Here is what Lisa and i built for our dance floors. It is the SR4719 clone. Double 2241 18's in a 20 cubic foot box. I have four of these cabs in the larger ballroom/dancefloor and two of these in the smaller dancefloor.
They even sound good with 2240's in them.
I have the plans and port lengths available if needed.
One step above: "Two Tin Cans and a String!"
Longtime Alaskan Low-Fi Guy - E=MC² ±3db
VERY NICE Scotty!
And your doing along the same principles as I use my ported subs, MULTIPLES! In a larger room, four double 18,s, I agree with this. I have two double 18in ported cabs in each of my two center stacks, and LOTS of power, and they come to life, big time.
scottyj
I was going to suggest the simple route of some 4719's. Still a good sounding box and should be somewhat available on the used market. They were fairly common.
JBL would be my first choice but there is other good subs to be had for high impact club applications. I am in KCMO and have experience with nightclub sound systems. If you wish I can answer anything you would like to know....just shoot me a PM. You can come listen to the rig I designed and installed.
What are you using?Originally Posted by clubman
JBL 2241's in custom cabs powered by MA3600VZ's
Ive used others in the past, EAW, EV, I have even had awsome results with eminence in custom boxes
My next choice would be EV, my tops are all EV and system FIR filters are through a EV N8000
Agree! I use 2242,s in custom boxes, right now I am using a QSC Powerlight 6.0II, and I have Crown Macro Tech I series for them, as well.
I also use some eminence in custom folded horns with exceptional results for nightclub bass, Crown I Tech powered, and some 2240 loaded double 18in scoops, 3600VZ powered.
I am partial to the way the JBL 18,s sound, they have a unique punch, very clearcut, and weight nothing else seems to have quite the same way. To my ears, JBL woofers, powered by Crown amps and TOTL QSC amps, deliver the goods.
scottyj
sorry to get off topic but just some ideas.
Club sound systems have to be designed so they are really easy to use for the non techy non sound man person. Not every club can staff a sound man everynight they are open. If processing equipment is in the booth make sure it is locked up in a ventalated rack. Ive seen Dj's who think they know what they are doing ajust setings all over the place not having a clue on what they are doing.... puting a big smile on a 31band graphic.
If possible locate the equipement in a climate controled room out of arms reach from anyone with sticky fingers. Keep speaker lines short as possible. I use 10 gauge THHN twisted in a drill pulled in conduit.
Have plunty of electrical power. I like a dedicated breaker for each amplifier, regaurdless of the duty its pulling. Have a seperate pannel for sound if you can, keeps things easy.
Not a fan of passives in top boxes I like to biamp everything. But this requires more amplifiers.
Always better to have way more than you need. Like having tons of headroom.
Only fly cabs desinged to do so, no chains through handles
have a cd player or ipod dock so bar manager can put on some music before the DJ goes on.
I could go on and on
I am thinking to make clone of the JBL ASB6128V box
I have (4) JBL 2258HPL drivers and I need drawning of the box.
can someone help me
Regards
Ari
I agree with most of what you say. However, in the BEST of clubs, ones that have 1 resident DJ, and no one else, this type of club can have sophisticated, and elaborate systems. Ones that give the DJ alot of control over the system. Whilst the room EQ,s are set and not to be touched, the DJ has a 5 band program EQ in the console as well as a 3 band DJ xover, sub, full range, and tweeter at their disposal too!sorry to get off topic but just some ideas.
Club sound systems have to be designed so they are really easy to use for the non techy non sound man person. Not every club can staff a sound man everynight they are open. If processing equipment is in the booth make sure it is locked up in a ventalated rack. Ive seen Dj's who think they know what they are doing ajust setings all over the place not having a clue on what they are doing.... puting a big smile on a 31band graphic.
If possible locate the equipement in a climate controled room out of arms reach from anyone with sticky fingers. Keep speaker lines short as possible. I use 10 gauge THHN twisted in a drill pulled in conduit.
Have plunty of electrical power. I like a dedicated breaker for each amplifier, regaurdless of the duty its pulling. Have a seperate pannel for sound if you can, keeps things easy.
Not a fan of passives in top boxes I like to biamp everything. But this requires more amplifiers.
Always better to have way more than you need. Like having tons of headroom.
Only fly cabs desinged to do so, no chains through handles
have a cd player or ipod dock so bar manager can put on some music before the DJ goes on.
I could go on and on
I also believe in dedicated AC service for sound systems, dedicated breakers for each amplifier, NO SHARED NEUTRALS, dedicated ground, and SQUARE D panels and breakers, and quality outlets.
We could go on and on, and the level of sophistication and control varies with each club. The rooms that have been top of the game, have systems that give the DJ what some might consider too much control, but used properly, the Richard Long style of sound systems have always been the best sounding.
OR, you can come to CONEY ISLAND and hear what I have in THE ELDORADO BUMPER CARS, and see what you think of my system!
scottyj
Hi everyone,
I am also looking for 18"s to put in a small techno club.
I get that the 2242H is strongly recommended (over the 2245), but what about 2240H and 2241H? They seem much cheaper and easier to find - is there a catch???
Price is definitely an issue for me as I am building this setup on a budget.
