Oppo?

[rdgrimes]

That will certainly make a difference. In this case, new is better.

The 83SE does have a "better" DAC chip, but the differences in DAC are extremely small compared to the affect that the analog board itself can impart. This all of course presumes that you will be using analog connects.

In any case, the 93 ported over much of the analog board design from the 83SE but still uses the less expensive DAC chip. The 83SE also offers a dedicated stereo analog output which utilizes it's own high-end DAC chip. So for those using stereo analog output exclusively, the 83SE might be the better choice. Again this presumes that your stereo system is of high enough quality to resolve these differences. Most don't fall into that category, and the simple truth is that ALL of these players offer excellent analog audio quality.

[Titanium Dome]

The 83SE does have a "better" DAC chip, but the differences in DAC are extremely small compared to the affect that the analog board itself can impart. This all of course presumes that you will be using analog connects.

The 83SE also offers a dedicated stereo analog output which utilizes it's own high-end DAC chip. So for those using stereo analog output exclusively, the 83SE might be the better choice.

I have both units. The BDP93 is in my Synthesis® theatre, while the BDP-83SE is the main source for my K2 S9900s.

[Mr. Widget]

The 83SE does have a "better" DAC chip, but the differences in DAC are extremely small compared to the affect that the analog board itself can impart. This all of course presumes that you will be using analog connects.

I agree completely. DAC designs do matter, but the differences between all of the recent crop of "good" ones are pretty subtle... however that doesn't mean that the differences in implementations and analog sections are trivial. Unfortunately even though we have a tendency to want simple easily identifiable choices like Sabre 32 DACs are better than the latest Burr Brown offering, but it isn't that simple. The only really useful method is to listen to them.

Here is a comparison I made of several Oppos.


Widget

[DavidF]

Where does the "split" come in the signal chain between transport and DAC? Does the decoding for such things as BlueRay and SACD rest with the transport circuitry or with the DAC?

[Robh3606]

Does the decoding for such things as BlueRay and SACD rest with the transport circuitry or with the DAC?

The DAC. You should just get a bitstream from the transport.

Rob

[BMWCCA]

What I ended up doing was lookling at the Emotica ERC-2 CD player but I realized that the new CD player uses the same DAC and Analog section as the DAC they have on sale for $249. I ended up getting the DAC and using the Denon as a transport for CD/SACD/DVDA.

The Emotiva XDA-1 is down to $199 now. So, after this period of time, what do you think about it?

[Robh3606]

The Emotiva XDA-1 is down to $199 now. So, after this period of time, what do you think about it?

Hello Phil

Well I am listening to it right now. I use a Denon Universal player and run through the DAC. I can also do analog out and it sounds better from the DAC. I can switch almost instantaneously between them as there is very little latency in the DAC. Much better low end through the DAC. With my older Sony ES CD player there is less of a difference. I like it and at $199 if you have any use what the hell it's a real bargain. I just got the Emotiva XPA-2 amp as well to replace my PS-400 and it sounds real nice as well. So I am an EMO groupy for the time being.

Rob

[moparfan]

I used to have the Oppo-83. While it was a very competent player and a well-supported piece of gear I have always felt it was over-hyped. I felt the Toshiba XDE was a better upscaler, which was my primary concern.

It you want a universal digital transport, it's a good deal. If you want it for it's upgraded DAC section, maybe you should reconsider trading off it's DAC quality vs. room correction because if you redigitize to use RC what's the point?

[hjames]

I used to have the Oppo-83. While it was a very competent player and a well-supported piece of gear I have always felt it was over-hyped. I felt the Toshiba XDE was a better upscaler, which was my primary concern.

It you want a universal digital transport, it's a good deal. If you want it for it's upgraded DAC section, maybe you should reconsider trading off it's DAC quality vs. room correction because if you redigitize to use RC what's the point?

I'm on my second Oppo. I got a DV-981 a few years back that was multidisc use in my "everything" system,
once I got Bluray, I moved it to my music-only stereo - plays CDs, SACDs, HDCDs - its handy.

Got an Oppo BDP-93 Bluray player for Christmas a year ago - handles anything I've thrown at it,
does all the newer 7.1 stuff and also the usual CD, SACD, HDCD, etc.
It plays music too, but does all the cool movie decoding stuff I want in my Home theater (everything) system.

I like the Oppo stuff - seems like a good company, decent customer service, like the web based software upgrade too.

[4313B]

I like it and at $199 if you have any use what the hell it's a real bargain.

Too bad there isn't one that is the same size as that little half width amp they have.

I just got the Emotiva XPA-2 amp as well to replace my PS-400 and it sounds real nice as well.

I'm tempted to pick up one to compare against my Citation 22's.

