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Thread: 4628B curve for Zilch

  1. #1
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    4628B curve for Zilch

    I finally got the mic to use with the RTA portion of the DBX DR260 and just did a quick analysis of a 4628B Cabaret series centered at 1 meter, but didn't move it outside - I just had it sitting on a carpeted floor in a fairly absorbant room. It was too windy to do it outside pointing up today - I'll try that some other time and check the difference.

    Anyway, here's the curve I got, (interpolating the ISO frequencies with the graph I had). The DBX mic has about a 1db curve up at 10K, then back to 0, or the high frequency might have come out a little flatter. The DBX RTA also starts at 25hz and ends at 16Khz, (I didn't graph 25hz - it just keeps falling). HF adjustment on the 4628B was at 0. With a little judicious EQ these sound pretty good, especially for what they are.
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    Last edited by johnaec; 09-18-2004 at 05:42 PM.

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    Re: 4628B curve for Zilch

    Originally posted by johnaec
    With a little judicious EQ these sound pretty good, especially for what they are.
    Yikes! DAMN good, I'd say, better than I expected, actually, within +/- 3 dB from 60 Hz up through the entire range.

    Might kick the 2118 in a little lower than the spec'd 800 Hz, is all, or some lower mid boost, for them that want it. The transition at 3KHz looks smooth. They got it right with this combination of drivers, looks like. Needs sub for home use, is all, as we already knew.

    So, tell us this: How are they working for you in performance reinforcement?

    Thank you very much for measuring these. The more controlled open air test will only look better, I'm betting!
    Last edited by Zilch; 09-18-2004 at 11:32 PM.

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    Re: Re: 4628B curve for Zilch

    Originally posted by Zilch
    So, tell us this: How are they working for you in performance reinforcement?
    'Haven't had occasion yet to use them live. I can pack the little 12" 2-ways we've been using in my car - I need to start looking for a cheap van/wagon to move the bigger stuff around...

    John

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    Registered User paragon's Avatar
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    Great,
    Absolutely flat and that`s an PA Speaker !!
    What will you do with this, Zilch ?

    Regards
    Eckhard

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    Originally posted by paragon
    Absolutely flat and that`s an PA Speaker !!
    Well, I don't know if I'd call that absolutely flat - those green line are 3db divisions - the cyan are 1db. 'Still pretty good, and easy to EQ.

    John

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    Repackage for in-home use.

    Originally posted by paragon
    What will you do with this, Zilch ?
    http://audioheritage.org/vbulletin/s...&threadid=3131

    I've got a couple of pairs of them, and always liked how they sound. So, I bought this pair to recondition and repackage. With the 2118 cone midrange, they were an anomaly among the sound reinforcement (PA) products.

    I'm not sure if I'll rebuild these cabinets in a friendlier form with mirror imaging, or go with something more like the Gold Sound box referenced there, maybe offsetting the mid and high, with a "Tower" form factor.

    Trolling for suggestions here, actually. [Hoping Widget and others will help with the cabinet design....]

    The originals go dirt cheap around $300 a pair here of late (not for very much longer, perhaps,) for a super nice combination of drivers. Hell, you can hardly buy the tweeters alone for that.

    John's RTA analysis confirms:

    a) their minimalist crossover (a couple of caps and an L-pad) works surprisingly well, and,
    b) they are well worthy of the repackaging effort.

    A couple of E145 baskets just sold on eBay for about $30 each. The recone kit is available. The system is an inexpensive project with virtually guaranteed good outcome. They are very efficient (96 dB SPL sensitivity) and drive nicely without a huge amp investment. I'm running them on a 6230 now, but any quality receiver will likely do....
    Last edited by Zilch; 09-19-2004 at 03:09 PM.

  7. #7
    Figge
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    The system is an inexpensive project with virtually guaranteed good outcome. They are very efficient (96 dB SPL sensitivity) and drive nicely without a huge amp investment.
    dammit zilchter! now i have to "get hold" of these beuties! or how about diy? the e-145:s are easy to find, probably the rest too...

    gimme some drawings!


    i guess this could be a fairly inexpensive, easy to do, and most of all a FUN speaker... bet those can do some damage inside a livingroom!

  8. #8
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    Originally posted by Figge
    dammit zilchster! now i have to "get hold" of these beauties! or how about diy?
    Searching for what I posted previously, I've rambled on endlessly about these for months, now, apparently.

    Several different Cabaret models came in the same basic "4.5 cu.ft." cabinet. Interior dimensions are actually 28" H X 18" W X 14-7/8" deep. Bracing configuration varies depending upon drivers used.

    The port for 4628B is 5-7/8" diameter X 5-1/2" deep. It might be worth doing a little analysis to see if a different (lower) tuning might be better for home use. Remember, these were made for sound reinforcement tuned around 40 Hz. WinISD says 11-1/4" long port for 32 Hz. Can't get "BIG" bass outta E145 in this size box without EQ, apparently, though room rise may be just enough.

    You can get an idea of the driver layout from the pics in this thread. You know the drivers already: E145-8, 2118H, 2404H. 2118 is in a subenclosure.

    The minimalist crossover is here.

    Consider also a tower design such as the Gold Sound Kit 11. That box is substantially bigger, tho....

    I'm hoping one or more of the cabinet gurus here take interest in this project and come up with a cool design for us.

    [Also hoping that John can find the time to do his controlled response curves, too!]
    Last edited by Zilch; 10-19-2004 at 04:36 PM.

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    Originally posted by Zilch
    [Also hoping that John can find the time to do his controlled response curves, too!]
    Well, it's raining cats and dogs today over here in Marin...

    John

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    Originally posted by Figge
    I guess this could be a fairly inexpensive, easy to do, and most of all a FUN speaker... bet those can do some damage inside a livingroom!
    Yeah, trust the Zilchster on this, now: you'll want to put a Surgeon General's warning label on 'em....

    [Did somebody say "Doggie?"]

  11. #11
    Figge
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    ok whats the e145-8? same?

    if so i get strange curves when calculating the 127L box.

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    Originally posted by Figge
    ok whats the e145-8? same?
    Yes. I was too quick to put the "H" there. :o

    We recognize they may want supplemental subs....

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    hey guys, I have two pair of 4628b's, I find them great. I use them with 1 2245 bass horn, and they sound great. Without the sub they are very light in the bottom end though. I may extend the ports and see what they are like as sugested in a previous post.
    I substituted the 2118's for a pair of 2123h's in a seperate enclosure and the mids came alive. I plan on building some new bins to include the 2123h's. The inprovment in sound is worth it.

  14. #14
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    Finally got around to RTA measurement on my own 4628B's. This is in the R&D garage.

    The 2404H's in these are "-1", meaning they have 2402 (075) diaphragms in them, presumably, for ruggedness in this sound reinforcement application, at the expense of VHF extension.

    [Purdy good, tho.... ]
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    Kind of different... due to different speakers? ...due to different rooms? ...due to different measuring techniques? ... due to different measuring equipment?

    Widget
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