JBL Performance Series

[80sKid]

Yes, everyone should experiment with what works best for their space, equipment and taste.

However, the general recommendation for surround speaker positioning is elevated. In my personal work on improving the surround sound systems of my friends and clients, moving the surround speakers higher up has always resulted in a more satisfactory sensation of being enveloped by the surround ambience.

I see three important reasons for this:

First, a speaker at a higher position is able to provide a wider spread of radiated sound, due to the lack of obstructions (furniture and lamp fixtures).

Second, surround reproduction is ideally as diffuse as possible as possible (for movie reproduction, less so for music concerts). A monopole speaker positioned against a wide, flat area will have closer to an infinite baffle effect -- providing a wider and more even dispersion across the listening area). In most homes, walls are their flattest at greater heights (because there are no longer cabinets up against the wall, or picture frames, or wall-mounted light fixtures, etc.)

The third reason is perhaps most important: Human bodies. The head of each person in the room can potentially block the primary sound path of a surround speaker to another person in the room.

[Titanium Dome]

Those are three very good points, and ones I agree with. I think the Performance Series was developed with at least some of this in mind. One need look no further than the Synthesis® Four system to see why I write that.

Still, for the music-only system I deviated with good results. However, not many people have a dedicated music-only multichannel system. I've found that in the home cinema I rarely listen to music, so I enjoy the improved spatial characteristics of properly elevated surrounds, and so do my guests, wherever they may be seated.

[Hoerninger]

I am not fixed to a certain setup although I use a surround system only for music. I had for example pleasing results with a experimantal semicircle arrangement.
TELARC wrote (Never Ending Waltz, 2006):

Multi-channel surround sound for audio playback for the home is a relatively new concept, and there are many variations as to how the systems can be set up. This disc will play in any surround configuration, but was designed for optimal performance on a system that utilizes at least five full-range and preferably equal speakers ... .There are mix components that require the presence of all five main speakers. A subwoofer is also recommended.

TELARC wrote in another inlet ("1812", 2001):

If you are using five full-range loudspeakers, it is recommended that Bass Management be disabled and set the subwoofer level and response to best suit your listening room.
In some cases, neither the center nor the ".1" channels are used. The selection of the number of channels to be employed in a recording, whether it be 4, 5 or 5.1 (6), is determined by the needs of the music, and the creative decisions of the artist and / or recording team. ...
This recording will employ a HEIGHT channel on the disk channel formerly used by the LFE (.1) channel ... optional... .
To use the height channel of this recording, set your receiver /premplifier Bass Management to derive the subwoofer signal (LFE or ".1") from the main audio channels rather than from the LFE track of the disk. ... The LFE output from the disk player itself will then be connected to a independend single channel amplifier or directly to a self-amplified speaker(s).

My conclusion from all this is to use for music a system with five equal speakers in ear height.
____________
Peter

[80sKid]

...
My conclusion from all this is to use for music a system with five equal speakers in ear height...

...When listening to a Telarc recording.

Because by no means do Telarc's guidelines apply to the recordings of other record labels.

[rdgrimes]

...When listening to a Telarc recording.

Because by no means do Telarc's guidelines apply to the recordings of other record labels.

I think it goes without saying that every studio, (indeed every mastering session), does things differently.

[Titanium Dome]

I think it goes without saying that every studio, (indeed every mastering session), does things differently.

Not to mention every performance...


Where's the CONSISTENCY?

[Hoerninger]

Where's the CONSISTENCY?

It is the flexibility.
____________
Peter

And it is all for the music. Look here,
although I could not find any hint that the recording was made as matrixed quad.

[Mike Ronesia]

It is the flexibility.
____________
Peter

And it is all for the music. Look here,
although I could not find any hint that the recording was made as matrixed quad.

If I am able to add some PT800 surrounds to go with my front two PT800's I need to place them either above the Light switches or below them. I'm thinking that above is to high and below is to low. Has anyone experimented with, or have any thoughts about mounting them upside down? Just thinking, I know it may be crazy talk!

