Ace

[paragon]

Does anybody know something about the ACE Bass circuit
(K.E. Stahl) ?
50 L Reflex Enclosure with JBL K140 and 20 Hz output,
no overload of diver and amp.
System changes Mmd, Cms, Ots, Rmt.
Did anybody try this ??

Regards
Eckhard

[Earl K]

Hi Eckhard

I did a few google searches and came back with the impression that Stahls' circuit was fairly similar to the ELF system. Enhanced bass extension through electronic means is fairly old hat by now. Without reading Stahl(s)' paper on the subject , I don't know what new wrinkles he brings (brought) to the subject.

Do you know someone using the ACE circuit ?

John Meyer of Meyer Sound Labs sell the "X-10" large format studio monitor that uses pressure sensors to control cone motion through the use of feedback circuits. This isn't a new idea. Harry Olson introduces this concept in one of his RCA publications from the 1950(s).

<. EarlK

[Mr. Widget]

I've heard the Meyer X-10s. They are a 15" two way with an aluminum diaphragmed 2" driver and CD horn on top. Both of these while fully hand dialed in proprietary designs are quite good but nothing revolutionary in design.

The bass however is awesome!!! While using a pressure mic and feedback loop may not be a unique idea, has been implemented in a new and patented way. The bass quality was extremely tight, yet natural sounding unlike most other feedback systems I've heard. The woofer and feedback system work up to the crossover frequency of 500Hz. The design of the woofer and system is also proprietary and really sounds great from deep infrasonics all the way up!

One unusual thing about the system is any pressure change in the room, like opening a door, is compensated for by the woofer as it reads this as a form of distortion from the input signal. The result is while nothing is coming out of the monitors if the door is opened the woofers immediately attempt to neutralize the sound and pressure change.

Widget

[johnaec]

Originally posted by Mr. Widget
I've heard the Meyer X-10s. They are a 15" two way with an aluminum diaphragmed 2" driver and CD horn on top.

I notice their specs say 1" throat with 4" V.C. - are you saying they compress that down to 1" on the way out? That does seem awfully small for 500 hz crossover, though I find their comment, "500 Hz- 1100 Hz, 950 Hz (equal acoustic pressure)", somewhat confusing. 'Some kind of sliding crossover point? And that HF horn sure looks similar to JBL's flat-front bi-radial designs. (Has anyone here ever objectively auditioned JBL's 238X series? How do they sound?)

Quote on the optional X-800 subwoofer: "because the X-800's dual 18-inch drivers are not tightly controlled by PSAC, they retain the subtle timbral cues of traditional subwoofers–a subjective characteristic that many listeners find familiar and pleasing." In other words - distortion?

The X-10's do look like a real nice set of speakers - 'wonder how many sets of various JBL heritage speakers you could get for what a pair of X-10's go for...?

John

[jlee]

I've heard the Meyer X-10s. They are a 15" two way with an aluminum diaphragmed 2" driver and CD horn on top. Both of these while fully hand dialed in proprietary designs are quite good but nothing revolutionary in design.

The bass however is awesome!!! While using a pressure mic and feedback loop may not be a unique idea, has been implemented in a new and patented way. The bass quality was extremely tight, yet natural sounding unlike most other feedback systems I've heard. The woofer and feedback system work up to the crossover frequency of 500Hz. The design of the woofer and system is also proprietary and really sounds great from deep infrasonics all the way up!

One unusual thing about the system is any pressure change in the room, like opening a door, is compensated for by the woofer as it reads this as a form of distortion from the input signal. The result is while nothing is coming out of the monitors if the door is opened the woofers immediately attempt to neutralize the sound and pressure change.

Widget

Hi Widget,

Do you still remember the sound from X-10?
I'm very interested in this speaker for a long time. Everyone talked about its excellent bass quality. However not much people talked about high freq. Also how did it sound under low SPL?

From other posts these two days from me, you can see that I'm trying to think different ways to get a good sound. One of the things is TAD is so expensive and the total cost to make a good system may not be less than just buy a set of X-10.