New here. I have some questions

[still4given]

I have recently come by some JBL speaker cabinets.

Two 4425, two 4412 and one B380 with crossover.

The B380 is in good shape but the woofers in the 4425 are bad. I am planning of having them reconed. First question. Are the woofers in the 4425 the best ones to use in there? Would I be better off using the recone money to look for something different?

Second question. The 4412's have bad surrounds and are missing the 035ti tweeters. I have already procured one 035 and am bidding on another now. I am wondering if the woofers ore worth having refoamed or maybe even reconed or should I again, maybe look for a better set of woofers. I see some 128H's for sale on ebay. Would these be an improvement over the stock speakers?

Thanks so much for any help you can give.

Blessings, Terry

[speakerdave]

Hello,

Welcome to the forum.

Changing woofers in the 4425: Unless you want to re-engineer the crossover and retune the cabinet it would be best to stay with JBL's design choices.

--in the 4412: According to the list I have the woofer in the 4412 is the 128H-1.

David

[still4given]

Thanks David,

I'll just keep heading in the same direction then. I read quite a few posts of folks changing out the woofers in their cabinets. I jsut wanted to make sure I wasn't spending money in a foolish way.

Blessings, Terry

[speakerdave]

Originally posted by still4given
I'll just keep heading in the same direction then. . . . wanted to make sure I wasn't spending money in a foolish way.

Well, I'm not sure what you are referring to in either case, here. Recones for the 2214 are $128. If the cabinets, tweeters and crossovers are OK, that seems reasonable. I would definitely go the recone route there and not start looking for used woofers.

Regarding the 4412: Current lists show the 035tia still available new for $115. Whether that works as an exact replacement for the 035ti I don't know. Others here would. Recones for the 128H-1 are $164, so refoaming might be worth a try if you can find someone local to do it for you. JBL does not support or recommend refoaming.

Check on line at Orange County Speaker to get a sense of what the costs are. When reconing be sure you are getting factory cone kits.

David

[still4given]

Strange. I wonder why the 128 costs more to recone than the 2214. The 2214 looks like a better speaker.

Thanks for the info. I have contacted Orange County Speaker already about the reconing.

Blessings, Terry

[Guido]

Hi Terry! Welcome!

IMO the 2214 IS the better woofer. JBL price policy is sometimes strange
I love my 4425 and I'm sure there is no better driver than the 2214 for this application.

[DavidF]

Originally posted by still4given
Strange. I wonder why the 128 costs more to recone than the 2214. The 2214 looks like a better speaker.

To be fair about which is better, the 128H-1 and the 2214 are both fine woofers. One could be rated better in different applications than the other. The 128H-1 has a shallower cone profile that reduces some response anomalies in the higher ranges of its response. The 2214 has a deeper cone profile but it will handle more power and is slightly more efficient. I have not seen the response curve of the 2214 to compare, but I would not be surprised that the response above 400-500 Hz for each is significantly different.

I agree that you should stay with the woofer model per the original design. This way you have the speaker responding as designed. Changing woofers can really impact the critical low-to-mid response in so many ways that just getting similar performance is not a sure thing, much less an “improvement”.

Prices for recone kits seem to go up as they near their intended phase-out time.

The 035 Ti have the connection terminals on opposite sides of the driver, the Tia have them near each other on one side. Some change in the tweeter flange is needed to fit both in the same cabinets.

DavidF

[Robh3606]

"I have not seen the response curve of the 2214 to compare, but I would not be surprised that the response above 400-500 Hz for each is significantly different."

Yes and the 2214 is used up to 1.2K in the 4425 as compared to the 850hz 4412 with the 128h-1?? With steep deep cone I would have thought the same but actually the opposite is true. Go figure??

Rob

[Guido]

Originally posted by Giskard
The 128H-1 has significantly lower second and third harmonic distortion. It has ruler flat response to ~ 500 Hz and then rises smoothly by 3 dB at 850 Hz. Above that it drops off rapidly. This response is exploited to excellent effect in the 120Ti and 4412.

The 2214H has a 4 dB rising response from ~ 250 Hz to ~ 700 Hz. Above 700 Hz it drops 5 dB to ~ 1.5 kHz and then spikes 6 dB at ~ 2 kHz. Above 2 kHz it drops off rapidly. This response is exploited masterfully in the L100T/t3 and 4425. This driver is also used in the XPL200.

Maybe a few response scans??

This would be great

[still4given]

I did use the search function before posting. I read a lot of posts but couldn't put together in my mind, what you fine folks were able to assemble for me. I am most thankful.

I'm really glad I found this forum. I have been fascinated with JBL speakers since I was a youth, Altec speakers too, for that matter.

Blessings, Terry

[doodlebug]

I picked up a set of 4425s for $30 at a yard sale a few months ago with the woofers needing the surrounds replaced. This is not too hard to do with the proper pre-formed surrounds, which I found on eBay for an additional $30.

Mine are now happily playing along with my tenor sax out in the garage. For the cost, I'd recommend this approach unless there is a clear reason for doing an entire recone.

Also, I'm not one for swapping out woofers in pre-engineered cabinets unless, again, there are clear and compelling reasons to override JBL engineering's diligence. BTW, there are a series of papers on the 44xx series posted on the JBL site, which will help you understand what level of work went into these designs. I'm sure you'll come to same conclusion as I after reading them.

Cheers,

David

[still4given]

Originally posted by doodlebug
I picked up a set of 4425s for $30 at a yard sale a few months ago with the woofers needing the surrounds replaced. This is not too hard to do with the proper pre-formed surrounds, which I found on eBay for an additional $30.

Mine are now happily playing along with my tenor sax out in the garage. For the cost, I'd recommend this approach unless there is a clear reason for doing an entire recone.

Also, I'm not one for swapping out woofers in pre-engineered cabinets unless, again, there are clear and compelling reasons to override JBL engineering's diligence. BTW, there are a series of papers on the 44xx series posted on the JBL site, which will help you understand what level of work went into these designs. I'm sure you'll come to same conclusion as I after reading them.

Cheers,

David

What site do you refer to. I would love to read those papers.

What you say makes sense about not fooling with JBL's designs. I just thought perhaps JBL had maybe changed some things since they first designed these cabinets that I should take advantage. If they "got it right" the first time then I will happily leave things alone.

Blessings, Terry