[rdgrimes]

If I am able to add some PT800 surrounds to go with my front two PT800's I need to place them either above the Light switches or below them. I'm thinking that above is to high and below is to low. Has anyone experimented with, or have any thoughts about mounting them upside down? Just thinking, I know it may be crazy talk!

You have to go with what you have. Anything from ear-level on up is OK. If you're sitting down, right below a light switch is ear level. So try them both, and forget up-side-down.

[Mike Ronesia]

Below is my aesthetic preference as they will be about 6" higher then the fronts, which are mounted on the L8400's. I think the wife would also prefer that as well.

[80sKid]

Actually, placing them upside down may be beneficial in a high position for surround use. Most tweeters have a more extended response and smoother rolloff on the axis opposite the midrange driver.

[natelabo]

I been reading this thread extensively and it seems that the Performance Series speakers are an excellent option for someone that is coming from the older Studio Series but can't afford the jump into the Arrays or Synthesis Systems. Is this the general consensus? What I am wondering or actually scared of is there something better around the corner? I was reading about the new LS series but from reviews and pricing they seem to offer slightly less performance and are cheaper. I read somewhere that the Performance line is discontinued. I have also searched and saw that few parts are left... Do you guys think its a good time to buy or should I hold off and see what the next round holds? What would you value a 7.2 system at 6 - PT800's, 2 - PS1400's, and a PC600 all in relatively good condition?

Thanks!

[Titanium Dome]

If I am able to add some PT800 surrounds to go with my front two PT800's I need to place them either above the Light switches or below them. I'm thinking that above is to high and below is to low. Has anyone experimented with, or have any thoughts about mounting them upside down? Just thinking, I know it may be crazy talk!

From the J. Gordon Holt review cited many, many pages ago:

Design & Installation
The PT800BE wasn't particularly critical about height relative to the listener; its vertical dispersion was smooth and uncolored from a few degrees below the woofer axis to about 30° above. Placing it with its center at ear height was about ideal, but anything much higher than that caused significant treble loss. This will be a problem if you put the PT800BEs on high stands (which is where I normally put satellites, to minimize front/back balance changes with changes in listening distance), so I turned them upside down. Unfortunately, this put most of their weight at the top, making them even less stable.


I should have taken my own advice about attaching them to the stands—partway through my tests, an accidental jolt that would never have fazed my Tannoy 10-DMTs pitched one of the PT800BEs off its stand and onto the floor. After that, I used adjustable straps to stabilize them. (There are no convenient threaded holes on the top of the enclosure.) A better solution for a permanent installation would be to wall- or corner-mount the surrounds, but because of the below-woofer treble loss, the supplied brackets should be attached to an angled board fastened to the wall, so as to aim the speakers down at the middle of the listening area.

That's from page 2 of this Ultimate AV article. http://ultimateavmag.com/speakersystems/31/index.html

[Titanium Dome]

I read somewhere that the Performance line is discontinued. I have also searched and saw that few parts are left... Do you guys think its a good time to buy or should I hold off and see what the next round holds? What would you value a 7.2 system at 6 - PT800's, 2 - PS1400's, and a PC600 all in relatively good condition?

Thanks!

It is out of production, though it's still being sold as new stock. There's no concern that it will be sold out anytime soon. Most parts are available through Harmanaudio.com, though you sometimes have to go on the waiting list until another production run takes place.

Prices vary wildly, depending on where/how you buy. Online, Harman will sell them at about 1/3 off. Individual sellers on ebay, AudiogoN, etc., usually ask less for used gear, with most sets going for a steal at below asking price. A 7.2 used set went on AudiogoN for $6k recently, well below new retail of over $13k.

Good used gear in the box should go for 30–45% of retail, depending on which model and seller's motivation. I sell PT800s at a lower price than PC600s or PS1400s because the latter two are harder to find.

[natelabo]

Thanks for the reply Titanium Dome... Your posts are what has drawn me to this series the most. I sent you PM maybe you didn't get it? Let me know. Anyone else have some insight? Thanks!