[speakerdave]

I believe it is still the case that there is no digital output of SACD data except in specially formatted and licensed players to specially licensed decoders in an AV receiver or preamp. controller. For S/PDIF output SACD is down-sampled first to the 'redbook' standard. If you are avoiding a not-so-good analog output section and using a good outboard DAC with a better analog output it may not matter that much to you, i.e., the tradeoff may be worthwhile. For me, using a Bryston DAC, and a Denon DVD-5900, I usually use the Bryston except when the disc is SACD only.

[BMWCCA]

I'm still looking to improve my two-channel CD reproduction without spending a fortune. Denon is updating their line so the older DBP-1611UD universal player is on-sale nearly everywhere for $350, or $150 off "list" price.

We have a local Crutchfield store and they offer a 60-day return policy so I bought the Denon a week ago to give it a try. The DAC is pretty standard; decent Burr-Brown 192kHz/24-bit. Seemed about the same spec as the $500 Oppo but the Denon has actual stereo analog output as well as a "pure-digital" option that bypasses most of the extraneous electronics when in just two-channel listening mode.

I brought it home and pulled out the existing Sony DVD carousel 5-disc player I've had for maybe ten years, expecting a serious upgrade in CD-playback performance. I didn't really get it. At first I thought it was better. Then I thought it actually had an edge to the highs that was irritating me so I turned the UHF L-pads on the 4345s back one notch and listened some more. After a few days of "break-in" I was so unconvinced, I put the Sony back in the system and ran some A-B comparisons using duplicate CDs in both drives. Inconclusive enough that I was sure I couldn't tell the difference if I walked into the room without knowing. Not really what I was hoping for!

Then I checked the specs on the old Sony (DVP-NC655P) and found the same specs for the DAC even on that old unit. I guess it was pretty decent for a carousel back when I got it. Next I compared the Denon to the H-K DVD-22 I purchased from Harman for $32 as a "refurb" a few years back. I really liked the sound of that one compared to my older Sony single-disc CD player but, as I now know is common for this unit, it blew a cap and wouldn't boot. With the help of Google, I replaced the cap and everything worked as before. It completely holds its own with the Denon, so I checked its specs: 192kHz/24-bit Wolfson DAC. I'm assuming that's a pretty good one, too.

I guess my question would be: How much would I have to spend to realize a noticeable improvement in my CD reproduction? Would I expect to hear any improvement using the same transports but running them through a stand-alone DAC even if most of those offer only the same 192/24 spec in the price range I'd be considering, such as the Imotiva, etc.? And why should I expect any better reproduction quality from my computer and an outboard DAC at 192kHz/24-bit using lossless files burned from the original CD?

We have a PS3 that can handle our limited BD requirements so taking the Denon back for a refund wouldn't really change anything. Any suggestions? Or am I getting the most out of CDs with what I've got?

[Krunchy]

If you're doing strictly 2 channel check out the ADCOM GCD 750 if you would consider non brand new gear (I dont know what kind of budget you are working with). Its a solid unit, I got two of them, one from Widget and am happy with both. NOt to diss Denon, I'm just not thrilled with the more recent offerings since I got my HT unit from crutchfield, the build seemed pretty cheap, definitely not impressed.


UPDATE:
Ruediger has some good points, my 2 channel system is strictly cds only, (I'm very low tech), if you aspire to do more varied listening then this might limit you a bit.

Linkage if interested, some technical stuff there as well (I think it was a $1,200.00 msr when new).

http://www.users.interport.net/a/d/adcom/gcd750.html

[Ruediger]

I can recommend the Marantz. It plays CDs and MP3 from CD and from USB stick. The USB handling is perfect - with many players it is crap.

Ruediger

[Mr. Widget]

I'm still looking to improve my two-channel CD reproduction without spending a fortune.

The DAC is pretty standard; decent Burr-Brown 192kHz/24-bit. Seemed about the same spec as the $500 Oppo but the Denon has actual stereo analog output as well as a "pure-digital" option that bypasses most of the extraneous electronics when in just two-channel listening mode.

We have a PS3 that can handle our limited BD requirements so taking the Denon back for a refund wouldn't really change anything. Any suggestions? Or am I getting the most out of CDs with what I've got?

Burr-Brown yada yada... I don't think chip sets are the principle driver in sonic performance. I think the overall design and quality of the analog circuitry makes the larger difference in performance.

I recently fell into a new "CD" player for $400... it is a pre Oppo Lexicon RT20 DVD player that has a high quality DSD DAC as well as a high quality quality PCM DAC. This unit originally cost several thousand dollars and it sounds significantly better as an analog player than the Oppos or any of the sub several thousand dollar Denon, Marantz etc. CD/SACD players that I have tried or owned. It doesn't quite match my Bryston DAC for redbook CD, but it does allow SACDs to slightly best the CDs through my Bryston... the $1200 Sony SACD player I own can not do that.

I would suggest finding a killer deal on a fairly recent high end unit or stay with the PS3. I don't think any $500 DAC or $1000 CD player will be a significant upgrade from your PS3.


Widget