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Thread: Drew Daniels' ANCIENT AUDIOPHILE system

  1. #1
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    Drew Daniels' ANCIENT AUDIOPHILE system

    http://www.audioheritage.org/html/pe...audiophile.htm I've been very blessed to land most of the parts in decent shape to build this system. I realize the time involved is deep and need advice along the way. If not a faithful production, then something he would have approved of. The sub cabs and any wood working in general is going to be the first hurdle for me. I was looking at used SR4719X cabs and thought that it could move this forward. I'm planning on reconing 4x 2245 baskets to rest in these. What I noticed right off is the cabinet volume. Daniels' cabs should have a volume of ~23 ft3 vs. the ~20 ft3 for the 4719x. Is this cabinet idea way off or..... http://www.jblproservice.com/pdf/SR-X Series/SR4719X.pdf
    Last edited by grey; 08-12-2012 at 10:46 PM. Reason: links!

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    I rebuilt a pair of srx cabs. I don't know if they where built in sweden or in us. But they where really badly built. Low quality plywood. Not properly braced. The bracing was glued to the plywood, and had caused the plywood to delaminate. The back corners of the cabinet was held together with carpet only.

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    That's not good at all. I was reading that birch ply was involved in the construction. I was expecting something that could maybe use a brace here and there. Undoubtedly re-tuning would be involved.
    There is no way I'm installing the recones in something described like that.

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    Well, mine could be locally built. Maybe someone else here has experience with american built cabinets.

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    Dang. Amateur speakerdave's Avatar
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    That's a challenging build. I would suggest you make a separate cabinet for each subwoofer using the Greg Timbers design from the '80's Audio Magazine article. For home use you only need two. If you build a 20 cu ft cabinet it will be very big and heavy. You will need to hire roadies.
    "Audio is filled with dangerous amateurs." --- Tim de Paravicini

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    Quote Originally Posted by speakerdave View Post
    That's a challenging build. I would suggest you make a separate cabinet for each subwoofer using the Greg Timbers design from the '80's Audio Magazine article. For home use you only need two. If you build a 20 cu ft cabinet it will be very big and heavy. You will need to hire roadies.
    It's been challenging just to get this far yet enjoyable all the way. Your thoughts are perfectly sane and I agree with you. I must also realize that this system doesn't completely follow sanity. I totally forgot about the 12 ft3 cabinet in that article. Excellent idea if that's what you had in mind. Two of those would work perfectly for now. Plans are for a bigger room (~35x25 ft. with rising ceiling) and it would be easy to scale.

    I'm still curios if the 4719x would be reasonable if there are is a variant in better quality.

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    Dang. Amateur speakerdave's Avatar
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    That's a nice big room. I am curious about what elements you have in hand and what the intended use is.
    "Audio is filled with dangerous amateurs." --- Tim de Paravicini

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    This is what's here and dedicated to the project.

    [4] 2245H 18" subwoofer (baskets)
    [2] 2220H 15" midbass drivers
    [2] 2123H 10" midrange drivers
    [2] 2445 4" compression drivers w/2452-SL phrams
    [2] 2397 Smith horns
    [2] 2405 Diffraction tweeters w/new phrams
    [1] Marchand XM-44 4 way crossover


    A mix of decent amplifiers that could be traded in favor a better fit. The largest being a com-tech 1600.
    A DSP unit to manage the subwoofers.

    Intended use if the room?
    Read, study, relax, listen, enjoy.....just what I do now.

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    Senior Member Lee in Montreal's Avatar
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    As much as I recognize the 2245 as being a superb infrabass driver, I find it lacks the roundness and kick of a midbass driver such as a 2220 or 2225. I don't think the 2245 performs "well" around 80-120Hz, at least not for the sound I particularly look for. That list above is not far from what I would use for a powerfull home system. My personal set-up would be as follows

    2245 to 2225 (20Hz-50Hz)
    2225 to 2441/2350 horn (50Hz-600Hz)
    2441/2350 horn to 2405 slot tweeter (600Hz-8Khz)
    2405 slot tweeter (8Khz- 20Khz)

    Nonetheless, I don't know if the 2225 can go as high as 1Khz if matched to a 2387 horn. I have both 2397 and 2350 horns and they have their own caracteristics. The 2350 horn is very dynamic and goes lower. The 2397 is transparent but doesn't go too low. I love trumpet and brass on a 2350.

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    Administrator Robh3606's Avatar
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    If it were me I would use subs below 80Hz or so. Use an E-145 as my midbase up to about 300Hz with a 2123 midrange up to about 1.5K. Up top the flavor you like best. I am partial to the Be drivers. That's my version of it scalled down of course. The original must have been a killer!Rob
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    Quote Originally Posted by Robh3606 View Post
    If it were me I would use subs below 80Hz or so. Use an E-145 as my midbase up to about 300Hz with a 2123 midrange up to about 1.5K. Up top the flavor you like best. I am partial to the Be drivers. That's my version of it scalled down of course. The original must have been a killer!

    Rob
    It was! I heard it back in the 80s on a visit to Disney. It was big and open, utterly effortless. The Saturn V launch shook the floor. But, yeah, you gotta use the high efficiency 15 to get anything near that level of performance. With the quad woofers Drew was using (per side!) the whole rig had to be operating at 100 spl. He was the ultimate believer of high efficiency for max fidelity. Mike

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    Quote Originally Posted by Robh3606 View Post
    If it were me I would use subs below 80Hz or so. Use an E-145 as my midbase up to about 300Hz with a 2123 midrange up to about 1.5K. Up top the flavor you like best. I am partial to the Be drivers. That's my version of it scalled down of course. The original must have been a killer!Rob
    That's the 100 x 100 waveguide isn't it Rob? 2435 bolted on back? I'm thinking of trying one with a 2450SL bolted on back just to see if it can give a stock SAM1HF a run for the money.

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    Administrator Robh3606's Avatar
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    That's the 100 x 100 waveguide isn't it Rob? 2435 bolted on back?

    Hello 4313B

    Good Eye! It's a PTH1010 with a 2435. I always wondered what a 2452SL would sound like on one.

    Rob
    "I could be arguing in my spare time"

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    Quote Originally Posted by Robh3606 View Post
    Hello 4313B

    Good Eye! It's a PTH1010 with a 2435. I always wondered what a 2452SL would sound like on one.

    Rob
    I never followed Zilch's work on any of the waveguides so I don't know if the 2452H-SL or 2450SL would be the better bet. I suspect the 2450SL would be if only because the 476Be measures so damn well on one.

    I wouldn't think the waveguide and 2452H-SL or 2450SL would be that much more expensive than a 2397/2441/2405 combination.

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    Senior Member pos's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 4313B View Post
    I never followed Zilch's work on any of the waveguides so I don't know if the 2452H-SL or 2450SL would be the better bet.
    2450SL without a doubt! (tested on your PT-F95)

    I would like to try a square PT also, as I feel the slow rise in vertical directivity of the rectangular one is difficult to handle.
    Maybe the rectangular 100x100 would be interesting if mounted sideway!

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