The club (more like a studio) will be max 1000 sq ft and I will be powering them with my Yamaha P2201 or similar yammies, maybe QSC or Carvin for bigger watts if I find a good deal.
Thanks for your help!
PS: Scott, the Eldorado Bumper Cars looks fantastic - I will be sure to check it out next time I visit NYC
2240H is a discontinued woofer. The 2240 was the hero of the 1980,s and it is a great sounding woofer but with everything and all the changes at JBL, I don't know what parts availability in the upcoming future is going to be! So, if you buy used 2240,s and blow them, which happens occasionally, I don't what OR if servicing will be doable or not. Therefore I cannot recommend this route at this time. And I personally, DO NOT RECOMMEND aftermarket parts, UNLESS the parts are made specifically for the items in question, and sanctioned by JBL! As is the case with the Truextent beryllium diaphragms. And, consider this, if you get vintage 2240,s, and you like them, and you blow one, or some, and you recone them, AND THE RECONES do not sound like what you first heard that you came to like? You will then be a VERY unhappy camper. The reason I stress that you consider this is simple, I went through it myself. And most people hear something they really like, they become accustomed to this, and you blow a driver, or drivers, we recone them, and for whatever reason, they don't sound the same, and most of the time, it is never an improvement over the original, it is inferior. Now your stuck chasing something that no longer exists, as well as having spent good money to fix your gear, and wind up, MAYBE, having to spend even more money on new, or different drivers that you can get factory parts for. Then, you are going to set up and operate a club, and play techno, which has LOTS of EXAGGERATED bottom end. And, being a dance club, whether a big room or small room, playing the system politely is NOT what's on the menu! You want your system to pump and kick, while sounding great doing all this so you need drivers that are up to the task, and can safely handle what your going to do. And you, I am sure, will want some power to be able to kick them, and large amounts of power can be had in all price ranges today. So you have to have drivers that sound great and can handle everything your gonna throw at them. AND YOU WILL THROW THE GOODS AT THEM!
The 2242 is rated to handle more power than the 2240, and I'm happy with them, myself. Also, I find with todays techno, and house music, the 2242 reproduces the bottom octaves better.
The 2241 is OK, but I didn't care for this particular model, both the 40 and 42 have a more pronounced kick, as well as that JBL weighty sounding bottom. This is my personal opinion here, I am not saying it's a bad driver, it is good, just not one of my preferences. We do have a member, who has a club in Alaska who uses the 2241, to great success, and he likes them. So, you really have to know what each model sounds like, and what it is YOU like!
AND, when I priced reconing my 2240H woofers, they came out higher than the 2242, I got prices of around $260.00ea for the 2242 vs $330.00ea for the 2240H! You may save buying 2240 baskets, but your going to spend for parts to fix Legacy drivers, IF JBL doesn't do away with them altogether! And the word is JBL is doing away with parts for the older items. Right now, they can be serviced, what happens 6 months or a year from now? I don't know.
Things to consider!
scottyj
Yes, I have many 2240 and 2241's installed here at the nightclub that work great!
BUT, The recone price of a 2240 has stopped me dead in my tracks. So all of the 2240's are upstairs in boxes on the shelf or installed in smaller speaker systems for the dog and pony show gigs every once in a while outside of the club, like taking the show to Fairbanks.
I am happy with the 2241's in both of my dance floors, and I have no direct experience with the 2242, I am sure that they are superb also.
The SR4719 style of double 18 just works for my particular situation. Size and scale. Just pile a bunch of them up and add some serious Crown power amps and away you go!
I had the Yamaha 2200/2201 powering the subs in the small dance floor (30'x30') and it was never enough! Never enough rack cooling, never enough extention of the lows...always chewed up drivers because the amps were clipping by the moron dj's we had at the time.
Now, in the same room, I have a crown 3600 driving 6 -2241's and have 4- SR4735a clones hanging from the unistrut mounted to the ceiling, and let me tell you... The gal dj can get the room groove on! She hasn't chewed up anything in over two years!!! (= $$$ in my pocket!)
Good luck with your little club. I understand what you are doing and know you have a friend here in Anchorage, but I am also saying that a small room is more difficult to stuff a bunch of low end into. No matter how much sound gear I put into that little room, it always sounds better out in the parking lot. (Must be the long wavelengths...yea, thats it!)
ScottyK.
One step above: "Two Tin Cans and a String!"
Longtime Alaskan Low-Fi Guy - E=MC² ±3db
I agree with the others the 2240H is a great woofer but the recone price makes it not such a good choice if you have to recone alot of them often. I run two of them for my personal system and love em. I also think for a techno aplication the power handling is a bit low on the 2240H but it all depends on how many you use for the space given.
Just my .02 but any sub driver you choose at one point you will have to recone it. Even if you dont burn the coil up the spider and surrounds will just wear out and get loose. I like to recone subs that get heavy use every couple years or so. Keeps the sound nice and tight.
Hey thanks scotty (and scotty) for the insight.
I'm NOT looking to recone every over week, will definitely go for bigger wattage to avoid any clipping. I think the re-cone economy will definitely cover the extra amp cost.
Just to be clear, this won't be strictly a club, more like a private studio with a dancefloor. I'm just trying to have a place to throw some gigs in for me & my DJ friends.
The 18"s would be paired with 4 ceiling-mounted speakers (something like what you have ScottyK!)
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