE available in Edge saves my ass, in other words going backwards to go forward... Yup, the whole universe is insane.

    Another work around used today to save on hard disc is when Web page is text only (e.g. looong interview with Bruce Edgar) then: Select all, copy and paste text to a WordPad page, give it a title and Save as text file... Done deal.

    Btw writing those tricks here means I've got a little more chances to remember them, lol

    Haven't had time yet to transfer all my stuff from old laptop to new one, plus its sometimes just faster to save a new copy of a document (e.g. pdf) to new laptop. No space issue It has two hard drives: one for operating system and programs SSD 120 GB (one third used) and one SATA 1 TB for the rest, enough room untill death...

    Richard

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